Dan Fouts picks Andrew Luck as best young QB

[Moose Of Woe]

Any QB is really bad under pressure that's why every team in the league tries to pressure the QB. 

 

 

Any QB will perform worse with a swiss cheese line than they would with great pass blocking, but that doesn't mean they'll be bad. Brady does struggle more than most when teams can get past his fortress, which isn't often.

 

Manning used to be the same way, as he used to have a very good O-line. He struggled when teams like the 2004 Patriots could slap it aside.

 

After Glenn's retirement, Manning learned to run for his life and still perform at a high level with one of the worst run and pass blocking lines in the NFL. Thankfully, he at least had Wayne and Clark to go to. Collie/Gonzo were good but always injured. Marvin got injured/retired ~2008.

[Goodtimes]

That's Cam Newton. Where you been??

 

;)

[GoColts8818]

Every QB is bad under pressure.

some are worse than others. Brady is on par with Blaine Gabbert when he's pressured.

I think he's about as bad as any QB is under pressure.  This isn't something where someone is good at it and where the difference between who is worse or better at it changes from play to play depending on the kind of pressure they are under and the difference between who is worse than someone else is very small.  It's not like trying to compare Peyton Manning or Tom Brady ability to run to Andrew Luck or RG3 where there are huge differences to the point it's a major plus for two of them and a weakness for two of them. 

 

Either way this is getting completely away from my original point which was simply that Andrew Luck, like Brady has, has the ability to win games that at times leave you scratching your head going how did they win that game?  He also seems to have Peyton Manning's smarts, Big Ben's ability to keep plays alive, and as another poster said Cam Newton's running ability.  That's pretty darn good. 

[GoColts8818]

Any QB will perform worse with a swiss cheese line than they would with great pass blocking, but that doesn't mean they'll be bad.

 

Brady does struggle more than most when teams can get past his fortress, which isn't often. Manning used to be the same way, as he used to have a very good O-line as well.

 

After Manning's O-line vanished with Glenn's retirement post 2006, he learned to run for his life and still perform at a high level with one of the worst run and pass blocking lines in the NFL. Thankfully, he at least had Wayne and Clark to go to. Collie/Gonzo were good but always injured. Marvin got injured/retired ~2008.

Manning handled it by dumping the ball quickly, that's different than being under pressure because he would dump the ball before he was under pressure.  When the pressure would get to him he would make mistakes just like any QB in the league does including Brady. 

[Moose Of Woe]

Manning handled it by dumping the ball quickly, that's different than being under pressure because he would dump the ball before he was under pressure.  When the pressure would get to him he would make mistakes just like any QB in the league does including Brady. 

 

When you're being hounded 1-2 seconds after the snap, dumping the ball is being a smart QB and not making a boneheaded throw or taking a sack. (Or intentional grounding.)

[ColtStrong]

He also seems to have Peyton Manning's smarts, Big Ben's ability to keep plays alive, and as another poster said Cam Newton's running ability.  That's pretty darn good. 

Yeah, but according to a "genius" here, he's still a 1 out of 1,000 longshot to ever win a super bowl.

[GoColts8818]

When you're being hounded 1-2 seconds after the snap, dumping the ball is being a smart QB and not making a boneheaded throw or taking a sack. Despite having atrocious blocking, he was one of the fewest sacked QBs in the league while still putting up very good numbers.

Again, Manning took steps to dump the ball before the pressure gets there.  Guess what Brady does that too when he's facing a team that gets heat.  I didn't say dumping the ball quickly wasn't smart I just said it's not the samething as trying to make as pass under pressure which it isn't.  If you get pressure on any QB when he is in the process of throwing the ball no QB is good at handling that.  That's my point.  So to say Brady isn't good at that is liking saying it's a strike against a kicker because he can't play OT well no kicker in the league can so how much of a strike against the QB is it really. 

[Moose Of Woe]

If you get pressure on any QB when he is in the process of throwing the ball no QB is good at handling that. 

 

We'll just have to agree to disagree on that. I think some handle it much better than others.

 

-P.M.

-Rodgers

-Roethlisberger (He's better than anyone at it, which is good for PIT since his line sucks. He extends plays while running for his life and is tough to bring down.)

-Luck (So far)

 

 

Brady is probably the most accurate long passer in the game if you give him time, or at least close to it. Rodgers might give him a run for his money.

[GoColts8818]

We'll just have to agree to disagree on that. I think some handle it much better than others.

 

-P.M.

-Rodgers

-Roethlisberger (He's better than anyone at it, which is good for PIT since his line sucks.)

-Luck (So far)

 

 

Brady is probably the most accurate long passer in the game if you give him time, or at least close to it. Rodgers might give him a run for his money.

Big Ben like Luck is good at staying up to avoid the pressure.  He just doesn't go down.  He keeps the plays alive.  That's different in my mind than trying to make a throw with a DE in your face.  I'd agree Luck is like Big Ben in that regard which is why I said Luck has that ability to like Manning.  When Big Ben tends to make a throw while he's still in the face of heat he tends to make mistakes.  Normally, and like Luck here, he gets out of trouble resets and makes the throw after he's escaped the pressure. 

 

Manning when he sees heat coming just down and takes the sack or tends to make a poor throw.  That or he dumps the ball before the pressure gets there.  For years teams have said the way you beat Peyton Manning is get pressure on him and make him uncomfortable.  Those aren't things you would say about someone if he was good at handling it.  Again, dumping the ball before the pressure isn't the samething as making a throw in the face of pressure.  It's a great plan to avoid the pressure before it gets there and lots of QBs do that or at least the good QBs in the league can do that. 

[Moose Of Woe]

Big Ben like Luck is good at staying up to avoid the pressure.  He just doesn't go down.  He keeps the plays alive.  That's different in my mind than trying to make a throw with a DE in your face.  I

 

I guess it depends how you define pressure. You seem consider it when a defender is right there/hitting the ball which will affect everyone, yes. Especially if they hit the ball or QB's arm, obviously.

 

I consider pressure any time a QB is hurried/forced to move off his spot aside from simply stepping up in the pocket. You're SUPPOSED to have a pocket if the O-line is doing its job.

[jvan1973]

Wow. Shows how much you know. There are 32 teams, so technically you could say it's 1 out of 32 to win a SB. Add the fact that half the teams don't have a realistic shot to begin with, so how you came up with 1,000 to 1 is beyond me. Plus, you said EVER winning a SB. If I were a betting man, I would take 1,000 to 1 all day for Luck to win a super before he retires.

 

i would put 5k at 1000-1 for his career

[GoColts8818]

I guess it depends how you define pressure. You seem consider it when a defender is right there/hitting the ball which will affect everyone, yes. Especially if they hit the ball obviously.

 

I consider pressure any time a QB is hurried/forced to move off his spot. I would not consider stepping up in the pocket pressure, as you're SUPPOSED to have a pocket if the O-line is doing its job.

Yes to me that's pressure.  If you look at the league when you can make a QB move off his spot and have to throw on the move they are not nearly as good as doing it when they can stand in the pocket and throw it.  If you can disrupt the play QBs tend to struggle.  That's why teams try so hard to do it. 

 

Manning had real issues if you got him off his spot.  Now he (and a lot of QBs) figured out the best way to handle it was to throw the ball before the defense has a chance to knock you off your spot.  I'd agree some QBs are better than others at moving around and keeping a play a live but I guess to me that's not the samething as throwing under pressure it's another way to avoid pressure because that's what they are doing moving around and trying to get free of the pressure to make a throw.  Generally speaking if you get someone right in their face though as they are trying to throw the ball they are going to make a poor decision with the ball.  That's why I say no QB is good at handling that.  Now if you want to say some QBs can move around more than others to escape pressure that I would agree with. 

[JWF]

I'll bet if you got a Las Vegas odds maker to make a bet on Luck ever winning a Super Bowl, it would be around 1,000 to 1. I could be wrong about that but I doubt it.

 

Wow what a hilariously baseless comment.

 

Seriously do you just throw stuff and hope it sticks.

[jvan1973]

Wow what a hilariously baseless comment.

Seriously do you just throw stuff and hope it sticks.

yes he does

[stat2883]

Isn't it funny how all the talking heads are now in the Luck camp ? One good game by Luck and a bad opening game performance by RG3 and now it's 90% Luck and 10% Colin Kap. and RG is not even in the discussion these days. I do realize that RG3 was hurt but Washington was running that QB killing offense when the talking heads were backing RB3.. no ?

Just because there was hype around the guys like Wilson, Kaep, and Griff doesn't mean that most reputable analysts didn't think Luck was the best of the group. You ask most of them, and that was probably always the case. The other guys made news because no one knew what to expect from them coming into the season. Luck was about as much of a given as you can have. Maybe not the most flashy or sexy QB, but for sure the safest and most pro-ready.

[dw49]

Just because there was hype around the guys like Wilson, Kaep, and Griff doesn't mean that most reputable analysts didn't think Luck was the best of the group. You ask most of them, and that was probably always the case. The other guys made news because no one knew what to expect from them coming into the season. Luck was about as much of a given as you can have. Maybe not the most flashy or sexy QB, but for sure the safest and most pro-ready.

 

 

Your talking about reputable analysts and I'm talking about "talking heads." 

[stat2883]

Your talking about reputable analysts and I'm talking about "talking heads."

they only ones I give any thought to ;)

[husker61]

Don't kill me for this but Luck has a little Brady in him and what I mean by that is that he just finds away to win.  Whatever we want to say about Brady that is something he has been really good at over the course of his career.

 

Honestly Luck seems to have Manning's brain, Brady's ability to just win, Big Ben's durability to hang in there and just make plays happen, and the ability to run.  You put all that together and you get one heck of a QB. 

 

i agree except the "brady's ability to just win". that hasn't happened in a long time since they lost a lot of the core defenders that they won championships with. that's not a knock on brady. he may not be quite as smart as manning, but he has a top arm (he rarely gets credit for) that manning never had and is very accurate.

[tahuyaman]

Actually, getting to two Super Bowls and winning one is pretty high and Peyton may not be done yet. What makes you think that Luck will get to a Super Bowl anytime in his career. He has got Peyton keeping him from getting there for the next four or five years.

 

 

[tahuyaman]

 

Actually, getting to two Super Bowls and winning one is pretty high and Peyton may not be done yet. What makes you think that Luck will get to a Super Bowl anytime in his career. He has got Peyton keeping him from getting there for the next four or five years.

 

 

I doubt that Luck will ever display the same type of game changing talent as Manning. Manning is arguable one of the best QB's ever to play. That's a pretty tall order for Luck to fill. I believe Luck will be a very good QB some day, but not an all time great.

 

[John Dee]

When was the last time Tommy B won anything?  

 

i would argue the bigger the game the "smaller" Tommy shows.....

 

IMO

[husker61]

I'll bet if you got a Las Vegas odds maker to make a bet on Luck ever winning a Super Bowl, it would be around 1,000 to 1. I could be wrong about that but I doubt it. Getting to the Super Bowl isn't easy. Winning it is even more difficult. There are lots of great QBs in NFL history that never won one.

 

this is one of the stupidest statements i have ever seen. the odds for the colts winning the sb just this year are 40-1.

 

i would love to make that bet at 1,000-1.

[braveheartcolt]

The ignore button needs more publicity. Spread the word!

[ponyboy]

I'll bet if you got a Las Vegas odds maker to make a bet on Luck ever winning a Super Bowl, it would be around 1,000 to 1. I could be wrong about that but I doubt it. Getting to the Super Bowl isn't easy. Winning it is even more difficult. There are lots of great QBs in NFL history that never won one.

I'd take that bet in a heartbeat.

[Goodtimes]

I'd take that bet in a heartbeat.

 

 

Well then, you need to visit Las Vegas and make that deal. I wouldn't take that bet but that is just me and it isn't just because of Andrew Luck.

[dw49]

they only ones I give any thought to ;)

 

I hear you.

[dw49]

1,000-1 not sure if that person has trouble with numbers and math or just a troll but as a long time 'gambler' those odds are not even close and I will show you why.   Take this season alone for example the Colts odds are 35 -1 and the overwhelming thought is Luck would be the one starting in that game not Haselbeck so for this year alone it is 35-1 not lets say just for the sake of argument Indy gets no better or worse in the coming seasons (I know most experts predict better but for the sake of argument lets say it stays steady) and lets be conservative and Says Luck plays 9 more season after this one, Vegas odds now become 3.5-1 he wins a Superbowl in his career.  Hope most follow, I'm sure many will, not taking a stand saying he will or wont but 3.5 compared to 1,000 just saying someone is WAY off in left field.

 

 

You're really being generous with the odds as he will play longer than 9 years and there is no way the Colts will average being 35-1 over the rest of Luck's career. What you forgot to do was deduct for the "vig" that Vegas works into the odds. If you add up all the odds of the 32 teams and say (i'm too lazy to just do it) it comes out to 1.19 ... that would mean the book is grabbing 19% over-all on this bet. So if you said all the odds on every team was correct the Colts in reality would be 1.19 X's 35 which would really make them around 42-1. But when you figure there all be year's when the team will be around 10-1 and Luck should play at least 12 years , you were more than fair. 

[erock]

Wow! Does he have a big S on his shirt under that jersey?

 

 

Neither of those things is going to happen.

This guy......

 

I can't tell if your really that big of a pessimist, uber troll or just still bitter that Manning was released.

 

Luck is our quarterback so if you really are a  Colts fan, (and that is debatable), support him or please

do us all a favor and find another forum to drape your "glass half full" attitude with.

 

 

Have a great day!

[jvan1973]

This guy......

I can't tell if your really that big of a pessimist, uber troll or just still bitter that Manning was released.

Luck is our quarterback so if you really are a Colts fan, (and that is debatable), support him or please

do us all a favor and find another forum to drape your "glass half full" attitude with.

Have a great day!

all of the above

[crazycolt1]

Neither of those things is going to happen.

[crazycolt1]

Wow! Does he have a big S on his shirt under that jersey?

[dudeski]

Look Brady isn't my favorite player in the NFL but no QB in the NFL is good under pressure.  It's like saying a running back isn't good when be talked, well yeah.

your point, or lack thereof, is pathetic

 

 

brady is a qb.  he wins because his team was better on that day.  there is no mystical magic to it.  we arent children