NCF's 2nd Round Next Best top-32....

[NewColtsFan]

Well....   the first round Big Board got almost no responses.   I confess I didn't see that coming!

I don't know if the website has gone quiet or if we're all burned out on this stuff...  but I've already prepared the material,  so I might as well keep posting.   Round One got over 100 looks, but few responses.    Ok...    Here with go with Round two...

 

Enjoy!

 

 

2-33.  C. Latimer        WR

2-34.  D. Carr             QB

2-35   K. Benjamin     WR

2-36.  T. Savage         QB

2-37.  J. Ward            DB

2-38.  K. Van Noy      OLB

2-39.  J. Bitonio        OT

2-40.  X. Sua-Filo       OG

2-41.  J. Garrapolo    QB

2-42.  C. Hyde            RB

 

2-43.  D. Ford            OLB

2-44.  C. Kouandjio   OT

2-45.  J. Attaouchu   OLB

2-46.  J. Matthews    WR

2-47.  J. James         OT

2-48.  S. Chricton      DE

2-49.  J. Amaro          TE

2-50.  C. Borland        ILB

2-51.  D. Easly            DT

2-52.  L. Joyner          DB/CB

2-53.  S. Jean-Baptiste  CB

2-54.  B. Sankey         RB

 

2-55.  T. Brooks         DB

2-56.  K. McGill          CB

2-57.  D. Adams         WR

2-58.  B. Breeland      CB

2-59.  D. Buchanon    DB

2-60.  D. Moncrief      WR

2-61.  M. Smith          OLB

2-62.  M. Martin         C

2-63.  G. Jackson      OG   

2-64.  J.  Hill              RB

 

Offense Breakdown: (18)

 

QB (3)          RB (3)      TE (1)      C (1)       OG (2)       OT (3)          WR (5)

Carr             Hyde       Amaro     Martin    XSF           Bitonio         Latimer

Savage        Sankey                                 Jackson    Kouandjio    Benjamin

Garrapolo    Hill                                                         James          Matthews

                                                                                                      Adams

                                                                                                      Moncrief

 

Defense Breakdown: (14)

 

DE (1)          DT (1)      OLB (4)        ILB (1)         DB (4)            CB (3)

Chricton     Easly        Van Noy      Borland       Ward              SJB

                                   Ford                               Joyner (cb)     McGill

                                   Attaouchu                      Brooks           Breeland

                                   Smith                             Buchanon

[Dustin]

Why do you hate Teddy?

[Moncrief]

No Allen Robinson huh.

[HtownColt]

Savage is not the 36 best player in this draft

[Dustin]

Savage is not the 36 best player in this draft

 

I agree. What is the difference between Savage and Brandon Weeden?

[NFLfan]

Well.... the first round Big Board got almost no responses. I confess I didn't see that coming!

I don't know if the website has gone quiet or if we're all burned out on this stuff... but I've already prepared the material, so I might as well keep posting. Round One got over 100 looks, but few responses. Ok... Here with go with Round two...

Enjoy!

2-33. C. Latimer WR

2-34. D. Carr QB

2-35 K. Benjamin WR

2-36. T. Savage QB

2-37. J. Ward DB

2-38. K. Van Noy OLB

2-39. J. Bitonio OT

2-40. X. Sua-Filo OG

2-41. J. Garrapolo QB

2-42. C. Hyde RB

2-43. D. Ford OLB

2-44. C. Kouandjio OT

2-45. J. Attaouchu OLB

2-46. J. Matthews WR

2-47. J. James OT

2-48. S. Chricton DE

2-49. J. Amaro TE

2-50. C. Borland ILB

2-51. D. Easly DT

2-52. L. Joyner DB/CB

2-53. S. Jean-Baptiste CB

2-54. B. Sankey RB

2-55. T. Brooks DB

2-56. K. McGill CB

2-57. D. Adams WR

2-58. B. Breeland CB

2-59. D. Buchanon DB

2-60. D. Moncrief WR

2-61. M. Smith OLB

2-62. M. Martin C

2-63. G. Jackson OG

2-64. J. Hill RB

Offense Breakdown: (18)

QB (3) RB (3) TE (1) C (1) OG (2) OT (3) WR (5)

Carr Hyde Amaro Martin XSF Bitonio Latimer

Savage Sankey Jackson Kouandjio Benjamin

Garrapolo Hill James Matthews

Adams

Moncrief

Defense Breakdown: (14)

DE (1) DT (1) OLB (4) ILB (1) DB (4) CB (3)

Chricton Easly Van Noy Borland Ward SJB

Ford Joyner (cb) McGill

Attaouchu Brooks Breeland

Smith Buchanon

As I wrote in the last thread showing your top 32, I cannot take you seriously if Bridgewater is not among your top 64. You think Savage and Garrapolo are better?!? Please explain your reasoning.

[NewColtsFan]

As I wrote in the last thread showing your top 32, I cannot take you seriously if Bridgewater is not among your top 64. You think Savage and Garrapolo are better?!? Please explain your reasoning.

 

I think Bridgewater is this year's Matt Barkley.

 

I think he's going to fall.

 

You'll see him tomorrow when you wake up and see my 3rd round.

[NewColtsFan]

I agree. What is the difference between Savage and Brandon Weeden?

 

You mean other than the fact that Savage is about 6-7 years younger than Breeden was?

 

And that's just for starters....    I don't know why you compared Savage with Breeden, who went in the mid-20's.

[NewColtsFan]

Why do you hate Teddy?

 

I don't hate Teddy....

 

But I think he's this year's Matt Barkley.    I think he's going to fall.    You'll see him at the top of my 3rd round....

 

And I don't know why you think I hate Teddy when you've put Bortles at 50.   I find that one even stranger than where I put Bridgewater.

[MrNLM]

Latimer to the Texans!? How bittersweet... or is it just bitter?

[NewColtsFan]

No Allen Robinson huh.

 

Robinson's rankings with other evaluators are all over the map.

 

Both Kiper and McShay have him in their 3rd round...  ranked in the 80's...     I have Robinson in the 60's.

 

NFL.com has Robinson in the 50's...  a 2nd round grade.

 

CBSSports.com (which I don't care for much, but I think they've gotten a little better)  has Robinson as the 30th ranked player.   A first round grade.      But, before you get too excited over that,  they also have Latimer and Matthews in the 60's with 3rd round grades.   So,  they're still wildly inconsistent for my comfort level.

 

The sooner you embrace the idea that everyone sees the same thing differently,  the less these variations will drive you crazy.

 

And at the end of the day,  the proof is where these guys get drafted and how they do.

[NewColtsFan]

Latimer to the Texans!? How bittersweet... or is it just bitter?

 

That's not my prediction.   I've just got him ranked as the 33rd best prospect.   That doesn't mean I predict he's going to the Texans.

 

This is not a mock.    Just a ranking of best players.

[MrNLM]

That's not my prediction.   I've just got him ranked as the 33rd best prospect.   That doesn't mean I predict he's going to the Texans.

 

This is not a mock.    Just a ranking of best players.

Oh, my bad. Carry on, breh!

[NFLfan]

I think Bridgewater is this year's Matt Barkley.

I think he's going to fall.

You'll see him tomorrow when you wake up and see my 3rd round.

That does not tell me anything. It does not explain your thinking. What is it about Bridgewater that makes you think he will drop to the 3rd Rd? Did you ever see him play? Performance in games matter, not Pro Days.

I don't recall Barkley being ranked that highly (1st or 2nd Rd). I saw Barkley as a 4th Rd guy. Wasn't he coming off an injury?

Bridgewater would have been selected ahead of all of last year's QBs.

[Dustin]

You mean other than the fact that Savage is about 6-7 years younger than Breeden was?

And that's just for starters.... I don't know why you compared Savage with Breeden, who went in the mid-20's.

6-7 years? Savage is going to be 25 at the start of the season.

[Dustin]

I don't hate Teddy....

But I think he's this year's Matt Barkley. I think he's going to fall. You'll see him at the top of my 3rd round....

And I don't know why you think I hate Teddy when you've put Bortles at 50. I find that one even stranger than where I put Bridgewater.

I don't understand. So is this where you think they'll be drafted or where you rank them personally?

[NFLfan]

That's not my prediction. I've just got him ranked as the 33rd best prospect. That doesn't mean I predict he's going to the Texans.

This is not a mock. Just a ranking of best players.

If this is not a mock, that means that you think at least 64 players are better than Bridgewater. And, you think Bortles is the 8th best player? Come on now. How do you determine who is a better player? What is your criteria? I am just trying to make sense of this.

[NewColtsFan]

That does not tell me anything. It does not explain your thinking. What is it about Bridgewater that makes you think he will drop to the 3rd Rd? Did you ever see him play? Performance in games matter, not Pro Days.

I don't recall Barkley being ranked that highly (1st or 2nd Rd). I saw Barkley as a 4th Rd guy. Wasn't he coming off an injury?

Bridgewater would have been selected ahead of all of last year's QBs.

 

I'm not impressed with the level of competition for Bridgewater, so I don't put much into his great stats.

 

When I see his hi-lites I rarely see what I think of as an NFL looking throw.    I see lots of college throws which wouldn't be completes in the NFL.   I see a small frame.    I see a questionable throwing motion that doesn't allow for Teddy to get much on his throws.   I don't see an NFL arm.    I see a nice college quarterback, and those two worlds are not the same.   Lots of QB's have put up great numbers in college and didn't amount to anything in the NFL.  

 

And while I would normally agree with you about not putting too much into a pro day,  I thought Bridgewater's was so spectacularly poor,  that I'd worry that he fared poorly in the spotlight.    He had a month to get that right, and he got it all wrong. Rather than rise to the occasion,  he shrank.    He looked dreadful.    And he did all that against no defense.   Again air.   With a month to prepare.     To me,  that's a red flag.

 

You can't watch ESPN or the NFLN without hearing about how Bridgewater's stock is falling.   Hey,  maybe he winds up going in the mid to late 20's.    I wouldn't rule that out at all.    I wouldn't be the least bit surprised.    But I wouldn't be the GM to make that call.     I'd stay away until I thought I was getting real value.    And I wouldn't feel comfortable until the 3rd round.

 

I'm not predicting Bridgewater will be a bust.   I think it depends on the team and the coaching he gets.   But I think he has to be handled just right.   

[NewColtsFan]

6-7 years? Savage is going to be 25 at the start of the season.

 

Fine....   but what was the point of comparing the two?     Why Weeden?     Weeden went in the first round.   I've got Savage as a high 2nd round kid.   What's your complaint again?

[Dustin]

Fine.... but what was the point of comparing the two? Why Weeden? Weeden went in the first round. I've got Savage as a high 2nd round kid. What's your complaint again?

I'm not talking about them as prospects. What is the difference in their skillsets? I'm comparing them because they're basically the same player.

[NewColtsFan]

If this is not a mock, that means that you think at least 64 players are better than Bridgewater. And, you think Bortles is the 8th best player? Come on now. How do you determine who is a better player? What is your criteria? I am just trying to make sense of this.

 

Look at my other responses to you regarding Bridgewater....   I think I've fully answered them there....   as for Bortles,  I like him much, much more.     What can I tell you.   I think he's a much better prospect.    Better arm.   Better passer.    More athletic.   Better body.    Better in the pocket.    Better out of the pocket.    Higher ceiling.     And I'm not alone in that.   It's not like my view is in the minority among people who do this for a living.....

 

Go to ESPN.com....   go to NFL.com....    I think you'll see most have Bortles higher than Bridgewater.  

[Dr. T]

I hope this is true. That means that we may be able to choose from Buchanon, Moncrief, Marcus Smith, Marcus Martin or Gabe Jackson.  The only problem is choosing from these five guys! For me it would be a toss up between Smith and Buchanon.

[NewColtsFan]

I don't understand. So is this where you think they'll be drafted or where you rank them personally?

 

Where I rank them.    NOT where I think they'll be drafted.

[NewColtsFan]

I'm not talking about them as prospects. What is the difference in their skillsets? I'm comparing them because they're basically the same player.

 

I think those two sentences are completely contradictory...    so I'm not sure how to answer this....    my view on Savage is that I'm hearing that so many teams are impressed with him,  have completely re-thought their view on him (a little like Latimer is shooting up the boards based on late info)   that many teams like Savage as a 2nd round guy.

 

They view him as a diamond in the rough. 

 

With a number of teams valuing him in the 2nd round,  that's where I've put him.    In a draft where the QB's are struggling to separate themselves from each other, I don't think this is outrageous.....

[Dustin]

I don't hate Teddy....

 

But I think he's this year's Matt Barkley.    I think he's going to fall.    You'll see him at the top of my 3rd round....

 

And I don't know why you think I hate Teddy when you've put Bortles at 50.   I find that one even stranger than where I put Bridgewater.

 

Bortles is big Alex Smith. He has a terrible windup on his release, operated in a one-read, quick hit offense, average arm strength, and his footwork crumbles under pressure.

[Dustin]

No Allen Robinson huh.

 

Not touching a player who can barely create seperation vs B1G DBs.

[Dustin]

Also, you have Kelvin Benjamin ranked to high. The only things he's good at is being tall and high-pointing the ball. Jon Baldwin 2.0 

[HtownColt]

Also what do you see in Savage to have him as your 36 best prospect?

[Gavin]

Also, you have Kelvin Benjamin ranked to high. The only things he's good at is being tall and high-pointing the ball. Jon Baldwin 2.0 

I see Benjamin a better fit at TE

[Dustin]

I see Benjamin a better fit at TE

 

He's a pretty bad blocker. I mean, they could classify him as a TE, but he'd be lining up in the slot.out wide the majority of the time anyway. 

[NFLfan]

Look at my other responses to you regarding Bridgewater.... I think I've fully answered them there.... as for Bortles, I like him much, much more. What can I tell you. I think he's a much better prospect. Better arm. Better passer. More athletic. Better body. Better in the pocket. Better out of the pocket. Higher ceiling. And I'm not alone in that. It's not like my view is in the minority among people who do this for a living.....

Go to ESPN.com.... go to NFL.com.... I think you'll see most have Bortles higher than Bridgewater.

I know that many have him ranked higher but you are the first to have Bridgewater ranked as the 6th or 7th best QB.

[Gavin]

He's a pretty bad blocker. I mean, they could classify him as a TE, but he'd be lining up in the slot.out wide the majority of the time anyway. 

Meh most teams dont have real good blocking TE's......Dwayne Allen was only decent at it when healthy, nothing great, Coby has gotten better but still has a long way to go, Very few great blocking TE's out there

[NewColtsFan]

Also what do you see in Savage to have him as your 36 best prospect?

 

It's not what I see....   it's what I'm hearing NFL evaluators see....

 

Superior arm strength.   Great size.   No chance to develop as his college career unfolded (went to 3 different schools)  had a very good year for a very poor Pittsburgh team this past year.    Raw, but with great physical tools...   some think the best physical tools in the draft....

[HtownColt]

It's not what I see.... it's what I'm hearing NFL evaluators see....

Superior arm strength. Great size. No chance to develop as his college career unfolded (went to 3 different schools) had a very good year for a very poor Pittsburgh team this past year. Raw, but with great physical tools... some think the best physical tools in the draft....

But it's your 36 best prospect, the nfl evaluators don't even have Savage as nearly as high as you do.

Kiper has him at #62

[Dustin]

Meh most teams dont have real good blocking TE's......Dwayne Allen was only decent at it when healthy, nothing great, Coby has gotten better but still has a long way to go, Very few great blocking TE's out there

 

Allen was only a decent blocker? Surely you jest. He was probably the best run blocking TE in the NFL. Nobody could move him off of his spot. 

[NewColtsFan]

But it's your 36 best prospect, the nfl evaluators don't even have Savage as nearly as high as you do

 

And you know this...   how?    I've heard anywhere from low-1 to mid-2....

[Dustin]

And you know this...   how?    I've heard anywhere from low-1 to mid-2....

 

Kiper has him at #62 and your boy Nawroki has him a 5th-6th.

[HtownColt]

And you know this... how? I've heard anywhere from low-1 to mid-2....

Kiper has him at #62 on his top 100 prospects

CBS Sports Rob Rang have him at #97 http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/story/24536975/big-board-judging-on-quality-or-depth-this-draft-class-impressive

He's not in Nolan Nawrocki's top 50 prospects

He's not in Daniel Jeremiah's top 50 prospects either

Not in Sports Illustrated top 64 prospects

http://nfl.si.com/2014/04/03/2014-nfl-draft-top-64-prospects/

[Hoosiernsavga]

Meh most teams dont have real good blocking TE's......Dwayne Allen was only decent at it when healthy, nothing great, Coby has gotten better but still has a long way to go, Very few great blocking TE's out there

Allen is better than decent when it comes to blocking. I wouldn't say he is great yet but very good is way better than decent.

[NewColtsFan]

Kiper has him at #62 on his top 100 prospects

CBS Sports Rob Rang have him at #97 http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/story/24536975/big-board-judging-on-quality-or-depth-this-draft-class-impressive

He's not in Nolan Nawrocki's top 50 prospects

He's not in Daniel Jeremiah's top 50 prospects either

Not in Sports Illustrated top 64 prospects

http://nfl.si.com/2014/04/03/2014-nfl-draft-top-64-prospects/

 

Thanks.    I appreciate all that.

 

As with Bridgewater,  my view on Savage is as much hunch than anything else.    I've heard enough good things to think he's going in the 2nd round.   And so I'm fine with that.    McShay and his crew have him as the 4th best QB, behind the big 3 and they have a high 3rd round, low 2nd round grade on him...

 

I realize I'm in the minority on both Savage and Bridgewater....    and maybe I have a mis-read on both....