Roster Moves 4/15/2019

[crazycolt1]

1 minute ago, Irish YJ said:

no, i don't. i was replying to the context of another poster who said they don't have to sell anything. if they aren't selling, then they are talking about positives and negatives. if they are selling, it's all positive. and as i said, i expect them to sell it. 

 

perhaps read the chain before jumping in with you're usual

What you don't seem to understand is Ballard is not selling anything. He signed Funchess and what the fan base thinks makes no difference to him. He explained why he signed him.

As far as the negative or positive comments it was the positive that made Ballard sign him in the first place. If he has any negative issues that would be taken up behind closed doors and not to the media.

Now if you want to concentrate on the negative that is certainly your right to think that.

Me, I stay on the positive till proven otherwise. That's all no more, no less.

 

[EastStreet]

6 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

What you don't seem to understand is Ballard is not selling anything. He signed Funchess and what the fan base thinks makes no difference to him. He explained why he signed him.

As far as the negative or positive comments it was the positive that made Ballard sign him in the first place. If he has any negative issues that would be taken up behind closed doors and not to the media.

Now if you want to concentrate on the negative that is certainly your right to think that.

Me, I stay on the positive till proven otherwise. That's all no more, no less.

 

If you think GMs and coaches don't sell as part of their jobs, then carry on. They'd be the only leadership position in any corporation that isn't responsible for selling their vision and decisions. 

[crazycolt1]

2 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

If you think GMs and coaches don't sell as part of their jobs, then carry on. They'd be the only leadership position in any corporation that isn't responsible for selling their vision and decisions. 

IMO what you call selling, I call explaining.

There is no need to sell something that's already bought.

 

[EastStreet]

11 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

IMO what you call selling, I call explaining.

There is no need to sell something that's already bought.

 

They are selling to the fan, who have not necessarily bought into the decision or vision yet. When fans stop buying the vision, they stop buying tickets, which is the primary goal of the organization. Fans stopped buying into the vision of Grigson, which led to the below. Ballard is in charge of correcting that. His duties are the same as anyone in charge of a company selling something.

 

Also... here's what the guy who hired Ballard to the Bears said about him....

 

Quote

 

“Two years into our time with the Bears, I said to (then-GM Jerry Angelo) after the 2004 draft … ‘We got a winner here with this kid.’ I said, ‘Not only is he going to be a director someday, he’s going to be a GM.’ He totally understands the big picture,” Gabriel said.

 

“He presents players better than any scout I’ve ever been around.

“If he truly believed in the player, he had a knack for selling him.”

 

 

His old boss's words, not mine...

 

[crazycolt1]

10 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

 

Attendance and ticket sales are two different things.

When is the last time the Colts were blacked out?

[EastStreet]

14 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Attendance and ticket sales are two different things.

When is the last time the Colts were blacked out?

You'd argue with mud puddle.

 

On the black out policy.... the NFL suspended the black out policy in 2015. Even when it was in place, you only had to sell out 85%

 

And... if you don't understand the correlation between attendance, ticket demand, and overall revenue, then you have other issues you may need to get checked out.

 

Season ticket renewals declined in the 16, 17, and 18 seasons (along with attendance). That was bad no matter how you spin it. Pump all the sunshine you want, but it was bad. The Colts even upped their food and beverage credits to sell tickets. They didn't pick up till we went on the second half winning streak last year.

 

Here's an article on the turnaround, but talks about the declines in previous years.

 

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2019/01/17/indianapolis-colts-season-ticket-sales-expected-to-increase-in-2019/2591196002/

[DerekDiggler]

7 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

You'd argue with mud puddle.

 

On the black out policy.... the NFL suspended the black out policy in 2015. Even when it was in place, you only had to sell out 85%

 

And... if you don't understand the correlation between attendance, ticket demand, and overall revenue, then you have other issues you may need to get checked out.

 

Season ticket renewals declined in the 16, 17, and 18 seasons (along with attendance). That was bad no matter how you spin it. Pump all the sunshine you want, but it was bad. The Colts even upped their food and beverage credits to sell tickets. They didn't pick up till we went on the second half winning streak last year.

 

Here's an article on the turnaround, but talks about the declines in previous years.

 

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2019/01/17/indianapolis-colts-season-ticket-sales-expected-to-increase-in-2019/2591196002/

And yet you keep taking the bait.  Ha

[Coltsfan66]

11 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Attendance and ticket sales are two different things.

When is the last time the Colts were blacked out?

 

11 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

You'd argue with mud puddle.

 

On the black out policy.... the NFL suspended the black out policy in 2015. Even when it was in place, you only had to sell out 85%

 

And... if you don't understand the correlation between attendance, ticket demand, and overall revenue, then you have other issues you may need to get checked out.

 

Season ticket renewals declined in the 16, 17, and 18 seasons (along with attendance). That was bad no matter how you spin it. Pump all the sunshine you want, but it was bad. The Colts even upped their food and beverage credits to sell tickets. They didn't pick up till we went on the second half winning streak last year.

 

Here's an article on the turnaround, but talks about the declines in previous years.

 

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2019/01/17/indianapolis-colts-season-ticket-sales-expected-to-increase-in-2019/2591196002/

 

[Dark Superman]

On 4/15/2019 at 1:03 PM, ProblChld32 said:

Matthias Farley, Marcus Johnson, Chester Rogers all sign their respective tenders to return for the 2019 season. 

This is a thing of beauty.

[ojsglove]

Crazycolt1, Once again, you are embarrassing yourself. ????????????

[EastStreet]

16 hours ago, DerekDiggler said:

And yet you keep taking the bait.  Ha

yup i know. it's typically pretty easy to post fact/links proving him wrong though lol.

[DerekDiggler]

19 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

yup i know. it's typically pretty easy to post fact/links proving him wrong though lol.

 

19 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

yup i know. it's typically pretty easy to post fact/links proving him wrong though lol.

As long as you continue to debate.  He wins.

 

Just stop.  I really appreciate your input   Even if o don’t always agree.   We can have a intellectual debate.  Unlike what your up against 

 

I have blocked his nonsense and am happier for that.    I want good debate not mindless arguments

 

keep posting.   Love reading your input! 

[crazycolt1]

7 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

yup i know. it's typically pretty easy to post fact/links proving him wrong though lol.

I like pulling your chain. The novel responses are worth it.

You easily get bent you know.

[BigQungus]

On 4/18/2019 at 10:06 PM, JPFolks said:

They all had an opportunity to prove they should be a #2.  They failed.  One due to injury, so he could change things, the others proved they were not ready to be #2.  Not much separation (Pascal seemed to have some potential there I will say), terrible hands as a group, only occasionally being in the right place at the right time like Rogers in the Miami game.  But to be clear, they proved they were not ready to be our #2 which is why we brought in Funchess and why many believe (and hope) that we will be drafting a WR in the draft to also address our underwhelming WR corps.  

 

Even if at some point in the future one of these guys end up as our #2, it doesn't change what they have all demonstrated already.  Cain has not had the opportunity in actual games so he's a question mark, the rest HAVE had a chance and were found wanting.  Odell Beckham Jr. proved immediately he was a #1.  Hilton proved immediately he was a top threat on our team even with Reggie on the team still.   These guys proved they are no Hilton or Beckham Jr. or the myriad of other WR's in the league who proved right out of the gate, whether they were draft picks or undrafted like Antonio Brown, that they were top end WRs.  Our guys have proven otherwise.  

 

Ok, so what you’re saying is that unlike the best receivers in the league, none of them have proven right out of the gate that they are surefire WR2s.

 

And that’s supposed to have practical value....... how?

[EastStreet]

12 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

I like pulling your chain. The novel responses are worth it.

You easily get bent you know.

it's easy to make you look foolish with a few links and a few paragraphs. sometimes it's almost worth it. 

 

but, glad you admit you're nothing more than a troll.

[crazycolt1]

2 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

it's easy to make you look foolish with a few links and a few paragraphs. sometimes it's almost worth it. 

 

but, glad you admit you're nothing more than a troll.

Well now that you revert to insults you have shown you have no sense of humor.

Not one time have I insulted you. Not the same can be said of you now.

[EastStreet]

40 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Well now that you revert to insults you have shown you have no sense of humor.

Not one time have I insulted you. Not the same can be said of you now.

you just admitted to the enjoyment of pulling peoples chains. that's pretty much the definition of a troll. sorry if the word triggers you, or gets you bent. 

 

[crazycolt1]

3 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

you just admitted to the enjoyment of pulling peoples chains. that's pretty much the definition of a troll. sorry if the word triggers you, or gets you bent. 

 

Don't trigger me at all. Matter of fact I find it funny you got bent enough to insult me over it.

On a side note :

Maybe with all the drops this team has our passing game might drop to #7 in the league. What you think?

[EastStreet]

1 minute ago, crazycolt1 said:

Don't trigger me at all. Matter of fact I find it funny you got bent enough to insult me over it.

On a side note :

Maybe with all the drops this team has our passing game might drop to #7 in the league. What you think?

well, you went drama queen on the "insult" narrative. sorry to upset you.

you should talk to someone about your obsession with drops and you inability to talk about your feelings.

[crazycolt1]

3 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

well, you went drama queen on the "insult" narrative. sorry to upset you.

you should talk to someone about your obsession with drops and you inability to talk about your feelings.

Obsession with drops?  Now that is pretty funny coming from you.

[EastStreet]

2 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Obsession with drops?  Now that is pretty funny coming from you.

you've brought drops up twice out of the blue in the last week or so. perhaps it's a subconscious problem you can't control. i'm sure it's not you just trolling again... sorry again. i don't mean to upset you.

[crazycolt1]

10 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

you've brought drops up twice out of the blue in the last week or so. perhaps it's a subconscious problem you can't control. i'm sure it's not you just trolling again... sorry again. i don't mean to upset you.

Sorry, no cigar today.

But don't let that get in the way of being delusional about me being upset.

 

[EastStreet]

10 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Sorry, no cigar today.

But don't let that get in the way of being delusional about me being upset.

 

[JPFolks]

14 hours ago, BigQungus said:

 

Ok, so what you’re saying is that unlike the best receivers in the league, none of them have proven right out of the gate that they are surefire WR2s.

 

And that’s supposed to have practical value....... how?

Simple.  It means we need to continue to look elsewhere for someone ready to play out of the box.  Someone who shines, even if its just as a rookie.  I would suggest the draft and we hope that Cain's brief spark before injury was more than fools gold.  Johnson and Paschal had brief moments where they appeared capable but certainly were far from Elite talent.  Rogers and the rest of the guys on the roster after Hilton and Funchess seem like cannon fodder for the most part.  We need elite talent.  We need elite speed.  We need elite hands.  We need elite route running.  In essence, we need SOMETHING to be elite about our qualified #2 and #3.  I didn't see anything that suggested "Elite" from any of these guys last year.  Did you? Someone will be #2 even if they're terrible.  There WILL be a #2.  What I think most people hope for is that the #2 has something elite, if not many things elite about their skill set.  Outside of Hilton, that isn't a word that applies to the backups from last year and camp bodies.  

 

Are you going on the record to say we have our full time, long term #2 and eventual #1 when Hilton is gone on the roster?  Who would that be?  And no matter how you answer, using your criteria, what supposed practical value is that supposed to have?  

 

What practical value does my opinion have? At least the same value as any opinion you or anyone else shares.  None of us have power over the team.  The point of a message board is to post opinions and discuss.  You apparently disagree with my statement, so let's hear who our #2 elite talent is among the scrubs? Settling for a #2 without elite talent is what we did last year.  Ryan Grant was devoid of anything elite and it showed.  

 

Questions? 

[richard pallo]

I believe Evan Boehm did not sign his restricted FA tender by Fridays deadline.  All of the other RFA's have.  Does anyone know how missing this deadline effects his status with the Colts?  I'm surprised by this actually.  

[EastStreet]

11 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

I believe Evan Boehm did not sign his restricted FA tender by Fridays deadline.  All of the other RFA's have.  Does anyone know how missing this deadline effects his status with the Colts?  I'm surprised by this actually.  

He's a RFA. So either another team offers him more, or he comes back (not sure if it matters if he signs). Should another team offer more, we have the right to match. If we don't match, he's let go (and we get a 2nd round since that's what he was tendered at). If he's not offered, since he's under 4 years in the league, he's ours regardless IIRC and we pay him at the 2nd round tender amount (~3M).

[dw49]

2 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

He's a RFA. So either another team offers him more, or he comes back (not sure if it matters if he signs). Should another team offer more, we have the right to match. If we don't match, he's let go (and we get a 2nd round since that's what he was tendered at). If he's not offered, since he's under 4 years in the league, he's ours regardless IIRC and we pay him at the 2nd round tender amount (~3M).

 

 

Yeah , I believe that's about the size of it. Boehm has no leverage other than just not play football in 2019. He for some reason did not sign the tender yet but bottom line is he will play for the Colts unless he's traded.

[richard pallo]

3 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

He's a RFA. So either another team offers him more, or he comes back (not sure if it matters if he signs). Should another team offer more, we have the right to match. If we don't match, he's let go (and we get a 2nd round since that's what he was tendered at). If he's not offered, since he's under 4 years in the league, he's ours regardless IIRC and we pay him at the 2nd round tender amount (~3M).

That's the big question I guess.  Why set a deadline if it doesn't matter?  I would think there would have to be consequences.  Our other RFA's signed in time. 

[EastStreet]

2 minutes ago, dw49 said:

 

 

Yeah , I believe that's about the size of it. Boehm has no leverage other than just not play football in 2019. He for some reason did not sign the tender yet but bottom line is he will play for the Colts unless he's traded.

 

i guess it could mean that someone has made and offer, and either they are working through something, or the colts are countering. i don't know all the ins and outs, but i posted the FA regs a few weeks ago. i'll try to find it.

3 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

That's the big question I guess.  Why set a deadline if it doesn't matter?  I would think there would have to be consequences.  Our other RFA's signed in time. 

it's probably more a deadline for the other teams to offer, than for the RFA to sign a tender. IDK, maybe?

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

He is very important to this team even as a backup. He played well when Kelly was injured

[dw49]

52 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

 

i guess it could mean that someone has made and offer, and either they are working through something, or the colts are countering. i don't know all the ins and outs, but i posted the FA regs a few weeks ago. i'll try to find it.

it's probably more a deadline for the other teams to offer, than for the RFA to sign a tender. IDK, maybe?

 

I was thinking the same but couldn't find the explanation for the "deadline date."

[EastStreet]

46 minutes ago, dw49 said:

 

I was thinking the same but couldn't find the explanation for the "deadline date."

Honestly I'm not really worried about it either way. I like Boehm a lot, but I'd take a 2nd round draft pick from the receiving team without too many tears. We picked him up off waivers, so we don't have any draft capital invested in him. and... He's an UFA next year. Hope he stays though.

[wig]

On 4/15/2019 at 7:00 PM, DerekDiggler said:

And we are Now good at WR.   Nothing needed in the draft except Defense and Oline 

 

On 4/15/2019 at 7:23 PM, DerekDiggler said:

Cant predict when the BPA will be available at any position.  Saying Day two is putting the pick in a box.   Ballard won’t ever do that 

 

Uhhhhh

[dw49]

50 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

Honestly I'm not really worried about it either way. I like Boehm a lot, but I'd take a 2nd round draft pick from the receiving team without too many tears. We picked him up off waivers, so we don't have any draft capital invested in him. and... He's an UFA next year. Hope he stays though.

 

 

No one will ver give up a second to sign him. I think it was the only way for the Colts to assure he stayed with the team . He was not drafted so no compensation if not tendered with a second. They could have just used the "right of first refusal ." That would give them the option to match any offer Boehm might receive. Maybe would have saved some money as it's hard to believe another team would offer 3.1 mill or more ?

 

But yeah , I'm sure the Colts are with you as they would have happily taken a 2nd for Bohm.

[EastStreet]

2 minutes ago, dw49 said:

 

 

No one will ver give up a second to sign him. I think it was the only way for the Colts to assure he stayed with the team . He was not drafted so no compensation if not tendered with a second. They could have just used the "right of first refusal ." That would give them the option to match any offer Boehm might receive. Maybe would have saved some money as it's hard to believe another team would offer 3.2 mill or more ?

 

But yeah , I'm sure the Colts are with you as they would have happily taken a 2nd for Bohm.

he was drafted in the 4th.

[DerekDiggler]

1 hour ago, wig said:

 

 

Uhhhhh

Uh what?

[BigQungus]

On 4/21/2019 at 4:27 AM, JPFolks said:

Simple.  It means we need to continue to look elsewhere for someone ready to play out of the box.  Someone who shines, even if its just as a rookie.  I would suggest the draft and we hope that Cain's brief spark before injury was more than fools gold.  Johnson and Paschal had brief moments where they appeared capable but certainly were far from Elite talent.  Rogers and the rest of the guys on the roster after Hilton and Funchess seem like cannon fodder for the most part.  We need elite talent.  We need elite speed.  We need elite hands.  We need elite route running.  In essence, we need SOMETHING to be elite about our qualified #2 and #3.  I didn't see anything that suggested "Elite" from any of these guys last year.  Did you? Someone will be #2 even if they're terrible.  There WILL be a #2.  What I think most people hope for is that the #2 has something elite, if not many things elite about their skill set.  Outside of Hilton, that isn't a word that applies to the backups from last year and camp bodies.  

 

Are you going on the record to say we have our full time, long term #2 and eventual #1 when Hilton is gone on the roster?  Who would that be?  And no matter how you answer, using your criteria, what supposed practical value is that supposed to have?  

 

What practical value does my opinion have? At least the same value as any opinion you or anyone else shares.  None of us have power over the team.  The point of a message board is to post opinions and discuss.  You apparently disagree with my statement, so let's hear who our #2 elite talent is among the scrubs? Settling for a #2 without elite talent is what we did last year.  Ryan Grant was devoid of anything elite and it showed.  

 

Questions? 

 

 

We need elite talent at #2 and #3...

 

Yeah sure...

 

So I guess you're saying the practical value of saying that our #2 and #3 receivers aren't as good as the best receivers in the league is that we should get elite receivers to be our #2 and #3 receivers? 

 

So this ultimately boils down to whether anything short of multiple top 10 WRs is flatly unacceptable.

[dw49]

13 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

he was drafted in the 4th.

 He was on waivers a few times is what threw me off. You are correct and I'm surprised the Colts thought they needed a 2nd round tender.

[JPFolks]

On 4/22/2019 at 9:01 AM, BigQungus said:

 

 

We need elite talent at #2 and #3...

 

Yeah sure...

 

So I guess you're saying the practical value of saying that our #2 and #3 receivers aren't as good as the best receivers in the league is that we should get elite receivers to be our #2 and #3 receivers? 

 

So this ultimately boils down to whether anything short of multiple top 10 WRs is flatly unacceptable.

No, I said they needed to have SOMETHING elite about them... speed, hands, route running etc.  If they have SOMETHING going for them, then they can develop additional skills to round out their talent.  If they possess ZERO elite level attributes, then no matter how much they learn, they're still not going to be good enough to get us where we need to go.  The Colts have OFTEN had multiple elite players.  Wayne and Harrison were elite along with an elite TE and RB and our QB.  We had elite people at all the skill positions on offense.   You imply that it's just not possible for our #2 and #3 to have elite speed or elite hands or elite route running or elite contested catch ability.  I say if they can't get separation, can't cut sufficiently to get open, can't catch the ball (the most common negative trait across our back up and starting receivers last year) we don't have qualified #2 and #3s.  So someone with all average or below skill sets and physical abilities/attributes will be a great #2 eh? 

 

Yikes. 

[Lucky Colts Fan]

31 minutes ago, JPFolks said:

If they have SOMETHING going for them, then they can develop additional skills to round out their talent.  If they possess ZERO elite level attributes, then no matter how much they learn, they're still not going to be good enough to get us where we need to go.

 

Huh?  So a player can develop additional skills, but only if they already possessed at least one to start with?

 

I'm trying to think of examples of what you're saying.

 

Did Reggie Wayne possess any elite attributes coming out of college?  I don't think there was anything elite about Antonio Brown coming out of college, which is why he was drafted so low.  I'm not sure what you're criteria is though.