Why Do People Doubt Peyton

[UndecidedFrog]

Indeed, I agree it's highly critical to have a quality OL.

One that can not only pass protect, but also run block.

[rabidfan77]

I don't doubt that he's making progress in his recovery, but 28 million is the largest single season payout in the history of the NFL. If he's not 100% it's a terrible deal, especially with Luck in the waiting. It has nothing to do with "doubt".

I agree with the 28mil part. I wonder why did Irsay give peyton that contract?? Irsay looks like a fool now with that contract.

Nobody had a problem with this contract before the season started last year, have ppl forgotten that Peyton led the colts to 12 or more wins 7 straight years and the 1 bad year he still won 10. Peyton earned his contract, but now "uncertainty" has dominated the conversation about Peyton and his recovery progress. Personally I've accepted the possibility of Peyton leaving but hope he stays and retires a colt like he should. With that said for the future of the franchise you take Luck and lock up the qb position for the next 10+ years. At the end of day we have 7 days until we get the answer we've been waiting for so a little patience people either way it's gonna be a long off season.

[UndecidedFrog]

Nobody had a problem with this contract before the season started last year,....

Nobody thought that the worse case scenario could happen and that PM would require invasive surgery such as spinal fusion before last season started last year either.

Nobody thought that PM's nerve damage would take so long to regenerate, such that there is this uncertainty about his arm strength now.

Since we know better now, and the contract provides the team with a mechanism to opt out, shouldn't we do it?

The consequences of paying the $28MM due March 8, and having PM not be able to play anymore would hit our cap $38.4MM or about 1/3 of the total team cap. This would set the team back for at least 2-3 years.

[southwest1]

I will never doubt #18. Throw out the medical reports. Forget the strength in his neck & nerve regeneration rate. Peyton is about to re-emerge faster, stronger, & with a larger than life monumental chip on his shoulder. By July, he will be fully recovered ready to unleash his new cannon. By September, he will leave a multitude of teams in his wake. His competitive juices are salivating & gnawing at the bit to redefine NFL record books again. The Yoda of NFL field generals has now returned!!!

[UndecidedFrog]

There is a difference between fact-based decisions and faith-based decisions.

I prefer the professionals who make decisions on my money market portfolio to make fact-based decisions.

I hope Mr. Irsay does the same for the Colts.

[Tark The Shark]

I love Peyton and will always be grateful for everything he has done for the franchise. But there was some extreme circumstances that came up like how bad the team was without a back-up and everyone was bashing the Colts for not having a back-up plan and Irsay probably felt like that he didn't want that to happen again. He probably realized that Peyton just had 4 neck procedures and he is 36 years old and didn't do well the last season he played (which definitely wasn't on him, injury bug bit us hard in 2010). And Luck comes along and how he is the safest pick and a can't miss prospect, the best since Peyton, and he wants him and he doesn't want to lose him like when Elway didn't want to come to the Colts, so Irsay probably wants Manning as much as anyone but he wants Luck and if he has to part with Manning to do it then he probably will. And sadly, Peyton Manning gets kicked out of Indy, but someone will take a chance at him, like Dan Synder who if they don't get RG3, i say they sign Peyton to a 2 year deal.

[rabidfan77]

Nobody thought that the worse case scenario could happen and that PM would require invasive surgery such as spinal fusion before last season started last year either.

Nobody thought that PM's nerve damage would take so long to regenerate, such that there is this uncertainty about his arm strength now.

Since we know better now, and the contract provides the team with a mechanism to opt out, shouldn't we do it?

The consequences of paying the $28MM due March 8, and having PM not be able to play anymore would hit our cap $38.4MM or about 1/3 of the total team cap. This would set the team back for at least 2-3 years.

Please let the rest of us know what inside info you have because colts fan are dying here , first off calm down Irsay already said he's not paying the option, second "sources" say Peyton would be open to a incentive laden contract wherever he plays. For Peyton it stopped being about the money long ago he just wants to win, I think the story that is being overlooked in this situation is IF Peyton returns he's looking at a completely different team with Wayne and Saturday possibly gone with a new coach he doesn't know. However the colts hiring Bruce (peyton's 1st qb coach) and Cylde somehow escaping the chopping block he should've been on is a little encouraging for a return. Like I said the 1st and most important question gets answered March 8, then a million more are asked until opening day when Peyton show's the world he hasn't lost a step

[braveheartcolt]

Please let the rest of us know what inside info you have because colts fan are dying here , first off calm down Irsay already said he's not paying the option, second "sources" say Peyton would be open to a incentive laden contract wherever he plays. For Peyton it stopped being about the money long ago he just wants to win, I think the story that is being overlooked in this situation is IF Peyton returns he's looking at a completely different team with Wayne and Saturday possibly gone with a new coach he doesn't know. However the colts hiring Bruce (peyton's 1st qb coach) and Cylde somehow escaping the chopping block he should've been on is a little encouraging for a return. Like I said the 1st and most important question gets answered March 8, then a million more are asked until opening day when Peyton show's the world he hasn't lost a step

Your optimisim is getting the better of you sir.

[KyFan18]

Irsay already said he's not paying the option

No.

[runstuffer]

The biggest story of the year will be about Manning and how he's holding up. Manning is going to play and play with a chip on his shoulder. He wants to match his brother in super bowls. The eyes of the world will be on him and the team he plays for. He is going to generate a lot of money and exposure for him and his team. He will make the colts back their money 10 fold this year alone and lead us back to the playoffs. We can restucture Mannings contract and draft luck. We can and should have both. Every team needs 2 good qbs. Well we will have 2 great qbs. We don't need years of downtime/rebuilding/losing. We can transition this team without a setback and still be the team that has dominated the south for 10 years, I've seen the future and it includes both Manning and luck. Mr. Irsay, hold onto Manning and draft Luck. You can hold all the chips and sit back and laugh at all those nay sayers as we are set for the present and the future.

[hawkeyes]

So whats the reason to doubt he will be our starter next year??

Oh my yet another what will we ever do without Peyton thread ... LOL. Facts are simple, he isn't a spring chicken, he hasn't taken a game snap in over a year, he is due a large amount of money, a talented prospect is available - all things point to its time to move on!

[Portage Coltfans]

There is a difference between fact-based decisions and faith-based decisions.

I prefer the professionals who make decisions on my money market portfolio to make fact-based decisions.

I hope Mr. Irsay does the same for the Colts.

how can you compare rooting for an NFL team to rooting for a money market portfolio? Professional sports are nothing like any other business, you can't compare K-mart, Verizon, BofA and your money market as a comparable business. They are just not the same.

Nobody is questioning Irsay if Manning can't play ever again, but it makes perfect since to question him if Manning has a chance to get back to 100% or even 90%. you are right about facts, and right now we don't have ANY! So until then, i believe that Manning can work hard to recovery and the wait can be worth it.

[FanFromtheWasteland]

Obviously....

..but you hear the talk about how we should never have a player again..who so internalized the offense that a replacement would have trouble..

..you hear about what Manning hasnt won in the playoffs..

...How 36 is SOOOOO old..(btw)

Tom Brady is 34 next season...Drew Brees is 33..

...Meanwhile what has Andrew Luck ever failed at, pro-wise? Nothing. He's never lost a big NFL game.

Never been injured seriously

Never thrown a big interception.......Clean slate

I understand wanting new over old... I just want not to throw out the old guy until we're sure about the new man.

I’m not sure it is Wanting new over old, I just think people are finally coming to the realization that Peyton may be done. It was going to happen eventually so why not now?

There is uncertainty either way, so which is the lesser of the two evils. Uncertainty with an older QB or uncertainty with a new young QB. Jmo.

[UndecidedFrog]

Please let the rest of us know what inside info you have because colts fan are dying here , first off calm down Irsay already said he's not paying the option, second "sources" say Peyton would be open to a incentive laden contract wherever he plays. For Peyton it stopped being about the money long ago he just wants to win, I think the story that is being overlooked in this situation is IF Peyton returns he's looking at a completely different team with Wayne and Saturday possibly gone with a new coach he doesn't know. However the colts hiring Bruce (peyton's 1st qb coach) and Cylde somehow escaping the chopping block he should've been on is a little encouraging for a return. Like I said the 1st and most important question gets answered March 8, then a million more are asked until opening day when Peyton show's the world he hasn't lost a step

1) I don't need inside information to deduce that the team expected PM to be back in 2011. The form of PM's current contract shows that expectation. The option bonus structure was suggested by PM/Condon, not Irsay. A team does not sign a LT contract with a player expecting that player to not play for the majority of the upcoming season.

2) I am plenty calm.

3) "sources" that say PM would be open to an incentive laden contract are not PM or Irsay. In fact, when confronted with this possibility, PM laughed at it and said that sources do not always report accurately.

4) Please tell us how you know what is inside PM's head that you claim PM does not care about money?

[UndecidedFrog]

how can you compare rooting for an NFL team to rooting for a money market portfolio? Professional sports are nothing like any other business, you can't compare K-mart, Verizon, BofA and your money market as a comparable business. They are just not the same.

Easily. I imagine that all businesses run on the same principles, and strive for success, both in financial terms as well as increase in brand recognition. For the Colts to be successful, it needs to field the best possible teams to win the SB on a consistent basis within the constraints of the salary cap and other NFL league rules, while increasing its revenues and maintaining its profit margin. I rely on its management to implement sound business tools to arrive at fact-based decisions in that process.

Nobody is questioning Irsay if Manning can't play ever again, but it makes perfect since to question him if Manning has a chance to get back to 100% or even 90%. you are right about facts, and right now we don't have ANY! So until then, i believe that Manning can work hard to recovery and the wait can be worth it.

Actually, we do have some facts:

1) PM will be 36 years old this upcoming season.

2) PM hasn't taken a game snap in over a year

3) PM is rehabbing from multiple neck surgeries, and hoping his throwing arm tricep nerve regenerates.

4) PM is due a large amount of money, $28MM by March 8 to keep him on the team.

From a business perspective, I have confidence what Mr. Irsay and the Colts will do.

[Portage Coltfans]

Easily. I imagine that all businesses run on the same principles, and strive for success, both in financial terms as well as increase in brand recognition. For the Colts to be successful, it needs to field the best possible teams to win the SB on a consistent basis within the constraints of the salary cap and other NFL league rules, while increasing its revenues and maintaining its profit margin. I rely on its management to implement sound business tools to arrive at fact-based decisions in that process.

Actually, we do have some facts:

1) PM will be 36 years old this upcoming season.

2) PM hasn't taken a game snap in over a year

3) PM is rehabbing from multiple neck surgeries, and hoping his throwing arm tricep nerve regenerates.

4) PM is due a large amount of money, $28MM by March 8 to keep him on the team.

From a business perspective, I have confidence what Mr. Irsay and the Colts will do.

I'll add a few more facts:

5) Peyton Manning puts in hours and hours of Rehab

6) Peyton Manning puts in hours and hours of practice

7) Peyton Manning puts in hours and hours of game film study

8) Peyton Manning is known for being one of the best at # 5, 6, 7 in NFL history

9) Peyton Manning's preparation is legondary in the NFL

10) Peyton Manning believes he is not finished playing at a high level

11) Peyton Manning has never lied to the fans

12) Jim Irsay has lied to the fans saying this is about heath, and then switching to "peyton can come back if he restructures"

[UndecidedFrog]

I'll add a few more facts:

5) Peyton Manning puts in hours and hours of Rehab

6) Peyton Manning puts in hours and hours of practice

7) Peyton Manning puts in hours and hours of game film study

8) Peyton Manning is known for being one of the best at # 5, 6, 7 in NFL history

9) Peyton Manning's preparation is legondary in the NFL

10) Peyton Manning believes he is not finished playing at a high level

11) Peyton Manning has never lied to the fans

12) Jim Irsay has lied to the fans saying this is about heath, and then switching to "peyton can come back if he restructures"

.

5) Yes, PM has indeed put in hours and hours into rehabbing his arm. I don't think anyone doubts this. What people doubt is the result of the rehab. Does putting more time into it result in faster or better nerve regeneration? From what the doctors say, rehab time is not related to nerve regeneration progress. They say that if rehab progress plateaus, nerve regeneration will have stopped, irrespective of how many hours you continue to rehab.

6) PM has not practiced with the team since his surgery.

7) 8) 9) Yes, historically this may all be true. Unfortunately, however, it is all irrelevant to the decision at hand. PM's preparation for game and film study is not relevant if he cannot play. PM may be one of the best in history, but if he cannot play, that's just history. Enshrine him in the HOF, but if he cannot play, you don't pay him to play.

10) This is irrelevant. What PM may or may not believe does not translate to his actual ability to play.

11) An honest PM or a dishonest PM have no bearing on his ability to play.

12) An honest JI or a dishonest JI have no bearing on PM's ability to play.

[Portage Coltfans]

.

5) Yes, PM has indeed put in hours and hours into rehabbing his arm. I don't think anyone doubts this. What people doubt is the result of the rehab. Does putting more time into it result in faster or better nerve regeneration? From what the doctors say, rehab time is not related to nerve regeneration progress. They say that if rehab progress plateaus, nerve regeneration will have stopped, irrespective of how many hours you continue to rehab.

6) PM has not practiced with the team since his surgery.

7) 8) 9) Yes, historically this may all be true. Unfortunately, however, it is all irrelevant to the decision at hand. PM's preparation for game and film study is not relevant if he cannot play. PM may be one of the best in history, but if he cannot play, that's just history. Enshrine him in the HOF, but if he cannot play, you don't pay him to play.

10) This is irrelevant. What PM may or may not believe does not translate to his actual ability to play.

11) An honest PM or a dishonest PM have no bearing on his ability to play.

12) An honest JI or a dishonest JI have no bearing on PM's ability to play.

for #11:

you don't think that Peyton knows when to hang it up? He has a father who could guide him on this, he's seen other QB's wait too long and turn sour (favre). I think I would trust what he says over anyone else. Point being, he doesn't have a history of lying to fans, so why should we not believe him?

#12: your right about his honesty and PM's ability. This is another topic completly for another day after this is done.

[BleedingBlue]

Why people are doubting peyton....?

The Irsay PR team wants you to think PM isn't ready to play ... "not cleared by the colts blah blah"

The Manning PR team wants you to think he'll be 100% 3 months before preseason "...sources say mannings workout with wayne was positive, blah blah blah"

We've already witnessed an ugly divorce. Unfortunately it was through twitter and the media.

At the end of the day, fans will pick their sides, but either way - Manning not retiring has divided the fan base already.

[UndecidedFrog]

for #11:

you don't think that Peyton knows when to hang it up? He has a father who could guide him on this, he's seen other QB's wait too long and turn sour (favre). I think I would trust what he says over anyone else. Point being, he doesn't have a history of lying to fans, so why should we not believe him?

Like most super-competitive athletes, PM may not know when to hang it up.

Favre, Montana, Unitas, Marino, Aikman, Bradshaw, Tarkenton, all did not know when to hang it up until they actually experienced declining performance. I bet they were just as honest as PM.

[Portage Coltfans]

Like most super-competitive athletes, PM may not know when to hang it up.

Favre, Montana, Unitas, Marino, Aikman, Bradshaw, Tarkenton, all did not know when to hang it up until they actually experienced declining performance. I bet they were just as honest as PM.

Based on 2010, I'd be willing to give him another shot. If it doesnt work out, then we still have a team with more high round talent on the roster than we did previously. So we would be left with a solid roster and no stud QB? I'm ok with that chance. Even with luck, you dont know if he'll be a stud either. Both are unknown.

[UndecidedFrog]

Based on 2010, I'd be willing to give him another shot. If it doesnt work out, then we still have a team with more high round talent on the roster than we did previously. So we would be left with a solid roster and no stud QB? I'm ok with that chance. Even with luck, you dont know if he'll be a stud either. Both are unknown.

There is risk either way.

The choice is between:

1) Draft Luck, an NFL-unproven rookie QB, but the most highly rated QB draft prospect since PM, some say Elway.

2) PM, a FHOF, 4xMVP QB, who will be 36 years old this upcoming season, who has not taken a snap in over a year, and who ihas just recovered from multiple neck surgeries and is rehabbing with an uncertain ability to make NFL level throws.

I clearly see which alternative has less risk compared to the other. To me, I choose Luck.

From a financial perspective:

1) Luck's 4-year contract will total about $23.1MM, or a $5.78MM avg. annual compensation.

2) PM's current 5-year contract will total $90MM, or a $18MM avg. annual compensation.

Luck's compensation rate is less than 1/3 of PM's compensation rate.

[BleedingBlue]

You get what you pay for. When Luck can surpass Curtais Painter numbers in the NFL, they'll give him some more money . When he lands NFL MVP 4 times, they'll pay him Peyton money.

The reason that Rookie signing number got changed was because too many teams got burdended by the high salaries of over-hyped flops.

[oldunclemark]

TY for your honest answer.

This actually goes back to making sure QB2 gets enough reps with the offense to help prepare him should he be needed.

The HC, and the OC and the QB coach should make sure that QB1 does not "hog" all the reps in practice.

'

That has to be addressed.....

Manning must change that aspect of his practice habits...

He must help Luck get ready to succeed him...

[oldunclemark]

Off point...does anybody else think that Justin Bieber looks like Tom Brady's long lost nephew...??

[Portage Coltfans]

There is risk either way.

The choice is between:

1) Draft Luck, an NFL-unproven rookie QB, but the most highly rated QB draft prospect since PM, some say Elway.

2) PM, a FHOF, 4xMVP QB, who will be 36 years old this upcoming season, who has not taken a snap in over a year, and who ihas just recovered from multiple neck surgeries and is rehabbing with an uncertain ability to make NFL level throws.

I clearly see which alternative has less risk compared to the other. To me, I choose Luck.

From a financial perspective:

1) Luck's 4-year contract will total about $23.1MM, or a $5.78MM avg. annual compensation.

2) PM's current 5-year contract will total $90MM, or a $18MM avg. annual compensation.

Luck's compensation rate is less than 1/3 of PM's compensation rate.

Would you agree that by time the Colts are good/great again, then we will be paying Luck quite a bit more (manning money) and you'll be worried about the Cap all over again?

Most agree that Lucks first 3-4 seasons have potiental to be pretty bad.

[UndecidedFrog]

Would you agree that by time the Colts are good/great again, then we will be paying Luck quite a bit more (manning money) and you'll be worried about the Cap all over again?

Most agree that Lucks first 3-4 seasons have potiental to be pretty bad.

No. I think without PM, this will be a 2-3 year rebuilding process with Luck. I do not expect bad seasons except for the upcoming one. I expect the 2nd and 3rd seasons will be much better than the first. The rookie contract will cover the first 4 seasons with Luck, with a team option for a 5th year. After that, assuming the expected success, Luck can then command young PM money (not old PM money).

PM's rookie contract (1998-2003) provided $48MM/6 years, or an avg. annual comp. of $8MM

PM's second contract (2004-2010) provided $99.2MM/7 years or an avg. annual comp of $14.17MM

PM's third and current contract (2011-2015) provides $90MM/5 years or an avg. annual comp of $18MM

Luck's rookie contract (2012-2016) provides about $23.1MM/4 years, or an avg. annual comp of $5.78MM

Assuming success, I expect Luck's second contract to be of longer duration and higher comp around $84MM/7 years or an avg. annual comp of $12MM

I would adjust that up or down depending how mediocre or spectacular his success has been.

[braveheartcolt]

Would you agree that by time the Colts are good/great again, then we will be paying Luck quite a bit more (manning money) and you'll be worried about the Cap all over again?

Most agree that Lucks first 3-4 seasons have potiental to be pretty bad.

Don't try and speak for me please. I do not thing 'most fans' think Luck will struggle. I'm more worried about our putrid defense, although I'm hopeful our new HC can fix that sooner rather than later.

Your love affair with Peyton is touching though...

[braveheartcolt]

Would you agree that by time the Colts are good/great again, then we will be paying Luck quite a bit more (manning money) and you'll be worried about the Cap all over again?

Most agree that Lucks first 3-4 seasons have potiental to be pretty bad.

Don't try and speak for me please. I do not thing 'most fans' think Luck will struggle. I'm more worried about our putrid defense, although I'm hopeful our new HC can fix that sooner rather than later.

Your love affair with Peyton is touching though...

[oldunclemark]

they still didn't take into account many parts from my original post, only physical parts. I applaud that study as well, it was very interesting and indeed a good topic.

would you be upset if the colts decided to trade the pick and take a chance on Peyton? I wouldn't, and I woudn't 4 years from now either.

Its no gamble if you resign Peyton Manning AND draft Andrew Luck...

...Its not perfect for either one of them/...but its the ultimate for the franchise as a whole...

I want tickets to that first exhibition game where Manning makes his return and Luck makes his debut...

ESPN will do all its shows from Indy that week..

[Portage Coltfans]

Don't try and speak for me please. I do not thing 'most fans' think Luck will struggle. I'm more worried about our putrid defense, although I'm hopeful our new HC can fix that sooner rather than later.

Your love affair with Peyton is touching though...

thanks, so is yours with the gieco caveman

His friends call him "goober", since you love luck, can I call you that as well?

[Portage Coltfans]

No. I think without PM, this will be a 2-3 year rebuilding process with Luck. I do not expect bad seasons except for the upcoming one. I expect the 2nd and 3rd seasons will be much better than the first. The rookie contract will cover the first 4 seasons with Luck, with a team option for a 5th year. After that, assuming the expected success, Luck can then command young PM money (not old PM money).

PM's rookie contract (1998-2003) provided $48MM/6 years, or an avg. annual comp. of $8MM

PM's second contract (2004-2010) provided $99.2MM/7 years or an avg. annual comp of $14.17MM

PM's third and current contract (2011-2015) provides $90MM/5 years or an avg. annual comp of $18MM

Luck's rookie contract (2012-2016) provides about $23.1MM/4 years, or an avg. annual comp of $5.78MM

Assuming success, I expect Luck's second contract to be of longer duration and higher comp around $84MM/7 years or an avg. annual comp of $12MM

I would adjust that up or down depending how mediocre or spectacular his success has been.

hopefully it would be adjusted up

[FireJimCaldwell]

Luck's rookie contract (2012-2016) provides about $23.1MM/4 years, or an avg. annual comp of $5.78MM

Assuming success, I expect Luck's second contract to be of longer duration and higher comp around $84MM/7 years or an avg. annual comp of $12MM

I would adjust that up or down depending how mediocre or spectacular his success has been.

I would say that is extremely conservative. His 5th year will be an option at top 5 money if they don't extend him prior to that. I would agree with the 6-8 year in length, but I think it's easily going to average north of 18-20 million. E.Manning, Roethlisberger & Rivers, along with Rodgers, Ryan, Stafford, Newton, & other younger and good to great QB's most will likely be on a new contract at that point which will push Luck's 2nd deal even higher.

If his 2nd deal would be in the 12 range, I would say he's become a steady to decent QB and not anywhere near what he's projected to be.

[UndecidedFrog]

I would say that is extremely conservative. His 5th year will be an option at top 5 money if they don't extend him prior to that. I would agree with the 6-8 year in length, but I think it's easily going to average north of 18-20 million. E.Manning, Roethlisberger & Rivers, along with Rodgers, Ryan, Stafford, Newton, & other younger and good to great QB's most will likely be on a new contract at that point which will push Luck's 2nd deal even higher.

If his 2nd deal would be in the 12 range, I would say he's become a steady to decent QB and not anywhere near what he's projected to be.

There may be inflation as time goes by. But much will depend on the comparitors of his cohort group as well as the comparitors of the group before him. I think most teams will pay their franchise QBs top money at the peak of their careers (late 20s to early 30s), and you may be right that the avg. annual comp (AAC) will exceed $18 (currently the highest AAC is being paid to Brady and Peyton).

Phil Rivers (30) is entering the 4th year of his current 7 year deal of $98.25MM with AAC of $14.04MM

Eli Manning (31) is entering the 4th year of his current 7 year deal of $106.9MM with AAC of $15.27MM

Ben Roethlisberger (30) is entering the 3rd year of his current 6 year deal of $102MM with AAC of $17MM

So, I can see Luck's 2nd contract may have a higher AAC than $12MM, if we assume he achieves success on the order of the above 3.

[Portage Coltfans]

There may be inflation as time goes by. But much will depend on the comparitors of his cohort group as well as the comparitors of the group before him. I think most teams will pay their franchise QBs top money at the peak of their careers (late 20s to early 30s), and you may be right that the avg. annual comp (AAC) will exceed $18 (currently the highest AAC is being paid to Brady and Peyton).

Phil Rivers (30) is entering the 4th year of his current 7 year deal of $98.25MM with AAC of $14.04MM

Eli Manning (31) is entering the 4th year of his current 7 year deal of $106.9MM with AAC of $15.27MM

Ben Roethlisberger (30) is entering the 3rd year of his current 6 year deal of $102MM with AAC of $17MM

So, I can see Luck's 2nd contract may have a higher AAC than $12MM, if we assume he achieves success on the order of the above 3.

We should take bets on how many players from the 2012 roster will be around in 2015.

[likm]

The fact is Mr. Irsay gave Peyton a larger contract than PM was asking for. Irsay new then that Peyton was going to have surgery and that even with a 100% healthy PM he would be in cap trouble. Mr. Irsay is a big boy and knows his financial situation better than any of us! PM and Mr. Irsay know PM's situation better than any of us and can make an intelligent decision based on their firsthand information. These same things have been argued over and over and the media and all the negative, so called Colts fans(you know the same team PM is still a part of) have been proven wrong constantly but will still keep coming up with falsified, & misinformation. If and when he is unable to perform his duties up to NFL or even his own standards then PM will be the first to acknowledge this. If Mr. Irsay and PM can't come to an agreement that is beneficial, & fair to both parties then they will part ways hopefully on good terms. PM and Mr. Irsay are working towards such a contract based on PM's nerve regeneration which as portrayed by eyewitnesses Bill Pollian, Joseph Addai, and Adam Vinateri is going well. So called Colts fans have got to see it to believe it but when they read all the unconfirmed garbage that's out there then that's gospel truth.

Why do people keep bringing up that Joseph Addai, Bill Polian And Adam say Peytons doing well? What are they gonna say? Peytons finished, cant make certain throws? He is doing well is a "canned" answer.

[likm]

I'll add a few more facts:

5) Peyton Manning puts in hours and hours of Rehab

6) Peyton Manning puts in hours and hours of practice

7) Peyton Manning puts in hours and hours of game film study

8) Peyton Manning is known for being one of the best at # 5, 6, 7 in NFL history

9) Peyton Manning's preparation is legondary in the NFL

10) Peyton Manning believes he is not finished playing at a high level

11) Peyton Manning has never lied to the fans

12) Jim Irsay has lied to the fans saying this is about heath, and then switching to "peyton can come back if he restructures"

Actually Irsay did not lie. Irsay said it was not about the money. Healthy Peyton on March 8 gets the 28 million. Peyton is not healthy so Irsay can not give him the money.

[number28]

Peyton is winning another MVP next season and will have a chance to win a SB. I really hope he remains a Colt.

[number28]

Actually Irsay did not lie. Irsay said it was not about the money. Healthy Peyton on March 8 gets the 28 million. Peyton is not healthy so Irsay can not give him the money.

please stop. Irsay has been lying for the past few months. Every word is a lie from him. He has dug himself so deep under ground we expect him to lie.

I just can't stand to look at his red face anymore. I'm sorry I just get sick looking at him.

[rabidfan77]

Your optimisim is getting the better of you sir.

You should have read my 1st post, I'm optimistic Peyton will return to form, I don't think he'll be a colt next year I only hope he will be