Very early look at Colts 2013 free agents

[Albaby]

So I was bored and decided to look up our free agents for 2013 and was thinking who we should sign, etc.

Colts free agents for 2013:

WR, Donnie Avery

WR, Austin Collie

LB, Moise Fokou

LB, Dwight Freeney

DL, Antonio Johnson

DL, Fili Moala

OL, Winston Justice

OL, Jeff Linkenbach

OL, Joe Reitz

P, Pat McAfee

RB, Mewelde Moore

CB, Jerraud Powers

CB, Cassius Vaughn

QB, Drew Stanton

It's early, but who do you think we will re-sign/should re-sign?

PS: Let me know if I put someone on the list that doesn't belong or if someone should be added to the list.

I would think that Donnie Avery, Fili Moala, Joe Reitz and Pat McAfee would be no brainers. I'm not sure if it's worth it to re-sign Freeney unless he gets a pay cut. I'm not sold on any of the CBs that we have. I hope that they shop around the league a little bit. They definately have the budget for it next year.

[NewColtsFan]

Pat is hopeless with his KO's. Are you watching the same games as I am?

I must be.

The KO's I see are rarely even returned, and when they are, the opposition struggles to reach the 20.

Are their some stats somewhere that spells things out for us? You're the first person I've read say anything bad about his KO's.

Maybe you're right. But I haven't seen it.

[Ted Kissel]

OK, THIS IS THE OFFICIAL COLTS LIST OF FREE AGENTS FOR 2013 EVERY ONE OF THEM: according to spottrac.com & the first post here, with them marked if their RFA's (restricted free agent) meaning they can be tendered for 1 year with a first, second or first refusal tender. Sometimes the first refusal tender will come with an original selection draft pick tender.

And what the team will do with them & what I think they will go for in the free agent market vs what their beat writer since 1984 Mike Chapel thinks they will go for in the free agent market.

DE/RLB Dwight Freeney-Gone for sure just ask Mike Chapel, Bob Kravits, and Pro Football talk, likely to sign with another team in 2013 and unfortunately that team in my opinion will either be Tennessee or New England, but the Colts will likely get the highest value (third round) 2014 comp. pick for him. Plus knowing Freeney's agent (Tom Condon) he's going to get more then his market value no matter where he signs.

WR Donnie Avery-Gone and likely to sign with another team mid round 2014 comp. pick

CB Darius Butler-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

WR Austin Collie (RFA)-If lowest RFA value stands as original selection (4th round) Collie will get a 1.26 million RFA original selection tender from the Colts, other wise gone (1.26 mill first refusal tender won't work) with mid-low round comp pick depending on rather his performance with another team.

LB Moise Fokou-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

CB Josh Gordy (RFA)-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

CB Marshay Green-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

DE/OLB Mario Harvey (RFA)-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

DE/OLB Justin Hickman (RFA)-1.26 mill first refusal tender, if he beats out Nevis for second string job then 1.927 mill second round tender.

T Tony Hills-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

DT Antonio Johnson-Defenitaly gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick

RT Winston Justice-40% chance he stays, allot of his future will depend on what the Colts can get at the T (a position that has allot of great free agents available) position in the free agent market. If he signs for less will likely stay as a backup.

T Jeff Linkenback (RFA)-Defenitaly gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

P Pat McAfee (RFA)-Second round 1.927 mill tender, then long-tern deal (no one in their right mind would ever give up a second round pick for a punter).

DL Fili Moala-Gone and likely to sign with another team mid-late round 2014 comp. pick (most likely late round)

LS Matt Oven (RFA)-Keep (tenders too high for the LS position)

CB Jerraud Powers-Since he exited the Miami game with a toe injury and knowing Powers injury history there's a good chance that injury is season ending, I'm gonna say gone here with a 2014 high to mid round pick when he signs with another team other wise 50 50 chance he stays.

G/C AQ Shipley-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

QB Drew Stanton-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

NT Martin Tevaseu-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

CB Cassius Vaughn (RFA)-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

RB Mewelde Moore-Gone and likely to sign with another team (possibly the Steelers) late round 2014 comp. pick possible

G Joe Reitz (RFA)-2.742 mill tender, here normally I would have the Colts giving him a 1.927 second round tender but with the offensive guard class being so weak this offseason and the Colts not having anyone else on their roster who can play the guard position, the Colts may have to go first round on the tender. Long term deal possible.

What Mike Chapel thinks the Colts need in no certain order with what's available in the free agent market

WR

Pass Rusher (I would assume this includes every position in the front 7 aside from ILB)

DB

The only position I disagree with Chapel on is WR and OLB. I think the receivers Grigson drafted have thus far been a pleasant surprise as 2 and 3 options but not #1's. And I think there's a good chance the Colts are sett on Hughes and Mathis as their pass rush LB's, Hughes has fared much better in a 3-4 then a 4-3 and Mathis just got a 4 year 36 million dollar contract. There aren't many team's playing a 3-4 D with 2 OLB's making over 8-9 mill a season. But just for the record, in order here's the positions I think the Colts need to address in free agency

1.NT-Johnson aside from Moala who's missed quite a few games is the only starter in the front 7 without a sack not to mention the fact that he gets run over by opposing RB's.

2.LT-It's tempting to move Castonzo to RT with all the good FA LT's available

3.DB-If I'm right about all the Colts free agent corners all the team will have in the backfield is Antoine Bethea and the thus far injury prone Vontae Davis. And as for what the team needs more in terms of S and CB it's a tie since I've never been a big believer in Tom Zbikowski as a starter.

4.DE-Moala is a free agent and Nevis according to his draft report in multiple 2011 draft magazines only fits the Tampa 2 defense.

And in the draft you can add G as the Colts number one team need since Joe Reitz is currently all the team has at that position and OLB as the team's 6th biggest need since the team may not have a quality backup for Hughes and Mathis. I also would not rule out the Colts trading one of their ILB's likely Pat Angerer for a position of higher need or draft pick.

So if this report is correct the only players the Colts will have left over from their last superbowl run will be WR Reggie Wayne, DE/RLB Robert Mathis, K/P Pat McAfee, RB Donald Brown, and S Antoine Bethea. And the only other Polian players on the team will be OLB Jerry Hughes, WLB Kavell Conner, T Anthony Costanzo, G Joe Reitz, RB Delone Carter, DL Drake Nevis, and S Joe Lafeged. Note Carter, Brown, Nevis, and Lafeged will be gone when their contracts are up. Veniteri may also be back, for the last year of his contract and not re-signed, but I doubt it.

HOW'S THAT FOR AN EARLY 2013 FREE AGENCY REPORT COLTS WARRIORS??????

[Ted Kissel]

Oh yeah I forgot, Chapell also claims the Colts need an offensive tackle.

[NewColtsFan]

OK.... it's now the half-way point of the season... so, I'll take a crack at this....

So I was bored and decided to look up our free agents for 2013 and was thinking who we should sign, etc.

Colts free agents for 2013:

WR, Donnie Avery Yes, very much want him back. The question is how big is the contract?

WR, Austin Collie Best of luck in your post-NFL career.

LB, Moise Fokou Yes, on a modest contract.

LB, Dwight Freeney 1-2 years tops. Modest terms. If he wants to finish as a Colt -- fine. Otherwise......

DL, Antonio Johnson I'll wait until the end of the season, but highly doubtful

DL, Fili Moala So far, I've been pleasantly surprised, so yes.

OL, Winston Justice Can he stay healthy? If so, bring back on a modest contract.

OL, Jeff Linkenbach I'll wait until the end of the season to decide.

OL, Joe Reitz He's barely played at all due to injuries, so again, I'll wait until the end of the season.

P, Pat McAfee Yes, Very much want him back. Willing to pay a premium, but still within reason.

RB, Mewelde Moore Happy trails.

CB, Jerraud Powers Yes. I want him back. I eventually want 3 very good corners. I'd be happy if he was one of them.

CB, Cassius Vaughn Maybe. Want to see more.

QB, Drew Stanton Yes. Don't know where this talk of him leaving to go someplace as a starter comes from?

It's early, but who do you think we will re-sign/should re-sign?

PS: Let me know if I put someone on the list that doesn't belong or if someone should be added to the list.

[Ted Kissel]

OK.... it's now the half-way point of the season... so, I'll take a crack at this....

Dude seriously, look at my list instead, Coltswarriors left out a few names and rather or not the player is an RFA and Freeney is gone and will likely sign for 3 years or more with another team. If John Abraham can get a 3 year deal at age 34, Freeney can get one at age 33. Keep in mind even though he may want to finish his career with the Colts in a defense that does not suite him well, it still isn't going to happen Condon always get's his clients contract's worth more then their market value and has many times been ranked the #1 NFL talent agent in Sportingnews magazine. Don't forget Condon was also Peyton Manning's agent in 2011 and Bob Sanders agent in 2007 look how much money the Colts threw away on those deals for 9 and 0 games. I believe that number was 73.5 million (more then Freeney's most recent contract). Plus Freeney's agent was a different person when he signed his 72 million dollar contract.

[NewColtsFan]

Dude seriously, look at my list instead, Coltswarriors left out a few names and rather or not the player is an RFA and Freeney is gone and will likely sign for 3 years or more with another team. If John Abraham can get a 3 year deal at age 34, Freeney can get one at age 33. Keep in mind even though he may want to finish his career with the Colts in a defense that does not suite him well, it still isn't going to happen Condon always get's his clients contract's worth more then their market value and has many times been ranked the #1 NFL talent agent in Sportingnews magazine. Don't forget Condon was also Peyton Manning's agent in 2011 and Bob Sanders agent in 2007 look how much money the Colts threw away on those deals for 9 and 0 games. I believe that number was 73.5 million (more then Freeney's most recent contract). Plus Freeney's agent was a different person when he signed his 72 million dollar contract.

Ted...... before I tackle your Tour de Force here.... a question....

You have all the players that the Colts will not be retaining bringing back a compensatory draft pick. Are you sure about that? Don't the Colts have to make some offer that the player rejects to earn a pick? Or, is just leaving the team enough to gain a pick? And, if that's the case, why don't the Colts gain a pick for that Manning fellow who left for Denver? I understand he was pretty good? You'd think if anyone would bring a pick, Manning would.....

Are you following my drift here? And if someone other than Ted knows the answer here, please chime in!!

Thanks....

[Warhorse]

WR, Donnie Avery

WR, Austin Collie

LB, Moise Fokou

LB, Dwight Freeney

DL, Antonio Johnson

DL, Fili Moala

OL, Winston Justice

OL, Jeff Linkenbach

OL, Joe Reitz

P, Pat McAfee

RB, Mewelde Moore

CB, Jerraud Powers

CB, Cassius Vaughn

QB, Drew Stanton

I'd try to resign the guys in bold and maybe Stanton, but I don't see any "must signs" on this list... maybe Powers (He should be cheap, the way he's stinking it up this year).

Dang, MS, we think alike on this one. Saved me a post my friend.

[ruf]

I have a feeling that both Freeney and Collie go to the Broncos next year!!

[HtownColt]

Ted...... before I tackle your Tour de Force here.... a question....

You have all the players that the Colts will not be retaining bringing back a compensatory draft pick. Are you sure about that? Don't the Colts have to make some offer that the player rejects to earn a pick? Or, is just leaving the team enough to gain a pick? And, if that's the case, why don't the Colts gain a pick for that Manning fellow who left for Denver? I understand he was pretty good? You'd think if anyone would bring a pick, Manning would.....

Are you following my drift here? And if someone other than Ted knows the answer here, please chime in!!

Thanks....

Manning got released he wasn't a free agent you don't get back a compensatory pick on released players.

32 compensatory picks are awarded to teams that have lost more or better compensatory free agents than they signed in the previous year. Teams that gain and lose the same number of players but lose higher-valued players than they gain also can be awarded a pick, but only in the seventh round, after the other compensatory picks. Compensatory picks cannot be traded, and the placement of the picks is determined by a proprietary formula based on the player's salary, playing time, and postseason honors with his new team, with salary being the primary factor.

[BleedBlu8792]

OK, THIS IS THE OFFICIAL COLTS LIST OF FREE AGENTS FOR 2013 EVERY ONE OF THEM: according to spottrac.com & the first post here, with them marked if their RFA's (restricted free agent) meaning they can be tendered for 1 year with a first, second or first refusal tender. Sometimes the first refusal tender will come with an original selection draft pick tender.

And what the team will do with them & what I think they will go for in the free agent market vs what their beat writer since 1984 Mike Chapel thinks they will go for in the free agent market.

DE/RLB Dwight Freeney-Gone for sure just ask Mike Chapel, Bob Kravits, and Pro Football talk, likely to sign with another team in 2013 and unfortunately that team in my opinion will either be Tennessee or New England, but the Colts will likely get the highest value (third round) 2014 comp. pick for him. Plus knowing Freeney's agent (Tom Condon) he's going to get more then his market value no matter where he signs.

WR Donnie Avery-Gone and likely to sign with another team mid round 2014 comp. pick

CB Darius Butler-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

WR Austin Collie (RFA)-If lowest RFA value stands as original selection (4th round) Collie will get a 1.26 million RFA original selection tender from the Colts, other wise gone (1.26 mill first refusal tender won't work) with mid-low round comp pick depending on rather his performance with another team.

LB Moise Fokou-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

CB Josh Gordy (RFA)-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

CB Marshay Green-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

DE/OLB Mario Harvey (RFA)-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

DE/OLB Justin Hickman (RFA)-1.26 mill first refusal tender, if he beats out Nevis for second string job then 1.927 mill second round tender.

T Tony Hills-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

DT Antonio Johnson-Defenitaly gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick

RT Winston Justice-40% chance he stays, allot of his future will depend on what the Colts can get at the T (a position that has allot of great free agents available) position in the free agent market. If he signs for less will likely stay as a backup.

T Jeff Linkenback (RFA)-Defenitaly gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

P Pat McAfee (RFA)-Second round 1.927 mill tender, then long-tern deal (no one in their right mind would ever give up a second round pick for a punter).

DL Fili Moala-Gone and likely to sign with another team mid-late round 2014 comp. pick (most likely late round)

LS Matt Oven (RFA)-Keep (tenders too high for the LS position)

CB Jerraud Powers-Since he exited the Miami game with a toe injury and knowing Powers injury history there's a good chance that injury is season ending, I'm gonna say gone here with a 2014 high to mid round pick when he signs with another team other wise 50 50 chance he stays.

G/C AQ Shipley-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

QB Drew Stanton-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

NT Martin Tevaseu-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

CB Cassius Vaughn (RFA)-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

RB Mewelde Moore-Gone and likely to sign with another team (possibly the Steelers) late round 2014 comp. pick possible

G Joe Reitz (RFA)-2.742 mill tender, here normally I would have the Colts giving him a 1.927 second round tender but with the offensive guard class being so weak this offseason and the Colts not having anyone else on their roster who can play the guard position, the Colts may have to go first round on the tender. Long term deal possible.

What Mike Chapel thinks the Colts need in no certain order with what's available in the free agent market

WR

Pass Rusher (I would assume this includes every position in the front 7 aside from ILB)

DB

The only position I disagree with Chapel on is WR and OLB. I think the receivers Grigson drafted have thus far been a pleasant surprise as 2 and 3 options but not #1's. And I think there's a good chance the Colts are sett on Hughes and Mathis as their pass rush LB's, Hughes has fared much better in a 3-4 then a 4-3 and Mathis just got a 4 year 36 million dollar contract. There aren't many team's playing a 3-4 D with 2 OLB's making over 8-9 mill a season. But just for the record, in order here's the positions I think the Colts need to address in free agency

1.NT-Johnson aside from Moala who's missed quite a few games is the only starter in the front 7 without a sack not to mention the fact that he gets run over by opposing RB's.

2.LT-It's tempting to move Castonzo to RT with all the good FA LT's available

3.DB-If I'm right about all the Colts free agent corners all the team will have in the backfield is Antoine Bethea and the thus far injury prone Vontae Davis. And as for what the team needs more in terms of S and CB it's a tie since I've never been a big believer in Tom Zbikowski as a starter.

4.DE-Moala is a free agent and Nevis according to his draft report in multiple 2011 draft magazines only fits the Tampa 2 defense.

And in the draft you can add G as the Colts number one team need since Joe Reitz is currently all the team has at that position and OLB as the team's 6th biggest need since the team may not have a quality backup for Hughes and Mathis. I also would not rule out the Colts trading one of their ILB's likely Pat Angerer for a position of higher need or draft pick.

So if this report is correct the only players the Colts will have left over from their last superbowl run will be WR Reggie Wayne, DE/RLB Robert Mathis, K/P Pat McAfee, RB Donald Brown, and S Antoine Bethea. And the only other Polian players on the team will be OLB Jerry Hughes, WLB Kavell Conner, T Anthony Costanzo, G Joe Reitz, RB Delone Carter, DL Drake Nevis, and S Joe Lafeged. Note Carter, Brown, Nevis, and Lafeged will be gone when their contracts are up. Veniteri may also be back, for the last year of his contract and not re-signed, but I doubt it.

HOW'S THAT FOR AN EARLY 2013 FREE AGENCY REPORT COLTS WARRIORS??????

Hickman is a pass rushing OLB. Nevis doesn't having anything to do with whether or not Hickman stays. Nevis plays DT/DE.

On top of that I think a few of these guys will be brought back for depth (Shipley, Fokou, Hickman, Avery, Johnson).

It wouldn't make sense to re-strip the entire team again and build with all new back-ups who are going to have to learn what these guys already know. Dollar for dollar its pretty much a wash.

[BleedBlu8792]

OK, THIS IS THE OFFICIAL COLTS LIST OF FREE AGENTS FOR 2013 EVERY ONE OF THEM: according to spottrac.com & the first post here, with them marked if their RFA's (restricted free agent) meaning they can be tendered for 1 year with a first, second or first refusal tender. Sometimes the first refusal tender will come with an original selection draft pick tender.

And what the team will do with them & what I think they will go for in the free agent market vs what their beat writer since 1984 Mike Chapel thinks they will go for in the free agent market.

DE/RLB Dwight Freeney-Gone for sure just ask Mike Chapel, Bob Kravits, and Pro Football talk, likely to sign with another team in 2013 and unfortunately that team in my opinion will either be Tennessee or New England, but the Colts will likely get the highest value (third round) 2014 comp. pick for him. Plus knowing Freeney's agent (Tom Condon) he's going to get more then his market value no matter where he signs.

WR Donnie Avery-Gone and likely to sign with another team mid round 2014 comp. pick

CB Darius Butler-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

WR Austin Collie (RFA)-If lowest RFA value stands as original selection (4th round) Collie will get a 1.26 million RFA original selection tender from the Colts, other wise gone (1.26 mill first refusal tender won't work) with mid-low round comp pick depending on rather his performance with another team.

LB Moise Fokou-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

CB Josh Gordy (RFA)-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

CB Marshay Green-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

DE/OLB Mario Harvey (RFA)-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

DE/OLB Justin Hickman (RFA)-1.26 mill first refusal tender, if he beats out Nevis for second string job then 1.927 mill second round tender.

T Tony Hills-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

DT Antonio Johnson-Defenitaly gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick

RT Winston Justice-40% chance he stays, allot of his future will depend on what the Colts can get at the T (a position that has allot of great free agents available) position in the free agent market. If he signs for less will likely stay as a backup.

T Jeff Linkenback (RFA)-Defenitaly gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

P Pat McAfee (RFA)-Second round 1.927 mill tender, then long-tern deal (no one in their right mind would ever give up a second round pick for a punter).

DL Fili Moala-Gone and likely to sign with another team mid-late round 2014 comp. pick (most likely late round)

LS Matt Oven (RFA)-Keep (tenders too high for the LS position)

CB Jerraud Powers-Since he exited the Miami game with a toe injury and knowing Powers injury history there's a good chance that injury is season ending, I'm gonna say gone here with a 2014 high to mid round pick when he signs with another team other wise 50 50 chance he stays.

G/C AQ Shipley-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

QB Drew Stanton-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

NT Martin Tevaseu-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

CB Cassius Vaughn (RFA)-Gone and likely to sign with another team late round 2014 comp. pick possible

RB Mewelde Moore-Gone and likely to sign with another team (possibly the Steelers) late round 2014 comp. pick possible

G Joe Reitz (RFA)-2.742 mill tender, here normally I would have the Colts giving him a 1.927 second round tender but with the offensive guard class being so weak this offseason and the Colts not having anyone else on their roster who can play the guard position, the Colts may have to go first round on the tender. Long term deal possible.

What Mike Chapel thinks the Colts need in no certain order with what's available in the free agent market

WR

Pass Rusher (I would assume this includes every position in the front 7 aside from ILB)

DB

The only position I disagree with Chapel on is WR and OLB. I think the receivers Grigson drafted have thus far been a pleasant surprise as 2 and 3 options but not #1's. And I think there's a good chance the Colts are sett on Hughes and Mathis as their pass rush LB's, Hughes has fared much better in a 3-4 then a 4-3 and Mathis just got a 4 year 36 million dollar contract. There aren't many team's playing a 3-4 D with 2 OLB's making over 8-9 mill a season. But just for the record, in order here's the positions I think the Colts need to address in free agency

1.NT-Johnson aside from Moala who's missed quite a few games is the only starter in the front 7 without a sack not to mention the fact that he gets run over by opposing RB's.

2.LT-It's tempting to move Castonzo to RT with all the good FA LT's available

3.DB-If I'm right about all the Colts free agent corners all the team will have in the backfield is Antoine Bethea and the thus far injury prone Vontae Davis. And as for what the team needs more in terms of S and CB it's a tie since I've never been a big believer in Tom Zbikowski as a starter.

4.DE-Moala is a free agent and Nevis according to his draft report in multiple 2011 draft magazines only fits the Tampa 2 defense.

And in the draft you can add G as the Colts number one team need since Joe Reitz is currently all the team has at that position and OLB as the team's 6th biggest need since the team may not have a quality backup for Hughes and Mathis. I also would not rule out the Colts trading one of their ILB's likely Pat Angerer for a position of higher need or draft pick.

So if this report is correct the only players the Colts will have left over from their last superbowl run will be WR Reggie Wayne, DE/RLB Robert Mathis, K/P Pat McAfee, RB Donald Brown, and S Antoine Bethea. And the only other Polian players on the team will be OLB Jerry Hughes, WLB Kavell Conner, T Anthony Costanzo, G Joe Reitz, RB Delone Carter, DL Drake Nevis, and S Joe Lafeged. Note Carter, Brown, Nevis, and Lafeged will be gone when their contracts are up. Veniteri may also be back, for the last year of his contract and not re-signed, but I doubt it.

HOW'S THAT FOR AN EARLY 2013 FREE AGENCY REPORT COLTS WARRIORS??????

Hickman is a pass rushing OLB. Nevis doesn't having anything to do with whether or not Hickman stays. Nevis plays DT/DE.

On top of that I think a few of these guys will be brought back for depth (Shipley, Fokou, Hickman, Avery, Johnson).

It wouldn't make sense to re-strip the entire team again and build with all new back-ups who are going to have to learn what these guys already know. Dollar for dollar its pretty much a wash.

[BleedBlu8792]

Sorry for the double post.

[NewColtsFan]

Manning got released he wasn't a free agent you don't get back a compensatory pick on released players.

32 compensatory picks are awarded to teams that have lost more or better compensatory free agents than they signed in the previous year. Teams that gain and lose the same number of players but lose higher-valued players than they gain also can be awarded a pick, but only in the seventh round, after the other compensatory picks. Compensatory picks cannot be traded, and the placement of the picks is determined by a proprietary formula based on the player's salary, playing time, and postseason honors with his new team, with salary being the primary factor.

Does anyone have an NFL Legalese to English translation dictionary?!? HTownColt has been nice enough to explain how compensatory picks works...

Now, I'm looking for someone to explain his explanation! Someone spell it out for me like I'm a 6-year old!! Cause the older I get, there are just sometimes when my brain feels just like a 6-year olds!! And I think this is one of those times!

Oy' I'm a mess! :slaphead:

[Ted Kissel]

On top of that I think a few of these guys will be brought back for depth (Shipley, Fokou, Hickman, Avery, Johnson).

It wouldn't make sense to re-strip the entire team again and build with all new back-ups who are going to have to learn what these guys already know. Dollar for dollar its pretty much a wash.

Johnson is going to be gone, the Colts already have Brandon McKinney and Josh Chapman for backups at the NT position. And there's a good chance Avery will be gone too, he was only brought in for development of guys like T.Y. Hilton. The others will stay if they will sign for next to nothing. And the team will be stripped again at least in terms of the starters, last season the Colts had 36 million in dead cap plus Dwight Freeney's highly overpriced contract, and Luck's 15 million signing bonus accounting to 80 million in cap space, this season the Colts will be around the 88-90 million dollar mark under the cap with no dead cap money without the cap being raised unless Adam Vinatieri is released which could happen and would save the Colts around a million in cap space. Even with the release of Peyton Manning the Colts didn't have much to work with and only traded for guys like Vaughan and Justice and signed guys like Avery and Shipley to develop Luck and other rookies on offense and make a playoff run to sell tickets. Don't forget for Justice and Vaughan the Colts gave up practically nothing. And from a business stand point it would make more sense for the Colts to have another make over next season in their starting line up for pretty much everywhere on defense except for the LB positions and on the O-line starting with the team not bothering to re-sign Dwight Freeney since even if they had released who they did with little to no dead cap space for who they released, they still would owe Luck a 15 million signing bonus. And you never know Shipley may out price himself for the Colts, the free agent market is pretty thin at the guard position. Last season the TE position was weak in the the FA market and look what Dallas Clark and Martellus Bennett got for horrific performances with their teams.

[Ted Kissel]

Ted...... before I tackle your Tour de Force here.... a question....

You have all the players that the Colts will not be retaining bringing back a compensatory draft pick. Are you sure about that? Don't the Colts have to make some offer that the player rejects to earn a pick? Or, is just leaving the team enough to gain a pick? And, if that's the case, why don't the Colts gain a pick for that Manning fellow who left for Denver? I understand he was pretty good? You'd think if anyone would bring a pick, Manning would.....

Are you following my drift here? And if someone other than Ted knows the answer here, please chime in!!

Thanks....

1.I don't think the Colts have to make an offer to a player to get a comp. pick other wise Freeney and Linkenbach would not be Colts. They got comp. picks for Tim Jennings, Clint Session, and Cato June. According to Mike Chapell the team didn't make much of an effort to sign Cato June and we all know the Colts did practically nothing to sign Tim Jennings considering the fact that he didn't receive any RFA tender and even though Session was tendered and had his tender revoked after the new CBA was finalized due to new league rules. Knowing what the Colts have done in the past in terms of keeping their OLB's, I highly doubt the team made much of an effort to keep him. And I'm not sure about all the players notice on most of them I said late round comp. pick possible.

2.See first post on Comp. pick for Manning.

[Gavin]

Johnson outplayed Mckinney and his skates, Getting rid of your second best receiver in Avery is not a very good decision, Hilton needs to show more consistency as it is when Whalen returns next season Hilton may not even be in the slot let alone #2 from what I have seen in my opinion

[coltnorth]

I hope some people here are kidding with the number of guys they have not being re-signed. Its very unlikely that the team will cut or not resign 2 or 3 starters on the oline, our #2 corner, our depth at lb etc... Grigson will most likely avoid creating holes which would force him to fill via draft or free agency. Continuity is important especially on the lines. Some guys that people are throwing away (justice, reitz, powers) on this forum, would be gold to other teams right now. With that said, here is my prediction.

Resign: Powers, Justice, Reitz, Link, Foiku, Pat, Moala, AJ, Vaughan, Avery.

With these guys in place, you can go into the draft and pick the best player available. No huge hole to fill, only upgrade. Maybe all of the guys I listed above wouldnt start but they could if needed.

[BOTT]

I have a feeling that both Freeney and Collie go to the Broncos next year!!

that feeling could be brain damage

[Ted Kissel]

Johnson outplayed Mckinney and his skates,

So McKinney sucks, so what the Colts still have Josh Chapman who will be back next season from IR. Do you really want to pay a backup NT like Johnson much more then league min when the Colts have the money to sign pretty much who ever they want in free agency next season. Also notice Johnson is pretty much the only player in the Colts front 7 without a sack.

[FightLikeSin]

So I was bored and decided to look up our free agents for 2013 and was thinking who we should sign, etc.

Colts free agents for 2013:

WR, Donnie Avery

WR, Austin Collie

LB, Moise Fokou

LB, Dwight Freeney

DL, Antonio Johnson

DL, Fili Moala

OL, Winston Justice

OL, Jeff Linkenbach

OL, Joe Reitz

P, Pat McAfee

RB, Mewelde Moore - he's gone...

CB, Jerraud Powers

CB, Cassius Vaughn

QB, Drew Stanton

It's early, but who do you think we will re-sign/should re-sign?

PS: Let me know if I put someone on the list that doesn't belong or if someone should be added to the list.

[colts 101]

agreed

Stanton may leave for a shot to start

If Stanton leaves, will Harnish move into the no. 2 spot? How is Harnish progressing? Anyone heard?

[Gavin]

So McKinney sucks, so what the Colts still have Josh Chapman who will be back next season from IR. Do you really want to pay a backup NT like Johnson much more then league min when the Colts have the money to sign pretty much who ever they want in free agency next season. Also notice Johnson is pretty much the only player in the Colts front 7 without a sack.

a Nose Tackles job in a 3-4 is not to get sacks, Johnson is more of a pass rusher from Nose then Chapman is he just doesnt have the sacks to show it, Chapman is a blocks eater that Johnson is not consistently in my opinion. Chapman will be a 2 down Nose Tackle

[HtownColt]

Were not going to get any compensatory picks. We only lost (Garçon, Wheeler, and Saturday) to free agency. And we added Redding, Avery, Zbikowski, Satele, McGlynn(all starters) we added more than we lost in free agency so we wouldn't get any compensatory picks. Well that's how I see it I could be wrong

[Ted Kissel]

a Nose Tackles job in a 3-4 is not to get sacks, Johnson is more of a pass rusher from Nose then Chapman is he just doesnt have the sacks to show it, Chapman is a blocks eater that Johnson is not consistently in my opinion. Chapman will be a 2 down Nose Tackle

A NT's job in a 3-4 is not to get sacks, I will agree with you there, but there still are allot of NT's in the NFL who do get sacks. But it is a NT's job to stop the run and team's run right through the middle of the Colts defense. That's the main reason why it's ranked 25th in the league and that's why Johnson will be gone next season and the Colts will use the salaries of Dwight Freeney and Antonio Johnson to either sign a NT or LT. Now as for Chapman and McKinney, I will give credit where credit is due Johnson did beat both of them out in training camp. But Chapman is only a rookie, rookies rarely start at NT and McKinney is a backup plus McKinney is on IR and Chapman is on the PUP list and their both under contract next season. But either way I highly doubt Chapman is coming back this season and him being injury prone makes the NT position all that much more of a need for the Colts this offseason.

[Ted Kissel]

Were not going to get any compensatory picks. We only lost (Garçon, Wheeler, and Saturday) to free agency. And we added Redding, Avery, Zbikowski, Satele, McGlynn(all starters) we added more than we lost in free agency.

Compensatory picks are not about who you loose and replace them with or rather or not you try to re-sign players you lose, their about contracts and performance with a new team. Garcon got a big contract, but he is also injury prone which means we will prolly get a 4-5th round pick for him and the same goes for Saturday and Wheeler if they can stay off IR since their contracts wasn't super huge like Garcon. Garcon would give us a 3rd round comp. pick if he could stay healthy and Wheeler may give us a bit lower pick then Saturday.

[PrincetonTiger]

All I know for sure is that Mewelde won't be back

[1959Colts]

An upgrade over Winston Justice is needed.

[ColtFan12]

I would resign most of the defense. Not sure about the rest of those guys.

[Jason_]

Compensatory picks are not about who you loose and replace them with or rather or not you try to re-sign players you lose, their about contracts and performance with a new team. Garcon got a big contract, but he is also injury prone which means we will prolly get a 4-5th round pick for him and the same goes for Saturday and Wheeler if they can stay off IR since their contracts wasn't super huge like Garcon. Garcon would give us a 3rd round comp. pick if he could stay healthy and Wheeler may give us a bit lower pick then Saturday.

Compensatory picks are determined based on the number of ufa's you lose vs the number of ufa's you bring in. It also is based on contract and performance. However if a team signs more fa's than they lost then they have very little chance of getting a comp pick.

There are also restrictions based on the number of years the player has been in the league. The best we could hope to get for freeney is a 5th. We might be able to get a third for garcon but we also brought in redding who has been a big contributor so that may cancel out garcon somewhat.

There is zero chance of getting a compensatory pick for backups like vaughn, fokou etc. As has already been said, there are only 32 picks total that are distributed between all teams.

[Jason_]

A NT's job in a 3-4 is not to get sacks, I will agree with you there, but there still are allot of NT's in the NFL who do get sacks. But it is a NT's job to stop the run and team's run right through the middle of the Colts defense. That's the main reason why it's ranked 25th in the league and that's why Johnson will be gone next season and the Colts will use the salaries of Dwight Freeney and Antonio Johnson to either sign a NT or LT. Now as for Chapman and McKinney, I will give credit where credit is due Johnson did beat both of them out in training camp. But Chapman is only a rookie, rookies rarely start at NT and McKinney is a backup plus McKinney is on IR and Chapman is on the PUP list and their both under contract next season. But either way I highly doubt Chapman is coming back this season and him being injury prone makes the NT position all that much more of a need for the Colts this offseason.

Actually thats not true. Teams are mostly busting big runs off tackle and on sweeps to the edges. Freeney and mathis, while great pass rushers, struggle with and are inconsistent at setting the edge on running plays. Not to mention bethea and zibs have struggled as well often times overpursuing and taking poor angles. Runs straight up the middle more often than not have been stuffed, especially when mookie is on the field. Id be very surprised if mookie is not back next year.

And on what are you basing that chapman is "injury prone"?

[Gavin]

The NT that will be gone in my opinion will be Tevasue, Could it be Mookie? sure, He hasn't played like a #1 NT should in my opinion but he has played better then Mckinney and Tevasue. Mookie is not the answer, we dont even know if Chapman can be but Mookie is more then capable of being a rotational Nose more so then either Mckinney or Tevasue

[GoColtsGo5150]

I think we should try to resign as many as possible cos later we could trade them to other teams, atleast we would get something for them. The only real question is should we use the franchise tag, if yes then who? Personally I think yes and on someone like mcafee

[Gavin]

Mcafee is good but I dont see the need to Franchise Tag a Punter, Mcafee wont be going anywhere I bet anyway. Other then that none of our soon to be Free Agents are Franchise Tag type players

[BleedBlu8792]

I think we should try to resign as many as possible cos later we could trade them to other teams, atleast we would get something for them. The only real question is should we use the franchise tag, if yes then who? Personally I think yes and on someone like mcafee

The guys we end up keeping aren't really going to be anything more than back-up players.

I doubt the franchise tag gets used because there will be more than enough money to get Pat resigned and whoever else they want to sign.

[Ted Kissel]

Actually thats not true. Teams are mostly busting big runs off tackle and on sweeps to the edges. Freeney and mathis, while great pass rushers, struggle with and are inconsistent at setting the edge on running plays. Not to mention bethea and zibs have struggled as well often times overpursuing and taking poor angles. Runs straight up the middle more often than not have been stuffed, especially when mookie is on the field. Id be very surprised if mookie is not back next year.

And on what are you basing that chapman is "injury prone"?

1.Johnson sucks he can't stop the run and he can't pressure the QB, the Colts biggest need on defense according to Brad Wells and a bunch of post on Stampede Blue (at least as of last offseason), is at the NT position they will have 82.6-90 million in cap room next season. The Colts big move in free agency will likely either be for an offensive and or nose tackle. They will likely have to make that move in order to avoid salary cap penalties. Plus re-siging Johnson and a good NT in free agency would mean Ryan Grigson keeping at least 4 NT's on his roster, no team in the NFL has that kind of roster space unless someone gets injured either towards the end of the season or during early offseason OTA's before free agency if there even are any.

2.Mathis may not be that great at stopping the run, but he still manages to unlike Freeney constantly pressure the QB and get sacks. Last offseason the Colts made their decision on who they were going to keep long-term between Freeney and Mathis and personally I think it was the right one. Freeney will get a bigger contract with another team then Mathis did last season and Mathis fits the 3-4 better.

3.I'm only saying Chapman is injury prone because he is currently injured and hasn't played a single down. There's a reason Chapman slipped as low as he did in the 2012 draft and I think it's because of Injury.

[NewColtsFan]

1.Johnson sucks he can't stop the run and he can't pressure the QB, the Colts biggest need on defense according to Brad Wells and a bunch of post on Stampede Blue (at least as of last offseason), is at the NT position they will have 82.6-90 million in cap room next season. The Colts big move in free agency will likely either be for an offensive and or nose tackle. They will likely have to make that move in order to avoid salary cap penalties. Plus re-siging Johnson and a good NT in free agency would mean Ryan Grigson keeping at least 4 NT's on his roster, no team in the NFL has that kind of roster space unless someone gets injured either towards the end of the season or during early offseason OTA's before free agency if there even are any.

2.Mathis may not be that great at stopping the run, but he still manages to unlike Freeney constantly pressure the QB and get sacks. Last offseason the Colts made their decision on who they were going to keep long-term between Freeney and Mathis and personally I think it was the right one. Freeney will get a bigger contract with another team then Mathis did last season and Mathis fits the 3-4 better.

3.I'm only saying Chapman is injury prone because he is currently injured and hasn't played a single down. There's a reason Chapman slipped as low as he did in the 2012 draft and I think it's because of Injury.

Hold on now.... let's come up for some air here and take a deep, deep breath....

I haven't read Stampedeblue much lately, but the salary cap numbers for next year at roughly 40+ that we'll have to spend, not 82-90 Mill. I don't know if that's a misread by you, or an error by them. Either way, I think it's way, Way, WAY off.

Second, Injury prone, means just that. Prone to injury. Being currently injured doesn't mean injury prone. Of course Chapman went lower due to his injury. He hurst his knee in early October, and bypassed surgery for 3 1/2 months so he could help his team win the National Championship. I don't know if he'll play this year. But there's no one in football circles who has called him 'injury prone'...

Let's make sure we're all on the same page so perhaps we can find some common ground before the latest raging internet debate starts.... Shall we? Hmmmm???

p.s. -- Ted, if you could please link the story that has the salary cap figures on Stampede Blue here, that would be appreciated. Or at least, try to guide me there. I just went to their website and couldn't find it. Not saying it's not there, only that I couldn't find it. Any help you could give me with this would be great.

Thanks again....

p.s.s. -- Here's a guess... the figure of $82-90 million is approximately what we ARE spending THIS YEAR. Not what we'll have to spend NEXT year. Here's a story that references the $82 Million figure. It's at the bottom, and the story is short.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/10/colts-moves-result-in-38-million-of-dead-money/

[Jason_]

1.Johnson sucks he can't stop the run and he can't pressure the QB, the Colts biggest need on defense according to Brad Wells and a bunch of post on Stampede Blue (at least as of last offseason), is at the NT position they will have 82.6-90 million in cap room next season. The Colts big move in free agency will likely either be for an offensive and or nose tackle. They will likely have to make that move in order to avoid salary cap penalties. Plus re-siging Johnson and a good NT in free agency would mean Ryan Grigson keeping at least 4 NT's on his roster, no team in the NFL has that kind of roster space unless someone gets injured either towards the end of the season or during early offseason OTA's before free agency if there even are any.

2.Mathis may not be that great at stopping the run, but he still manages to unlike Freeney constantly pressure the QB and get sacks. Last offseason the Colts made their decision on who they were going to keep long-term between Freeney and Mathis and personally I think it was the right one. Freeney will get a bigger contract with another team then Mathis did last season and Mathis fits the 3-4 better.

3.I'm only saying Chapman is injury prone because he is currently injured and hasn't played a single down. There's a reason Chapman slipped as low as he did in the 2012 draft and I think it's because of Injury.

1. Johnson does not suck. He has been mostly consistent in clogging the middle and keeping the lb's clean. He has had his bad moments but so do all players. He's not meant to be a pass rusher yet he has been collapsing the pocket more recently. He was less than a step away from 2 sacks against the browns. There have been several runs busted up the middle of our defense but every time its happened i rewind the play to double check who the nt was on the play and with the exception of a less than a handful of plays (all season) it was the backup nt in on that play. Im not saying hes pro bowl material by any means but he has played very well for the most part. If chapman can emerge as the nt i think he can be then i think we'll have a very good 1-2 rotation with him and aj. I dont expect tevaseu to be back next year and mckinney is iffy. Id also say that aj could slide over to 5 tech de in 3-4 fronts in running downs.

2. I agree with you completely. I merely brought up the point to explain why our run defense is still poor and inconsistent and its not because if aj. Mathis is much better at chasing s run play down from behind than he is at setting the edge on plays that come to his side. I do not mean to say we should get rid of him though. Far from it.

3 as gavin already pointed out there us a huge difference between being prone to injury and being currently injured. Bob sanders and anthony gonzales were injury prone. Chapman merely is currently injured. Big difference.

[throwing BBZ]

Colts free agents for 2013:

WR, Donnie Avery - YES

WR, Austin Collie - No, but so good

LB, Moise Fokou - yes, pretty decent in the system

LB, Dwight Freeney - Absolutely NOT. His ankles are weak (OLD), no chance to play at near 100% for a season which he needs to be effective.

DL, Antonio Johnson - maybe

DL, Fili Moala - yes

OL, Winston Justice - maybe, I do believe he can start

OL, Jeff Linkenbach - IF you want him on the roster you have NO CLUE.

OL, Joe Reitz - yes - he might start at LG, RT, or be a very good backup

P, Pat McAfee- yes

CB, Jerraud Powers- maybe at best - he lacks cover speed, always has always will

QB, Drew Stanton yes

[BOTT]

Colts free agents for 2013:

WR, Donnie Avery - YES

WR, Austin Collie - No, but so good

LB, Moise Fokou - yes, pretty decent in the system

LB, Dwight Freeney - Absolutely NOT. His ankles are weak (OLD), no chance to play at near 100% for a season which he needs to be effective.

DL, Antonio Johnson - maybe

DL, Fili Moala - yes

OL, Winston Justice - maybe, I do believe he can start

OL, Jeff Linkenbach - IF you want him on the roster you have NO CLUE.

OL, Joe Reitz - yes - he might start at LG, RT, or be a very good backup

P, Pat McAfee- yes

CB, Jerraud Powers- maybe at best - he lacks cover speed, always has always will

QB, Drew Stanton yes

i don't want link starting, but having a guy who can play multiple positions on the oline isn't a bad thing.