Matt Ryan benched for Sam (merge)

[Happy2BeHere]

13 hours ago, jonjon said:

I don't think most people here think our biggest problem was Ryan. I think most realize it was a combo of Ryan and a bad OL, which you agree with, that's all I'm saying 

I think that Ryan was by far the worst offensive player we had on the field. Sure you can say Pinter sucked it up, Raimann, etc, because at times they sure did. However, in the grand scheme of the offense the most important player on the field was far more often than not making bad decisions and unable to handle the ball properly. There are currently a handful of QB’s who’ve taken more sacks than Ryan and not fumbled the ball anywhere close to what Ryan has and likewise have less interceptions.

 

For me the bottom line is that Ryan was the most detrimental player to the team when on the field. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Because Sam is a threat to run we should have more open receivers and more running room.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 minutes ago, Happy2BeHere said:

I think that Ryan was by far the worst offensive player we had on the field. Sure you can say Pinter sucked it up, Raimann, etc, because at times they sure did. However, in the grand scheme of the offense the most important player on the field was far more often than not making bad decisions and unable to handle the ball properly. There are currently a handful of QB’s who’ve taken more sacks than Ryan and not fumbled the ball anywhere close to what Ryan has and likewise have less interceptions.

 

For me the bottom line is that Ryan was the most detrimental player to the team when on the field. 

If oline suddenly becomes good we will know who was at fault.

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, Happy2BeHere said:

I think that Ryan was by far the worst offensive player we had on the field. Sure you can say Pinter sucked it up, Raimann, etc, because at times they sure did. However, in the grand scheme of the offense the most important player on the field was far more often than not making bad decisions and unable to handle the ball properly. There are currently a handful of QB’s who’ve taken more sacks than Ryan and not fumbled the ball anywhere close to what Ryan has and likewise have less interceptions.

 

For me the bottom line is that Ryan was the most detrimental player to the team when on the field. 

We will see, I hope you are right because we are 3-3-1 with Matt. So if Matt sucks, then with Sam we should go above .500.

[Happy2BeHere]

1 hour ago, Chucklez said:

 

You are being extremely bullish on a 6th round draft pick my friend. I want him to succeed as much as the next person and I agree a change at QB was needed, Ryan not playing particularly well, coupled with the O line playing like hot garbage meant a change HAD to be made. I just wouldn't be so all in on Ehlinger if I were you, in all likelihood, he isnt going to be the long term answer for the Colts. 

Again, I hope he is, but being completely realistic, he probably isn't.

Why not be all in on Ehlinger? What’s there to lose? I think many of us were “all in” when we traded for Ryan even though some of us had reservations about it. I know I was. It didn’t work out and that’s ok! I’m all in on Ehlinger because he’s showed promise and yea maybe it doesn’t end up being the best case scenario and it doesn’t work out long term…but that’s ok. We are in the best position we can realistically be in at this point in time with hope that Ehlinger can prove us wrong and glad he is getting his opportunity. So many QB’s have been drafted or signed here in Indy without ever getting a chance. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

[RollerColt]

3 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

 

Poster and t-shirt material quote right there. 

 

"Catch the damn ball"

"Throw the damn ball"

"Protect the damn QB"

"Block the damn defenders"

"Kick the damn ball"

[shasta519]

1 hour ago, Nickster said:

 

yes the Ryan fallacy of being a quick read/release guy had NO BASIS in reality.  He's NEVER been this type of QB.

 

Nope. Or the idea that he was still this great deep passer. Lots of wrong things were said about Ryan this offseason to fit the narrative about how this was a good move.

 

I am excited to see what Ehlinger can do. But my expectation is we are about to see JB ball again, with an extra run or two.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Good attitude by Parris here. Making sure they are there for Sam is important to him. Also said it’s exciting but has uncertainty. Parris seems like a great leader. Parris credits Matt for making his confidence go through the roof.

 

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/colts-official-podcast/id1177715432?i=1000584101398

[shasta519]

5 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

 

 

He's right. But it's certainly going to change their seasons. Colts were throwing 42 PAs/game...second to only LAC. I bet they are bottom 5-10 with Sam. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

3 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

Poster and t-shirt material quote right there. 

 

"Catch the damn ball"

"Throw the damn ball"

"Protect the damn QB"

"Block the damn defenders"

"Kick the damn ball"

"front office needs to quit changing their mind every day"

 

[Nickster]

52 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

You did say that and credit to you but against the Jags he was getting it out quick. I also think Matt wanted complete control of the offense and Frank did not want that. That is why I have my theory's. Frank wants to call the plays and I think Matt wanted more control. When Matt just ran the hurry up, he was good without Frank calling anything.

 

In the first half he was throwing behind the the LOS and inside 5 yds a lot which is fine when the D is backed off.  All the D basically has to do to eliminate that is press or walk up within about 3-5 yds of LOS.  In the 2nd half he had time to throw.  

 

That game plan worked v. Jags because they weren't expecting it.  It's easy to adjust to.  You just walk up.

 

Those were scripted no read passes often in the first half of the Jags game.  They weren't read/react/release throws.

 

Ryan is not a quick release guy and never has been. 

 

 

[buccolts]

I swear. If Frank calls Hines up the middle for the first play this Sunday I'm going to start taking it personally.

 

Would be cool if they went downfield on the first play, but anything other than Hines up the middle will do.

 

AND, I wonder if Frank would entertain Taylor, and Hines in the backfield with Sam at QB, here and there.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

7 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

He's right. But it's certainly going to change their seasons. Colts were throwing 42 PAs/game...second to only LAC. I bet they are bottom 5-10 with Sam. 

Reich said yesterday they still need to get passing  game going  better. So doesn’t sound like they are going to just run the ball. Sam bring a run threat should open up receivers and the running backs.

[Nickster]

14 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

I’m stating the obvious?    Huh?

 

it looks to me that most here think the biggest problem with our offense is Matt Ryan.   I’m disagreeing with that saying I think the biggest problem is our O-line.   So how is that stating the obvious?  
 

Whether or not this is the right move is NOT an issue for me.   The decision has been made and I understand it.   It’s about money and next years salary cap.   I get it. The Colts are moving on from Matt Ryan.  

 

Yes the OLine is the biggest problem with the offense. No doubt.  Ryan sucks adz too.  These things aren't mutually exclusive. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 minutes ago, buccolts said:

I swear. If Frank calls Hines up the middle for the first play this Sunday I'm going to start taking it personally.

 

Would be cool if they went downfield on the first play, but anything other than Hines up the middle will do.

 

AND, I wonder if Frank would entertain Taylor, and Hines in the backfield with Sam at QB, here and there.

I actually think we are going to see more screen passes with Sam. Sam is just a better fit.

[shasta519]

Just now, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Reich said yesterday they still need to get passing  game going  better. So doesn’t sound like they are going to just run the ball. Sam bring a run threat should open up receivers and the running backs.

 

Sure, but they can't throw it MORE than they have been. I think there will be big swing toward a more balanced offense, in the name of creating more efficient passing plays.

[Defjamz26]

 

[Nickster]

12 hours ago, EastStreet said:

 

I would say 5ish planned runs, but probably more unplanned. 

 

A buddy predicted.... another QB year like 2011... when Painter, Orlovsky, and Collins, all started at least 3 games... 

 

He believes Sam will only last 3-4 games, either due to injury or performance. And we'll end up with Foles to finish the year. 

 

fun... lol

Surely, the are going to do some zone read plays.  If SamE BOI  can burn them by pulling the ball and scampering outside the tackles a couple of times, that would open up yards and yards of space for everything else.  That is our hope IMO.  Sam is going to struggle mightily in the passing game most likely with blitz after blitz like all young QBs unless he can prove he can beat it.

 

I don't expect him to prove that this week. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Sure, but they can't throw it MORE than they have been. I think there will be big swing toward a more balanced offense, in the name of creating more efficient passing plays.

Yes i think we will see a much more balanced offense. Plus I think it will look more modern and fun then stuck in something from 30 years ago.

 

Something else Sam has actually been in system longer then Ryan. So is it possible the playbook gets opened because he understands the playbook better.

[Nickster]

16 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

"front office needs to quit changing their mind every day"

 

"front office needs to quit changing their damn mind every day"

 

fixed it for you

[2006Coltsbestever]

Just now, Nickster said:

"front office needs to quit changing their damn mind every day"

 

fixed it for you

Yep, it seems like that is what they have been doing for a while.

[shasta519]

16 minutes ago, Nickster said:

 

Yes the OLine is the biggest problem with the offense. No doubt.  Ryan sucks adz too.  These things aren't mutually exclusive. 

 

Yep. They aren't mutually exclusive. And while the OL is at fault for a lot, there's a reason Ryan has been sacked 40+ times in 4 straight years and teams blitz him 30%+ of the time. 

 

The real people at fault are the ones who didn't recognize this potential hurdle after last season.

 

The pass pro was bad last year. And while I did not like Wentz, he never got credit for how he was able to evade pressure last season. And it was often downplayed this offseason, in the name of leadership and accuracy.

 

So basically, the QB pressure was still there from last season, but instead of a mobile QB with a strong arm to keep defenses honest, they plugged in an immobile QB with a weaker arm and no real threat to stretch the field.

 

It's honestly strategic malpractice when you think about it. And unless Sam is the real deal, it should cost some people their jobs.

[crazycolt1]

2 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Yep. They aren't mutually exclusive. And while the OL is at fault for a lot, there's a reason Ryan has been sacked 40+ times in 4 straight years and teams blitz him 30%+ of the time. 

 

The real people are at fault are the ones who didn't recognize this potential hurdle after last season.

 

I did not like Wentz, but he never got credit for how he was able to evade pressure last season. And it was completely downplayed this offseason, in the name of leadership and accuracy.

 

So basically, the QB pressure was still there from last season, but instead of a mobile QB with a strong arm to keep defenses honest, they plugged in an immobile QB with a weaker arm and no real threat to stretch the field.

 

It's honestly strategic malpractice when you think about it. And unless Sam is the real deal, it should cost some people their jobs.

Strategic malpractice? 

Are you serious?

[Nickster]

3 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Yep. They aren't mutually exclusive. And while the OL is at fault for a lot, there's a reason Ryan has been sacked 40+ times in 4 straight years and teams blitz him 30%+ of the time. 

 

The real people at fault are the ones who didn't recognize this potential hurdle after last season.

 

The pass pro was bad last year. And while I did not like Wentz, he never got credit for how he was able to evade pressure last season. And it was often downplayed this offseason, in the name of leadership and accuracy.

 

So basically, the QB pressure was still there from last season, but instead of a mobile QB with a strong arm to keep defenses honest, they plugged in an immobile QB with a weaker arm and no real threat to stretch the field.

 

It's honestly strategic malpractice when you think about it. And unless Sam is the real deal, it should cost some people their jobs.

 

I was accused of being a Wentz lover for highlighting those ideas.  Glad he's gone.  Team was going nowhere with him, but he was an effective QB for us in very difficult circumstances with a top 10 QBR.  

 

It's amazing that an NFL FO actually thought Matt Ryan was going to fit right into this offense with all the challenges and the completely different natured offense than what he was used to. 

[NewColtsFan]

24 minutes ago, Nickster said:

 

Yes the OLine is the biggest problem with the offense. No doubt.  Ryan sucks adz too.  These things aren't mutually exclusive. 

I understand that.   Completely agree.   But to me, one is much worse than the other.  If, as Frank told Ryan,  the Colts held up their end of the bargain,  and given him a good O-line and a top running game,  I don’t think we’d be where we are today. 

[coming on strong]

2 hours ago, Chucklez said:

 

You are being extremely bullish on a 6th round draft pick my friend. I want him to succeed as much as the next person and I agree a change at QB was needed, Ryan not playing particularly well, coupled with the O line playing like hot garbage meant a change HAD to be made. I just wouldn't be so all in on Ehlinger if I were you, in all likelihood, he isnt going to be the long term answer for the Colts. 

Again, I hope he is, but being completely realistic, he probably isn't.

I will be all in unless he really plays bad .  If he plays bad I will be all in on drafting a Qb in the first round . 
 

it’s a win win situation either Sam shows up and is the future or we get a high draft pick . 

[Nickster]

7 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

I understand that.   Completely agree.   But to me, one is much worse than the other.  If, as Frank told Ryan,  the Colts held up their end of the bargain,  and given him a good O-line and a top running game,  I don’t think we’d be where we are today. 

 

Ryan is washed and was never a good fit for what the Colts are trying to do though.  bad OLINE play is only partially responsible for his failure.  He took bad sacks, fumbles and INTS too.

 

Interestingly, Ryan is 1 yard from 3rd place in passing yards this year lol. 

[Happy2BeHere]

Is it Sunday yet ???

 

[RollerColt]

 

[shasta519]

46 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Strategic malpractice? 

Are you serious?

 

Yes. It was negligence in multiple ways.

 

The pass pro was bad in 2021 (#30 in PFF pass pro efficiency). Wentz, despite actually being a mobile QB who could (and did) evade pressure, was still hit 75x. That was #2 in the NFL behind only...Matt Ryan.

 

So after getting rid of the mobile Wentz, they went out and acquired the immobile Matt Ryan...a QB that gets hit and pressured MORE than Wentz. And somehow that was going to solve the pass pro issues.

 

It would have been bad enough to stick Ryan behind the same OL as last year, but what they did was even worse. Their plan was:

• Pinter at RG (even though he has never played it) - BENCHED
• Pryor at LT (a journeyman OL player who played 94 snaps at LT last season) - TERRIBLE (MOVED TO RT)
• Raimann as competition at LT (3rd round project) - BENCHED

 

It was a terrible overall strategy that has resulted in the worst offense in the NFL (after nearly being a top 10 offense last year). And while Ryan being benched is surprising, it's not remotely surprising that their counter-intuitive offseason approach blew up in their faces. I blame the players as well, but the accountability starts at the top.

 

[coming on strong]

15 hours ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

He doesn’t seem to feel pressure. He also doesn’t make teams pay for blitzing very well. Oline hasn’t been great but I think Matt made it look a lot worse.

For being a veteran he doesn’t seem to be able to read defenses at a high level . He doesn’t audible to blitz beating plays at the line .   

[2006Coltsbestever]

5 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

 

Nick Foles was the SB Champ, Carson was holding a clipboard. 

[RollerColt]

 

Uh. Did Reich change the narrative? 

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, RollerColt said:

 

Uh. Did Reich change the narrative? 

- in 2 weeks, Frank: Matt is our QB again, Sam did a great job at getting us to 5-3-1  

[RollerColt]

1 minute ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

- in 2 weeks, Frank: Matt is our QB again, Sam did a great job at getting us to 5-3-1  

I'm guessing it's just weird wording with that last statement "if he wasn't benched". Still... made me turn my head in confusion.

[2006Coltsbestever]

2 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

I'm guessing it's just weird wording with that last statement "if he wasn't benched". Still... made me turn my head in confusion.

Week to week with this team.

[shasta519]

26 minutes ago, Nickster said:

 

I was accused of being a Wentz lover for highlighting those ideas.  Glad he's gone.  Team was going nowhere with him, but he was an effective QB for us in very difficult circumstances with a top 10 QBR.  

 

It's amazing that an NFL FO actually thought Matt Ryan was going to fit right into this offense with all the challenges and the completely different natured offense than what he was used to. 

 

I was about as anti-Wentz as anybody around here. But watching him last season, you couldn't help but see that he was a magician at times when it came to evading pressure. And there were times when he would turn a sure sack into a 1st down scramble. 

 

But I guess people didn't really notice or care. Or I guess they blamed Wentz for the OL issues. Either way, we heard little about it this offseason.

 

And once the Ryan trade happened, mobility didn't really matter because Ryan had leadership and would "hit the layups."

 

Now Ryan's been benched after a poor performance and getting pummeled behind this OL. And in comes Sam Ehlinger, who is a mobile QB and "fits the offense better."

 

I think that's what you might call irony. But it's also represents what was a poor offseason strategy for QB and the OL. And you can argue that it's two seasons in a row of it. So yeah, I think the FO and coaching staff are really the ones at fault here.

[Dingus McGirt]

6 hours ago, RollerColt said:

Love Matt Ryan. He's the ultimate professional and leader. Regression of physical ability happens to everyone, and it's expedited when you're getting hit every throw. While he may be done as a player, I doubt this is the last we see of him on the field and or in the NFL in general. 

I don't know, RC.  Ryan made more than $250M from the Falcons in the last 15 years.  Add in what gets from the Colts, and he never needs to work again.

[crazycolt1]

15 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Yes. It was negligence in multiple ways.

 

The pass pro was bad in 2021 (#30 in PFF pass pro efficiency). Wentz, despite actually being a mobile QB who could (and did) evade pressure, was still hit 75x. That was #2 in the NFL behind only...Matt Ryan.

 

So after getting rid of the mobile Wentz, they went out and acquired the immobile Matt Ryan...a QB that gets hit and pressured MORE than Wentz. And somehow that was going to solve the pass pro issues.

 

It would have been bad enough to stick Ryan behind the same OL as last year, but to make matters worse, what they did was even worse. Their plan was:

• Pinter at RG (even though he has never played it) - BENCHED
• Pryor at LT (a journeyman OL player who played 94 snaps at LT last season) - TERRIBLE (MOVED TO RT)
• Raimann as competition at LT (3rd round project) - BENCHED

It was a terrible overall strategy that has resulted in the worst offense in the NFL (after nearly being a top 10 offense last year). And while Ryan being benched is surprising, it's not remotely surprising that their counter-intuitive offseason approach blew up in their faces. I blame the players as well, but the accountability starts at the top.

 

I don't need to write a book to say that things didn't work out.  Calling it strategic malpractice is overreacting.