Colts have the 15th pick in the draft. (MERGE)

[GoColts8818]

8 minutes ago, PRnum1 said:

For MHJ ?  I would do it and never look back.

Yes but is this because of the name?  Say this was 2021 and you could pay this price to go up and get Chase or you could pay less and go up and get Waddle or Smith I think most would do the later and be just as happy.  
 

I would love for Marvin Junior to be a Colt but if the Colts can get one of the other two WRs who are supposed to be right there with Marvin Junior depending on who you talk too I’d rather pay less and get one of those guys.  That’s just my two cents.  That’s also assuming Ballard will trade up for a WR which I don’t think is a lock.  

[Superman]

6 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

Respectfully 

 

I agree on Mitchell

 

But 

 

I believe DeJean is a great candidate for a boundary role in a ZONE that the Colts play the vast Majority of the time

 

He is a great tackler and has good speed

 

He would shine in our zone IMHO

 

I see DeJean differently. He could survive in our zone, I guess. But I was previously talking about boundary corners who have the speed to keep up with dynamic downfield receivers in the NFL. You say DeJean has good speed; do you think he has that kind of speed??

 

Where I think he'd be best in our defense is SS/nickel, and because I view him that way, I think the value on him is in Day 2. JMO. I know a lot of people like him way more than I do.

[ShuteAt168]

Mel Kiper just did a TV spot and he said this is the most fascinating, interesting, uncertain draft since he started in the business. Things could get crazy. I know a lot of people don’t like Kiper but I love how he brings the energy and passion. 

[w87r]

2 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Not trying to derail your hypothetical, but when healthy, JJ averages 1,600 yards, 8 TDs, 15 yards/catch. MHJ is an unknown. We can project what we think he'll do, but no one is bust-proof. So while I'd cover my eyes and push the button on a big trade for a proven NFL performer, I couldn't bring myself to give up that kind of haul to draft a rookie WR, not knowing often WRs bust. That includes the difference in player salary.

 

Just sticking to your parameters, I can't do it. We know Ballard would never do it. If Ballard's body was suddenly taken over by an alien being and he made this trade, I'd shake my head at the cost/risk, and root for the player to be a huge success. 

Yeah, it's all just for the sake of discussion.

 

I wouldn't do the trade either, if they did it I wouldn't be too upset, but still feel iffy about it. Story would be good.

 

 

I would also just rather trade less than that package for JJ.

 

#15 and 2025 2nd might bet that done.

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, w87r said:

Zach Wilson just got traded to the Broncos probably effects their 1st Rd QB plans 

 

I don't know... It's a late round pick swap, and the Jets are paying part of his salary. 

[w87r]

1 minute ago, ShuteAt168 said:

Mel Kiper just did a TV spot and he said this is the most fascinating, interesting, uncertain draft since he started in the business. Things could get crazy. I know a lot of people don’t like Kiper but I love how he brings the energy and passion. 

It is, although I watched the '83 draft yesterday. That one gets me every time.

 

Elway drama, commissioner potential interference not letting Al Davis trade up to be able to trade with Colts for Elway. Fascinating stuff that year no doubt.

 

 

I don't know which way it will go this year, I do know that I think most people will end up happy with whichever WR we end up with in round 1-3. A lot of talk now about certain this certain that, but there are so many options that we should be happy with whichever it is.

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, w87r said:

Yeah, it's all just for the sake of discussion.

 

I wouldn't do the trade either, if they did it I wouldn't be too upset, but still feel iffy about it. Story would be good.

 

 

I would also just rather trade less than that package for JJ.

 

#15 and 2025 2nd might bet that done.

 

It's probably an overpay for JJ, compared to what the Dolphins gave up for Tyreek Hill, but not by a lot. I don't think your proposal above is enough... But my point is that if we're going to overpay for a WR, let's get a proven guy.

[w87r]

3 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I don't know... It's a late round pick swap, and the Jets are paying part of his salary. 

Yeah, I agree, I was thinking it could potentially be a smoke screen to make the Raiders think or some other team think they won't be taking one.

 

Wasn't necessarily saying it took them out, but even if it is a smoke screen, I guess it still effects their 1st round draft plan.

 

 

It was poorly written by me.

[MikeCurtis]

10 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I see DeJean differently. He could survive in our zone, I guess. But I was previously talking about boundary corners who have the speed to keep up with dynamic downfield receivers in the NFL. You say DeJean has good speed; do you think he has that kind of speed??

 

Where I think he'd be best in our defense is SS/nickel, and because I view him that way, I think the value on him is in Day 2. JMO. I know a lot of people like him way more than I do.

He was the 100m champion in Iowa 

 

He ran a 4.43 forty a week after being cleared to run at his pro day. 

 

He said that he thought he could do faster with more time 

 

Are there faster CBs? Sure

 

 

But imho he is the best tackler in the group

 

 

[ShuteAt168]

The Ringer mock is wild. It has DB Mitchell and Edge Turner dropping to us, but we pass and take WR Thomas. I’d be more than good with that. Turner is falling in some mocks and no one can agree on Mitchell or Arnold at CB. Verse is rising. 

[smittywerb]

11 minutes ago, w87r said:

Zach Wilson just got traded to the Broncos probably effects their 1st Rd QB plans 

no way Sean is trading for Zach to start.  I don’t think Sean could even fix Zach. He’s probably there as insurance and change of scenery.

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

He was the 100m champion in Iowa 

 

He ran a 4.43 forty a week after being cleared to run at his pro day. 

 

He said that he thought he could do faster with more time 

 

 

I watched his games. I don't see him having that kind of speed. JMO.

[stitches]

12 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

I do think 5 QBs is unlikely,  but not impossible.   I think 4 is a lock.  Then, if one team lives Penix or Nix, there’s your 5th.   
 

So 4 QBs…. 4 OT’s….   3 WRs…. 1 TE….  2 DEs….     There’s 14, and the Colts are on the Clock with pick 15.  
 

Do the Colts stay and pick, or do they trade down a little?   Perhaps 6-7 picks?   
 

Thursday is going to be fun!   

If I had to guess... 4 QBs, 3 WRs, 3 OTs, 2 EDGE, 1 CB, 1 TE... Colts trade back... Colts pick Xavier Worthy in the 20s... 

[ADnum1]

17 minutes ago, w87r said:

Zach Wilson just got traded to the Broncos probably effects their 1st Rd QB plans 

Zach Wilson is an interesting player.

He was a NFL combine warrior that could throw the ball 60 yards on the run accurately.

 

But struggled in reading defenses and at this point is a bust.

[Superman]

5 minutes ago, ShuteAt168 said:

The Ringer mock is wild. It has DB Mitchell and Edge Turner dropping to us, but we pass and take WR Thomas. I’d be more than good with that. Turner is falling in some mocks and no one can agree on Mitchell or Arnold at CB. Verse is rising. 

 

The Ringer mock I see has the Colts taking Dallas Turner at #15, and BTJ goes to the Jags at #17. Makes a lot of sense for the Jags by the way, they are likely targeting a WR. 

[w87r]

Seems as though Irsay won't be in the draft room this year.

 

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/jim-irsay-wont-be-in-colts-draft-room

 

 

“The main thing is I’m just following my doctors’ orders and just making sure the bottom line is just to get back to 100% and to do the things they say,” Irsay said. “I’m just being a good patient and trying to make sure I can get back sooner than later. I’ll get back on the golf course sooner than later.”

 

Irsay said he’ll be connected to the draft room virtually, and that he plans to defer to G.M. Chris Ballard in any event.

“I’ve always kind of sat back and watched,” Irsay said.

[stitches]

47 minutes ago, w87r said:

Kinda known this to potentially be the case.

 

So what's it take.

 

#3 - 2200

 

#15 - 1050

#46 - 440

2025 1st - 590pts(value of #32 pick)

 

2080pts

 

Probably need to add 2025 4th(40pts) + 2026 3rd(116pts)

 

 

2236pts pts - 2200pts

 

 

So would anyone do that if it was actually on the table? Not what we think Ballard would do.

 

#3

 

For

 

#15

#46

2025 1st

*2025 4th

*2026 3rd

 

 

*Maybe could trade Pierce or/and a TE in package to maybe save a pick?

 

 

 

 

Yeah, never can believe anything this time of year.

Ballard would not do this ... I don't think. I am not sure he would do it for a QB, let alone any other position... 

[Dobbinblitz]

7 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

He was the 100m champion in Iowa 

 

He ran a 4.43 forty a week after being cleared to run at his pro day. 

 

He said that he thought he could do faster with more time 

 

 

 

I really like this player as well. Despite some knocks about tightness, sometimes it comes down to on field production and this player has proven himself.  I think he would be all-pro caliber in the slot and box - and good enough on the outside. Football IQ and Ball Skills are excellent.

[stitches]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

What do you think about Nate Wiggins?

Short arms. Not gonna happen

[w87r]

51 minutes ago, w87r said:

So would anyone do that if it was actually on the table? Not what we think Ballard would do.

 

3 minutes ago, stitches said:

Ballard would not do this ...

 

 

And now there is a new question or 2 attached.

 

1. Would you be mad if they made the deal?

 

2. Would you rather just trade for JJ if going to put big trade package together?

 

 

[stitches]

26 minutes ago, w87r said:

Zach Wilson just got traded to the Broncos probably effects their 1st Rd QB plans 

IMO Zach Wilson should NOT effect anybody's 1st round QB plans... he's a shot you take at rehabilitating a talented player, he's not a game changer who should influence your decisions at the top of the draft and at the top of your roster. 

[stitches]

20 minutes ago, MikeCurtis said:

He was the 100m champion in Iowa 

 

He ran a 4.43 forty a week after being cleared to run at his pro day. 

 

He said that he thought he could do faster with more time 

 

Are there faster CBs? Sure

 

 

But imho he is the best tackler in the group

 

 

DeJean IMO is fast-...ish and explosive-...ish but IMO he looks stiff on tape. That's not to say Ballard wouldn't like him. I think he fits a lot of the things Ballard likes in his corners... except for the arm length... 

[stitches]

15 minutes ago, w87r said:

 

 

 

And now there is a new question or 2 attached.

 

1. Would you be mad if they made the deal?

 

2. Would you rather just trade for JJ if going to put big trade package together?

 

 

I'd rather trade for MHJ, but I see him as a generational prospect... something others might disagree with and reasonable people can disagree on this one. About whether I would do it... I think I said earlier in another thread that I personally would probably wait for Minny/Broncos/Raiders to trade up to 3/4 and and then try to trade up for the pick after, because I feel like this would lower the cost. BUT... in this specific hypothetical... I will wince hard... and I'd probably do it. 

 

About why MHJ and not JJ... because the cost of MHJ is just the picks and rookie contract. The cost of JJ is the picks... +30M+ a year salary. You can do A TON with 23-24M(the difference in salary) a year for the next 4-5 years... and I think MHJ is very low risk prospect. In essence I think the difference in $$ is well worth taking the risk. Hell if worst comes to worst(MHJ is complete and total bust, that you cannot even play - not gonna happen), you can pay the 23-25M in savings for a Pittman/Ridley level receiver in the FA to soften the blow. 

[Dobbinblitz]

I will just add, that there is some really good discussion on the board today - by everyone. Good to converse with such knowledgeable Colts fans; regardless of opinion. It makes this part of the off-season leading up to the draft much more enjoyable and interesting to hear everyone's take.

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

I'm thinking that Bowers or DeJean in the 1st (depending upon trade up of down) plus Cooper in the 2nd would be the best picks for intersecting need and value.  JMO.

BTW, I'm thinking DeJean at FS, reasoning for the trade down to 22 and picking up #83.  He doesn't have to man up cover.  Just be instinctive, quick, tackle. and make plays.

[ShuteAt168]

24 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

The Ringer mock I see has the Colts taking Dallas Turner at #15, and BTJ goes to the Jags at #17. Makes a lot of sense for the Jags by the way, they are likely targeting a WR. 

Not sure, I just checked again and it’s Thomas to Colts at 15. Maybe they have two mocks. Anyway, I’d be good w Turner too but someone said he’s too light? I’d rather go Thomas. 

[Dobbinblitz]

23 minutes ago, w87r said:

 

 

 

And now there is a new question or 2 attached.

 

1. Would you be mad if they made the deal?

 

2. Would you rather just trade for JJ if going to put big trade package together?

 

 

If I was going to the deal I would trade for MHJ to grow with essentially a rookie QB. The Colts would have their Triplets going forward.  If the Colts had a veteran QB and were currently in contention then probably JJ.

[w87r]

3 minutes ago, stitches said:

About why MHJ and not JJ... because the cost of MHJ is just the picks and rookie contract. The cost of JJ is the picks... +30M a year salary. You can do A TON with 23-24M(the difference in salary) a year for the next 4-5 years... and I think MHJ is very low risk prospect. In essence I think the difference in $$ is well worth taking the risk. 

Yeah broke those numbers down in a different post. It's definitely a big part of the discussion. Like I said really just something to talk about, which led to couple additional questions.

 

I think JJ could be had for #15 and 2025 1st at the most.

 

MHJ going to cost #15, #46, 2025 1st + 4th and 2026 3rd

 

Save big money per year on unproven guy while giving up 2-3 additional premium picks, or pay big money but less capital for proven commodity.

 

 

Lot to think about with those 2 options.

 

End of day neither is going to happen.(More than likely)

[Dobbinblitz]

Eagles:

Eagles General Manager Howie Roseman has been making phone calls to get an idea of what teams picking higher than the Eagles would be looking for to swap with Philadelphia, which has the 22nd overall pick. The Eagles own two second-round picks (their own and the Saints’).

 

Seems to be somewhat of a consensus out there that there are 18-21 or so 1st round caliber players in this year's draft.

[stitches]

2 minutes ago, Dobbinblitz said:

Eagles:

Eagles General Manager Howie Roseman has been making phone calls to get an idea of what teams picking higher than the Eagles would be looking for to swap with Philadelphia, which has the 22nd overall pick. The Eagles own two second-round picks (their own and the Saints’).

 

Seems to be somewhat of a consensus out there that there are 18-21 or so 1st round caliber players in this year's draft.

Very good target if Ballard is set on trading back,,, 

[w87r]

14 minutes ago, DougDew said:

BTW, I'm thinking DeJean at FS, reasoning for the trade down to 22 and picking up #83.  He doesn't have to man up cover.  Just be instinctive, quick, tackle. and make plays.

They don't have #83, they have #53. 

 

#22 + #53 is pretty close to #15 value. We might need to add #117 to make it work. I could see that deal though, even more talk today about Eagles trying to move up.

 

That would give us:

#22,#46,#53,#82

[w87r]

4 minutes ago, Dobbinblitz said:

Eagles:

Eagles General Manager Howie Roseman has been making phone calls to get an idea of what teams picking higher than the Eagles would be looking for to swap with Philadelphia, which has the 22nd overall pick. The Eagles own two second-round picks (their own and the Saints’).

 

Seems to be somewhat of a consensus out there that there are 18-21 or so 1st round caliber players in this year's draft.

Yeah and I think 22 might be as low as we want to go if we want a 1st round guy.

 

Our 21 isn't everyone's 21 so good chance a couple guys would be available that we had on our 21 at #22.

 

Of course we have the benefit of counting actual spots and prospects left when we are in the clock. So easy to know then.

[DougDew]

5 minutes ago, w87r said:

They don't have #83, they have #53. 

 

#22 + #53 is pretty close to #15 value. We might need to add #117 to make it work. I could see that deal though, even more talk today about Eagles trying to move up.

 

That would give us:

#22,#46,#53,#82

Ok, my bad.  Yeah, DeJean and pick 53 for our pick 15.  Play him at FS.  Could get Cooper at 46, EDGE Marshawn Kneeland at 53 (or a WR), then the OT with the 36 inch arms from Yale at 82....hopefully still there.

 

Philly could trade up for Mitchell.  Probably a better pure corner than DeJean at 22.

 

Fantasy stuff, but plausible.

[Dobbinblitz]

4 minutes ago, stitches said:

Very good target if Ballard is set on trading back,,, 

And a familiar team the Colts have done business with in the past.

[w87r]

Just now, DougDew said:

Ok, my bad.  Yeah, DeJean and pick 53 for our pick 15.  Play him at FS.  Could get Cooper at 46, EDGE Marshawn Kneeland at 53, then the OT with the 36 inch arms from Yale at 82....hopefully still there.

 

Philly could trade up for Mitchell.  Probably a better pure corner than DeJean at 22.

 

Fantasy stuff, but plausible.

Also, Philly has some CB concerns with Rodgers not being reinstated.

 

Not sure when he will, but they have to go into the draft expecting him to miss some time this season. 

[Stephen]

3 hours ago, PRnum1 said:

I wonder if Ballard is thinking of taking Arnold at 15 and converting him to FS

Take dejean at 15 if you going to do that

[Dobbinblitz]

1 minute ago, DougDew said:

Ok, my bad.  Yeah, DeJean and pick 53 for our pick 15.  Play him at FS.  Could get Cooper at 46, EDGE Marshawn Kneeland at 53, then the OT with the 36 inch arms from Yale at 82....hopefully still there.

 

Philly could trade up for Mitchell.  Probably a better pure corner than DeJean at 22.

 

Fantasy stuff, but plausible.

Dejean, Cooper, and Kneeland - that would be outstanding.  Although, I see a WR in there somewhere. Legette, Franklin etc.

[w87r]

2 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Fantasy stuff, but plausible.

Not that far fetched.

 

 

Probably better odds of that happening, than most the stuff posted around here 

 

 

I would say my odds as I sit here now.

 

60% trade back

35% stay put 

05% trade up

[Superman]

46 minutes ago, stitches said:

Short arms. Not gonna happen

 

Between that and the tackling, I eliminated him from consideration by the Colts a long time ago. Was just thinking whether BBZ sees him as the kind of guy who can fill the role he wants.

[Superman]

30 minutes ago, ShuteAt168 said:

Not sure, I just checked again and it’s Thomas to Colts at 15. Maybe they have two mocks. Anyway, I’d be good w Turner too but someone said he’s too light? I’d rather go Thomas. 

 

Weird, I see what you see now. Maybe I was seeing a cached version earlier.

 

I really like Thomas, so I'd like it. But now that I'm seeing it in mocks, it's obvious it won't happen.