Colts vs Raiders post game thread

[Dingus McGirt]

On 1/1/2024 at 11:11 PM, Goatface Killah said:

No, if all you do is hate on the Colts you arent a fan.

 

Nobody is upset. They are just annoyed. Big difference. Your projection of peoples emotions into a valid conversation is just gaslighting. 

 

He has made all these claims so he doesnt get to hide when reality proves hes wrong.

 

 

Kansas City is a smaller market, they dont sell half the seats to any visiting team that wants to see the game. Thats just an excuse.

It was a question, not an excuse.  Given your response - I suppose we can say the Indianapolis football fan base is just weak.

[Goatface Killah]

13 minutes ago, husker61 said:

It’s may not be the team being good or bad, it could be the game plan designing short quick passes that negates a pass rush. I think the colts getting as many sacks as they have is tremendous with a defensive scheme that gives up short quick passes.

Or running the ball effectively, which also slows the rush down.

 

The Colts typically rush 4. Thats it. Their defense is designed to allow short passes and limit big plays. So a team that can do that well is gonna be very tough to rush.

[GoColts8818]

59 minutes ago, Hoose said:

Regarding Cox: there are plentiful “block first” TEs out there. Mo is getting paid $5m per year. He has stone hands and pedestrian speed. The Colts can upgrade there at half the cost. I think MAC is a luxury that is no longer affordable. 

That’s pretty accurate for how most Colts fans feel not arguing that.   My point is I don’t think the Colts share that opinion of him.  

[Goatface Killah]

18 minutes ago, Dingus McGirt said:

It was a question, not an excuse.  Given your response - I suppose we can say the Indianapolis football fan base is just weak.

Sorry man me and the Colts fan base are not on the best of terms rn. 

 

They are just flakey and very needy. 

[GoColts8818]

6 minutes ago, Goatface Killah said:

Or running the ball effectively, which also slows the rush down.

 

The Colts typically rush 4. Thats it. Their defense is designed to allow short passes and limit big plays. So a team that can do that well is gonna be very tough to rush.

My problem with the defense is more that it’s designed to not give up big plays yet they give up a lot.  It’s not doing what it’s designed to do.  To me that’s the issue.

[Goatface Killah]

13 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

My problem with the defense is more that it’s designed to not give up big plays yet they give up a lot.  It’s not doing what it’s designed to do.  To me that’s the issue.

Thats just something that shouldnt happen, but I think the run defense hasnt been good enough, and ultimately that is why we have given up more big plays this year. 

 

Too many 3rd and shorts. Thats a big play down. Too many 2nd and 4s. Thats another big play down. We need 3rd and 6 or longer, more often. 

 

I just wants solid run defense, sacks and turnovers. 2 of those things we have done very well. But the run defense has been very disappointing this year.   

 

[Superman]

17 minutes ago, Goatface Killah said:

Thats just something that shouldnt happen, but I think the run defense hasnt been good enough, and ultimately that is why we have given up more big plays this year. 

 

Too many 3rd and shorts. Thats a big play down. Too many 2nd and 4s. Thats another big play down. We need 3rd and 6 or longer, more often. 

 

I just wants solid run defense, sacks and turnovers. 2 of those things we have done very well. But the run defense has been very disappointing this year.   

 

 

Can I interest you in a tasty 3rd and 16 play that goes for 18 yards and a first down? How about a juicy 4th and 10 that goes for 16 yards? We did both against the Raiders.

 

Third and 14 against the Falcons, 3rd and 19 against the Steelers...

 

You want stops on third and short, I'm waiting for us to be consistent on third and long.

[GoColts8818]

2 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Can I interest you in a tasty 3rd and 16 play that goes for 18 yards and a first down? How about a juicy 4th and 10 that goes for 16 yards? We did both against the Raiders.

 

Third and 14 against the Falcons, 3rd and 19 against the Steelers...

 

You want stops on third and short, I'm waiting for us to be consistent on third and long.

They are consistent on third and long.  They give it up everytime because they play 20 yards off the line of scrimmage because Bradley is so scared of getting beat deep.  Like I’ve said before I’ve never seen a team play so scared of getting beat deep only to get beat deep like the Colts do.

[GoColts8818]

6 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

They are consistent on third and long.  They give it up everytime because they play 20 yards off the line of scrimmage because Bradley is so scared of getting beat deep.  Like I’ve said before I’ve never seen a team play so scared of getting beat deep only to get beat deep like the Colts do.

Yeah it makes me sad too @Superman

[Superman]

1 hour ago, jskinnz said:

I don’t have the statistical data that you’ve discussed previously. My sense is anecdotal at best but what I am looking for out of the d’line is to make a play to affect that game and far too often that is not the case. Ebukan got strip sack to end the Bucs game but my memory fails on too many more than that. The 4th quarter of the Raiders game I wanted them to make a play against O’Connell that never came. 
 

They have feasted on injured or inferior lines. That makes me nervous for Saturday night. 

 

Yeah, I don't think we have that kind of playmaking DL. I think we have a more opportunistic DL.

 

And anything can happen Saturday night. The Colts aren't good enough for me to be confident about any matchup, especially not one against a QB who has been as good as Stroud has been at times this year.

[cbear]

On 1/2/2024 at 8:38 AM, Superman said:

 

I'm not complaining about it, but I think it needs a lot of context. First and most obvious, we've played a lot of bad/inexperienced QBs with poor OLs, and have feasted on them. 

 

Second, we have a low pressure rate with high sack output. That's a statistical anomaly, and is unlikely to continue. We're fifth in sacks, behind Ravens, Chiefs, Dolphins, and Bills. Dolphins are first in pressure rate, 27.1%; Chiefs are 2nd, 26.9%; Bills are 6th, 23.3%. Then the Colts are 19.1%, and the Ravens are 19% (it's one of the areas of concern for the Ravens defense, IMO). The bottom five teams are around 17-18% pressure rate. So we're closer to the bottom of the league in pressure rate.

 

I'll take the 49 sacks, but we've faced well over 600 pass plays (including sacks and scrambles), and on more than 500 of them, we get no pressure on the QB. Against a good QB -- or even a QB who is just having a moment and is in a rhythm, like Jake Browning -- that's a recipe for disaster.

Hmmm....interesting and it might explain a lot. By the eye test, I always felt that the Colts weren't as good a pass rushing team as the sack numbers indicated but couldn't quite put my finger on it. 

[Goatface Killah]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

Can I interest you in a tasty 3rd and 16 play that goes for 18 yards and a first down? How about a juicy 4th and 10 that goes for 16 yards? We did both against the Raiders.

 

Third and 14 against the Falcons, 3rd and 19 against the Steelers...

 

You want stops on third and short, I'm waiting for us to be consistent on third and long.

Our secondary is exremely young, so I expect that sometimes. Thats just 4 plays over 3 games.

 

What I dont expect are vets like Zaire Franklin, EJ Speed, Grover Stewart and DFO to allow teams to run for 6 yards on first down. And thats happened a lot. 

 

EDIT: We have given up the 6th most rush yard this year, and faced the most attempts. Over 2k in 16 games on almost 500 attempts. And this is from a team thats been a good rush defense over the last few years.

 

Its just a fallacy to suggest we have constantly been in 3rd and longs. You all just remember it because giving up a 3rd and 16 is very memorable vs. a 6 yard run on first down that isnt. Its death by a thousand cuts. 

 

We are actually in the middle of the league on defensive 3rd down percentage and better than last year believe it or not.

[husker61]

2 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

My problem with the defense is more that it’s designed to not give up big plays yet they give up a lot.  It’s not doing what it’s designed to do.  To me that’s the issue.

that’s the issue most if not everyone here think. I don’t think anyone has disputed that.

[husker61]

2 hours ago, Goatface Killah said:

Thats just something that shouldnt happen, but I think the run defense hasnt been good enough, and ultimately that is why we have given up more big plays this year. 

 

Too many 3rd and shorts. Thats a big play down. Too many 2nd and 4s. Thats another big play down. We need 3rd and 6 or longer, more often. 

 

I just wants solid run defense, sacks and turnovers. 2 of those things we have done very well. But the run defense has been very disappointing this year.   

 

Playing only two, and very average lb’s is a big reason for the rushing defense problems.

[husker61]

2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Yeah, I don't think we have that kind of playmaking DL. I think we have a more opportunistic DL.

 

And anything can happen Saturday night. The Colts aren't good enough for me to be confident about any matchup, especially not one against a QB who has been as good as Stroud has been at times this year.

he has been up and down. He only has 4 td passes in 6 road games. 
 

you can say that about almost every game this year, even with the top teams.

[Superman]

1 hour ago, Goatface Killah said:

Its just a fallacy to suggest we have constantly been in 3rd and longs. You all just remember it because

 

???

 

When did anyone suggest that the defense is constantly in 3rd and longs? 

 

You have your issues with the defense. I have my issues with the defense. I don't know why there seems to be a disconnect. Maybe you think I was agreeing with moose earlier? I assure you, I'm not.

[Goatface Killah]

40 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

???

 

When did anyone suggest that the defense is constantly in 3rd and longs? 

 

You have your issues with the defense. I have my issues with the defense. I don't know why there seems to be a disconnect. Maybe you think I was agreeing with moose earlier? I assure you, I'm not.

I think 18 to 88 said they consistently gave those up "everytime", thats what I was responding to. I dont think thats true. I agree here lately its been pretty bad but I doubt if you dug into it thats something they have given up at a high clip this year.

 

I took your earlier post as supporting Mooses assertion that our pass rush was really bad. If not my mistake.

[Superman]

9 minutes ago, Goatface Killah said:

I think 18 to 88 said they consistently gave those up "everytime", thats what I was responding to. I dont think thats true. I agree here lately its been pretty bad but I doubt if you dug into it thats something they have given up at a high clip this year.

 

I took your earlier post as supporting Mooses assertion that our pass rush was really bad. If not my mistake.

 

No, definitely not. Moose is only interested in crusading against Chris Ballard, and rubbing Colts fans noses in it.

 

I was just countering the '5th in sacks' stat with some context that I find meaningful. Like I said, I'll take the sacks all day, but I think we need to be better at getting consistent pressure. And like you said, the defense needs to get better at other stuff as well. I think we mostly agree on our opinion of the quality of the defense. I'm not hating on the pass rush, I just don't think we can count on our pass rush being able to generate sacks at this rate if we don't get better at generating pressure.

[OLD FAN MAN]

23 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

No, definitely not. Moose is only interested in crusading against Chris Ballard, and rubbing Colts fans noses in it.

 

I was just countering the '5th in sacks' stat with some context that I find meaningful. Like I said, I'll take the sacks all day, but I think we need to be better at getting consistent pressure. And like you said, the defense needs to get better at other stuff as well. I think we mostly agree on our opinion of the quality of the defense. I'm not hating on the pass rush, I just don't think we can count on our pass rush being able to generate sacks at this rate if we don't get better at generating pressure.

as long our d is near the top in points allowed we need improvement, imo our talent level is not good enough to play the gus soft scheme on a regular basis