Luck Era vs Manning Era

[amfootball]

Luck didn't exceed the other two rookie QBs in any way and you are just making excuses for Luck. He leads the NFL in excuses!!

just curious as to your take on Manning's 9-11 playoff record? Are his 8 one and done's mostly on him or the team around him?

[Balzer40]

Luck didn't exceed the other two rookie QBs in any way and you are just making excuses for Luck. He leads the NFL in excuses!!

 

 

You feel this way because you are one of the one's that don't fully understand the game. Sorry if that's an insult to you, but you prove it more with every post you make.

[Dustin]

You feel this way because you are one of the one's that don't fully understand the game. Sorry if that's an insult to you, but you prove it more with every post you make.

 

That's an understatement.

[amfootball]

Lol AM we've had this discussion before about Morris. Lynch is self-explanatory of course. Neither the Colts, Redskins, nor Seahawks were playoff teams the season before they drafted their three signal-callers. Heck, the Redskins were considered mediocre bottom-feeders, but the Seahawks were on the rise already

But you cant dispute that of the three, luck was in the worst situation on the inferior team? or can you. :-)

[Jason_]

There's also a few posters on here that love to bash every part of our team so that Luck gets too much credit.   Apparently we only have Luck, Wayne, McAfee and the rest are scrubs.

 

I agree with that.  A lot of people point to the turn around from a 2-14 team to an 11-5 team.  Yes that is true, but that's not all on Luck.  It's also on having a coaching staff that doesn't run a tampa 2, prevent defense almost 60% of the time.  It's about having an offensive coordinator that has somewhat of a clue.  It's about not trying to force a former 7th round draft pick to run the offense in the same manner that Peyton Manning did.  

 

I also think that some people are a little harsh on the run game from last year.  There were several games where the run game was effective, but for the season they still ranked very low.  However, that had a lot more to do with the playcalling than execution, imo.  I do agree that we had a very poor offensive line, especially when it came down to pass blocking.  However they were fairly decent at run blocking.

[Dustin]

I agree with that.  A lot of people point to the turn around from a 2-14 team to an 11-5 team.  Yes that is true, but that's not all on Luck.  It's also on having a coaching staff that doesn't run a tampa 2, prevent defense almost 60% of the time.  It's about having an offensive coordinator that has somewhat of a clue.  It's about not trying to force a former 7th round draft pick to run the offense in the same manner that Peyton Manning did.  

 

I also think that some people are a little harsh on the run game from last year.  There were several games where the run game was effective, but for the season they still ranked very low.  However, that had a lot more to do with the playcalling than execution, imo.  I do agree that we had a very poor offensive line, especially when it came down to pass blocking.  However they were fairly decent at run blocking.

 

Statistically they were the 2nd worst run blocking team in the league. https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/01/28/ranking-the-2012-offensive-lines/

[Jason_]

We'll see how his percentage goes up when he'd not forced to throw the ball 20+ yards every play.

 

And that's simply not true.  Yes the offense utilized a lot of deep routes, but there were underneath routes as well.  Arians said in at least one press conference that one of the things he was working with Luck on was not always trying to push the ball down-field and instead taking the check-down when necessary.

[Dustin]

And that's simply not true.  Yes the offense utilized a lot of deep routes, but there were underneath routes as well.  Arians said in at least one press conference that one of the things he was working with Luck on was not always trying to push the ball down-field and instead taking the check-down when necessary.

 

It was hyperbole. Yes Luck could have taken more checkdowns (as he should have) but the offense was built around the deep ball. Something that is one of Lucks weaknesses.

[Qwiz]

But you cant dispute that of the three, luck was in the worst situation on the inferior team? or can you. :-)

Colts went to the playoffs in 2010. Redskins hadn't been to the playoffs since 2007. You do the math.

[Jason_]

Statistically they were the 2nd worst run blocking team in the league. https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/01/28/ranking-the-2012-offensive-lines/

 

That's great....but I really don't care about profootballfocus rankings.  I watched the games and saw with my own eyes that the offensive line was able to get some push.  They were pretty poor in known short yardage, but when the playcalling was balanced, the RB's were able to get a pretty good ypc average.  Look at Ballard's ypc averages on a week to week basis.  From week 7 through week 16, he only had one game where his average was under 3.5 ypc.  

[Jason_]

It was hyperbole. Yes Luck could have taken more checkdowns (as he should have) but the offense was built around the deep ball. Something that is one of Lucks weaknesses.

 

How was it hyperbole?  You said yourself he could have, AND SHOULD HAVE, taken more check downs...that's exactly what Arians said.  So how is Arians saying it hyperbole then how is it not hyperbole for you to say it?

[Dustin]

How was it hyperbole?  You said yourself he could have, AND SHOULD HAVE, taken more check downs...that's exactly what Arians said.  So how is Arians saying it hyperbole then how is it not hyperbole for you to say it?

 

What you quoted me saying was hyperbole. He didn't throw it 20 yards every play, but he threw it deep more than any QB in the league.

[Callie]

Your husband/boyfriend is a lucky man. I've never found a good woman that gets into football like I do.

, I am single!

My mother calls me obsessed. I love the NFL channel, and always want to watch it. She also makes fun of me for demanding her to DVR the football games if I have to miss them.

[amfootball]

Colts went to the playoffs in 2010. Redskins hadn't been to the playoffs since 2007. You do the math.

but we both know it was #18 that carried them there. The team stunk. lol.  but really though Luck's team was awful in comparison. Only takes one year for a playoff team to win 6 games the next year or vice versa. I wouldn't be surprised if the Ravens win less than 8 games.

[OlBlu]

just curious as to your take on Manning's 9-11 playoff record? Are his 8 one and done's mostly on him or the team around him?

 

Neither. I think it was a "team" effort and so was the Colts 11 wins last year. I think they will struggle to get to .500 this year. I also do not think Luck will make great strides forward this year. He may in time but not this coming year.... But that is just my opinion.

[Jason_]

What you quoted me saying was hyperbole. He didn't throw it 20 yards every play, but he threw it deep more than any QB in the league.

 

So then what I quoted you as saying was completely useless to the conversation.  Yes he threw the ball downfield more than any QB in the league, but by his own choice and not because his coaching staff forced him to as you implied.  So you made an exaggerated comment to defend a guy who was doing what he did by his own choice and was less than successful because what he was trying to do is not one of his strengths.  Gotcha.

[amfootball]

And that's simply not true.  Yes the offense utilized a lot of deep routes, but there were underneath routes as well.  Arians said in at least one press conference that one of the things he was working with Luck on was not always trying to push the ball down-field and instead taking the check-down when necessary.

In other words become Brady. :-)))  That was a joke before I get berrated...

[Balzer40]

, I am single!

My mother calls me obsessed. I love the NFL channel, and always want to watch it. She also makes fun of me for demanding her to DVR the football games if I have to miss them.

 

 

 

Nothing wrong with that. That's awesome. I have tried to get my daughter to love football as much as I do so she'll sit down and watch the games with me. I've taken her to Colts camp the last few yrs. and she loves that, but she loses interest after a while watching them on TV.

[Jason_]

but we both know it was #18 that carried them there. The team stunk. lol.  but really though Luck's team was awful in comparison. Only takes one year for a playoff team to win 6 games the next year or vice versa. I wouldn't be surprised if the Ravens win less than 8 games.

 

Well that simply isn't true because Manning is so overrated.  No way could such an average QB as Peyton actually carry a team to the playoffs.  That's absurd.  Only an infinitely better QB than Peyton could single-handedly carry a team to the playoffs right?

[amfootball]

I was joking.

Well that simply isn't true because Manning is so overrated.  No way could such an average QB as Peyton actually carry a team to the playoffs.  That's absurd.  Only an infinitely better QB than Peyton could single-handedly carry a team to the playoffs right?

[Callie]

Nothing wrong with that. That's awesome. I have tried to get my daughter to love football as much as I do so she'll sit down and watch the games with me. I've taken her to Colts camp the last few yrs. and she loves that, but she loses interest after a while watching them on TV.

Since I'm going to be in Indy this summer, I will for sure hit training camp. Andrew Luck stalking for sure. ;)

[amfootball]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9099723/robert-griffin-iii-tosses-football-elephant-ringling-bros-barnum-bailey-circus

 

Yet another feather in the cap for RG supporters - he can throw to an elephant...lol. ESPN you really are reaching with this one. Slow news day apparently.

[RGIII]

but we both know it was #18 that carried them there. The team stunk. lol.  but really though Luck's team was awful in comparison. Only takes one year for a playoff team to win 6 games the next year or vice versa. I wouldn't be surprised if the Ravens win less than 8 games.

 

The Colts may have tanked for a year but I don't know that if that alone makes for a super-compelling argument that their roster was worse on the whole.  I mean, at least they still had Mathis, Freeney, Wayne, Garcon, Angerer, Bethea, Diem, Saturday, and Castonzo in 2011.  Not having even a mediocre backup QB is just a death sentence in the NFL and I suspect that they might have fared better with Rex Grossman at QB than we did.

 

The difference in how the rosters are perceived NOW is that the Skins were ahead in the rebuilding process by a few years, so we had some younger guys developing who proved to be capable of making an impact in 2012 and our offensive line had the requisite time to gel as a unit.  We also basically had a completely new cast of contributors at our offensive skill positions in 2012 from what we had in 2011, which helped tremendously.

[Dustin]

So then what I quoted you as saying was completely useless to the conversation.  Yes he threw the ball downfield more than any QB in the league, but by his own choice and not because his coaching staff forced him to as you implied.  So you made an exaggerated comment to defend a guy who was doing what he did by his own choice and was less than successful because what he was trying to do is not one of his strengths.  Gotcha.

 

Sure, if you choose to think that Roethlisberger also being Top 10 in deep pass attempts 3 times in between 2007 and 2011 (11th in 2011) was a just a coincedence and not something to do with Bruce Arians then more power to 'ya.

[OlBlu]

You feel this way because you are one of the one's that don't fully understand the game. Sorry if that's an insult to you, but you prove it more with every post you make.

 

Think whatever you want, I have been following them for 50 years and Luck isn't in the top five or Colts QBs in that time.. He might get there but he isn't close yet. When he gets to number five (if he does), It will be very hard for him pass the top four....

[NewEra]

Think whatever you want, I have been following them for 50 years and Luck isn't in the top five or Colts QBs in that time.. He might get there but he isn't close yet. When he gets to number five (if he does), It will be very hard for him pass the top four....

God forbid out rookie qb help take a 2-14 team to a 11-5 playoff appearance. All that with a new coaching staff, tons of new guys and rookies on both offense and defense and a horrible line.

Pacersdigest just called, they want their troll back. I can tell from your posts you either don't know crap about football. Or you're just flat out here to rub people the wrong way.

[jvan1973]

Think whatever you want, I have been following them for 50 years and Luck isn't in the top five or Colts QBs in that time.. He might get there but he isn't close yet. When he gets to number five (if he does), It will be very hard for him pass the top four....

unitas, jones, harbaugh, Manning?

[Dustin]

unitas, jones, Manning?

 

Painter.

[OlBlu]

God forbid out rookie qb help take a 2-14 team to a 11-5 playoff appearance. All that with a new coaching staff, tons of new guys and rookies on both offense and defense and a horrible line.

Pacersdigest just called, they want their troll back. I can tell from your posts you either don't know crap about football. Or you're just flat out here to rub people the wrong way.

 

I am not here to rub people the wrong way at all. I have watched more football than you can ever imagine. Check PD and you will see my predictions about Luck before the draft last year. You will see that I said RGIII would be an immediate star. I'll review them for you. I said that Luck threw a long ball that floated and he would be very interception prone. This is a physical problem, not a problem with the offense. I also said he was going to take lots of punishment because he did not get rid of the ball quickly. I also noted that he was not the most accurate passer in the world. Now, RGIII has a cannon. He may not complete the pass but he will get it out there long enough if the speed receiver (Garcon`) can get to it. He is also very accurate with his passes. I will admit that I didn't know much about Wilson but I was sure impressed when I saw him play. So, go ahead and call people names and spew whatever you like. I am a tough old bird and I'll be right about this in the long run.

[Fx Stryker]

 This thread is priceless. From both side.

 

I want to point out one argument though. Andrew didn't take a 2-14 team to 11-5.

 

The front office rolled over a roster from a 2-14 roster into an 11-5 roster.

 

Andrew lead a completely different team. We had different offensive philosophy. A different defensive philosophy. It was completely new all around. To say he took a 2-14 team to 11-5 makes it sound like he was just plugged into the 2011 team. Which is completely wrong.

 

Saying he lead a team filled of rookies to 11-5 is a bit more accurate.

[jvan1973]

I am not here to rub people the wrong way at all. I have watched more football than you can ever imagine. Check PD and you will see my predictions about Luck before the draft last year. You will see that I said RGIII would be an immediate star. I'll review them for you. I said that Luck threw a long ball that floated and he would be very interception prone. This is a physical problem, not a problem with the offense. I also said he was going to take lots of punishment because he did not get rid of the ball quickly. I also noted that he was not the most accurate passer in the world. Now, RGIII has a cannon. He may not complete the pass but he will get it out there long enough if the speed receiver (Garcon`) can get to it. He is also very accurate with his passes. I will admit that I didn't know much about Wilson but I was sure impressed when I saw him play. So, go ahead and call people names and spew whatever you like. I am a tough old bird and I'll be right about this in the long run.

forgive me if i take the opinions of those in the know over you

[Fx Stryker]

unitas, jones, harbaugh, Manning?

 

Morrall. He won an MVP.

 

Even though he choked the SB away.

[OlBlu]

unitas, jones, harbaugh, Manning?

Morrall and then Jack Trudeau in the modern era where I have been watching.

[OlBlu]

forgive me if i take the opinions of those in the know over you

 

That is OK, I take their opinion over yours too...

[OlBlu]

unitas, jones, harbaugh, Manning?

 

I know it is just speculation but I wonder what Johnny U's stats would have looked like if he played in the modern era. Even Peyton might not have been able to match that....

[jvan1973]

Morrall and then Jack Trudeau in the modern era where I have been watching.

trudeau....... youre out of your mind. i loved jack, but he wasnt special at all

[jvan1973]

That is OK, I take their opinion over yours too...

those in the know disagree with most everything you have said

[NewEra]

I am not here to rub people the wrong way at all. I have watched more football than you can ever imagine. Check PD and you will see my predictions about Luck before the draft last year. You will see that I said RGIII would be an immediate star. I'll review them for you. I said that Luck threw a long ball that floated and he would be very interception prone. This is a physical problem, not a problem with the offense. I also said he was going to take lots of punishment because he did not get rid of the ball quickly. I also noted that he was not the most accurate passer in the world. Now, RGIII has a cannon. He may not complete the pass but he will get it out there long enough if the speed receiver (Garcon`) can get to it. He is also very accurate with his passes. I will admit that I didn't know much about Wilson but I was sure impressed when I saw him play. So, go ahead and call people names and spew whatever you like. I am a tough old bird and I'll be right about this in the long run.

Based on what? Because everything I read was that Luck was the more accurate passer. Also, rg3 has been a media driven star. I think he did what the coaches asked him to do. But do I think he will have a better career than Luck like you claim? No fricken way!

[OlBlu]

trudeau....... youre out of your mind. i loved jack, but he wasnt special at all

 

I didn't say he was but he was ahead of Luck at the present time in my opinion. He was the starter for a few years....  In case you have not noticed, Andrew Luck has shown me nothing at all. He gets credit for the 11 wins but he shouldn't just as he should not have gotten the blame if we had lost 11 games..... I think Luck is overhyped and very overrated.... But, that is just me.

[Balzer40]

trudeau....... youre out of your mind. i loved jack, but he wasnt special at all

 

 

 

That's almost as bad as his statement that the Dolphins wouldn't trade Tannehill for Luck. Absolute nonsense and it was time to just bow out of any conversation with him. There is bullheadedness and then there is plain ignorance and that is as kindly as I can put it here.