Hold up....Donald Brown

[Indyfan4life]

Brown was also on pace for over 1,000 yards before he got hurt. We *should* have a *decent* Oline this year, better than last. Give him a shot with the new unit and see how it goes. For all we know he could have a 1,200+ yard rushing season.

[RomanianColtsFan]

I have been really irritated with some fans' fixation on Donald Brown being a sub par RB or even a bust.

He did not benefit of good OL play, he was often injured, there are many well founded excuses.

What bothers me even more is the complete disregard of his running statistics and the opinion of actual football people.

 

Some fans think that Ballard is much better even though the average yards/carry is the same, 3.9 last year, with a career average of 4.1 for Donald. In 2011, running behind a pretty bad OL he had a 4.8 average, coincidentally the year when he was healthy the entire season.  

 

I personally can't wait to watch Donald next season provided he stays healthy.

[schwamm]

The Brown bashing is exhausting, especially when most is unfounded, or flat out wrong.

I also think it is amusing that posters are quick to discount DB's 80 yard scamper in '11, but claim Ballard is a "big play back" because of one spectacular twisting dive into the endzone last year.

Truth is, DB has been steady but mostly unremarkable behind a decaying OLine (got progressively worse each year he's been with the Colts), has been very careful with the football, has really come on with his blocking and receiving out of the backfield, and was putting up the better stats last year, until he was injured. His biggest problem continues to be that he may be too fragile for this league.

Stats have been provided ad nauseum, though, to show that Brown was not hardly as ineffective as some of you want to claim. I'm not going to bother digging them up again, because it seems so much easier for some of you to bury your head in the sand of your reality than to actually see what's happening on the field.

[Narcosys]

Their career ypc is the same I think. Doesn't sound like he is that far and away better.

If a rookie can come in and do just as good against the 4yr veteran starter, something's wrong. If that's all your argument is, it's a losing one.

And the speed isn't that drastic of a difference. 4.51 or 4.65. So he doesn't have that much speed over him. But he has shown he has better vision, which is huge for a RB to be successful.

[PMan Escape Plan]

its not that people dont like donald brown... its that they dont like that he was a 1st rnd pick

[TKnight24]

its not that people dont like donald brown... its that they dont like that he was a 1st rnd pick

Yep, same as the Jerry Hughes bashing. It's Polian fault they got drafted that high. I'm a TCU Fan, I knew Hughes wasn't a 1st rounder. Polian obviously wasn't to bright I supoose

[Narcosys]

He did not benefit of good OL play, he was often injured, there are many well founded excuses.

.

why would you want an often injured RB? If an excuse is well founded...IT'S NOT AN EXCUSE!

[John Dee]

There will be a lot of disappointed "Vick" fans when Donald starts week one. 

 

The two are a "very dynamic" backfield.        With the re vamped OL...  and an OC who WANTS to run the football.    This is going to be a good year for ALL Colt backs.

There's a lot of Ballard love-ins on this Forum, and the guy hasn't even played one full season as starter. And I bet it's the same guys who decry the sensationalism written by Kravitz and BBS etc.

 

Crown him the messiah of our back field once he puts up a few thousand more yards please.

[Narcosys]

Some fans think that Ballard is much better even though the average yards/carry is the same, 3.9 last year, with a career average of 4.1 for Donald. In 2011, running behind a pretty bad OL he had a 4.8 average..

Oh and that 4.8 average was bloated by one 80 yard run that was saved by orlovsky. Otherwise it's a 4.1 season.

[RomanianColtsFan]

why would you want an often injured RB? If an excuse is well founded...IT'S NOT AN EXCUSE!

 

Well, I am glad I gave you a good laugh at least. Why do I want an often injured RB? Maybe because I don't view players like pieces of meat like some in the macho, business only minded  football world.  

[Pombi9]

Pass Protection.

If that is true why on earth is Joseph Addai not on our roster. Or any NFL roster for that matter.

[Narcosys]

Well, I am glad I gave you a good laugh at least. Why do I want an often injured RB? Maybe because I don't view players like pieces of meat like some in the macho, business only minded football world.

Well that would def cost you some serious cash.

[braveheartcolt]

Oh and that 4.8 average was bloated by one 80 yard run that was saved by orlovsky. Otherwise it's a 4.1 season.

They should not allow big plays! Ban them I say! And you should get double the kudos for back twisting TD plays. It's getting beyond pathetic that long runs are even allowed.

[braveheartcolt]

If a rookie can come in and do just as good against the 4yr veteran starter, something's wrong. If that's all your argument is, it's a losing one.

And the speed isn't that drastic of a difference. 4.51 or 4.65. So he doesn't have that much speed over him. But he has shown he has better vision, which is huge for a RB to be successful.

You are so blind to your own weak reasoning that all you can do is focus on one aspect of RB play, conveniently ignoring DB's obvious strengths....good luck. 

[Narcosys]

You are so blind to your own weak reasoning that all you can do is focus on one aspect of RB play, conveniently ignoring DB's obvious strengths....good luck.

Can you name his strengths that Ballard doesn't have please. Plus, all the great RB's had excellent vision, sanders, smith, Dickerson, Peterson, etc.. I'd say its pretty important.

[Narcosys]

They should not allow big plays! Ban them I say! And you should get double the kudos for back twisting TD plays. It's getting beyond pathetic that long runs are even allowed.

Brian is that you? . I've already been through this, so instead of explaining the scientific method to you about normalizing data, excluding fluke plays, etc.. I'm just going to say trust me. Donald can't produce that on a seasonal basis.

I'm only saying Brown isn't as good as people seem to obsess about him, it's like your all personally invested in him and refuse to admit he's not an above par RB. Ballard may not be either, but he has atleast shown that he should be given the chance to be starter over Brown, because he sure hasn't done enough to be.

[Gavin]

Brian is that you? . I've already been through this, so instead of explaining the scientific method to you about normalizing data, excluding fluke plays, etc.. I'm just going to say trust me. Donald can't produce that on a seasonal basis.

I'm only saying Brown isn't as good as people seem to obsess about him, it's like your all personally invested in him and refuse to admit he's not an above par RB. Ballard may not be either, but he has atleast shown that he should be given the chance to be starter over Brown, because he sure hasn't done enough to be.

2 things:

 

1.You asked to know what strengths Brown has that Ballard does not.......So I will ask you.......Have you ever seen Ballard go 80 yards for a TD on 1 play? How about 45 or 49? Brown did that against Tennessee, Miami and St Louis

 

2.If you dont want to involve those "fluke plays" as you call them....even though they were earned every step of the way Brown still carried the ball for 4.2 ypc in 2011......In 2010 lets take out his 49 yarder, well he carried the ball for 3.5 ypc not very good of course BUT still better then what Darren Mcfadden averaged this year at 3.3 through 12 starts (Brown only started 8 games that year)

 

 

The 2 points above are not to make a case for or against Brown, He does not show alot of agility in his cuts and is much more of a darter, he even was that way in college.......None of those is his biggest problem however...His biggest problem is he cant stay healthy. With an NFL caliber O Line there is no doubt the man can be very productive and very easily give you a 1000 yard season or more if given the number of touches  if he could stay healthy but he just cant, he had 645 yards in 2011 in just 134 carries so obviously the talent is there...But the health is not....He is not a big guy at all not so much in height but in thickness, I got his autograph last year, He is not built like Darren Sproles who is even shorter but quite a bit thicker in my opinion...even though Sproles is listed as even less in weight, And Brown is certainly no Jamal Lewis who was only 1 inch bigger but 35 pounds heavier

[Narcosys]

2 things:

1.You asked to know what strengths Brown has that Ballard does not.......So I will ask you.......Have you ever seen Ballard go 80 yards for a TD on 1 play? How about 45 or 49? Brown did that against Tennessee, Miami and St Louis

2.If you dont want to involve those "fluke plays" as you call them....even though they were earned every step of the way Brown still carried the ball for 4.2 ypc in 2011......In 2010 lets take out his 49 yarder, well he carried the ball for 3.5 ypc not very good of course BUT still better then what Darren Mcfadden averaged this year at 3.3 through 12 starts (Brown only started 8 games that year)

The 2 points above are not to make a case for or against Brown, He does not show alot of agility in his cuts and is much more of a darter, he even was that way in college.......None of those is his biggest problem however...His biggest problem is he cant stay healthy. With an NFL caliber O Line there is no doubt the man can be very productive and very easily give you a 1000 yard season or more if given the number of touches if he could stay healthy but he just cant, he had 645 yards in 2011 in just 134 carries so obviously the talent is there...But the health is not....He is not a big guy at all not so much in height but in thickness, I got his autograph last year, He is not built like Darren Sproles who is even shorter but quite a bit thicker in my opinion...even though Sproles is listed as even less in weight, And Brown is certainly no Jamal Lewis who was only 1 inch bigger but 35 pounds heavier

The only one I normalized was the 80 yd run so that you can get a better feel for what his true ypc was. He wouldn't have even had that run if not for Orlovsky either.

And here we go with the speed thing. If that's his only strength over Ballard, then I'm not impressed cause they are nearly equal in that aspect.

With an 'NFL caliber Oline', nearly any back can do well. But this dream of an Oline is maybe but a handful teams. One if which we will never be. You either have a run Oline, pass protect Oline, or neither. Rarely is any team excellent at both. Seeing as Luck is the future, we will rely in pass over run. DB was put in a crappy situation and may have significantly hurt his potential in the NFL. I don't view him as one we can rely on to get that 1-2 yds for the first down. Which is what our backs are mostly used for. I know last year it was different, but I don't expect us to do it again this year.

On a Minnesota like team, he could have a 1500+ season, but were not that, and doubt we ever will be. If people are getting excited about possibly having a 1000 yd rusher, that only proves my point that were not a run team.

Donald only missed like 3 games last year but yet a rookie took over the carries from him. Now we have this kershawn Williams guy that everyone seems to be gushing over, he could be in trouble. I supported him for 3 years, but even when my wife comes to say he's bad, (Who I got into liking the colts and football just over 3 years ago) then something is wrong. I argued for him, but he kept making me put my foot in my mouth.

I'm over him, I hope he does well, just not on our team.

[braveheartcolt]

Can you name his strengths that Ballard doesn't have please. Plus, all the great RB's had excellent vision, sanders, smith, Dickerson, Peterson, etc.. I'd say its pretty important.

You seem to think I don't see 'good vision' as important. What I struggle with is how you 'measure it'? You say Ballard (who I do like in case you are getting the wrong end of the stick) has far superior vision than Brown. I ask, how to you know. His yardage isn't any better, so how can you be sure. I've searched the NFL stats page, but nothing. With Brown, Does breaking off 80 yard runs not show good vision? Vick may turn out to be a better back, but he has not done enough in my opinion to trash Brown in comparison.  

 

Brown has better breakaway speed. His ball security is better, his blocking potentially better now, and he generally has good receiving hands. He also gets some tough yards.

[Gavin]

The only one I normalized was the 80 yd run so that you can get a better feel for what his true ypc was. He wouldn't have even had that run if not for Orlovsky either.

And here we go with the speed thing. If that's his only strength over Ballard, then I'm not impressed cause they are nearly equal in that aspect.

With an 'NFL caliber Oline', nearly any back can do well. But this dream of an Oline is maybe but a handful teams. One if which we will never be. You either have a run Oline, pass protect Oline, or neither. Rarely is any team excellent at both. Seeing as Luck is the future, we will rely in pass over run. DB was put in a crappy situation and may have significantly hurt his potential in the NFL. I don't view him as one we can rely on to get that 1-2 yds for the first down. Which is what our backs are mostly used for. I know last year it was different, but I don't expect us to do it again this year.

On a Minnesota like team, he could have a 1500+ season, but were not that, and doubt we ever will be. If people are getting excited about possibly having a 1000 yd rusher, that only proves my point that were not a run team.

Donald only missed like 3 games last year but yet a rookie took over the carries from him. Now we have this kershawn Williams guy that everyone seems to be gushing over, he could be in trouble. I supported him for 3 years, but even when my wife comes to say he's bad, (Who I got into liking the colts and football just over 3 years ago) then something is wrong. I argued for him, but he kept making me put my foot in my mouth.

I'm over him, I hope he does well, just not on our team.

"The only one I normalized was the 80 yd run so that you can get a better feel for what his true ypc was. He wouldn't have even had that run if not for Orlovsky either". Blatant  disregard the fact that Brown had to change directions avoid his QB turn the corner and run away from an entire defense because our O Line got ovewhelmed?

 

 

 

"With an 'NFL caliber Oline', nearly any back can do well. But this dream of an Oline is maybe but a handful teams. One if which we will never be. You either have a run Oline, pass protect Oline, or neither."

 

Your mixing pro bowl caliber O Line players with NFL caliber O Line, we had neither last year in a couple areas, primarily Guards

 

"One if which we will never be. You either have a run Oline, pass protect Oline, or neither. Rarely is any team excellent at both."

 

Then why was Tampa Bay tied for 5th in the league in least amount of sacks allowed with Josh Freeman as there QB and still 15th in total rushing yards, he is not a scrambler that much and his numbers are not great

 

 "Seeing as Luck is the future, we will rely in pass over run"

 

Most teams do but were still going to establish the run UNLESS we get behind big early and are forced to sling the ball 50 times....And you need a good O Line for that or you have D Linemen and Linebackers T'ing off on your QB

 

 

"If people are getting excited about possibly having a 1000 yd rusher, that only proves my point that were not a run team".

 

Wrong-That just means people are getting excited of the possibility that we will actually be able to run the ball.......Im cautiously optimistic we will be able to, Like I said, we will be a pass first team but we wont be a pass only team like we were last year and for a fair amount of the Manning era as well

 

"DB was put in a crappy situation and may have significantly hurt his potential in the NFL." Agree do to bad O Line play and health

 

"I don't view him as one we can rely on to get that 1-2 yds for the first down. Which is what our backs are mostly used for."

 

The 1st part of that is nonsensical and there is proof to refute that statement and a fair amount of it....As to our Backs mostly being used for just to get the first down thats also false, Generally teams have short yardage run plays in there Playbook, longer yardage designed plays and medium yardage, ya run the play how its designed and what its designed for, But if there is open field ya hit it

 

 

"Donald only missed like 3 games last year but yet a rookie took over the carries from him"

 

Thats what happens when an injury lingers and the Back you put in for him is doing well

 

 

Now we have this kershawn Williams guy that everyone seems to be gushing over, he could be in trouble. I supported him for 3 years, but even when my wife comes to say he's bad, (Who I got into liking the colts and football just over 3 years ago) then something is wrong. I argued for him, but he kept making me put my foot in my mouth.

 

 

Not sure how you mean he is bad-He is a change of pace Back who had 15 td's and 1512 yards last yea who shows vision and ability to cut quickly....Its also Kerwynn Williams

[mvbighead]

There's a lot of Ballard love-ins on this Forum, and the guy hasn't even played one full season as starter. And I bet it's the same guys who decry the sensationalism written by Kravitz and BBS etc.

 

Crown him the messiah of our back field once he puts up a few thousand more yards please.

 

Sorry, but at this point, Ballard deserves far more credit than Brown.

 

In Brown's best season, he put up 645 yards on 134 carries, add in 86 yards on 16 receptions.  And a total of 5 TDs.

 

In Ballard's best and only season, he put up 814 yards on 211 carries.Add in 152 yards on 17 receptions.  And a total of 3 TDs.

 

Frankly, I am sick of all the excuses for Brown.  "Well, he's been injured..."  Being frequently injured and unavailable, IMO, is not a valid excuse.  If you're not durable, RB is not the position for you.  Sure, he's done better this year, behind a slightly better Oline, but he was still outperformed by Ballard, who stayed healthy for the entire duration.

 

Long story short, Brown has never truly seized the opportunities he has had.  The team had far more interest and investment in him, and it never truly took.  At this point, he is worthy of his salary figure for this year, and being in the spell back role behind Ballard.  Should we lose Ballard, we at least have a capable RB behind him.  But as far as I see it, Ballard is simply far more reliable than Brown has ever been.

 

I don't see all this love and fascination with a guy who has had 4 seasons to prove something, and is already being outshined by a 1st year player.  Brown makes some plays here and there, but his body of work leaves a lot to be desired.

[jskinnz]

Can't tell the people on this site that I've tried...You'd think we have Emmitt Smith and Marshall Faulk the way these people on here talk...Ballard is good, but I'd prefer he be a #2 back and I'm hopeful we get our thoroughbred next year cause we do need 1...We got the "In the trenches" guys by reaching in the 3rd and 4th and passing up superior talent so i hope everyone on here is happy...I as a Colts fan hope they turn out to be studs but it's far from guaranteed and "Rookie" o-linemen usually struggle..

 

Several Dear God worthy posts in this thread from you. 

 

1) No one here thinks that Brown & Ballard are the 2013 version of Smith and Faulk.  No one.  Has the running game throughout the NFL been devalued - absolutely.  But your characterization of what people on here think of Brown & Ballard is comical and over the top.

 

2) To say they passed over guys with superior talent requires you to have access to the Colts draft board and somehow I doubt you have that.  Otherwise, that is more comical and frankly just silly analysis.

 

3) Are skill position players more likely to succeed than in the trench players?  I would guess there is bust potential with either so the logic on that argument fails. 

[Gavin]

Sorry, but at this point, Ballard deserves far more credit than Brown.

 

In Brown's best season, he put up 645 yards on 134 carries, add in 86 yards on 16 receptions.  And a total of 5 TDs.

 

In Ballard's best and only season, he put up 814 yards on 211 carries.Add in 152 yards on 17 receptions.  And a total of 3 TDs.

 

Frankly, I am sick of all the excuses for Brown.  "Well, he's been injured..."  Being frequently injured and unavailable, IMO, is not a valid excuse.  If you're not durable, RB is not the position for you.  Sure, he's done better this year, behind a slightly better Oline, but he was still outperformed by Ballard, who stayed healthy for the entire duration.

 

Long story short, Brown has never truly seized the opportunities he has had.  The team had far more interest and investment in him, and it never truly took.  At this point, he is worthy of his salary figure for this year, and being in the spell back role behind Ballard.  Should we lose Ballard, we at least have a capable RB behind him.  But as far as I see it, Ballard is simply far more reliable than Brown has ever been.

 

I don't see all this love and fascination with a guy who has had 4 seasons to prove something, and is already being outshined by a 1st year player.  Brown makes some plays here and there, but his body of work leaves a lot to be desired.

you do realize that 134 carries and 645 yards....or 4.8 ypc was with him only starting 2 games that year right?.......2 games behind yet another subpar O Line...mainly do to age mixed in with some lack of talent, Injuries are  a part of the game they are gonna happen thats not an excuse, thats a fact, that does not mean a player does not have talent, It just means that player cant stay healthy, That is Browns biggest problem not an excuse........your aware that had Brown remained healthy Ballard would not have had quite as many touches as he had right? Which means less yards and quite possibly those TD's may not have happened, Big assumption there I know but a valid one cosidering he had 3 total on the year and the 2 rushing td's did not come until week 13 and 17 of the season........A better argument can be made for Ballard with his running style vs Browns running style, Brown is a darter when it comes to running the ball, Ballard is a bit of a slasher with some but not a ton of power, He is certainly no Jamal Lewis or Jerome Bettis

[schwamm]

Frankly, I am sick of all the excuses for Brown. "Well, he's been injured..." Being frequently injured and unavailable, IMO, is not a valid excuse. If you're not durable, RB is not the position for you. Sure, he's done better this year, behind a slightly better Oline, but he was still outperformed by Ballard, who stayed healthy for the entire duration.

Ballard is simply far more reliable than Brown has ever been..

I agree with the durability. Absolutely.

I take issue, though, with the argument that Ballard performed better. That's not what I saw last year, and it wasn't what the stats suggest.

Brown has been pretty solid, and consistently so... when he's been able to stay on the field... which he just doesn't seem able to do.

I guess I'm just hoping that an improved line may mean DB has a better chance of staying healthy.

[mjsimans]

I have been really irritated with some fans' fixation on Donald Brown being a sub par RB or even a bust.

He did not benefit of good OL play, he was often injured, there are many well founded excuses.

What bothers me even more is the complete disregard of his running statistics and the opinion of actual football people.

 

Some fans think that Ballard is much better even though the average yards/carry is the same, 3.9 last year, with a career average of 4.1 for Donald. In 2011, running behind a pretty bad OL he had a 4.8 average, coincidentally the year when he was healthy the entire season.  

 

I personally can't wait to watch Donald next season provided he stays healthy.

 

thats what i'm saying! thanks for the stats.

[schwamm]

Donald only missed like 3 games last year but yet a rookie took over the carries from him.

This just makes me wonder if you actually watched any games or even know which guy DB is. Or maybe you are one of those guys who just regurgitates nonsense.

Donald missed 7 games last year. He was first injured in the GB game, tried to come back in game 8, but got dinged up again. After sitting out week 9, he tried to play in games 10-13, but was too banged up to contribute much, so the team finally IR'd him for the last 4.

If you want to argue he's too fragile, I'm with you. But he didn't lose his starting job because he was getting outperformed.

[Dark Superman]

I think that was Shipley playing center when Ballard made that run against Miami..

And it's far to premature to call Ballard better than Brown.

I do think they could add a very nice 1-2 punch though..

And Williams can come off the bench.

This may mean Delone Carter is looking for a new team this fall.

[Narcosys]

You seem to think I don't see 'good vision' as important. What I struggle with is how you 'measure it'? You say Ballard (who I do like in case you are getting the wrong end of the stick) has far superior vision than Brown. I ask, how to you know. His yardage isn't any better, so how can you be sure. I've searched the NFL stats page, but nothing. With Brown, Does breaking off 80 yard runs not show good vision? Vick may turn out to be a better back, but he has not done enough in my opinion to trash Brown in comparison.

Brown has better breakaway speed. His ball security is better, his blocking potentially better now, and he generally has good receiving hands. He also gets some tough yards.

You say runs like it happened more than once. No I don't. It was a broken play that orlovsky got a lead block and the sideline was wide open. Breakaway speed cannot be compared as Ballard hasn't had the chance to demonstrate, plus that's not what he's designed for. Ballard got his yards even when plays broke. He adjusted, moved to the holes that formed, brown does not. He just goes where he's told. It's like watching a monkey h....... A football. That's how I'm sure in my opinion. The kid is a rookie and took over the starting job. And I don't need to compare to 'trash' brown. Brown does enough for that.

[mvbighead]

you do realize that 134 carries and 645 yards....or 4.8 ypc was with him only starting 2 games that year right?.......2 games behind yet another subpar O Line...mainly do to age mixed in with some lack of talent, Injuries are  a part of the game they are gonna happen thats not an excuse, thats a fact, that does not mean a player does not have talent, It just means that player cant stay healthy, That is Browns biggest problem not an excuse........your aware that had Brown remained healthy Ballard would not have had quite as many touches as he had right? Which means less yards and quite possibly those TD's may not have happened, Big assumption there I know but a valid one cosidering he had 3 total on the year and the 2 rushing td's did not come until week 13 and 17 of the season........A better argument can be made for Ballard with his running style vs Browns running style, Brown is a darter when it comes to running the ball, Ballard is a bit of a slasher with some but not a ton of power, He is certainly no Jamal Lewis or Jerome Bettis

 

Part of the benefit of the spell back is that he gets to face defenses that are already gassed.

 

As for the fact of durability, that is absolutely true.  But the problem is, many players do considerable things to improve their health. Players that aren't healthy generally don't give their team enough stability to be relied upon.  Bob Sanders was a phenomenal talent, and when he lasted a full year, the results were great.  When he last less than a few games, the results weren't so good as the team had to figure out a new method to produce without him.

 

Long story short, while Brown has some talent, he simply isn't reliable.  My point has not been that Brown sucks.  It's that he cannot be relied upon, which is evidenced by the fact that he has not yet given a season better than Ballard's only season.  Addai did far more things as the #2, and while he was still about as frail as Brown, we at least eeked a few good seasons out of him, and he was a better back overall as he could do just about everything pretty well, even as a rookie.

 

All in all, Brown is an ideal spell back, but a less than ideal starter.  If we can get 5-10 carries a game out of him, that'd be great.  I just don't buy all this "he hasn't had a chance to prove himself" crap.  He's been here for four seasons.  What he has proven hasn't been much, other than a few flashes of greatness, and otherwise largely inconsistent and unreliable play.  Ballard gets us 3-4 yards most plays, and a few flashes of greatness here and there.  And he is almost always there, thus far.

[Narcosys]

This just makes me wonder if you actually watched any games or even know which guy DB is. Or maybe you are one of those guys who just regurgitates nonsense.

Donald missed 7 games last year. He was first injured in the GB game, tried to come back in game 8, but got dinged up again. After sitting out week 9, he tried to play in games 10-13, but was too banged up to contribute much, so the team finally IR'd him for the last 4.

If you want to argue he's too fragile, I'm with you. But he didn't lose his starting job because he was getting outperformed.

Which 7 games did he miss?

http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/playergamelog?playerId=12489&season=2012〈=EN

[schwamm]

Which 7 games did he miss?

http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/playergamelog?playerId=12489&season=2012〈=EN

Weeks 6,7,9,14,15,16 and 17

[Narcosys]

Weeks 6,7,9,14,15,16 and 17

Ah dang it, im use to seeing thing list every game, played or not and list them just like they did 6 and 7.  So when i scrolled through i was looking at carries and attempts and not the weeks.  I stand corrected.

[House]

DB is quickly becoming one of those players where I say, "What am I not seeing that others are."

[Narcosys]

Blatant  disregard the fact that Brown had to change directions avoid his QB turn the corner and run away from an entire defense because our O Line got ovewhelmed?

 

 

Your mixing pro bowl caliber O Line players with NFL caliber O Line, we had neither last year in a couple areas, primarily Guards

 

 

Then why was Tampa Bay tied for 5th in the league in least amount of sacks allowed with Josh Freeman as there QB and still 15th in total rushing yards, he is not a scrambler that much and his numbers are not great

 

 

Most teams do but were still going to establish the run UNLESS we get behind big early and are forced to sling the ball 50 times....And you need a good O Line for that or you have D Linemen and Linebackers T'ing off on your QB

 

 

Wrong-That just means people are getting excited of the possibility that we will actually be able to run the ball.......Im cautiously optimistic we will be able to, Like I said, we will be a pass first team but we wont be a pass only team like we were last year and for a fair amount of the Manning era as well

 

Agree do to bad O Line play and health

 

 

The 1st part of that is nonsensical and there is proof to refute that statement and a fair amount of it....As to our Backs mostly being used for just to get the first down thats also false, Generally teams have short yardage run plays in there Playbook, longer yardage designed plays and medium yardage, ya run the play how its designed and what its designed for, But if there is open field ya hit it

 

 

Thats what happens when an injury lingers and the Back you put in for him is doing well

 

Not sure how you mean he is bad-He is a change of pace Back who had 15 td's and 1512 yards last yea who shows vision and ability to cut quickly....Its also Kerwynn Williams

 

 

Im not disregarding anything, It was pure luck.

 

Im not mixing anything.  You said NFL Caliber Oline, nothing about pro-bowl players.  Do all pro-bowlers play onthe same team?

 

I dont get the next one, I did say rarely yes?

 

Again your throwing in non subject info.  Were talking good Oline in reference to running not pass protection.

 

Fair enough i guess.  Its not wrong, i just see it the other way.  But it still goes to show that we havent been a run team.

 

He has 86 1st downs.  Hardly your refutable evidence.  14, 26, 26, 20.  How many of those were on 3rd down conversions?  And i know what teams Generally have, but we dont generally run like most teams.....because we historically cant.  It was pass all day, maybe throw in a run on the 1st play, then run on short yardage.  Bring in irrelevant info that is off subject to what we are discussing.  I dont care what other teams do, or have done, or can do or what most teams generally do.  It is what we do, have done, or generally do. 

 

When i was talking about HE, i was talking in reference to Brown.  Not wiliams.  Kershawn, Kerwynn whatever.  I didnt have the time to go look up his name.  I hope he (Kerwynn) is good for us.

[jshipp23]

Several Dear God worthy posts in this thread from you. 

 

1) No one here thinks that Brown & Ballard are the 2013 version of Smith and Faulk.  No one.  Has the running game throughout the NFL been devalued - absolutely.  But your characterization of what people on here think of Brown & Ballard is comical and over the top.

 

2) To say they passed over guys with superior talent requires you to have access to the Colts draft board and somehow I doubt you have that.  Otherwise, that is more comical and frankly just silly analysis.

 

3) Are skill position players more likely to succeed than in the trench players?  I would guess there is bust potential with either so the logic on that argument fails. 

Historically, O-linemen, even those highly drafted struggle year 1 much more than skill positions and defensive line positions....It is a major adjustment for them with the exotic defenses they face in the NFL as well as the size , strength, and speed of NFL defensive players....The mental aspect of o-line is almost as difficult as for quarterbacks and they don't get the benefit of dumbed down simplified offenses like Bob Griffin 111 and Russell Wilson had generally speaking....Your lack of actual knowledge is astounding to say the least...

[Gavin]

Im not disregarding anything, It was pure luck.

 

Im not mixing anything.  You said NFL Caliber Oline, nothing about pro-bowl players.  Do all pro-bowlers play onthe same team?

 

I dont get the next one, I did say rarely yes?

 

Again your throwing in non subject info.  Were talking good Oline in reference to running not pass protection.

 

Fair enough i guess.  Its not wrong, i just see it the other way.  But it still goes to show that we havent been a run team.

 

He has 86 1st downs.  Hardly your refutable evidence.  14, 26, 26, 20.  How many of those were on 3rd down conversions?  And i know what teams Generally have, but we dont generally run like most teams.....because we historically cant.  It was pass all day, maybe throw in a run on the 1st play, then run on short yardage.  Bring in irrelevant info that is off subject to what we are discussing.  I dont care what other teams do, or have done, or can do or what most teams generally do.  It is what we do, have done, or generally do. 

 

When i was talking about HE, i was talking in reference to Brown.  Not wiliams.  Kershawn, Kerwynn whatever.  I didnt have the time to go look up his name.  I hope he (Kerwynn) is good for us.

1.It was not luck, it was bad tackling

2.we were not going to be a run team under Manning

3.I dont think Pagano is worried about what the Colts did historically under a different scheme and players entirely

4.86 1st dows over 449 career carries thats 19.2% of his carries have went for a 1st down compared to 24.1 percent by MJD while Brown has had far FAR less carries

 

He is probably not going to be returning next season but its not do to lack of talent but lack of staying healthy

[Narcosys]

1.It was not luck, it was bad tackling

2.we were not going to be a run team under Manning

3.I dont think Pagano is worried about what the Colts did historically under a different scheme and players entirely

4.86 1st dows over 449 career carries thats 19.2% of his carries have went for a 1st down compared to 24.1 percent by MJD while Brown has had far FAR less carries

He is probably not going to be returning next season but its not do to lack of talent but lack of staying healthy

Nice, i doubt there is a way to breakdown the down/distance that he got those on is there? Curios on how many if those were on short yardage, and how many on longer runs (>3).

[a06cc]

Donald Browns return this season depends on how he fits the new system. I personally think he fits at a catch out of the backfield stand point. Running is something I need to see with us "upgrading" the Oline. I still think we need a left tackle, some my disagree...

[ar1888]

your joking right?

No I am not. Donald Guesses wrong on his assignment all the time. Looks lost in pass protection.

[jshipp23]

DONALD BROWN IS PUUUURRRREEEE BUM YOU *AS!!!