Tommy Kelly asked to be released from the Patriots

[chad72]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/tommy-kelly-asked-released-patriots-123800940.html

 

 

 

Kevin Williams turned down more money to play for the Patriots and Tommy Kelly, seeing how they are playing games to reduce his incentives based on playing time, asks to be released.

[amfootball]

What hurt Kelly is the that when he got injured last year, Vellano came in and played well especially late in the year. Has another team picked up Kelly? I have not heard.

[chad72]

What hurt Kelly is the that when he got injured last year, Vellano came in and played well especially late in the year. Has another team picked up Kelly? I have not heard.

 

Arizona Cardinals did, after he passed their physical. You will see him tonight vs the Chargers

[amfootball]

Arizona Cardinals did, after he passed their physical. You will see him tonight vs the Chargers

Thanks. I thought someone picked him up. Do you know what the Cards paid him? Like I said, his value diminished with the Pats when Vellano stepped in last year and played well.

[GoPats]

That's too bad but I suppose the player's got to look out for his interests. I don't think the Patriots would have sat him to avoid paying him incentives, assuming they thought he was their best option. BB is a lot of things but stupid isn't one of them. 

[chad72]

That's too bad but I suppose the player's got to look out for his interests. I don't think the Patriots would have sat him to avoid paying him incentives, assuming they thought he was their best option. BB is a lot of things but stupid isn't one of them. 

 

I wouldn't call that stupid but I would call that "Krafty" and "conniving" .

 

However, I am not one of those that think that being conniving is beyond BB.

[GoPats]

I wouldn't call that stupid but I would call that "Krafty" and "conniving" .

 

However, I am not one of those that think that being conniving is beyond BB.

 

Were you around for the poster named "Sons of Krafty Bob?" LOL...

 

Winning is more important to him than money (BB, I mean). He wouldn't sit his best player at a position just to keep him from hitting incentives, is what I meant. 

[Sports Central1]

The Pats sure could have used Kelly last sunday and this sunday.

[ReMeDy]

I don't think the Patriots would have sat him to avoid paying him incentives

 

Oh I don't know... They love trading away veterans for that delicious $$$, so why not bench players to avoid incentives? They're all about that $$$, and if Tom Brady keeps playing like he did in week 1, that's even more $$$ (hmm).

[amfootball]

The Pats sure could have used Kelly last sunday and this sunday.

Wilfork did not look good. I would put Vellano in this Sunday if Vince struggles again.

[lollygagger8]

Wilfork did not look good. I would put Vellano in this Sunday if Vince struggles again.

 

Wilfork should've had a field day with Satele. 

[Dustin]

He wanted to get off that sinking ship...

[GoPats]

Oh I don't know... They love trading away veterans for that delicious $$$, so why not bench players to avoid incentives? They're all about that $$$, and if Tom Brady keeps playing like he did in week 1, that's even more $$$ (hmm).

 

Kind of apples and oranges. When they've traded away vets (Seymour, Mankins) they were on the tail ends of big money deals. The Patriots operate on a "better a year too early than a year too late" basis on those. 

 

With Kelly, if he was on the roster and was their best option at his position, it'd be pretty foolish to bench him. 

 

We'll see about Brady I guess. His contract is pretty modest. 

[SkyBane]

Oh I don't know... They love trading away veterans for that delicious $$$, so why not bench players to avoid incentives? They're all about that $$$, and if Tom Brady keeps playing like he did in week 1, that's even more $$$ (hmm).

Pats don't do that for money, they do it to stock an absurd amount of draft picks and save cap space to reload with new talent year after year. Occasionally it bites them in the butt, but usually not enough to matter. It's essentially the old moneyball approach to football, maximize your talent by buying low (rookie contracts) and selling high (Veterans with inflated salaries from being on winning teams). The Mankins deal may have crossed that line, but it's too early to tell after just week 1 in a place where NE has traditionally struggled (strange but true, Miami gives them fits in the warm sun of south Florida).

 

Overall, New England's approach is a little misunderstood by those just paying attention to the names, it's all about making sure there's as little down time as possible between reloads of talent, and it's probably the reason they've stayed so highly competitive for well over a decade now.

 

Also if we're being perfectly honest about the Pats, that defense was far, far more worrisome than the few offensive kinks they had. The only time they could stop Miami was when they got gift turnovers.

[IcEWoLF]

Wilfork did not have a good day because you had Jones and Nink playing with him 3-4. If you watched the game closely in the first half Wilfork was playing fine, but the other two struggled. Also Wilfork is no longer a young man, so you can't play him 3-4 with those two. They need bigger bodies.

With the current roster I hope they start playing 4-3 again!

[Sports Central1]

Miami could have had another 3 TD's in the game if Tannehill didn't make some bad throws.  That fact that an average QB like Tannehill made the Pats look below average defensively says more about the Pats.  If Tannehill was a better QB the Phins would have put up 40 on the Pats.

 

Tannehill/Wallace made Revis look like another CB out there.

[Sports Central1]

The Pats are not fundamentally set up to be a 3-4 D.  They don't have the large oversize outside LB's for a 3-4.  Their D-linemen are meant for a 4-3.  Jones and Easley are 4-3 DE pass rushers.

 

In order to run a successful 3-4 D you need those outside LB's like Richard Seymour, Demarcus Ware and Shawne Merriman type LB's.  The Pats are undersized for a 3-4 D.

[amfootball]

Miami could have had another 3 TD's in the game if Tannehill didn't make some bad throws.  That fact that an average QB like Tannehill made the Pats look below average defensively says more about the Pats.  If Tannehill was a better QB the Phins would have put up 40 on the Pats.

 

Tannehill/Wallace made Revis look like another CB out there.

Tanny was average. It was Moreno that torched the Pats. Revis had a solid game. You are not going to completely shut down a guy like Wallace and he is still learning the D.

[jvan1973]

Tanny was average. It was Moreno that torched the Pats. Revis had a solid game. You are not going to completely shut down a guy like Wallace and he is still learning the D.

Wallace caught 10% of his total last season in one game Sunday

[amfootball]

Wallace caught 10% of his total last season in one game Sunday

That is more on Tanny for last year. Not sure he trusted him but Revis did not cover Wallace the whole time on Sunday either. He actually moved around and covered four different receivers throughout the game.

[SkyBane]

Wallace caught 10% of his total last season in one game Sunday

Sounds impressive, then you remember its only a 16 game season, so that's just a smidge above average, in other words, Wallace had a good game on the high end of what you expect from him.

[Sports Central1]

Tanny was average. It was Moreno that torched the Pats. Revis had a solid game. You are not going to completely shut down a guy like Wallace and he is still learning the D.

 

Wallace is not that good of a WR.  He's ok.  He's just a down the field speed guy.  Unless Wallace in the off season decided to dedicate his career to change part of his playing style to be a more complete WR and run better routes like Reggie Wayne he just out played Revis.

[jvan1973]

Sounds impressive, then you remember its only a 16 game season, so that's just a smidge above average, in other words, Wallace had a good game on the high end of what you expect from him.

Extrapolated out it would equal 40 more catches this season than last. So its more than a smidge above average

[amfootball]

Wallace is not that good of a WR.  He's ok.  He's just a down the field speed guy.  Unless Wallace in the off season decided to dedicate his career to change part of his playing style to be a more complete WR and run better routes like Reggie Wayne he just out played Revis.

Revis covered him fairly well. There was the one double fake move when he got Revis but Tanny threw it too close to the sideline. And then he defended the TD throw by knocking the ball down and hit his rear and Wallace caught the deflection. Just bad luck there but he had him covered. Revis really is the least of the Pats problems. If they don't do better stopping the run then the pass defense is irrelevant. The game was lost in the trenches on defense. Moreno ran rough shod all second half. And Brady has to hit the open guys.

[Sports Central1]

The Patriots need a true legit defensive coordinator that has real power and say.  A Wade Phlllips type coordinator.  If Marvin Lewis is fired as the Bengals' head coach at the end of the season I'd love to see him as the Pats' D coordinator.

 

The Pats' current d-coordinator is one of Belichick's "inside" guy he can control.  They haven't had a legit d coordinator since Romeo Crennel.  It seems Belichick is either insecure or doesn't trust legit powerful d coordinators.  He gives a lot of power to the offensive coordinators but not defensive coordinators.  I believe that was one of the reasons why Pepper Johnson left, he felt he was being too controlled by Belichick.

[Sports Central1]

Revis covered him fairly well. There was the one double fake move when he got Revis but Tanny threw it too close to the sideline. And then he defended the TD throw by knocking the ball down and hit his rear and Wallace caught the deflection. Just bad luck there but he had him covered. Revis really is the least of the Pats problems. If they don't do better stopping the run then the pass defense is irrelevant. The game was lost in the trenches on defense. Moreno ran rough shod all second half. And Brady has to hit the open guys.

 

That's true.

 

But if Tannehill didn't over throw Wallace that would have been a TD.

[GoPats]

The Patriots need a true legit defensive coordinator that has real power and say.  A Wade Phlllips type coordinator.  If Marvin Lewis is fired as the Bengals' head coach at the end of the season I'd love to see him as the Pats' D coordinator.

 

The Pats' current d-coordinator is one of Belichick's "inside" guy he can control.  They haven't had a legit d coordinator since Romeo Crennel.  It seems Belichick is either insecure or doesn't trust legit powerful d coordinators.  He gives a lot of power to the offensive coordinators but not defensive coordinators.  I believe that was one of the reasons why Pepper Johnson left, he felt he was being too controlled by Belichick.

 

No, no, and no thank you to Wade Phillips or Marvin Lewis! 

 

You need to have a little faith here. It was one game. The Patriots never play all that well in Miami and this year was no exception. Give it a couple more weeks... the pieces are all there, it's just a matter of finding the ones that work best together. 

[GoPats]

Extrapolated out it would equal 40 more catches this season than last. So its more than a smidge above average

 

Revis wasn't shadowing Wallace. The Patriots will probably not be able to do a lot of that because if you move Revis around you need other corners who can do the same. Browner, the projected starter once his suspension is up, plays only on the right side. 

[amfootball]

Revis wasn't shadowing Wallace. The Patriots will probably not be able to do a lot of that because if you move Revis around you need other corners who can do the same. Browner, the projected starter once his suspension is up, plays only on the right side. 

Revis played a lot of zone. I also did not like what they did at FS. At one point Revis played FS. They really need to figure that position out. Chung and/or Wilson are not the solution.

[Sports Central1]

No, no, and no thank you to Wade Phillips or Marvin Lewis! 

 

You need to have a little faith here. It was one game. The Patriots never play all that well in Miami and this year was no exception. Give it a couple more weeks... the pieces are all there, it's just a matter of finding the ones that work best together. 

 

What's wrong with having a real defensive coordinator?  They haven't had a good defense since Crennel left.  Belichick's way doesn't work and it hasn't worked since the Pioli/Weis/Crennel days.  Those defenses in the early 2000's under Belichick, well many of those guys were drafted by Parcels and Carroll.

 

Many Pats' fans can't connect the dots.

[Sports Central1]

Revis played a lot of zone. I also did not like what they did at FS. At one point Revis played FS. They really need to figure that position out. Chung and/or Wilson are not the solution.

 

Chung is a Strong Safety (SS), or that's where he should be.  Not at FS.

 

McCourty is the real Free Safety (FS).  What the Pats have been lacking since Rodney Harrison left is a true SS with talent.  Tj Ward for the Broncos is a true strong safety.

 

Maybe Browner will play SS?  With the new contact rules being enforced it could hurt Browner at CB.

[amfootball]

Chung is a Strong Safety (SS), or that's where he should be.  Not at FS.

 

McCourty is the real Free Safety (FS).  What the Pats have been lacking since Rodney Harrison left is a true SS with talent.  Tj Ward for the Broncos is a true strong safety.

 

Maybe Browner will play SS?  With the new contact rules being enforced it could hurt Browner at CB.

I meant SS. Thanks for the correction. It is maddening. I am thinking Browner may go there but he is better at CB.

[amfootball]

What's wrong with having a real defensive coordinator?  They haven't had a good defense since Crennel left.  Belichick's way doesn't work and it hasn't worked since the Pioli/Weis/Crennel days.  Those defenses in the early 2000's under Belichick, well many of those guys were drafted by Parcels and Carroll.

 

Many Pats' fans can't connect the dots.

I don't think a new DC would matter. It is the personnel. Pats never replaced Seymour or Asante Samuels and that has really hurt them. Right now they have the pieces to be a very good if not great defense but need some time for everyone to gel. I think Bill outcoached himself on Sunday.

[Sports Central1]

I don't think a new DC would matter. It is the personnel. Pats never replaced Seymour or Asante Samuels and that has really hurt them. Right now they have the pieces to be a very good if not great defense but need some time for everyone to gel. I think Bill outcoached himself on Sunday.

 

Coaching matters.  You can have lots of talent but if the coach isn't good and doesn't put forth a good game plan then those players are running around confused and out schemed.

[TAPLOOK]

Pats don't do that for money, they do it to stock an absurd amount of draft picks and save cap space to reload with new talent year after year. Occasionally it bites them in the butt, but usually not enough to matter. It's essentially the old moneyball approach to football, maximize your talent by buying low (rookie contracts) and selling high (Veterans with inflated salaries from being on winning teams). The Mankins deal may have crossed that line, but it's too early to tell after just week 1 in a place where NE has traditionally struggled (strange but true, Miami gives them fits in the warm sun of south Florida).

 

Overall, New England's approach is a little misunderstood by those just paying attention to the names, it's all about making sure there's as little down time as possible between reloads of talent, and it's probably the reason they've stayed so highly competitive for well over a decade now.

 

Also if we're being perfectly honest about the Pats, that defense was far, far more worrisome than the few offensive kinks they had. The only time they could stop Miami was when they got gift turnovers.

 

 

Just about as perfect as a post could get.

Edited September 9, 2014 by 21isSuperman

[TAPLOOK]

Coaching matters.  You can have lots of talent but if the coach isn't good and doesn't put forth a good game plan then those players are running around confused and out schemed.

 

 

BB loves to teach and is more than up for the challenge.

Edited September 9, 2014 by 21isSuperman

[amfootball]

Coaching matters.  You can have lots of talent but if the coach isn't good and doesn't put forth a good game plan then those players are running around confused and out schemed.

They looked good in the first half - three turnovers. Only let up 3 points as I don't count the 7 on the blocked punt. Not sure what happened in the second half but I think they got gassed and the Fins just ran rough shod. It was not like they confused the Pats.

[TAPLOOK]

What's wrong with having a real defensive coordinator?  They haven't had a good defense since Crennel left.  Belichick's way doesn't work and it hasn't worked since the Pioli/Weis/Crennel days.  Those defenses in the early 2000's under Belichick, well many of those guys were drafted by Parcels and Carroll.

 

Many Pats' fans can't connect the dots.

 

There's a good dose on truth here but BB's had some very good points against D's.  

Edited September 9, 2014 by 21isSuperman

[GoPats]

What's wrong with having a real defensive coordinator?  They haven't had a good defense since Crennel left.  Belichick's way doesn't work and it hasn't worked since the Pioli/Weis/Crennel days.  Those defenses in the early 2000's under Belichick, well many of those guys were drafted by Parcels and Carroll.

 

Many Pats' fans can't connect the dots.

 

Fair points, but... that doesn't mean you bring in someone like Wade Phillips though. 

[JerodMayo51]

Oh I don't know... They love trading away veterans for that delicious $$$, so why not bench players to avoid incentives? They're all about that $$$, and if Tom Brady keeps playing like he did in week 1, that's even more $$$ (hmm).

 

yea.. those big, bad, evil patriots... if they were so awful, why did they grant him his request and release him to free agency?  They could have just told him to shut his hole because hes under a contract that HE SIGNED.

 

You want to blame someone, blame Kelly's agent for getting him a horrible contract.  He tore his ACL, young guys filled in and proved serviceable so his role was no longer as vital and they viewed him at his age as more of a rotational player.  He didn't like that because his horrible agent got him an incentive based deal based on playing time.

 

Guess what, you sign an incentive laced deal based on playing time and then blow your ACL out, its probably going to cost you money!

 

The Patriots, being the class organization that they are, allowed the veteran to move on and get the contract he was looking for on another squad through free agency.

 

Keep spinning that wheel Remedy, you're so filled with hate towards the Patriots its amusing at this point.  its impossible for you to look at anything objectively when it comes to the Pats, you immediately have your mind made up before you know the facts, and your mind is always convinced that the Patriots are this huge, evil empire that is out to screw over anyone and everyone.

 

Its not healthy to bottle up that kind of anger and bitterness inside.