Playing with House Money

[Superman]

21 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

Apparently he was working with Tom House while he was in Indy on improving accuracy (although that seems like one of the harder skills to get better at as a QB).

 

Tom House will help with footwork and throwing mechanics, not so much accuracy. But accuracy can be a byproduct of better footwork and mechanics, so let's hope. 

 

And just before anyone thinks I'm getting carried away, Brissett always had decent accuracy. He wasn't Derek Anderson or Brett Hundley or anything like that.

[Fisticuffs111]

37 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Tom House will help with footwork and throwing mechanics, not so much accuracy. But accuracy can be a byproduct of better footwork and mechanics, so let's hope. 

 

And just before anyone thinks I'm getting carried away, Brissett always had decent accuracy. He wasn't Derek Anderson or Brett Hundley or anything like that.

Yeah, I guess I'd say I'd like to see more consistency in his accuracy. He'll throw one right on the money like he did the Ebron TD against the Bears or that legendary deep ball on the run he had in '17...but it seems like he tends to struggle/throw behind his receiver on short and intermediate routes, crossing, comeback/curl, etc. 

Of course, I get that not every QB can be Drew Brees in terms of accuracy.

[dw49]

4 hours ago, Superman said:

 

There are several reasons he might not be very good: throwing accuracy, pocket awareness, reading coverages, identifying blitzes/hots, etc. 

 

You guys know that QBs don't get better at these things just because time passes, right? Some of these traits are inherent. There are very talented and smart QBs who struggle in the NFL because they can't figure this stuff out.

 

There are others who do get better, or who make up for a deficiency in one area by leaning on another area of strength -- Cam Newton struggles with several aspects of pro QBing, but makes up for it with athleticism and arm strength. 

 

I don't doubt that Brissett will be better. My question is whether he'll be good enough, whether he'll prove to be a starting caliber NFL QB. Last time we saw him, he was just a plucky and determined fighter with a strong arm. That won't get it done now.

 

 

I hope I'm wrong but I agree totally with what you have above. Who had more talent than RG111? Strong , accurate arm (including good touch) and ran a 4.4. He couldn't read the field and  saw "ghosts" in the pocket . 

[Stephen]

5 hours ago, Superman said:

 

I'm not knocking Brissett for not having great stats or even for not winning a lot of games. I'm saying I think he showed significant limitations as a passer and a QB, and that's not dependent on stats, wins or teammates. 

 

To go further, one of the major issues with Brissett in 2017 was that he didn't see open receivers at times. That's something that should be much better with the new staff, and since he has a year in the offense. I expect his decision making and reaction times to be much improved.

 

But he also struggled with accuracy and touch, he didn't show great pocket awareness or mobility, and he had a lot of fumbles. (By the way, he's always had a lot of fumbles, since college.) These are not a function of the offense or coaching. These are his own limitations, independent of any external factors.

 

Obviously, he can improve, but Brissett has never been praised for his accuracy or his touch, so he probably doesn't have a high ceiling there. He's not quick footed, he doesn't navigate the pocket very well, and he'll have to focus in on ball protection on top of trying to avoid the pass rush and deliver the ball to receivers. 

 

If the protection sucks, if his receivers drop passes, if the coaching is inept, I won't be blaming him. But if he's throwing bad passes, fumbling, holding the ball too long, overlooking open receivers, and struggling to navigate the pocket, well those will be the same issues that he showed two years ago. 

He has improved  navigating the pocket. If you watch his browns high lights. He avoided being sacked numerous  times, stepped  up in pocket. Spread the ball around, threaded the needle. Passing  was never really a weakness of his. In 2017 it was tough because  he was learning  the wrs while learning  the play book. Luck would over look open receivers occasionally  to. When he held on to the ball noone was open. He had moncrief  who got hurt, aiken,Roger's and hilton. Also the fumbles don't  bother me as Luck fumbled alot to behind that bad oline. The one thing he didn't  do was throw alot of ints. Def think Brissett  will be a great starter.  His pocket awareness  is better than Kelly. I've watched Brissett  side step blitzers on plays kelly would get sacked. Brissett  can also use mobility  to extend  plays Aaron Rodgers style. That 60 yard pass to hilton while rolling  to the right was a thing of beauty. 

[King Colt]

Brissett will prove half of us wrong and half of us right.

[Fisticuffs111]

16 minutes ago, King Colt said:

Brissett will prove half of us wrong and half of us right.

 
Just to clarify on my posts, I'm pretty middle of the road on Brissett. I don't think he's bad by any means, I just don't know if he's going to become a great QB like some are expecting. I do expect a pretty decent season from him though. Something like 20ish TD's, 10ish INT's, and 3500 yards is about what I expect.

[stitches]

7 hours ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

 
Just to clarify on my posts, I'm pretty middle of the road on Brissett. I don't think he's bad by any means, I just don't know if he's going to become a great QB like some are expecting. I do expect a pretty decent season from him though. Something like 20ish TD's, 10ish INT's, and 3500 yards is about what I expect.

Yep... that's my take too... and that's the thing I fear the most too. I would prefer him to be either much better or much worse than this so we don't make the mistake of tying ourselves to a mediocre QB who gives you just enough glimpses to fool you into wasting several seasons with him. 

[braveheartcolt]

The Brissett we see in 2019 will be significantly different from 2017. We just don't know if he will be significantly better.

[Yoshinator]

24 minutes ago, stitches said:

Yep... that's my take too... and that's the thing I fear the most too. I would prefer him to be either much better or much worse than this so we don't make the mistake of tying ourselves to a mediocre QB who gives you just enough glimpses to fool you into wasting several seasons with him. 

Agreed. To add to that, if he would do bad (6 wins or less), we can get a new QB in the draft. If Brissett thrives (10 wins or more and possibly a playoff win or more), we know we have our QB of the future. We need to learn who Jacoby Brissett, the QB, is this season.

[MB-ColtsFan]

19 hours ago, Stephen said:

He has improved  navigating the pocket. If you watch his browns high lights. He avoided being sacked numerous  times, stepped  up in pocket. Spread the ball around, threaded the needle. Passing  was never really a weakness of his. In 2017 it was tough because  he was learning  the wrs while learning  the play book. Luck would over look open receivers occasionally  to. When he held on to the ball noone was open. He had moncrief  who got hurt, aiken,Roger's and hilton. Also the fumbles don't  bother me as Luck fumbled alot to behind that bad oline. The one thing he didn't  do was throw alot of ints. Def think Brissett  will be a great starter.  His pocket awareness  is better than Kelly. I've watched Brissett  side step blitzers on plays kelly would get sacked. Brissett  can also use mobility  to extend  plays Aaron Rodgers style. That 60 yard pass to hilton while rolling  to the right was a thing of beauty. 

I just looked at the Browns game, and I agree.  His pocket awareness is much better than what I remember from 2017.  His accuracy looked good as well that game.

 

I'm not sure I would say his awareness is a good as from what I have seen from Kelly, but only because I haven't seen Kelly having to avoid pressure as much as JB has.  Some of that is because Kelly gets rid of the ball quicker, in my opinion - for one reason or the other. 

Both appear to run the ball well when they have to.

 

I think we'll all be pleasantly surprised by JB this year.  At least I'm hoping so.

[Stephen]

2 hours ago, MB-ColtsFan said:

I just looked at the Browns game, and I agree.  His pocket awareness is much better than what I remember from 2017.  His accuracy looked good as well that game.

 

I'm not sure I would say his awareness is a good as from what I have seen from Kelly, but only because I haven't seen Kelly having to avoid pressure as much as JB has.  Some of that is because Kelly gets rid of the ball quicker, in my opinion - for one reason or the other. 

Both appear to run the ball well when they have to.

 

I think we'll all be pleasantly surprised by JB this year.  At least I'm hoping so.

Kelly has some of the same traits  as Brissett. What I noticed  on a few on his sacks is he didn't  always step up and on the one play where he took off running  the pass rushers just flat out over shot him. Pocket presence  is something  I think both will continue  to get better  at over time. The way I see it is both their skill  sets are close enough  that if one went down the play book wouldn't  have to adjusted  much assuming  Kelly knows most the play book. Bother can be successful  starters  in this league. Don't  get that vibe from walker.

[JimJaime]

On 8/27/2019 at 5:50 PM, Superman said:

 

I didn't mean to be pedantic.

 

But I also think we need more out of the QB than just an avoidance of mistakes. I think Luck was one of the best playmakers in the league, and in general, I think that playmaking ability is critical to playoff teams.

 

Tom Brady is a great example of QB who avoids mistakes, but even in games where the defense is dominant, he is called on to make a couple of plays down the stretch. He made big plays in his first SB, on that final drive. In this last SB, he had an early turnover, then vowed to his teammates he wouldn't make any more mistakes. But the game came down to the offense being able to score down the stretch, and he had to make some big plays. Meanwhile, Goff was completely incapable of doing anything to help his team.

 

I think Brissett has to rely heavily on his teammates to be successful, but I also think even the best overall team needs a couple of plays a game from the QB. And I thought that playmaking was lacking from Brissett in 2017. Hopefully Reich's coaching can help him be more efficient and productive, and to keep the offense moving.

I’m quoting you because of the Brady comment but this is for everyone.

 

i expect Brissett be a decent QB, no he is not Luck so he won’t be able carry the Colts on his back but he will do enough make your team dangerous..

 

that said dont don’t expect him be Brady, or Manning when it comes to 4th quarter comebacks on rising to the occasion.. he will be good but those two are on the Mount Rushmore for NFL QBs and just isn’t fair to compare him to them.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

The only real question I have about Brissett is the clutch factor. Your down 3 or 7 with two minutes left in the game can he drive the team down the field for a win. We have so many weapons I would hope he would be able to but in that situation it is mostly about the QB. Not having a QB that can carry the team on his back might make this team stronger.

[Stephen]

2 hours ago, Chloe6124 said:

The only real question I have about Brissett is the clutch factor. Your down 3 or 7 with two minutes left in the game can he drive the team down the field for a win. We have so many weapons I would hope he would be able to but in that situation it is mostly about the QB. Not having a QB that can carry the team on his back might make this team stronger.

I'm hoping  he won't  get put in that situation.  Blow every  team out lol