The o line-potential might be there

[Jules]

Many think the o line is terrible and could get Luck killed. This is possible. But, for fun and interest I Iooked up last years total o line stats.

Colts finished the year ranked 15th out of 32. Not as horrible as many make it sound right? And the Colts never had solid QB help either all season long.

http://www.nfl.com/s...=true&Submit=Go

Now, of course feel free to analyze anything you want on this or delve much deeper. There are a few factors we cannot control or predict. And we lost Jeff Saturday but possibly have replaced him, so we will see on that one later.

Fun facts: The Colts gave up less sacks last season then the often praised Packers o line. The Colts gave up 3 more sacks then the heavily praised Patriots o line.

[bahhummbug]

The Colts also have a more mobile GB and his delivery speed in far faster than Collins or Painters.These are factors and deficiencies Peyton covered his time with the Colts.Also in any scramble I would take Luck over Manning,or Brady,or Phillips any day.So add in this year a QB that can scramble,run,take a hit,and quicker release then judge O-Line or figure atleast a top 10 IMO easy.

[21isSuperman]

Stats can always be manipulated to show what you want. During Peyton's time here, our O-line gave up very few sacks. But that was not because we had quality O-linemen, it was because Peyton had a quick release and could read the defense to know where the pressure was coming from. He would get the ball out before taking a hit. With that said, I do think our O-line can be a top 15 group. Castonzo, Reitz, Satele, Ijalana, and Justice could make a solid group

[Creekside]

I believe the O-line this year may be good. Last year's line was pretty good in pass protection, and pretty good in run blocking. The Colt's 4.2 yds per carry rushing is impressive when you consider that defenses did not need to respect the passing game. Colt's running backs were tackled behind the line of scrimmage only 9% of the time, which is exactly the same as the 12 playoff teams. Question is, have Saturday and Diem been adequately replaced? I believe they have. I'm optimistic that the line will be pretty good.

[Jules]

Stats can always be manipulated to show what you want. During Peyton's time here, our O-line gave up very few sacks. But that was not because we had quality O-linemen, it was because Peyton had a quick release and could read the defense to know where the pressure was coming from. He would get the ball out before taking a hit. With that said, I do think our O-line can be a top 15 group. Castonzo, Reitz, Satele, Ijalana, and Justice could make a solid group

Yes but the fact remains, with the struggles at QB all season last year the Colts finished with a top 15 o line. It is what it is.

And TBH, I feel we had some pretty decent o lines in Peyton's time here even though many of them got trashed and did decline post SB win. Losing Tarik was bigger then people felt at the time though and probably began the decline, that man was a rock. It is remarkable to me that Polian publicly put the blame on the o line for the SB loss. For one thing, that last ranked rushing attack in the NFL was actually reaching nearly 6 ypc by Addai in the SB but he only had around 13 carries for the entire game and Manning threw 45 times. To this day you cannot convince me that running the ball does not matter even in today's pass happy league. If you throw nearly 40 to 50 times in a big game you are often doomed.

[21isSuperman]

Yes but the fact remains, with the struggles at QB all season last year the Colts finished with a top 15 o line. It is what it is.

And TBH, I feel we had some pretty decent o lines in Peyton's time here even though many of them got trashed and did decline post SB win. Losing Tarik was bigger then people felt at the time though and probably began the decline, that man was a rock. It is remarkable to me that Polian publicly put the blame on the o line for the SB loss. For one thing, that last ranked rushing attack in the NFL was actually reaching nearly 6 ypc by Addai in the SB but he only had around 13 carries for the entire game and Manning threw 45 times. To this day you cannot convince me that running the ball does not matter even in today's pass happy league. If you throw nearly 40 to 50 times in a big game you are often doomed.

I agree. I thought the O-line played pretty well in the Super Bowl...in both, to be honest. And yes, losing Glenn was a big blow to the offensive line.

[Gavin]

I believe the O-line this year may be good. Last year's line was pretty good in pass protection, and pretty good in run blocking. The Colt's 4.2 yds per carry rushing is impressive when you consider that defenses did not need to respect the passing game. Colt's running backs were tackled behind the line of scrimmage only 9% of the time, which is exactly the same as the 12 playoff teams. Question is, have Saturday and Diem been adequately replaced? I believe they have. I'm optimistic that the line will be pretty good.

The left side of our O Line scares the heck out of me, Take out the game against Suggs in which he gave up 3 sacks and he did good though (castonzo), unfortunately you cant take out games and our running backs couldnt run behind him or Joe Reitz

[jimirsaysdog]

i think the addition of satele, justice and mcglynn is huge . young but experienced battle tested veterans to bring some stability to the line along with castonzo and reitz. stability up front will be paramount to lucks development.

[jimirsaysdog]

Stats can always be manipulated to show what you want. During Peyton's time here, our O-line gave up very few sacks. But that was not because we had quality O-linemen, it was because Peyton had a quick release and could read the defense to know where the pressure was coming from. He would get the ball out before taking a hit. With that said, I do think our O-line can be a top 15 group. Castonzo, Reitz, Satele, Ijalana, and Justice could make a solid group

substitute mcglynn for ijalana and barring injury that's your starting group.

[Gavin]

I seriously dont think Castonzo or Reitz have the leg strength you need in the running game

[Smonroe]

This is fun to speculate, but it's all moot until we see it (the O Line) in action. Except for Satele, non of the guys brought in were exactly stars. A few were competent, had good and bad seasons. I suspect we'll have a pretty good idea by the third preseason game, on how many max protection sets we'll expect to see.

I don't know if Gavin is correct about Castonzo and Reitz leg strength, but I thought they both showed signs of development last season. To be honest, I'm way more concerned about our defensive backfield than our O line.

[Creekside]

The left side of our O Line scares the heck out of me, Take out the game against Suggs in which he gave up 3 sacks and he did good though (castonzo), unfortunately you cant take out games and our running backs couldnt run behind him or Joe Reitz

.....Colts had fewest negative rushes going left (10) ....compared to center (13).....and going right (13).....power rushing (needing 2 yds or less to achieve 1st down)... was most successfull going left (75%)....compared to center (31%)....and going right (71%)......no way to manipulate these stats. They are what they are.

[21isSuperman]

substitute mcglynn for ijalana and barring injury that's your starting group.

You're not sold on Ijalana? Or do you think McGlynn is better? Or do you think Ijalana needs more time to heal from his injury?

[Gavin]

.....Colts had fewest negative rushes going left (10) ....compared to center (13).....and going right (13).....power rushing (needing 2 yds or less to achieve 1st down)... was most successfull going left (75%)....compared to center (31%)....and going right (71%)......no way to manipulate these stats. They are what they are.

Those rushing stats are kind of hard to tell whats what because of the lack of separation in each section

[Michael Lebron]

Having a GM that is a former O lineman should account for something. I am confident he has an eye for good o lineman. Also this is the position he addressed first.

[colts1993]

I see our O line better than the one we had last year so I hope that's a good sign.

[Mameluc]

deppending on Ijalana if he pans out and where, id say we are only 1 guy from a pretty good OL. if iajalan ends up beeing the T Pollian thought, we need 1 G. if Ijalana ends up being a pretty good G then a T.

if he busts, then we need 2 guys .

honestly im more excited than worried about the OL. the possiblities.

[OLD FAN MAN]

The left side of our O Line scares the heck out of me, Take out the game against Suggs in which he gave up 3 sacks and he did good though (castonzo), unfortunately you cant take out games and our running backs couldnt run behind him or Joe Reitz

i agree casto will be replaced by the coaches if he dosent improve this year,he is very slow, got to move if he is to start

[Gavin]

.....Colts had fewest negative rushes going left (10) ....compared to center (13).....and going right (13).....power rushing (needing 2 yds or less to achieve 1st down)... was most successfull going left (75%)....compared to center (31%)....and going right (71%)......no way to manipulate these stats. They are what they are.

Colts also had the fewest rushes going left, they primarily ran it up the middle or to Linkenbachs side

[ColtsAllDay12]

i agree casto will be replaced by the coaches if he dosent improve this year,he is very slow, got to move if he is to start

Man cut the guy some slack. He was a rookie that came in and played the toughest spot on the line without any training camp. He also played the second half of the season hurt. He had to go up against some really good pass rushers too (Suggs, Mario Williams). He has tons of potential and I can't believe some of you are already willing to write him off after one year where the whole team was a disaster

[jimirsaysdog]

I seriously dont think Castonzo or Reitz have the leg strength you need in the running game

they're young players who should improve in that are given arians offensive philosophy.

[jimirsaysdog]

i agree casto will be replaced by the coaches if he dosent improve this year,he is very slow, got to move if he is to start

last year was an odd year with the lockout and all. i think grigson and pagano know exactly what they want up front and the moves they have made indicate that.

[jimirsaysdog]

You're not sold on Ijalana? Or do you think McGlynn is better? Or do you think Ijalana needs more time to heal from his injury?

no one has seen nearly enough from ijalana. as i posted earlier solid veterans and stability are crucial to lucks development.

[dacoats]

Many think the o line is terrible and could get Luck killed. This is possible. But, for fun and interest I Iooked up last years total o line stats.

Colts finished the year ranked 15th out of 32. Not as horrible as many make it sound right? And the Colts never had solid QB help either all season long.

http://www.nfl.com/s...=true&Submit=Go

Now, of course feel free to analyze anything you want on this or delve much deeper. There are a few factors we cannot control or predict. And we lost Jeff Saturday but possibly have replaced him, so we will see on that one later.

Fun facts: The Colts gave up less sacks last season then the often praised Packers o line. The Colts gave up 3 more sacks then the heavily praised Patriots o line.

I might be there, and it might not be there, I guess we will have to see how they play on the field during game time. Nothing else really matters

[coltnorth]

I seriously dont think Castonzo or Reitz have the leg strength you need in the running game

I'm not as concerned about having our LT as a beast in the run game. His primary job is protecting the QB. I think that by taking the time now to fully heal and having a full training camp, Castonzo will be quite solid. Outside of a few members of this forum, he received a lot of praise for his play last year, even with the ankle injury. By resting now and not aggrivating the ankle, he should avoid playing through pain alll season.

As for Reitz, He showed potential but I'm not sold on him. The good thing is we have a number of potential guards. Big Ben, Hicks, Reitz, Mc Glynn, Anderson can all fight for the Guard spots.

[weslo1812]

Many think the o line is terrible and could get Luck killed. This is possible. But, for fun and interest I Iooked up last years total o line stats.

Colts finished the year ranked 15th out of 32. Not as horrible as many make it sound right? And the Colts never had solid QB help either all season long.

http://www.nfl.com/s...=true&Submit=Go

Now, of course feel free to analyze anything you want on this or delve much deeper. There are a few factors we cannot control or predict. And we lost Jeff Saturday but possibly have replaced him, so we will see on that one later.

Fun facts: The Colts gave up less sacks last season then the often praised Packers o line. The Colts gave up 3 more sacks then the heavily praised Patriots o line.

Great pionts here! One more thing to add to it though would be all the Injuries we had up front. I believe we had about 7 different starting line combinations last year. Dont think you can expect them to come together and have any sort of chemisrty when you practically loose a guy every other week. So that taken into consideration with whats alaredy been mentioned I have high hopes. It really is a matter of health to me. If we can stay healthy up front I think were gonna be solid.

[Creekside]

Colts also had the fewest rushes going left, they primarily ran it up the middle or to Linkenbachs side

...........Not saying I don't believe you, that is one thing I thought about when looking at this. You have numbers, or going by memory?.....still, not trying to nitpick, but I think you overstated it when you said the Colts couldn't run left....they could. They did.

[Creekside]

Also, one thing we are leaving out of this conversation is the utilization of the two new tight ends, especially Allen. I loved Clark, I liked Tamme, but neither were very good blockers. No way do the Colts draft Allen after taking Fleener if they don't think he will be a great asset in blocking.

[Gavin]

...........Not saying I don't believe you, that is one thing I thought about when looking at this. You have numbers, or going by memory?.....still, not trying to nitpick, but I think you overstated it when you said the Colts couldn't run left....they could. They did.

FireJimCaldwell posted the numbers on a thread but I forget which thread it was, Colts ran up behind Center the most followed by right (Linkenbachs side even if its not directly behind Linkenbach, alot of those was actually behind Deim). I dont mean to say something like oh no our left side is terrible, just that its a concern when you cant get much push from that side. I look for it to be much improved hopefully

[Andy]

Don't put the Colts O-line in the Pats or Packers league. The reason they had that many sacks is because they didn't have the ball often and when they did, they ran it more than passed it. Don't go crazy over them yet.

I'll give them this... they are young, and they do have tremendous upside. There will be holes in the O-line this season, but in a few years, they could be at the top of the league.

[Gavin]

Don't put the Colts O-line in the Pats or Packers league. The reason they had that many sacks is because they didn't have the ball often and when they did, they ran it more than passed it. Don't go crazy over them yet.

I'll give them this... they are young, and they do have tremendous upside. There will be holes in the O-line this season, but in a few years, they could be at the top of the league.

Colts actually passed the ball way more then they ran

[Andy]

Colts actually passed the ball way more then they ran

On paper they threw it about 100 times more, but you have to take in account that they had 7 games that were done before the 4th quarter, so when they got the ball in the 4th, all they did was throw. I don't count those meaningless drives that they had. Now if you forget about the 4th quarter meaningless drives, it comes out to more run than pass.

[Superman]

I agree. I thought the O-line played pretty well in the Super Bowl...in both, to be honest. And yes, losing Glenn was a big blow to the offensive line.

Because they failed on 3rd and short. I don't agree that they were the biggest reason for the loss, but that was a crucial spot in the game and the line didn't get it done.

Much more impactful was the series of poor coaching decisions and overall conservatism displayed by the coach.

[Gavin]

Because they failed on 3rd and short. I don't agree that they were the biggest reason for the loss, but that was a crucial spot in the game and the line didn't get it done.

Much more impactful was the series of poor coaching decisions and overall conservatism displayed by the coach.

Which Super Bowl? 1st or 2nd

[Superman]

Which Super Bowl? 1st or 2nd

The second Super Bowl, when Polian blamed the loss on the offensive line (and then didn't draft an offensive lineman until the end of the 4th round).

[21isSuperman]

Because they failed on 3rd and short. I don't agree that they were the biggest reason for the loss, but that was a crucial spot in the game and the line didn't get it done.

Much more impactful was the series of poor coaching decisions and overall conservatism displayed by the coach.

Not to mention the dropped Garcon catch, an injured Freeney, a defense that couldn't tackle Pierre Thomas...and let's not forget that dreaded onside kick, which is a whole other story. Some also say the bounty stuff had a role. I'm not trying to make excuses though. We lost because we didn't execute.

[Jules]

Colts actually passed the ball way more then they ran

In the second SB yes. I mentioned this. Peyton threw 45 times. 45 freaking times. There was no need IMO to throw that many times when the score was relatively close enough and the run game was working quite a bit when used. Addai was doing a terrific job for the most part getting nearly 6 ypc. when given the football.

In fact, in several playoff losses I don't feel the Colts stuck with the run enough and got too pass happy.

[Gavin]

In the second SB yes. I mentioned this. Peyton threw 45 times. 45 freaking times. There was no need IMO to throw that many times when the score was relatively close enough and the run game was working quite a bit when used. Addai was doing a terrific job for the most part getting nearly 6 ypc. when given the football.

In fact, in several playoff losses I don't feel the Colts stuck with the run enough and got too pass happy.

Wasnt talking about the Super Bowl with that post

[Jules]

Don't put the Colts O-line in the Pats or Packers league. The reason they had that many sacks is because they didn't have the ball often and when they did, they ran it more than passed it. Don't go crazy over them yet.

I'll give them this... they are young, and they do have tremendous upside. There will be holes in the O-line this season, but in a few years, they could be at the top of the league.

I'm not saying the Colts are the NE offensive line. However if you have a good pass rush/defense the NE line is just as vulnerable as any other line can be no matter how good Brady is. In 2007 in the SB loss that stellar Pats o line was held in check. The Pats could not run. And they could not protect Brady long enough either.

My favorite o line has often been the Saints in recent years. In the playoff loss to the Niners, SF did an excellent job of taking away the Saints good run game and holding it to 37 yards and Ivory only managed 2.7 ypc. Brees threw for 462 yards and threw 63 times and 4 TDs.

As for the Packers o line, it had injuries last year as well. I often felt it was a smoke and mirrors o line though. Rodgers mobility helped a lot and the run game was poor and finished nearing the bottom of the league.

[Jules]

Wasnt talking about the Super Bowl with that post

Thats fine, I was just going off again on a tangent over the idea of throwing that many times in big games. Many feel the run game does not matter as much in today's NFL. I disagree. You still need some sort of balance.