Enough of draft Luck, need to draft CB and a saftey

[tfunky14]

I'm not one to complain and I usually look at the cup half full but the Colts secondary is sub par at best. Really...

These guys are not good, miss INT's, can't tackle at all. If the Colts are going to play cover 2 or Tampa 2 and let the QB complete passes for 3-5 yards then the DB's need to tackle at the spot of completion. Too many times last night the Bucs WR made the catch and broke tackles for a bigger gain.

I don't want Luck, too much hype and too much hype means bust. (ie: Leaf and Russell come to mind)

What ever draft spot we get I would first address the secondary because right now that is the weekest part of the team. I'll give the O-line a pass since two guys went down last night but its been the same DBs for 4 weeks now and they are bad.

thoughts?

[oldunclemark]

Funky is all over this..

We better forget about luck and try to get good...

We're picking up guys off the street to play in the secondary and that's why we have them 20 yards off the line of scrimmage.

Poor Jacob Lacey is overmatched against everybody

We look like Purdue in the secondary...

[oldunclemark]

and I dont even want to talk about our tackling.. :shh:

[indy_nick]

Totally agreed. a good CB (I've been preaching Dre Kirkpatrick for a week or so now) would move powers to the #2 CB and Lacey in the Nickel. That could actually pan out to be a formidable secondary. I hope Polian and Polian Jr. agree we need to address our secondary next year.

[ruksak]

/signed

[pacolts56]

I'm not one to complain and I usually look at the cup half full but the Colts secondary is sub par at best. Really...

These guys are not good, miss INT's, can't tackle at all. If the Colts are going to play cover 2 or Tampa 2 and let the QB complete passes for 3-5 yards then the DB's need to tackle at the spot of completion. Too many times last night the Bucs WR made the catch and broke tackles for a bigger gain.

I don't want Luck, too much hype and too much hype means bust. (ie: Leaf and Russell come to mind)

What ever draft spot we get I would first address the secondary because right now that is the weekest part of the team. I'll give the O-line a pass since two guys went down last night but its been the same DBs for 4 weeks now and they are bad.

thoughts?

If you want a DB first then we'd have to trade down out of the #1 spot....if in fact we wind up at #1. I'm assuming you meant for us to trade down because there is no way Bill Polian will spend the 1st overall pick on a CB or S.....nor does any of this year's DB crop warrant it.

It is a legitimate need and for once....I'd like to see something resembling a stellar pair of CBs in our secondary.

Side note: Comparing Luck to Leaf and Russell is way off base....he has 10X the work ethic of those two slugs combined. We may or may not select him....but I highly doubt he'll bust.

[Smitto]

QB is the colts last problem... they need to do put some quality players on the defesne no doubt about it.

[oldunclemark]

If you want a DB first then we'd have to trade down out of the #1 spot....if in fact we wind up at #1. I'm assuming you meant for us to trade down because there is no way Bill Polian will spend the 1st overall pick on a CB or S.....nor does any of this year's DB crop warrant it.

It is a legitimate need and for once....I'd like to see something resembling a stellar pair of CBs in our secondary.

Side note: Comparing Luck to Leaf and Russell is way off base....he has 10X the work ethic of those two slugs combined. We may or may not select him....but I highly doubt he'll bust.

'56'...we just dont know...

You can say you knew the truth..

but I was SURE Jemarcus Russell would be a star ..

[tfunky14]

If you want a DB first then we'd have to trade down out of the #1 spot....if in fact we wind up at #1. I'm assuming you meant for us to trade down because there is no way Bill Polian will spend the 1st overall pick on a CB or S.....nor does any of this year's DB crop warrant it.

It is a legitimate need and for once....I'd like to see something resembling a stellar pair of CBs in our secondary.

Side note: Comparing Luck to Leaf and Russell is way off base....he has 10X the work ethic of those two slugs combined. We may or may not select him....but I highly doubt he'll bust.

I was compareing this "hype" Luck is getting to all the "hype" Leaf and Russell got when they entern the draft.

[Balzer40]

'56'...we just dont know...

You can say you knew the truth..

but I was SURE Jemarcus Russell would be a star ..

That means there were 2 people that thought that, you and Al Davis. Everybody else knew this guy was nothing but a heaping pile of crap.

[Xfiles]

We just drafted a Corner this year....who might convert to a safety eventually(Rucker). We need to start drafting players with skill sets that are perfect for the tampa two or scrap the whole dang scheme and start over.

[GoGoColts]

For this team, CB and safeties are second round picks and beyond. Picking as high as we are, we can get a good corner in the second round. You don't draft a safety in the first round unless he is Ed Reed or Troy Polumolu.

That first pick needs to go to a QB, DT, and then CB.

[Balzer40]

For this team, CB and safeties are second round picks and beyond. Picking as high as we are, we can get a good corner in the second round. You don't draft a safety in the first round unless he is Ed Reed or Troy Polumolu.

That first pick needs to go to a QB, DT, and then CB.

This is what I keep saying. We play a zone coverage most of the time. A top CB will not make much of a difference (if any) at all. To waste a high 1st rd. pick on one would be ludicrous.

[hawkeyes]

Unless Mannings career is over we would be dumb to spend a #1 overall on a QB - so I agree enough of the Luck talk! If he can come back he still has 4-5 years left in him!

We need to improve on D and on the Oline!

[SanAntonioColt]

If the Colts get the first pick and the assumption is Peyton is coming back, parlay the pick into multiple picks and draft for other needs and let a QB-hungry team have the first pick.

[GatorColts]

I agree we need some better CB's. I am confused why we do not improve this position year after year. With our pass rushers, we should have some solid CB's and then it would make it so much harder for teams to pass against us. Freeney and Mathis can only do so much, put some solid CB's on the field to help these guys out.

[Jason_]

plain and simple, if we get the #1 pick and use it on any player regardless of position it would be a huge waste....imo

[GatorColts]

How about no matter who we draft its a player that makes a difference and is actually productive on the field. We have not hit a solid first round pick in a while it seems. Castonzo still to young to tell.

[pacolts56]

'56'...we just dont know...

You can say you knew the truth..

but I was SURE Jemarcus Russell would be a star ..

Oh....I'm no Draft Day sage.....no one is. I was a Jarron Gilbert fan, for anyone who remembers him. He fell to the 3rd round....and apparently for good reason. No one is a draft "guru"....including the people who get paid to do the real thing.

My take on Russell at the time was....the guy could rifle the ball with the best of them, but there were fairly well-known warning signs that he was very lax on the work habits. He showed up at the combine at 270lbs.... and the red flags were there.

The last thing I'm gonna say about Andrew Luck is the 1st thing I said....if Peyton is down to 2 seasons or less, take him.....if not, then trade the pick. And among other needs....try and get an impact DB, it is said to be a pretty deep class.

[ALuck12]

What if Manning isn't the same next year and we didn't draft a QB, then we are left with Painter and who knows who else. IMO, we draft either Luck or Kellen Moore with our first pick and then in the second round we go defense. We need a QB for the future, he will need to learn the system before stepping out there on week 1 and have no clue like Collins this year. The defense can wait until the 2nd round. IMO, there won't be that many good defensive players in this draft anyway.

[Balzer40]

What if Manning isn't the same next year and we didn't draft a QB, then we are left with Painter and who knows who else. IMO, we draft either Luck or Kellen Moore with our first pick and then in the second round we go defense. We need a QB for the future, he will need to learn the system before stepping out there on week 1 and have no clue like Collins this year. The defense can wait until the 2nd round. IMO, there won't be that many good defensive players in this draft anyway.

I know you're on the Kellen Moore guy but he will be available in the 4th or 5th rd.. The guy simply does not have good arm strength and is too short.

[Jason_]

What if Manning isn't the same next year and we didn't draft a QB, then we are left with Painter and who knows who else. IMO, we draft either Luck or Kellen Moore with our first pick and then in the second round we go defense. We need a QB for the future, he will need to learn the system before stepping out there on week 1 and have no clue like Collins this year. The defense can wait until the 2nd round. IMO, there won't be that many good defensive players in this draft anyway.

We don't have to draft a QB in the top 5 to get someone that Peyton can groom to become an excellent QB. And I'll predict now there is NO WAY Kellen Moore goes in the first round. I think he'll fall to the 3rd round at best. He doesn't have the arm strength to make a majority of NFL type throws and he's 5'11..too many hurdles to overcome to be considered a first round pick imo.

[ruksak]

This is what I keep saying. We play a zone coverage most of the time. A top CB will not make much of a difference (if any) at all. To waste a high 1st rd. pick on one would be ludicrous.

I think we've seen enough of the cover 2.

We need to trend toward a base 4-3 look and get away from the same philosophy we installed when we led the league in points scored and were shattering passing records.

[Balzer40]

I think we've seen enough of the cover 2.

We need to trend toward a base 4-3 look and get away from the same philosophy we installed when we led the league in points scored and were shattering passing records.

I agree 100%, but until Polian is gone I don't think were going to see any scheme change.

[pacolts56]

I was compareing this "hype" Luck is getting to all the "hype" Leaf and Russell got when they entern the draft.

That's fair....I compared apples and oranges to what you said, my bad.

But some times the hype is actually fulfilled too. Stafford, Suh and Jake Long look like hyped up Draft Day winners.

There are good arguments on both sides....but Peyton's status and our W-L record will dictate the outcome.

For now....I'm gonna hold off on any further Luck debates until we know more.

[ruksak]

I agree 100%, but until Polian is gone I don't think were going to see any scheme change.

Polian is gone soon, on his own volition. I wonder if Chris Polian would be more capable in drafting and signing a different prototype?

I think there is a fear of going down that road until Manning is gone. I firmly believe that Manning's absence is a ready excuse for all shortcomings this year, and the FO will not even think to enter into drastic change until Manning is gone.

[WSO]

Manning can work with players like Collie, Garcon, White etc. if he has to he is a great QB. I would rather see all the picks used on our defense, drafting offense in the 1st round has only produced us 1 super bowl. We need more players like Freeney, Sanders (When healthy), Mathis, Bethea. I am tired of seeing us bust on picks like Brown, Gonzalez etc.

[Jason_]

I think we've seen enough of the cover 2.

We need to trend toward a base 4-3 look and get away from the same philosophy we installed when we led the league in points scored and were shattering passing records.

I disagree...I'd prefer to see more cover 2 but less tampa 2. people say that a different scheme requires different players but the players we have now would play well in cover 2 because the colts do run some cover 2. It's the tampa 2 that's leading to all the easy over the middle completions and the lack of getting off the field on 3rd downs. When they don't drop angry pat back into deep coverage they do actually mix up the coverage between man and zone and drafting an elite CB would allow them to run man even more often.

[Coltsman1788]

I'm not one to complain and I usually look at the cup half full but the Colts secondary is sub par at best. Really...

These guys are not good, miss INT's, can't tackle at all. If the Colts are going to play cover 2 or Tampa 2 and let the QB complete passes for 3-5 yards then the DB's need to tackle at the spot of completion. Too many times last night the Bucs WR made the catch and broke tackles for a bigger gain.

I don't want Luck, too much hype and too much hype means bust. (ie: Leaf and Russell come to mind)

What ever draft spot we get I would first address the secondary because right now that is the weekest part of the team. I'll give the O-line a pass since two guys went down last night but its been the same DBs for 4 weeks now and they are bad.

thoughts?

What good will it do to draft help in the secondary, when our coaches are just going to instruct them to play 10-15 yards off the ball? It's the overall scheme that sucks more so than the players playing in it in my opinion. Our secondary has gotten progressively worse each year under Coyer. This should not be surprising to anyone because that is exactly what happened to Denver while he was there. Colts need to purge themselves of this guy ASAP.

[oldunclemark]

That means there were 2 people that thought that, you and Al Davis. Everybody else knew this guy was nothing but a heaping pile of crap.

Did you? That's some revisionist history...

Everyone raved about him/......Its easy to talk now....

but look back at the draft previews...

[oldunclemark]

We don't have to draft a QB in the top 5 to get someone that Peyton can groom to become an excellent QB. And I'll predict now there is NO WAY Kellen Moore goes in the first round. I think he'll fall to the 3rd round at best. He doesn't have the arm strength to make a majority of NFL type throws and he's 5'11..too many hurdles to overcome to be considered a first round pick imo.

Jason..

There's no way Kellen Moore is not picked in the first round.

He holds every college passing record west of the Mississippi...

[ALuck12]

Kellen Moore is the better fit for this Colts offense. He can make the throws and he can run when the pocket collapses, which happens a lot with our offensive line.

[theking213]

If the Colts have the # 1 pick they will draft Luck. There's no question about that.

But if the Colts are not the # 1 pick they should draft a defensive player or a WR.

[oldunclemark]

Oh....I'm no Draft Day sage.....no one is. I was a Jarron Gilbert fan, for anyone who remembers him. He fell to the 3rd round....and apparently for good reason. No one is a draft "guru"....including the people who get paid to do the real thing.

My take on Russell at the time was....the guy could rifle the ball with the best of them, but there were fairly well-known warning signs that he was very lax on the work habits. He showed up at the combine at 270lbs.... and the red flags were there.

The last thing I'm gonna say about Andrew Luck is the 1st thing I said....if Peyton is down to 2 seasons or less, take him.....if not, then trade the pick. And among other needs....try and get an impact DB, it is said to be a pretty deep class.

Sounds like the draft reports on Russell were similar to Cam Newton..right??

Egomaniac.....doesnt want to work hard. see?

[oldunclemark]

I'm not one to complain and I usually look at the cup half full but the Colts secondary is sub par at best. Really...

These guys are not good, miss INT's, can't tackle at all. If the Colts are going to play cover 2 or Tampa 2 and let the QB complete passes for 3-5 yards then the DB's need to tackle at the spot of completion. Too many times last night the Bucs WR made the catch and broke tackles for a bigger gain.

I don't want Luck, too much hype and too much hype means bust. (ie: Leaf and Russell come to mind)

What ever draft spot we get I would first address the secondary because right now that is the weekest part of the team. I'll give the O-line a pass since two guys went down last night but its been the same DBs for 4 weeks now and they are bad.

thoughts?

This is what I keep saying. We play a zone coverage most of the time. A top CB will not make much of a difference (if any) at all. To waste a high 1st rd. pick on one would be ludicrous.

Gus you draft what you need when you can....

This positional drafting is crazy...

If you need a corner (and we do).take the best on available...

Dont take a lineman when you need a corner just because you're too proud to take a corner in the first round...

[dn4192]

Is it poor talent or poor coaching/schemes game plan? And NO you still take Luck with the number 1 pick.

[ALuck12]

It's poor coaching all the way. This is the same team just without their normal starting QB.

[P-Money]

We have to draft Luck if we get the first pick. If he pans out to have great potential after playing under Manning for two years you then could trade Manning to another team for some good picks or trades. Its a business, don't forget that. The 49ners and Green Bay both axed their franchise quarterbacks and they still had excellent teams. But if Luck turns out to be mediocre than of course you trade him away or keep him as a backup with a lower salary.

[Jason_]

Jason..

There's no way Kellen Moore is not picked in the first round.

He holds every college passing record west of the Mississippi...

lol...we'll see. ;) college passing records mean very little, especially when you're constantly playing the poor quality opponent that Boise State plays year in and year out. I have nothing personal against the guy and in fact he seems like the kind of guy you want to root for...but imo he's nothing more than a decent backup in the NFL.

[dn4192]

Unless Mannings career is over we would be dumb to spend a #1 overall on a QB - so I agree enough of the Luck talk! If he can come back he still has 4-5 years left in him!

We need to improve on D and on the Oline!

I am truelly baffled how anyone can think that in year 4 or 5 Peyton would be a better option over a younger better QB in Luck? Green Bay showed how to handle it, and if the Colts are smart they follow their pattern. You draft Luck, he takes the 2012, 2013 and maybe 2014, but the Peyton era is coming to a close and people need to wake up to that.