Pat Angerer Ranks At 26Th Best Ilb According To B/r

[OllyDawes]

In the Bleacher Report's Top 1000 section they have released their ILB rankings. Pat Angerer ranks as #26, but what I want to discuss is the rating of 5 for his tackling.

Angerer made 146 tackles for us this year, don't think he's particularly bad at it...

[Gavin]

His ranking will probably get better once he shows he can do it consistently, last year was obviously great but that was only one year

[Robin]

how many tackles did he get dropping 15 yard back, and giving up 1st downs... just saying

[Dan]

Good thing it's only Bleacher.

[Gavin]

enough to be near the top of the league

[Smurphy1]

how many tackles did he get dropping 15 yard back, and giving up 1st downs... just saying

I blame that more on the scheme than the player.

[Gavin]

the player was at the top of the league in tackles at one point, I forget where he finished exactly but its bleacher report I dont care what they say most of the time

[Gavin]

as much as we were ran on last year (at the top in number of attempts against any opposing team) if they actually schemed to stop the run he would have had 200 or more

[IndyTrav]

He actually only had along the lines of 77 tackles. The rest were assists.....and many were several yards after the LOS. So while I did enjoy Pat, and think we MAY have found a good player, I'm pretty hesitant to start claiming he is a top player. A sentiment very few on here share. Nothing wrong with being excited about Pat, but let's hold back on claiming he's anything better than 26th in the league.

[Robin]

I blame that more on the scheme than the player.

so do I, but thats dosent make hes stats more usefull.

I think hes good and probably also #26 but hes stats from last year cant be used as comparison to others.

[Gavin]

so do I, but thats dosent make hes stats more usefull.

I think hes good and probably also #26 but hes stats from last year cant be used as comparison to others.

thats actually one of the ways that you can tell if a middle linebacker is good or not by the number of tackles he gets, look at Patrick Willis or Ray Lewis they are top of the league and why is that? because they consistently get to the guy with the ball and get that tackle, now thats not the only way to measure how good a guy is, but look what he does compared to others at his position on game day that will tell ya a great deal about how good he is along with his instincts for getting to the ball. the middle linebacker is in the middle of most of the action especially if its a run play

[Robin]

thats actually one of the ways if you can tell if a middle linebacker is good or not by the number of tackles he gets, look at Patrick Willis or Ray Lewis they are top of the league and why is that because they consistently get to the guy with the ball and get that tackle, now thats not the only way to measure how good a guy is, but look what he does compared to others at his position on game day that will tell ya a great deal about how good he is along with his instincts for getting to the ball. the middle linebacker is in the middle of most of the action especially if its a run play

if you can get 10 free yards on every play by dumping it to the reciever, because the LB is 15 yards off, and then he gets the tackle, thats not good stats, he get exploited, I dont try to blame Pat, its our scheme but hes tackles cant be used to comparison to others WIllis etc, because i doubt he stands 15 yards from LOS and get exploited that way,

would I be a good quarterback if i consistently threw to a WR that dident get covered before the 15 yard line? no need to force a 25 yard play if you can get 10 yard as easy as our defense gives them... I cant wait to see Angerer in our new scheme because i'll think he does good,

because he is good, not because our scheme is bad, and he get exploited

sorry for my bad English its my second language.

[Gavin]

if you can get 10 free yards on every play by dumping it to the reciever, because the LB is 15 yards off, and then he gets the tackle, thats not good stats, he get exploited, I dont try to blame Pat, its our scheme but hes tackles cant be used to comparison to others WIllis etc, because i doubt he stands 15 yards from LOS and get exploited that way,

would I be a good quarterback if i consistently threw to a WR that dident get covered before the 15 yard line? no need to force a 25 yard play if you can get 10 yard as easy as our defense gives them... I cant wait to see Angerer in our new scheme because i'll think he does good,

because he is good, not because our scheme is bad, and he get exploited

sorry for my bad English its my second language.

your english is good, but Ray Lewis dropped back like that plenty of times and he makes tackles all the time, now I know Pat has a way to go cause this is a new scheme and new everything but he didnt just drop back he moved all around the field and made tackles

[MTC]

I would rate him higher than some of these linebackers. I would put him around 10-15.

[MAC]

I would rate him higher than some of these linebackers. I would put him around 10-15.

Than you can write your own article for bleacher report - and it will be JUST as valid as anything else the produce.

[Robin]

your english is good, but Ray Lewis dropped back like that plenty of times and he makes tackles all the time, now I know Pat has a way to go cause this is a new scheme and new everything but he didnt just drop back he moved all around the field and made tackles

he did move around, and he did make some good plays I agree with you there, but i remember when he drop backs 6 times in a row and get exploited and thats just in 1 game, and he might the get told to drop back, and thats fine but then hes stats is not really for use, and thats why I think we shall wait till next year when we release the monster to see how good he really is, he might be even better then we imagined.

[21isSuperman]

how many tackles did he get dropping 15 yard back, and giving up 1st downs... just saying

But is that his fault or is that the playcaller's fault?

[WSnotch]

Man, Does Robin spell better than most Americans........?

[LJpalmbeacher2]

I doubt he will ever be more than average and according to Bleacher he has a way to go to get to being average.

[Robin]

But is that his fault or is that the playcaller's fault?

it's not he's fault, but you cant give him credit to him either, 150 tackles is not good if you give up 1000 yards...

[Robin]

Man, Does Robin spell better than most Americans........?

Thanks

[dgambill]

I would be more interested in Pat if I saw him identify formations better...see what is happening and help people get to the ball..watch great ILB...they read the formation and change the call all the time to counter what is happening at the line. That is what Ray Lewis was great at. They also read the play and meet runners IN THE HOLE...not 5 to 10 yards down field. It doesn't matter what defense is called if you are a great lb you identify the play and go and make a play on it...at the line or behind the line. Now..Angerer seemed like a sure tackler...but he also had huge issues shedding blockers (but most lbs do..thats partly our lines fault) and he looked absolutely lost in coverage. To say he is 26th best ILB is probably close to accurate despite the source. If he was top ten his play would affect the whole defense. You would see him putting guys where they need to be to stop plays...making plays at the line or behind it...and defending balls in coverage. I think he is growing and a good player that will get better but he is avg right now. That isn't a bad thing...but he has skills and ability..he just needs to spend more time in the film room and get just a tad quicker reacting...I guess more anticipating and less waiting to see the play develop.

[El Poonerator]

A bit suprising to me, but we'll take it. Thanks BR.

[21isSuperman]

it's not he's fault, but you cant give him credit to him either, 150 tackles is not good if you give up 1000 yards...

He made the best of the situation he was given. His defensive coordinator told him to drop back 15 yards into coverage despite knowing full well that the offense would run. Pat did that, then went up to make the tackle. I'm sure if it were up to him, he would have dropped less and played more around the LOS, but he can't control that. Based on the film we have now, he has done well

[dgambill]

He made the best of the situation he was given. His defensive coordinator told him to drop back 15 yards into coverage despite knowing full well that the offense would run. Pat did that, then went up to make the tackle. I'm sure if it were up to him, he would have dropped less and played more around the LOS, but he can't control that. Based on the film we have now, he has done well

I could be wrong but doesn't Pat have the option of changing the defense? Was he not the defensive play caller on the field? Maybe I was wrong. If his instincts tell him to get somewhere he should get there. I am not going to say our soft defense wasn't an issue...or our poreous defensive line wasn't helpful either but Pat needs a lot of growth to me in the mental part of the game..he showed he was a capable tackler however.

[Andy]

I love Pat, but people gotta stop using that tackles excuse. He got a lot of tackles due to the defense being on the field so much and the teams they were against running the ball 65% of the time. I thinik 26th is just about right, but the thing with Pat is that he will only get better.

The future is bright for Pat!

[21isSuperman]

I could be wrong but doesn't Pat have the option of changing the defense? Was he not the defensive play caller on the field? Maybe I was wrong. If his instincts tell him to get somewhere he should get there. I am not going to say our soft defense wasn't an issue...or our poreous defensive line wasn't helpful either but Pat needs a lot of growth to me in the mental part of the game..he showed he was a capable tackler however.

I think it depends on the defense/defensive coordinator/coaching staff. If your play caller on the field is a younger guy like Angerer, they might not let him change the play call. But if it's a veteran like Ray Lewis, they'll probably give him more control. I'd say Angerer is too young (he just finished his second season), but by his 4th or 5th season, I wouldn't be surprised if he was given more freedom to change the play

[Camio]

Out of the top 40 they did, there are 6 ilb between 40 and 27 (below Angerer) that I'd rather have if I could choose, over Angerer. Of the guys ranked above him, there's about 3-5 guys that are about the same as Angerer. Rest are clearly better, sorry to say.

Angerer has a great asset and its his range. However, he has several weaknesses that keep him outside of the top 20 ilb in the league.

I dont see the issue with him being so low.

[Robin]

He made the best of the situation he was given. His defensive coordinator told him to drop back 15 yards into coverage despite knowing full well that the offense would run. Pat did that, then went up to make the tackle. I'm sure if it were up to him, he would have dropped less and played more around the LOS, but he can't control that. Based on the film we have now, he has done well

it might not have been hes preferred situation, and might not been hes call but thats still dosent make it any better, I'm not arguing thats hes a good player or not, but alot of those tackles where 15 yards off, and he got exploited for free first downs, the DC might told him to do that, and thats okai but thats dosent make he's tackle more impressive...

look at Revis, I know hes a CB but he got very few tackles, still he is the best CB, because the QB wont throw hes way.. Angerer is just opposite

[21isSuperman]

it might not have been hes preferred situation, and might not been hes call but thats still dosent make it any better, I'm not arguing thats hes a good player or not, but alot of those tackles where 15 yards off, and he got exploited for free first downs, the DC might told him to do that, and thats okai but thats dosent make he's tackle more impressive...

look at Revis, I know hes a CB but he got very few tackles, still he is the best CB, because the QB wont throw hes way.. Angerer is just opposite

It's much easier to ignore a CB than a MLB. Don't throw towards Revis and he won't get the stats. But as a MLB, Angerer plays sideline to sideline. Regardless of how he got so many tackles, he still did. He was still in on plays and has a nose for the ball. If they play him closer to the LOS next year and his stats drop significantly, there might be some question as to his ability. But up until now, he was put into situations he didn't control (like dropping back 15 yards), but still made a number of plays. Even if he had poor tackling ability, that would have been exploited when going 1 on 1 against a RB in the open field.

[Robin]

It's much easier to ignore a CB than a MLB. Don't throw towards Revis and he won't get the stats. But as a MLB, Angerer plays sideline to sideline. Regardless of how he got so many tackles, he still did. He was still in on plays and has a nose for the ball. If they play him closer to the LOS next year and his stats drop significantly, there might be some question as to his ability. But up until now, he was put into situations he didn't control (like dropping back 15 yards), but still made a number of plays. Even if he had poor tackling ability, that would have been exploited when going 1 on 1 against a RB in the open field.

you cant use the excuse that he dident control the situation, when it is this "situation" that make him get so many tackles,

again im not bashing Pat I've think hes a great player but he haven't proved that hes as good as the stats say...

when QB keep throwing hes way for easy yards again and again and he just make that easy tackles that doesn't prove any skills.

[dgambill]

I think Pat is starting out to be a fine young tackler. I see nothing wrong with where he is ranked. That said just watching him alone you see him out of position A LOT. He is suppose to make a lot of tackles because that is his job. He seems to be a very good tackler. I haven't seen him wiff a lot or be totally overpowered. I have seen him get out of position costing us valuable yards several times. I am sure he isn't allowed to necessarily call the defensive plays but he is the MLB and his job is to recognize formations and make sure what is called is the right defense for that play. If not he needs to check us out of it. He definately needs to grow there. His anticipation and reaction is just a bit slow. His foot speed is just fine. Recognizing where the play is going and getting there just a fraction of a second faster is the difference between getting blocked many times and making a play in the hole. I think we all can say that he wasn't there last year..but is young and has promise. His form, size, speed all lead me to believe he has skills. It is all between the ears that he needs to improve. That isn't a diss..I just feel it is a fair accessment. The only thing I see real need for improvement as far as technique is his coverage skills. He does get a little lost in space. He could do a better job covering up holes in the zone...but again..I think he is one of our guys we continue to develop..not one destined to be cast off.

[21isSuperman]

you cant use the excuse that he dident control the situation, when it is this "situation" that make him get so many tackles,

again im not bashing Pat I've think hes a great player but he haven't proved that hes as good as the stats say...

when QB keep throwing hes way for easy yards again and again and he just make that easy tackles that doesn't prove any skills.

I think it does. Making an open field tackle on a RB is a very difficult thing to do and Pat has shown he can do that. And even if tackle stats are wildly inaccurate, it still shows he is always around the ball.

With that said, it seems as though we will have to agree to disagree on this situation. One thing we can both agree on is that we want Pat to keep improving and making big plays for this defense

[Robin]

I think it does. Making an open field tackle on a RB is a very difficult thing to do and Pat has shown he can do that. And even if tackle stats are wildly inaccurate, it still shows he is always around the ball.

With that said, it seems as though we will have to agree to disagree on this situation. One thing we can both agree on is that we want Pat to keep improving and making big plays for this defense

I think thats best, reading your post I don't think we talking about the same thing.

[21isSuperman]

I think thats best, reading your post I don't think we talking about the same thing.

I agree with you there. I think we are both talking about different things. Oh well

[Malakai432]

If he keeps getting better I could see him be kind of like a Zach Thomas's mini me.

[Andy]

If he keeps getting better I could see him be kind of like a Zach Thomas's mini me.

I think that's a bit of a stretch, but I definitely see James Laurinaitis kind of potential.

[Malakai432]

I think that's a bit of a stretch, but I definitely see James Laurinaitis kind of potential.

I would be more than fine with that.

[jemack]

how many tackles did he get dropping 15 yard back, and giving up 1st downs... just saying

Ya know, that's coaching. He was asked that question after the Saint's game where at the snap he would sprint 15 yrds downfield. He beamed when saying, this is what I do in the system. (paraphrasing)

......as if he did a job well done

[Robin]

Ya know, that's coaching. He was asked that question after the Saint's game where at the snap he would sprint 15 yrds downfield. He beamed when saying, this is what I do in the system. (paraphrasing)

......as if he did a job well done

I have no idea what your talking about :???: