Photos of Greg Hardy's former girlfriend show multiple injuries

[SteelCityColt]

Do you even read my posts.

Yes

 

Focus on the topic not me. If you want to talk personal, do you want me to talk British and moral system?. It's your normal MO.... because yeah I'm British so therefore I must have agreed with all moral decisions ever they have made in history. I'm making it about you as you're putting out, in a public forum, your opinion on the matter. I am disagreeing with your statement. 

 

I don't want to go there. So shut it. 

Let me repeat this. I hate domestic violence. I spend thousands of dollars of my own money to prevent it. Well done, sincerely.

Whine about justice system and NFL to allow this to happen. Jerry Jones is one guy who is selecting a player who is eligible to be selected. Jerry Jones IS the NFL. Who owns the league? You want a change to be made where the NFL won't touch players with a DA history, it has to start somewhere. But ok, picking up the guy aside.

 

Jerry Jones is going out and publicly calling this guy a role model... and you're ok with that?

[ColtsBlueFL]

That's all I am saying. Fault lies in the justice system. Let's not blame Jerry Jones.

I organize and sponsor fund raising events against domestic violence. Of course, what he did is wrong. Read my earlier posts.

 

Why not?  The FBI accused Goodell of not looking in to the Ray Rice affair enough before handing out his 2 game suspension.  Those photos of Holder were seen by the NFL, after winning their lawsuit vs. North Carolina to see them.  Jerry could have set up a meeting to discuss those photos with Roger, but chose not to.  I find fault in Jerry for that.

[Shane Bond]

Why not? The FBI accused Goodell of not looking in to the Ray Rice affair enough before handing out his 2 game suspension. Those photos of Holder were seen by the NFL, after winning their lawsuit vs. North Carolina to see them. Jerry could have set up a meeting to discuss those photos with Roger, but chose not to. I find fault in Jerry for that.

Goodwill is the chair of NFL. You can't legally blame Jerry, can you ?

[ColtsBlueFL]

I understand that.

All I am saying is why NFL not implement a policy to block this to begin with?.

 

The Personl Conduct Policy is collectively bargained.  Goodell stretched his power to the max altering the PCP for Domestic Violence  recent;y.  And even then the results get overturned by from other lawyers on technicalities and not on actions of the players themselves.  It's a no win, so public outcry is the last refuge, unfortunately.

[jvan1973]

Sure, Organizations should implement those policies but NFL is a money making machine. They don't care about these.

We all are guilty to be following and supporting such an organization.

They will if they start losing sponsorships.

[Shane Bond]

Do you even read my posts.

Yes

Focus on the topic not me. If you want to talk personal, do you want me to talk British and moral system?. It's your normal MO.... because yeah I'm British so therefore I must have agreed with all moral decisions ever they have made in history. I'm making it about you as you're putting out, in a public forum, your opinion on the matter. I am disagreeing with your statement.

I don't want to go there. So shut it.

Let me repeat this. I hate domestic violence. I spend thousands of dollars of my own money to prevent it. Well done, sincerely.

Whine about justice system and NFL to allow this to happen. Jerry Jones is one guy who is selecting a player who is eligible to be selected. Jerry Jones IS the NFL. Who owns the league? You want a change to be made where the NFL won't touch players with a DA history, it has to start somewhere. But ok, picking up the guy aside.

Jerry Jones is going out and publicly calling this guy a role model... and you're ok with that?

Normal?. That's all you have.

Other than all the facts, well done.

[Shane Bond]

They will if they start losing sponsorships.

Now you are talking. It will soon happen if this continues.

[ColtsBlueFL]

Goodwill is the chair of NFL. You can't legally blame Jerry, can you ?

 

On not doing due diligence in vetting his potential employee?  Yes, I do.  The NFL can' t force a team to hire, or not hire anybody.  Only the team itself can do that.  If they don't perform the necessary checks and it come out later the employee is flawed, that is on the organization that hired him.  Now If Jerry says he talked with Goodell about the photos, and the content of the abuse, and still wants to give Hardy another chance, that's another barrel of fish.  But he didn't, he denied seeing the photos.  Not good enough.

[NFLfan]

We have bigger issue than Jerry Jones is all I am saying. Blame the law system and NFL first before we get to Jerry Jones.

Why do we have to leave it to morality?. Why not implement a policy saying players with domestic violence records are not eligible to play in NFL?.

Okay, thanks for clarifying that. I don't support a zero tolerance policy, as I believe people can change. We all make mistakes, some worse than others.

If Hardy showed some acknowledgement that he did something wrong and that he was working on his problem (ala Ray Rice), I may give him a second chance. Instead, he is still acting like he is above the law. As Jvan wrote, he probably will end up in prison some day, as he has not shown that he realizes that what he did was criminal.

[SteelCityColt]

Normal?. That's all you have.

Other than all the facts, well done.

 

You still dodged the direct question I see...

[chad72]

It just becomes a hard sell when Jerry Jones does try to extend him, IMO. 

[SteelCityColt]

It just becomes a hard sell when Jerry Jones does try to extend him, IMO. 

 

If he's played well probably not. Once it's acceptable to sign him in the first place you can't really have an outcry about resigning him. 

 

Starting to stack up some "personalities" in that locker room certainly. 

[Shane Bond]

You still dodged the direct question I see...

You asked a question?. What was it?

I didn't even want to dig your flawed answer and make your stance look even more vulnerable.

[Shane Bond]

Okay, thanks for clarifying that. I don't support a zero tolerance policy, as I believe people can change. We all make mistakes, some worse than others.

If Hardy showed some acknowledgement that he did something wrong and that he was working on his problem (ala Ray Rice), I may give him a second chance. Instead, he is still acting like he is above the law. As Jvan wrote, he probably will end up in prison some day, as he has not shown that he realizes that what he did was criminal.

Yes, don't have to be zero tolerance but at second at least.

[SteelCityColt]

You asked a question?. What was it?

I didn't even want to dig your flawed answer and make your stance look even more vulnerable.

 

So you dig at me saying I don't read your posts and then admit to not reading mine.... ok. Please dig away, I stand by everything I've said so far. 

 

Jerry Jones is going out and publicly calling this guy a role model... and you're ok with that?

[Shane Bond]

So you dig at me saying I don't read your posts and then admit to not reading mine.... ok. Please dig away, I stand by everything I've said so far.

Jerry Jones is going out and publicly calling this guy a role model... and you're ok with that?

Did he say, he is a role model in life or in football field?

[SteelCityColt]

Did he say, he is a role model in life or in football field?

 

Where does the line begin and end? 

 

He said:

https://cdn.*/video/mp4/eoiv.mp4

 

 

Ok let's ask another question. Let's say what JJ is true, Hardy is very very sorry for what he did, is going to become a stand up guy, donate thousands of money etc etc. Does someone who has that mindset go out and star in a rap video promoting guns, violence and the objectification of women (well it is rap video...).

[jaybird95]

That's sad, for you.

 

You don't know me, don't judge me for having an opinion other than yours.

[Shane Bond]

Where does the line begin and end?

He said:

https://cdn.*/video/mp4/eoiv.mp4

Ok let's ask another question. Let's say what JJ is true, Hardy is very very sorry for what he did, is going to become a stand up guy, donate thousands of money etc etc. Does someone who has that mindset go out and star in a rap video promoting guns, violence and the objectification of women (well it is rap video...).

That video is not loading for me.

If JJ said Hardy is a role model for life, he is wrong.

If JJ said Hardy is a role model in the football field, what is wrong with that?.

I am not aware of any rap video. If Hardy is part of rap video promoting guns, blame him. Why Jerry?.

I understand why you blame Jerry because you call him THE NFL which in itself is fundamentally wrong to begin with.

[jvan1973]

I wouldn't be happy about the move of the Colts would have picked him up, but I wouldn't stop watching and rooting for the team.

The only way to keep him out of the league is for major sponsors to pull their money from the nfl

[Superman]

Do you see what's going on here?  I recognize the play.  Jerry is doing what Roger did in the Ray Rice case.  Roger says he didn't see the Rice video. Thus the light penalty.  Then TMZ puts it out in the public, and the world lights up Goddell's world!  Then the sage ensued.

 

It was true, Roger and the League never saw the video.  FBI investigation proved it, but that didn't get Roger and the League off the hook.  Here is an excerpt from the FBI report-

 

** The report scolded the NFL for deference to law enforcement, saying that it “can foster an environment in  which it is less important to understand precisely what a player did than to understand how and when the criminal justice system addresses the event.” And, in Rice's specific case it “led to deficiencies in the League’s collection and analysis of information during its investigation.”

The Mueller Report says there was enough evidence for the NFL to dig further into what happened, which it did not. **

 

Jerry is truthful, he couldn't see the photos, but he could have inquired more to the league.  But like Goodell in Rice, Jerry doesn't want to be accountable for knowing and signing Hardy anyway.  Now pictures come out and Jerry defends on the not seeing them routine Goodell used.  Classic.

 

I didn't get the impression Jerry Jones was hiding behind the 'we didn't see the pictures' defense. I felt like his point was that they already had a good idea what happened, based on the information they already had, and that the pictures haven't really changed their idea of what happened. Which, by the way, is my thinking also, so maybe I'm slanted on this. But reading the reports and the results of the trial and whatnot, these pictures are what I expected. 

 

In fact, unlike Goodell and the NFL, the Cowboys are not acting like they had no idea that this situation was this bad. Goodell saw the video and tried to change his decision, then tried to paint a picture of him being misled about the seriousness of the situation. That was mishandled from start to finish. 

 

Here's where I differ from Jones. I wouldn't have signed Hardy, knowing what I thought I knew at the time. He chose to give Hardy a second chance, as he stated, and that's his right, but i just wouldn't have signed the guy. And it's because, like I said, these pictures are pretty much what I imagined. The reports said he tossed her around, threw her in the bath tub and choked her, etc. Maybe the reports are one-sided, but I was always under the impression that she had been injured. There's nothing surprising about these pictures, IMO.

[Cynjin]

You don't know me, don't judge me for having an opinion other than yours.

It doesn't work that way, if you truly believe Hardy was a good decision by the Cowboys then you really need to do some soul searching. I also realize that you will be the last one to figure that out.

[jaybird95]

It doesn't work that way, if you truly believe Hardy was a good decision by the Cowboys then you really need to do some soul searching. I also realize that you will be the last one to figure that out.

 

That's quite a strong judgment, you should do some soul-searching for judging someone's character whom you don't even know. A player that gets payed to play with footballs is playing well with footballs. How in the hell is that not a good decision. One person does not represent everyone, I'm sure the majority of his teammates don't even like him. I don't either.

[Superman]

That's quite a strong judgment, you should do some soul-searching for judging someone's character whom you don't even know. A player that gets payed to play with footballs is playing well with footballs. How in the hell is that not a good decision. One person does not represent everyone, I'm sure the majority of his teammates don't even like him. I don't either.

 

I disagree with your stance, but I understand where you're coming from. My question is whether you understand why many wouldn't want him.

[NewColtsFan]

We have bigger issue than Jerry Jones is all I am saying. Blame the law system and NFL first before we get to Jerry Jones.

Why do we have to leave it to morality?. Why not implement a policy saying players with domestic violence records are not eligible to play in NFL?.

 

Because it can't be done unilaterally,  and the NFLPA says "no" to that....

 

That's why.

[jaybird95]

I disagree with your stance, but I understand where you're coming from. My question is whether you understand why many wouldn't want him.

 

I understand why. I just want to be afforded the same respect for my opinion. You'd think I beat the woman for saying Greg Hardy is a good football player that helps a team win.

[jvan1973]

Because it can't be done unilaterally, and the NFLPA says "no" to that....

That's why.

You don't need a policy. Ray Rice is currently unemployed.. the league just needs common sense. You would think that would be easy

[NewColtsFan]

You don't need a policy. Ray Rice is currently unemployed.. the league just needs common sense. You would think that would be easy

 

Ray Rice is closer to the twilight of his career.       There's an argument (perhaps not a great one)   that no one has offered him a job anymore because he can't be a good RB anymore.

 

But Hardy is in the prime of his career.     If he's cleared by the legal system and all 32 teams pass on him,  I think the NFLPA would have a strong lawsuit on its hand showing collusion on behalf of the league and all 32 owners.      No on would believe an owner saying he's past his prime.

 

Just offering a different perspective to consider.....

[2006Coltsbestever]

Imagine if Jerry signed Ray Rice, boy would the crap really hit the fan then. This is a sad story.

[Cynjin]

That's quite a strong judgment, you should do some soul-searching for judging someone's character whom you don't even know. A player that gets payed to play with footballs is playing well with footballs. How in the hell is that not a good decision. One person does not represent everyone, I'm sure the majority of his teammates don't even like him. I don't either.

 

I am not judging your character, I am judging your stance on this particular subject based on what you have posted.  It is not a good decision because it casts a bad light on the Cowboys and the NFL as a business.  I doubt that many of the sponsors of that team or the NFL are happy to see this kind of publicity on something that they are supporting monetarily.  Just because someone does something well does not mean he should get to continue to do it when he has been shown to be a abuser of a woman.

[NFLfan]

Ray Rice is closer to the twilight of his career. There's an argument (perhaps not a great one) that no one has offered him a job anymore because he can't be a good RB anymore.

But Hardy is in the prime of his career. If he's cleared by the legal system and all 32 teams pass on him, I think the NFLPA would have a strong lawsuit on its hand showing collusion on behalf of the league and all 32 owners. No on would believe an owner saying he's past his prime.

Just offering a different perspective to consider.....

All 32 teams passed on La'el Collins in 7 rounds of the draft. He was expected to be a 1st round pick. He lost millions because he was not drafted. He did not sue the league.

[Blue Horseshoe]

I'll say what I have said all along on all of this stuff regarding the Goodell tenure.

 

They need to have very specific clear rules in place with clearly defined penalties for all foreseen infractions with a clearly defined mechanism for expanding them when unforeseen incidents occur. 

 

Everything has been completely arbitrary which has opened the process to players getting out of or at least reducing their punishments through the courts.  This would be much harder if everyone knew exactly what standards they were expected to adhere to and what their penalties would be if they failed to do so.

 

For example, the menu of punishments for domestic violence could be something like

Domestic disturbance involving law enforcement - 1 game w/o pay, mandatory psychological intervention

Domestic violence involving bruising - 8 games w/o pay, mandatory in patient anger management during those 8 weeks

Violent assault resulting in permanent injury or death - Lifetime ban, forfeiture of all retirement benefits

There would also be a system of escalator clauses for repeat offenders such increasing the punishment

 

The point is that the expectations and consequences need to be explicitly stated by the league and agreed to by the players

[jaybird95]

I am not judging your character, I am judging your stance on this particular subject based on what you have posted. It is not a good decision because it casts a bad light on the Cowboys and the NFL as a business. I doubt that many of the sponsors of that team or the NFL are happy to see this kind of publicity on something that they are supporting monetarily. Just because someone does something well does not mean he should get to continue to do it when he has been shown to be a abuser of a woman.

Newsflash, the NFL, the Cowboys, and many people are scumbags. It's a great decision if it helps Jerry's Cowboys, it's quite obvious he just wants to win. I don't look to athletes for a moral compass. If you hated this that much you wouldn't watch the NFL, because by watching it you're giving people like Greg Hardy money.

[NewColtsFan]

All 32 teams passed on La'el Collins in 7 rounds of the draft. He was expected to be a 1st round pick. He lost millions because he was not drafted. He did not sue the league.

 

Collins ASKED the NFL ***NOT*** to draft him.

 

Once he realized his problems would mean he wouldn't be drafted in the first round,  or likely even the 2nd,  he and his agent asked the NFL not to draft him.

 

Said he wouldn't sign with the team that drafted him.

 

He WANTED to be a free agent so he could pick his team.

 

That was HIS decision.

[NFLfan]

Collins ASKED the NFL ***NOT*** to draft him.

Once he realized his problems would mean he wouldn't be drafted in the first round, or likely even the 2nd, he and his agent asked the NFL not to draft him.

Said he wouldn't sign with the team that drafted him.

He WANTED to be a free agent so he could pick his team.

That was HIS decision.

Ok, I get that. I had heard/read that if he was not drafted in the first 3 rounds, he would not sign with another team. I may be wrong, but the point remains that he was projected everywhere to be a first round pick and he was not drafted. The teams made a decision not to draft him.

I won't go back and forth on this. I was just making a point that this was an example where every team chose not to draft him.

[Nadine]

I hope his second chance includes anger management and domestic violence counseling

 

That sort of thing just doesn't go away on it's own

[NewColtsFan]

Ok, I get that. I had heard/read that if he was not drafted in the first 3 rounds, he would not sign with another team. I may be wrong, but the point remains that he was projected everywhere to be a first round pick and he was not drafted. The teams made a decision not to draft him.

I won't go back and forth on this. I was just making a point that this was an example where every team chose not to draft him.

 

Yes.....

 

But they didn't collude.     They didn't all get together and say "let's all not draft this guy..."

 

They all reached the same conclusion,  that a guy who might be charged with a double-murder was not worth the PR hit to the team.    They chose not to draft him, in part to the wishes of Collins and his agent,  and part to avoid a possible PR nightmare.

 

No collusion.     Big,  big difference.

[Cynjin]

Newsflash, the NFL, the Cowboys, and many people are scumbags. It's a great decision if it helps Jerry's Cowboys, it's quite obvious he just wants to win. I don't look to athletes for a moral compass. If you hated this that much you wouldn't watch the NFL, because by watching it you're giving people like Greg Hardy money.

 

This quote right above is why I said earlier that you would be the last to know.

[BloodyChamp]

Cris Collinsworth thinks his commemts on TV just how is what made this get real. He's such a joke.

[jaybird95]

This quote right above is why I said earlier that you would be the last to know.

 

Accept that other people think differently from you. And yes, you judged my character, don't nonesense me. Why else would you tell me to do some "soul-searching". Give me a break. Sorry not everyone is as saintly as you.