Colts Salary Cap

[Iancolts]

Grigson failed in FA the past couple years!!  Now it's coming back to haunt us big time.  We went to the AFC champ game two seasons ago!  We lost our QB this past season so we miss the playoffs.  Luck will be back and now all of a sudden we are a few years out of being a SB contender?  Grigson needs to be fired can't believe he was resigned.  Now we have to rebuild the monster all over again through draft picks which is good but it's gonna take a while.  We are gonna sign Luck to a monster contract.  We are gonna have a SB QB and no defense.  If we are gonna play the waiting game and rebuild all over again mine as well trade Luck while we are at it and get draft picks.   I'm just angry that Grigson missed so much in FA even if he didn't put us in salary cap issue he used up most of it for below average talent!

[loudnproudcolt]

8 minutes ago, Iancolts said:

Grigson failed in FA the past couple years!!  Now it's coming back to haunt us big time.  We went to the AFC champ game two seasons ago!  We lost our QB this past season so we miss the playoffs.  Luck will be back and now all of a sudden we are a few years out of being a SB contender?  Grigson needs to be fired can't believe he was resigned.  Now we have to rebuild the monster all over again through draft picks which is good but it's gonna take a while.  We are gonna sign Luck to a monster contract.  We are gonna have a SB QB and no defense.  If we are gonna play the waiting game and rebuild all over again mine as well trade Luck while we are at it and get draft picks.   I'm just angry that Grigson missed so much in FA even if he didn't put us in salary cap issue he used up most of it for below average talent!

The problem you bring up is the problem in FA, signing what you thought was good talent and it turns out to be average to below average. This happens every year. Grigson fell into the same trap as almost every team who tries to get over the hump.

Anyone know how many sacks Malik Jackson had this year, and in his four year career? 51/2 sacks, 14 for the career. That is average talent who did great during a Superbowl run who Jacksonville paid 45M/ guaranteed to. I can continue with numbers and dollars, especially this year, but FA is a trap, and Grigson only has 4 years under in his tenure.

You live and learn. If you are not given the chance, then you have no continuity as an organization. There is a reason Polian after a long time in the NFL did not use FA, although he could not in Buffalo under the old rules. Why do you think Baltimore does not, or GB? Baltimore had a horrendous year. I am sure there fans are clamoring for change, yet they stayed to their formula. Ozzie knows it works. Grigson next year will have at least one if not two comp. picks from this year. Plus there are still players out there, like Heyward, at very reduced dollars. I know people wanted Heyward from this board. Can you imagine if we signed him the first day. Would everyone of been glad about that?

This is a business about continuity, and both GM and coach are still learning. I agree with many, I wanted a top notch guard and CB, but we are not privy to their plans. As I said in my Colts Salary Cap post, after we sign Andrew this off season, we will have large cap dollars next year, and a lot of our players signed. I think we are waiting for that to happen, and then make smarter decisions, like Denver did for their Superbowl run did in FA. Only my very long HO.

[swankdizzle]

LoudnProud's point about back-loading Luck's contract also applies to free agent signings.  We have enough space next year to sign someone this year. Casey Hayward would be my choice.

[chad72]

Lessons from the past, both Grigson and Pagano have 4 more years to get it right. If we get a SB this year or a SB next year, knowing how hard it is to get 1 with so many things going right for you in the regular season and the playoffs, would you not take it?

 

The way things are set up, the Seahawks and Patriots along with the Steelers will be at it again at the highest level, IMO. Panthers will make it tough on the Seahawks, and the Packers will just tease as always.

 

Chiefs are a very good team that probably take the AFC West now, IMO. The AFC South is up for grabs now, I feel. I personally think we are a couple of years away from being a SB contender. Right now, we are just a playoff contender.

[SaturdayAllDay]

On 10/03/2016 at 10:58 PM, rock8591 said:

By your logic, NE should waive Tom Brady, because Gisele had insulted the team players before.

To be fair Gisele isn't showing up to games and getting arrested. If your spouse shows up to your job and made enough of a scene to get arrested that would be a red flag in any line of work.  

[Dark Superman]

If we don't re-sign Freeman, we can still make a few moves in free agency and hopefully fill the roster and some holes with some 2nd tier guys.

 

Still a lot of guys to look at. I really did like Scott Chandler as our 2nd TE behind Allen. I was hoping he signed here.

[OHColtfan]

Considering our limitations in cap space, would be good to get a couple of decent quality starters, If we are replacing Toler and Thornton/Holmes, then we can improve just by signing some good talent at decent prices. Don't need superstars at high dollars to improve the team in those positions

[Dark Superman]

On ‎3‎/‎10‎/‎2016 at 5:48 PM, loudnproudcolt said:

I just wanted to give everyone a reminder who is saying we don't have enough salary cap to do this or that. It is true we only have around 20M left this year in salary cap, but a couple things to remember.

 

1) Andrew's salary is already counted in that number, at least the 5yr option at 16.1, so signing him will not hurt the cap this year unless we front load it.

2)I believe more cuts or restructurings will happen.

3) I think most of the high money fruit is off the tree, but I am sure most will not see that as a positive, but if we want to sign players, we have the money for it.

4) Next year, we have cap space of over 72M, and that is without the carryover I am guessing we will have, and without the 8% raise in salary cap which has been happening because of TV revenues, so next year, we are going to have a lot of cap space. I hope if we have cap space at the end of FA, we front load Andrew's contract!

 

Just a few thoughts going through my head about the cap, but the most important, is Andrews salary for this year is already in the numbers.

There's absolutely no way the Colts have that much cap space next season.

[Iancolts]

I'm not sure how we end up with only 20 something mill to spend.  When a team has that low of a cap space that means we should be stacked with talent on both sides.  But looking at the roster even if we aren't in salary cap issue we are damn close.  I know Luck takes majority of cap space but we had 4 years with Luck on a rookie contract and we all know Luck has the talent to take this team to the SB.  He just needed some help and Grigson failed to take advantage of his rookie salary.  Now it's back to Peyton era!! Not enough money to field a team because all the money goes to the QB!

[TheRustonRifle#7]

31 minutes ago, Iancolts said:

I'm not sure how we end up with only 20 something mill to spend.  When a team has that low of a cap space that means we should be stacked with talent on both sides.  But looking at the roster even if we aren't in salary cap issue we are damn close.  I know Luck takes majority of cap space but we had 4 years with Luck on a rookie contract and we all know Luck has the talent to take this team to the SB.  He just needed some help and Grigson failed to take advantage of his rookie salary.  Now it's back to Peyton era!! Not enough money to field a team because all the money goes to the QB!

Instead of looking at the roster why don't you look at the cap numbers for the information that you seek?

 

http://overthecap.com/salary-cap/indianapolis-colts/

 

I believe some people are forgetting that TY and Castonzo's new extensions take effect this season? They both are making substantially more money than their rookie deals... 

[DougDew]

20 minutes ago, TheRustonRifle#7 said:

Instead of looking at the roster why don't you look at the cap numbers for the information that you seek?

 

http://overthecap.com/salary-cap/indianapolis-colts/

 

I believe some people are forgetting that TY and Castonzo's new extensions take effect this season? They both are making substantially more money than their rookie deals... 

Just reviewing the numbers, I think TY and DA are overpaid.  In fact, DA's cap hit is $7.3 million higher than Jack Doyle's.  Vontae's is $8.3 million.  So the front office thinks the difference in what DA can provide over Doyle is about one Vontae Davis.  Wow.

[TheRustonRifle#7]

Just now, DougDew said:

Just reviewing the numbers, I think TY and DA are overpaid.  In fact, DA's cap hit is $7.3 million higher than Jack Doyle's.  Vontae's is $8.3 million.  So the front office thinks the difference in what DA can provide over Doyle is about one Vontae Davis.  Wow.

Vontae's contract was signed a couple years ago and if he had been a Free Agent this year it would have been more in the 12mil plus range. Free Agency prices are getting ridiculous.

[DougDew]

13 minutes ago, TheRustonRifle#7 said:

Vontae's contract was signed a couple years ago and if he had been a Free Agent this year it would have been more in the 12mil plus range. Free Agency prices are getting ridiculous.

I think Vontae's  cap hit will go up in future years.  I'm surprised DA's is so high since I thought it was a $7 million per year deal.  Must be really front loaded.

[TheRustonRifle#7]

Just now, DougDew said:

I think Vontae's  cap hit will go up in future years.  I'm surprised DA's is so high since I thought it was a $7 million per year deal.  Must be really front loaded.

Here is Vontae's break down and it goes up next year, the final year of his recently signed contract:

 

http://overthecap.com/player/vontae-davis/597

 

Here is DA's and his cap hit decreases the next two years then increases the final:

 

http://overthecap.com/player/dwayne-allen/557

 

I would recommend cross referencing these contracts with Spotrac.com's numbers as they sometimes slightly differ?

 

Here is Spotrac's Colts 2016 current cap:

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/

 

Vontae's contract:

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/vontae-davis/

 

DA's Contract:

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/dwayne-allen/

[Valpo2004]

On 3/13/2016 at 10:47 AM, DougDew said:

Just reviewing the numbers, I think TY and DA are overpaid.  In fact, DA's cap hit is $7.3 million higher than Jack Doyle's.  Vontae's is $8.3 million.  So the front office thinks the difference in what DA can provide over Doyle is about one Vontae Davis.  Wow.

 

Doyle's on a rookie contract I believe.  You can't make that comparison.  

[dgambill]

Why do I feel like any salary cap thread without Superman's comments is about as meaningless as a $3 bill?

[TheRustonRifle#7]

1 minute ago, dgambill said:

Why do I feel like any salary cap thread without Superman's comments is about as meaningless as a $3 bill?

 

1 minute ago, dgambill said:

Why do I feel like any salary cap thread without Superman's comments is about as meaningless as a $3 bill?

Kiss butt much? Joking of course 

[TheRustonRifle#7]

39 minutes ago, TheRustonRifle#7 said:

 

Kiss butt much? Joking of course 

I really was joking Friend...Supe rocks!

[Coltfreak]

Out of those numbers you still have other obligations that are not included in there. 10-man practice squad salary and Rookie Draft salary

 

We have less than 20    more like 16-17

[TheRustonRifle#7]

53 minutes ago, Coltfreak said:

Out of those numbers you still have other obligations that are not included in there. 10-man practice squad salary and Rookie Draft salary

 

We have less than 20    more like 16-17

The top 51 are factored in...please recheck? If you need further clarification....please PM me and I will assist?

[Coltfreak]

2 minutes ago, TheRustonRifle#7 said:

The top 51 are factored in...please recheck? If you need further clarification....please PM me and I will assist?

A friend broke this down

 

$155.270m = 2016 NFL Salary Cap
$004.950m = 2015 Roll-over
$000.388m = Accounting Adjustment (I think from a previous error in “likely to be met” incentives)
____________________________________________________________

$160.609m = 2016 Colts Salary Cap

$127.610m = Current top 51 contracts (including an guess of $7.35m for Dwayne Allen)
$009.942m = Dead Money
$001.050m = Spots 52 and 53 on roster
$001.200m = 10-man practice squad salary
$001.257m = Rookie Draft salary (not the full amount; just the amount above min “replacement” level)
$003.000m = In-season “churn” space
__________________________________________________________
$144.059m = 2016 Colts Cap Obligations

$016.550m = Free Cap Space to sign free agents

[TheRustonRifle#7]

5 minutes ago, Coltfreak said:

A friend broke this down

 

$155.270m = 2016 NFL Salary Cap
$004.950m = 2015 Roll-over
$000.388m = Accounting Adjustment (I think from a previous error in “likely to be met” incentives)
____________________________________________________________

$160.609m = 2016 Colts Salary Cap

$127.610m = Current top 51 contracts (including an guess of $7.35m for Dwayne Allen)
$009.942m = Dead Money
$001.050m = Spots 52 and 53 on roster
$001.200m = 10-man practice squad salary
$001.257m = Rookie Draft salary (not the full amount; just the amount above min “replacement” level)
$003.000m = In-season “churn” space
__________________________________________________________
$144.059m = 2016 Colts Cap Obligations

$016.550m = Free Cap Space to sign free agents

Here is the current cap and i mean no disrespect to you or your friend:

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/

 

http://overthecap.com/calculator/indianapolis-colts

[Coltfreak]

Just now, TheRustonRifle#7 said:

Here is the current cap and i mean no disrespect to you or your friend:

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/

 

 

Right  But they do not take into account the other things mentioned.

 

$001.050m = Spots 52 and 53 on roster
$001.200m = 10-man practice squad salary
$001.257m = Rookie Draft salary (not the full amount; just the amount above min “replacement” level)
$003.000m = In-season “churn” space

 

Total  6.507 million 

 

22,981,994 (from spotrac) minus 6.507  = 16,474,994

 

 

Cant spend 20 m and not have money left over for these areas. 

[TheRustonRifle#7]

5 minutes ago, Coltfreak said:

 

 

Right  But they do not take into account the other things mentioned.

 

$001.050m = Spots 52 and 53 on roster
$001.200m = 10-man practice squad salary
$001.257m = Rookie Draft salary (not the full amount; just the amount above min “replacement” level)
$003.000m = In-season “churn” space

 

Total  6.507 million 

 

22,981,994 (from spotrac) minus 6.507  = 16,474,994

 

 

Cant spend 20 m and not have money left over for these areas. 

By adding the expected Rookie wage then I agree...but that isn't relevant to what is actually available in your scenario, until you just added it? No disrespect but I was speaking of pure "Cap Space",

[Coltfreak]

Just now, TheRustonRifle#7 said:

By adding the expected Rookie wage then I agree...but that isn't relevant to what is actually available in your scenario? Again, I mean no disrespect but I was speaking of pure "Cap Space",

No offense taken, but that would be have to be included in the grand scheme otherwise they would be over the cap correct?

[TheRustonRifle#7]

OK, point taken,,,,after the rookie considerations it is less than the aforementioned links but in no way, shape or form are they in Cap Heck.....btw. thanks for engaging me! I love to speak with fellow fans!

[JPFolks]

On 3/9/2016 at 9:26 PM, DougDew said:

Its more important to have cap money in the near future when Brady declines and the Steelers can't pay all of their WRs than it is for us to have it now and beat our heads against the wall trying to beat them this year.

Brady won't decline for at least 3 more years in any significant way.  Meanwhile, the Patriots have nearly stacked their team even BEFORE the draft into a surefire Super Bowl representative, unless of course Pittsburg gets there in front of him.  No one else even looks competitive against those two teams.  In third (but behind those two) we have Cincy and KC and Denver's Defense taking up another 3 spots.  

 

Meanwhile it appears we'll be fortunate to win our division and not finish in 3rd or 4th based solely on Luck and a couple of good players on each side of the ball playing out of their minds good.  Otherwise we could realistically be looking up at Houston and Jacksonville and soon a much improved TN.   The last time I saw the Patriots load up like this was when they went undefeated in the reg season.  I only see AZ on the other side keeping Brady away (maybe) from his 5th Super Bowl.  

 

We couldn't even keep some of our own key players let alone sign anyone better than a placeholder.  Sure, we'll sign some more guys off the scrapheap, but our only shot at a deep playoff run rests on our top 5 picks being well above average and at least 3 being clear cut starters and Luck doing his magic.  

 

Our schedule is a bear this year and likely just as tough as Houston's (they have the Pats and Bengals, we have Pittsburgh at their place and the Jets who, if they sign Fitzpatrick, is no easy cup of tea).  

 

And Pittsburgh won't have to pay Bryant anything this year and perhaps nothing going forward if he can't stay off the weed.  They have a solid team which isn't going anywhere for the next 3 years minimum either.  We'll be in third place if we max out until Luck become Manning (when's he ever going to win a SB?).  

 

So, let's hope we hit 4-5 home runs in the draft and at least 2 more in UDFA's to really compete for anything beyond our division for 3 years.  The meaning behind the phrase "In Luck we trust" may be our only real salvation.  

 

Why we didn't keep Freeman and at least sign an upgrade Corner out of a solid pool of FA's to replace Toler is a mystery.  D'joun Smith is unproven, but he sure better step up and stay healthy.  

 

 

[Coltfreak]

23 minutes ago, JPFolks said:

Brady won't decline for at least 3 more years in any significant way.  Meanwhile, the Patriots have nearly stacked their team even BEFORE the draft into a surefire Super Bowl representative, unless of course Pittsburg gets there in front of him.  No one else even looks competitive against those two teams.  In third (but behind those two) we have Cincy and KC and Denver's Defense taking up another 3 spots.  

 

Meanwhile it appears we'll be fortunate to win our division and not finish in 3rd or 4th based solely on Luck and a couple of good players on each side of the ball playing out of their minds good.  Otherwise we could realistically be looking up at Houston and Jacksonville and soon a much improved TN.   The last time I saw the Patriots load up like this was when they went undefeated in the reg season.  I only see AZ on the other side keeping Brady away (maybe) from his 5th Super Bowl.  

 

We couldn't even keep some of our own key players let alone sign anyone better than a placeholder.  Sure, we'll sign some more guys off the scrapheap, but our only shot at a deep playoff run rests on our top 5 picks being well above average and at least 3 being clear cut starters and Luck doing his magic.  

 

Our schedule is a bear this year and likely just as tough as Houston's (they have the Pats and Bengals, we have Pittsburgh at their place and the Jets who, if they sign Fitzpatrick, is no easy cup of tea).  

 

And Pittsburgh won't have to pay Bryant anything this year and perhaps nothing going forward if he can't stay off the weed.  They have a solid team which isn't going anywhere for the next 3 years minimum either.  We'll be in third place if we max out until Luck become Manning (when's he ever going to win a SB?).  

 

So, let's hope we hit 4-5 home runs in the draft and at least 2 more in UDFA's to really compete for anything beyond our division for 3 years.  The meaning behind the phrase "In Luck we trust" may be our only real salvation.  

 

Why we didn't keep Freeman and at least sign an upgrade Corner out of a solid pool of FA's to replace Toler is a mystery.  D'joun Smith is unproven, but he sure better step up and stay healthy.  

 

 

because he turned down the offer because he was upset that they didnt pay him last yr.   

 

[TheRustonRifle#7]

7 hours ago, Coltfreak said:

because he turned down the offer because he was upset that they didnt pay him last yr.   

 

Yes, it has been reported that Indy had made an almost identical offer to him prior to Free Agency. I am unsure why there are still some who refuse to acknowledge this?

[crazycolt1]

10 hours ago, JPFolks said:

Brady won't decline for at least 3 more years in any significant way.  Meanwhile, the Patriots have nearly stacked their team even BEFORE the draft into a surefire Super Bowl representative, unless of course Pittsburg gets there in front of him.  No one else even looks competitive against those two teams.  In third (but behind those two) we have Cincy and KC and Denver's Defense taking up another 3 spots.  

 

Meanwhile it appears we'll be fortunate to win our division and not finish in 3rd or 4th based solely on Luck and a couple of good players on each side of the ball playing out of their minds good.  Otherwise we could realistically be looking up at Houston and Jacksonville and soon a much improved TN.   The last time I saw the Patriots load up like this was when they went undefeated in the reg season.  I only see AZ on the other side keeping Brady away (maybe) from his 5th Super Bowl.  

 

We couldn't even keep some of our own key players let alone sign anyone better than a placeholder.  Sure, we'll sign some more guys off the scrapheap, but our only shot at a deep playoff run rests on our top 5 picks being well above average and at least 3 being clear cut starters and Luck doing his magic.  

 

Our schedule is a bear this year and likely just as tough as Houston's (they have the Pats and Bengals, we have Pittsburgh at their place and the Jets who, if they sign Fitzpatrick, is no easy cup of tea).  

 

And Pittsburgh won't have to pay Bryant anything this year and perhaps nothing going forward if he can't stay off the weed.  They have a solid team which isn't going anywhere for the next 3 years minimum either.  We'll be in third place if we max out until Luck become Manning (when's he ever going to win a SB?).  

 

So, let's hope we hit 4-5 home runs in the draft and at least 2 more in UDFA's to really compete for anything beyond our division for 3 years.  The meaning behind the phrase "In Luck we trust" may be our only real salvation.  

 

Why we didn't keep Freeman and at least sign an upgrade Corner out of a solid pool of FA's to replace Toler is a mystery.  D'joun Smith is unproven, but he sure better step up and stay healthy.  

 

 

The Steelers I think do have to pay the money for Bryant. It just don't go to Bryant. It goes to the retirement fund. I have no clue if it's the total salary but that is where the money goes for fines.

[JPFolks]

13 hours ago, Coltfreak said:

because he turned down the offer because he was upset that they didnt pay him last yr.   

 

you don't think he would have stayed if we'd offered what the Bears did? Did they offer him less than us? Otherwise, perhaps he just took the money (I don't know the difference, but it was my understanding we low balled him).  He was a huge performer every year. With Jackson now likely to be suspended on top of it, I see our defense in a dire situation, far worse off than even last year.  

[Coltfreak]

1 hour ago, JPFolks said:

you don't think he would have stayed if we'd offered what the Bears did? Did they offer him less than us? Otherwise, perhaps he just took the money (I don't know the difference, but it was my understanding we low balled him).  He was a huge performer every year. With Jackson now likely to be suspended on top of it, I see our defense in a dire situation, far worse off than even last year.  

From what I understand we made the same offer but I also heard there may have been some incentives in the Bears contract  that the Colts didn't include 

So who knows.  

[JPFolks]

9 hours ago, Coltfreak said:

From what I understand we made the same offer but I also heard there may have been some incentives in the Bears contract  that the Colts didn't include 

So who knows.  

It seems I read somewhere (maybe here) that he wanted a contract comparable to Trevathan's as he had similar performance results.  Since the Bears signed both, I figured they must have offered something more to his liking.  If they'd only offered what we did, it seems odd he'd go to the team paying his "equal" much more money.  

[JPFolks]

I thought some of you might find this ESPN article interesting reviewing the teams inactive in FA (hint, they didn't understand why Indy wasn't getting help and didn't think it was a good idea blaming possible gun-shy-ness on why Grigson seems frozen this time around).  

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/15002995/grading-teams-largely-sat-free-agency-2016-nfl

[BProland85]

Does anyone have a link or know for sure the Colts updated cap space? I don't see how they have anything less than 30-35 mil in space since they have signed no one and Luck's deal has not been extended yet.

[Gavin]

http://overthecap.com/calculator/indianapolis-colts

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/cap/

 

We currently have between $21,198,459.00 (Over the Caps #) and $22,981,994.00. (Spotrac #)Those numbers take into account Lucks option but keep in mind we have rookies to sign which Over The Cap estimates will cost roughly  $5,000,459.00 in cap if reading it right http://overthecap.com/draft