Should we trade up in the 2015 draft for 2 elite or 3 near elite defensive players?

[Manning1887]

Brandon Scherff is really good and he played under one of the best OL coaches out there. I'd take him as a future RT.

 

With safety, you need one in Pagano's mold of being interchangeable. He doesn't really have a safety like that. Adams has been great this year in coverage, but he's not good in run support. But ILB is really the pick we need to hit on. Most mock draft sites have us taking Benardrick McKinney.

 

Brandon Scherff is a likely top ten pick from what I have seen. I have also read that some scouts view him as a better guard prospect. I would be all for drafting Scherff, but I am afraid he will be long gone by the time we pick. 

 

I like Eric Rowe a lot from Utah as a safety prospect we can get in the middle rounds. 

 

I like McKinney. I would not necessarily be opposed to drafting him. I am not a big fan of Perryman, especially early in the draft. I just don't see him staying healthy in the NFL. 

 

A name to keep an eye on is DeForest Buckner from Oregon. He is a 6'6" 290 lb. defensive end. He could become a force on defense and really improve our defensive line play. There is a nice snippet on him in a Bleacher Report article. 

[Indianapolis-Colts-Fan]

Not with Grigson. There have been a few misses as with any team, (Kerwynn Williams, Chandler Harnish, John Boyett,etc..) but he's shown an ability to find depth late in the draft. Newsome was a 5th round pick,as was Vick Ballard. Zach Kerr was undrafted as was Dewey McDonald who is excellent on special teams. Lavon Brazil (before he decided to be a knucklehead) was a 4th round pick. You can say that he's underwhelmed, but Josh Chapman was also a late round pick who starts at NT.

You never know with Grigson. Who wouldve thought Newsome would be a better OLB than the one we took in the 1st round in 2013. What we really need are great players, not average or mediocre ones. He has a habit of experimenting with below average players longer than he should (Satele, Landry,etc...). If that means trading up from the 6th to 7th, or 3rd back into the 2nd, then so be it. They just need to be instant upgrades, or at least serviceable with room to become great.

Wasn't chapman drafted by Polian?

[Defjamz26]

Wasn't chapman drafted by Polian?

 

Nope. 6th round pick in the 2012 draft iirc.

[rock8591]

Suffice to say you and I see this very, very differently.

 

Not to beat a dead horse...But given the bad state of our OL...it's no coincidence that Luck is #1 in passing yardage in the league. It's not because we have a dearth of talent at WR. Our OLs are not making our RBs and WRs look good, but vice versa.

 

Nicks has roughly 300 yards receiving and 4 TD this year, as our 7th receiving option. (!!!!!) 7th...not 3-4th. TY is ahead of him, as is Fleener and Allen, Wayne, Moncrief, and Bradshaw before injury. Find another team in the league where the 7th WR has 300 yards and 4 TDs, or has consistently had 900 yard seasons before. #7 receiver on a NFL team is pretty much worse than being a member of the Practice Squad. If Nicks was the #2-3 option on a team, he would clearly be an average starter at minimum; you're not gonna get 3+ 1000 yard receivers on a team.

IMHO, build the O-Line and defense...let the QB make his WRs and TEs good, let the OL make the RB great instead of vice versa. I'd much rather have the Cowboys OL and high school WRs than our current WRs and OLs.

[NewColtsFan]

Not to beat a dead horse...But given the bad state of our OL...it's no coincidence that Luck is #1 in passing yardage in the league. It's not because we have a dearth of talent at WR. Our OLs are not making our RBs and WRs look good, but vice versa.

 

Nicks has roughly 300 yards receiving and 4 TD this year, as our 7th receiving option. (!!!!!) 7th...not 3-4th. TY is ahead of him, as is Fleener and Allen, Wayne, Moncrief, and Bradshaw before injury. Find another team in the league where the 7th WR has 300 yards and 4 TDs, or has consistently had 900 yard seasons before. #7 receiver on a NFL team is pretty much worse than being a member of the Practice Squad. If Nicks was the #2-3 option on a team, he would clearly be an average starter at minimum; you're not gonna get 3+ 1000 yard receivers on a team.

IMHO, build the O-Line and defense...let the QB make his WRs and TEs good, let the OL make the RB great instead of vice versa. I'd much rather have the Cowboys OL and high school WRs than our current WRs and OLs.

 

You seem to be under the impression that Nicks is 7th by choice and not because there's something wrong with him.

 

Like bad feet, ankles,  legs, knees.     Read the posts around here.    No one thinks the Nicks we have is the Nicks from when he was great with the Giants.    We're not choosing to pass to other players because we think all of them are better.    We're throwing elsewhere because Nicks has had trouble all year getting open.    He can't separate from anyone.

 

If Nicks goes to another team,  maybe he does alright -- maybe.    But maybe he ends up with another team as he did with us.   A guy who can't get open and his QB has to throw the ball to someone else.

 

Your one saving grace in this is this past week Nicks began to show flashes of what we were hoping we'd get from him from Day One.    If he delivers this Sunday and against Tennessee and then in the playoffs too,   then maybe Nicks still has something left in the tank.

 

But he hasn't shown much all year.    So that simply may be who he is these days.

[FalseStart]

I think over the past two games (Browns and Texas) you have seen what our offensive is capable of with a bad Running game and a injured Reggie Wayne.  I still think BPA would have to include a WR in either RD 1-3. Unless our needs change...I think our DTs will improve with another year of experience.

 

Realistic Guys I like:  

 

LB: Mckinney, Wilson

OL: Erving G/C/OT, Cann G, Ogbuhei G , Grasu C, Jackson G, Collins G/OT ,Matias G, Dismukes C, Humphries OT/G

WR:  Coates, Green-Beckham, Agholor, Greene, 

DE: Calhoun, Dupree, Edwards, Maudin, Anderson, Orchard

RB: Coleman, Allen, Abdullah

CB/S Prewitt, Peters, Collins

[Bleedin Blue]

We don't need to draft another wide receiver.  We technically have 5 now (TY, Moncrief, Fleener, Allen, Wayne).  We could go get a quality slot receiver FA and focus our draft on defense and a round 1 or 2 O-lineman.  This draft has tons of defensive play makers in all rounds and we can pick up a RB or two in round 5-7.  There are many great pass rushing OLBs to be had in rounds 1-3 as well. 

[crazycolt1]

I sure hope he doesn't whiff on defensive picks.    Because if he does,  then we're so screwed!

 

I'm not ready to call Werner a bust yet,   and Newsome may turn into something.    And I hope Hughes does too.

 

But otherwise,  we haven't invested much in defensive players and that's what I'm expecting this year....    a big investment on that side of the ball.

IMO the O-line needs the most improvement. Maybe taking the best player available might be the way to go since the Colts have great needs on both sides of the ball?

[NewColtsFan]

IMO the O-line needs the most improvement. Maybe taking the best player available might be the way to go since the Colts have great needs on both sides of the ball?

 

As we sit here today,  Dec. 27, I confess my mind bounces around a lot of ideas about the draft and free agency and how to get better......

 

As of today -- and I reserve the right to change my mind based on any and all new information that is sure to come -- I'm leaning toward this...

 

1st R:   o-line.    We just have to get it right, both for Luck and for the running game.   Our offense will never max out until we do.

2nd R:   d-line or Safety.      We have to start investing heavily on defense.   Both are positions of need, I'm fine with either.

3rd R:    Safety or d-line.     Whatever we don't take in the 2nd round we'll need here.

4th R:    ILB.     I think we can get a quality linebacker here.

5th R:    RB.     I'd also get one in free agency as well.   We may need to replace both Bradshaw and Ballard.

6th R:    WR.    Development guy.   Hopefully like Brazil athletically, but without all the off the field baggage

7th R:    BPA.   At this point, I'll take any quality player regardless of position.

 

 

I suspect I might change my mind between now and then.   But it feels like when we lose,  we're losing at the line of scrimmage.  Both sides of the ball.   So, it feels to me that we have to start investing top-100 picks on those positions.   We also have to be strong up the middle, so the need for safety and ILB.

 

Sorry....   it's nearly 2am as I'm writing...   just wanted to respond to your post....

[John Dee]

The problem with this D is the O and the inability to run the ball...     the D was GREAT early in the season when this O led the league in TOP.        BUT since around the NE game....   uhhh    This O has been pedestrian.    And the reasons are obvious.  

 

And losing Brad was a lot bigger than we all are realizing.    Things did in fact go south when Brad got hurt.    He was HUGE for this O. 

 

I think the D is not that far off from being above average.    But this D NEEDS a pass rusher or two to emerge or get drafted or signed.   And I am confident Grigs will go after OL and DE/OLB hard in the offseason.    

 

The honeymoon is over for Chuck and Grigs ...     IF Indy could squeeze one more good year out of Mathis that would be HUGE.

 

 

I'm strongly against this type of trading simply because the Colts are NOT one or two key defensive players away from competing at a higher level.     We're just not.

 

Our grocery list of needs is long....   and it's on both sides of the ball.     We'll need most, if not all of our picks.

 

We're not as close as we'd like to building a monster....   especially not on the defensive side of the ball.....

 

Patience will be needed.....

[John Dee]

EXACTLY we are losing at the LOS...       Both lines need attention and A Lot of it. . 

 

I would hit the D hard in the draft and I would spend BIG $$ on the OL in FA.      Or as much as possible.   And I would really like one of these GREAT RB's that are all coming out...  Gordon, Gurley, Duke J, AA, Davis, T Coleman...    but recent mocks I look at are having all of  them going pretty fast withing round 2 early 3 at the latest.       

 

Dang it would be wonderful if Gurley dropped into the 3rd round but he won't..

 

It will work out...   And I am bringing Brad back...    if I am Grigs...

As we sit here today,  Dec. 27, I confess my mind bounces around a lot of ideas about the draft and free agency and how to get better......

 

As of today -- and I reserve the right to change my mind based on any and all new information that is sure to come -- I'm leaning toward this...

 

1st R:   o-line.    We just have to get it right, both for Luck and for the running game.   Our offense will never max out until we do.

2nd R:   d-line or Safety.      We have to start investing heavily on defense.   Both are positions of need, I'm fine with either.

3rd R:    Safety or d-line.     Whatever we don't take in the 2nd round we'll need here.

4th R:    ILB.     I think we can get a quality linebacker here.

5th R:    RB.     I'd also get one in free agency as well.   We may need to replace both Bradshaw and Ballard.

6th R:    WR.    Development guy.   Hopefully like Brazil athletically, but without all the off the field baggage

7th R:    BPA.   At this point, I'll take any quality player regardless of position.

 

 

I suspect I might change my mind between now and then.   But it feels like when we lose,  we're losing at the line of scrimmage.  Both sides of the ball.   So, it feels to me that we have to start investing top-100 picks on those positions.   We also have to be strong up the middle, so the need for safety and ILB.

 

Sorry....   it's nearly 2am as I'm writing...   just wanted to respond to your post....

[NewColtsFan]

EXACTLY we are losing at the LOS...       Both lines need attention and A Lot of it. . 

 

I would hit the D hard in the draft and I would spend BIG $$ on the OL in FA.      Or as much as possible.   And I would really like one of these GREAT RB's that are all coming out...  Gordon, Gurley, Duke J, AA, Davis, T Coleman...    but recent mocks I look at are having all of  them going pretty fast withing round 2 early 3 at the latest.       

 

Dang it would be wonderful if Gurley dropped into the 3rd round but he won't..

 

It will work out...   And I am bringing Brad back...    if I am Grigs...

 

Yup....   I'm in favor of bringing him back as well.

 

The problem is,  we likely won't know until late spring (post draft) or early summer just how good he can be and how much we can count on him.

 

That's why I'm fine if we also bring in a FA running back as well as drafting one.    We can't be caught short here....

 

Good post....   the running game disappeared and so did our offense....

[Deano1818]

I just spent some time looking at the top performing rookies the last few years makes trading up look like a really bad idea . Seems in theory teams are better off piling up picks and finding the gems in mid and late rounds .

Agree 100%

The "can't miss" picks seem to miss in many cases

We could actually pick up some later picks with our first.

Many solid, contributing : safeties, OGs, and LBs come in 2 thru 5 rounds

We have many holes.......

It's sort of like bullets in a gun........

You could have the biggest baddest bullet known to man........ It's no good IF YOU MISS!

Better to have many bullets, the ONE needed, may be right there.......

[DougDew]

IMO, the most glaring need on the entire team is S.  Not that the play at the position has been particularly bad, but there is no young player that has been added in the past three years that can take over for the vets or add depth.

 

Howell was supposed to be that guy but he has neck issues. 

 

All of the G/Cs are young.  The OLBs have Werner and Newsome.  And the DL has Chap, Hughes, and Kerr.

 

I don't think a team should draft in a way that cuts off their previous drafts at the knees... meaning..the new draft choice shouldn't keep a recent draft choice from developing.

 

Using that as a criteria, S, another ILB, and a slot WR are the priorities. 

 

I'm not sure that trading up into the top 15 is the way to go (kind of contrary to my previous post in this thread), especially since productive players at those positions can be found in later picks, but moving up some in the early rounds to get a playmaker at those positions would seem like sound strategy to me.

[rock8591]

OL, S, ILB are biggest needs.

[Deano1818]

Pass rush???

We have to have a pass rush......

Last year the ONLY pass rusher we had was Mathis.... It wasn't enough

I agree that we need help at S, OL, ILB,....... But don't leave out a pass rusher