Bucky Brooks lists top-5 at each position....

[NewColtsFan]

 

This is from NFL.com's other scout turning media analyst.....

 

Some surprises here for you to enjoy and consider.....

 

Just click, scroll and read....       

 

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000775852/article/top-5-2017-nfl-draft-prospects-by-position

[Andrew Luck fan club]

Just a great draft class. OTs aren't the best prospects outside of Robinson, but there's so much talent everywhere. 

[jshipp23]

44 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

This is from NFL.com's other scout turning media analyst.....

 

Some surprises here for you to enjoy and consider.....

 

Just click, scroll and read....       

 

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000775852/article/top-5-2017-nfl-draft-prospects-by-position

So they are projecting Cunningham as an OLB now? He seems light to me not sure he has the strength ...Might be a risk that could pay off, and if not he can play ILB...I wouldn't mind the pick at least you have 2 options..

[MPStack]

1 minute ago, jshipp23 said:

So they are projecting Cunningham as an OLB now? He seems light to me not sure he has the strength ...Might be a risk that could pay off, and if not he can play ILB...I wouldn't mind the pick at least you have 2 options..

 

I also saw he was listed an OLB the other day on CBS site. His combine will one to pay close attention to. Kind of reminds me of P. Dawson from TCU last year or year before I believe.

[Andrew Luck fan club]

15 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

So they are projecting Cunningham as an OLB now? He seems light to me not sure he has the strength ...Might be a risk that could pay off, and if not he can play ILB...I wouldn't mind the pick at least you have 2 options..

Yeah I think he got that wrong. He's an ILB.

[Boiler_Colt]

15 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

So they are projecting Cunningham as an OLB now? He seems light to me not sure he has the strength ...Might be a risk that could pay off, and if not he can play ILB...I wouldn't mind the pick at least you have 2 options..

Most likely they meant in a 4-3. He would not fit as a 3-4 olb. But a 4-3 will is probably his best position. 

[jshipp23]

Just now, Majin Vegeta said:

Yeah I think he got that wrong. He's an ILB.

Thats what i was thinking, but if he put on some weight and got stronger i could see him as a edge too..Id draft him to be ILB personally, but even at ILB he could be a dangerous blitzer and get us some pass rush that way too and be able to cover tight ends..You don't see many guys with his skill set for sure, sideline to sideline he is elite...

[NewColtsFan]

35 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

So they are projecting Cunningham as an OLB now? He seems light to me not sure he has the strength ...Might be a risk that could pay off, and if not he can play ILB...I wouldn't mind the pick at least you have 2 options..

 

First,  it's not "they"...   it's just Bucky Brooks.

 

2nd,  I've seen Cunningham mentioned by others as a possible outside candidate.     In this situation, it's not clear to me if that's for a 3-4 or a 4-3,  because the responsibilities are different.     So,  it's a bit unclear to me...

 

I figure it will become more clear as the next 3 months unfold.....     (At least, I hope so....)

 

 

[jshipp23]

18 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

First,  it's not "they"...   it's just Bucky Brooks.

 

2nd,  I've seen Cunningham mentioned by others as a possible outside candidate.     In this situation, it's not clear to me if that's for a 3-4 or a 4-3,  because the responsibilities are different.     So,  it's a bit unclear to me...

 

I figure it will become more clear as the next 3 months unfold.....     (At least, I hope so....)

 

 

I checked him out on a few sites after this, and they were projecting him at 3-4 OLB as well....

[NewColtsFan]

4 hours ago, Majin Vegeta said:

Just a great draft class. OTs aren't the best prospects outside of Robinson, but there's so much talent everywhere. 

 

Honestly,  I don't think this is a great class at all.    I'd give it roughly a "C" maybe C+ plus tops.....    but most classes the last few years have been roughly that...

 

Terrible year for QB's...   poor year for WR's....   Bad year for OT's....     these might be the three worst positions on the board.       Fortunately,  the Colts don't need any of those spots.       We need a ton of defense.   A new RB for the future and perhaps a mid-round choice for a lineman of Philbin's choice.

 

I think we can get a lot of that in the draft,  and hopefully a strong haul in the free agent window come March.

 

[Andrew Luck fan club]

5 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Honestly,  I don't think this is a great class at all.    I'd give it roughly a "C" maybe C+ plus tops.....    but most classes the last few years have been roughly that...

 

Terrible year for QB's...   poor year for WR's....   Bad year for OT's....     these might be the three worst positions on the board.       Fortunately,  the Colts don't need any of those spots.       We need a ton of defense.   A new RB for the future and perhaps a mid-round choice for a lineman of Philbin's choice.

 

I think we can get a lot of that in the draft,  and hopefully a strong haul in the free agent window come March.

 

You can argue it's a bad year for QBs and OTs. But Mike Williams and Corey davis are easy 1st rounders. The cb class is amazing. There's a ton of great linebackers. Quite a few good RBs. I definitely disagree. 

I'd give the 2013 draft class a C, not this one. 

[PeterBowman]

as we've discussed this draft is deep where the Colts are weakest. Could be a great draft. Like last year was for O linemen.

[krunk]

I see Daniel Jeremiah has mocked Derek Barnett to us in his latest 2017 Mock Draft.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2017/mock-drafts/daniel-jeremiah/330601

[krunk]

He's got TJ Watt going in the first round in this mock. ???

[Andrew Luck fan club]

1 hour ago, PeterBowman said:

as we've discussed this draft is deep where the Colts are weakest. Could be a great draft. Like last year was for O linemen.

That's what I'm saying, it's a great draft for us. 

[jshipp23]

This draft is the deepest defensive draft I've seen...There will be guys going in the 3rd that would have been first rounders in previous years. ..It is one of the weakest offensive drafts I've seen other than RB or TE....It is tailor made for the Colts to knock it out of the park..

[jshipp23]

27 minutes ago, krunk said:

He's got TJ Watt going in the first round in this mock. ???

Your sleeping on TJ Watt..He has the highest ceiling in the draft. ..Only reason he is even that low is the knees. .If he is medically ok'd he will go top 20...

[jshipp23]

11 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

First,  it's not "they"...   it's just Bucky Brooks.

 

2nd,  I've seen Cunningham mentioned by others as a possible outside candidate.     In this situation, it's not clear to me if that's for a 3-4 or a 4-3,  because the responsibilities are different.     So,  it's a bit unclear to me...

 

I figure it will become more clear as the next 3 months unfold.....     (At least, I hope so....)

 

 

"They" is a figure of speech here in Indiana..That was really unnecessary  California...

[NewColtsFan]

3 hours ago, Majin Vegeta said:

You can argue it's a bad year for QBs and OTs. But Mike Williams and Corey davis are easy 1st rounders. The cb class is amazing. There's a ton of great linebackers. Quite a few good RBs. I definitely disagree. 

I'd give the 2013 draft class a C, not this one. 

 

Yes....   Williams and Davis are easy first rounders,  and maybe one other....   someone like Ross.

 

But that's 2-3 first round receivers.     Often,  there are 4-6....   then quality drops off pretty quickly....

 

I wouldn't call this CB class amazing....   I'd call it very good and very deep.     

 

The 2013 class got roughly a C before the draft.     But AFTER the draft,  it's more like a D or D-.   Terrible draft.

 

And when I grade a draft,  I'm talking about not just the first round....    I'm talking about depth as well.   Most since roughly 2000 have gotten something in the range of a C...   some C+,  some C-.    But in the range of C.

 

For me,  when the QB, WR and OT positions are not just below average, but very poor,  it's hard to get worked up about the draft.      Yes,  other positions are good,  and that's what keeps this overall class in the range of C.

Remember,  C is average.        The Colts are fortunate this year,  the strength of the draft matches up with the needs of the team.     And the weaknesses,  we care less about.

 

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, jshipp23 said:

This draft is the deepest defensive draft I've seen...There will be guys going in the 3rd that would have been first rounders in previous years. ..It is one of the weakest offensive drafts I've seen other than RB or TE....It is tailor made for the Colts to knock it out of the park..

 

No.    Not even close.     Not even a little bit.

 

Do NOT get carried away.       Defense may be the strength of the draft,  but it's NOT that good.  

 

Take a deep breath.....    slow your roll....       Remember,  32 teams,  and there aren't even 32 total players -- any players --- with a first round grade.     There will be NO guys going in the 3rd who would've been 1st rounders in other years....       it's NOT that kind of draft....       Really.     I promise.

 

[Andrew Luck fan club]

2 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Yes....   Williams and Davis are easy first rounders,  and maybe one other....   someone like Ross.

 

But that's 2-3 first round receivers.     Often,  there are 4-6....   then quality drops off pretty quickly....

 

I wouldn't call this CB class amazing....   I'd call it very good and very deep.     

 

The 2013 class got roughly a C before the draft.     But AFTER the draft,  it's more like a D or D-.   Terrible draft.

 

And when I grade a draft,  I'm talking about not just the first round....    I'm talking about depth as well.   Most since roughly 2000 have gotten something in the range of a C...   some C+,  some C-.    But in the range of C.

 

For me,  when the QB, WR and OT positions are not just below average, but very poor,  it's hard to get worked up about the draft.      Yes,  other positions are good,  and that's what keeps this overall class in the range of C.

Remember,  C is average.        The Colts are fortunate this year,  the strength of the draft matches up with the needs of the team.     And the weaknesses,  we care less about.

 

 

 

Oh if you're talking like overall, then yeah I agree. Still a good class though, and especially for us.

[jshipp23]

14 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

No.    Not even close.     Not even a little bit.

 

Do NOT get carried away.       Defense may be the strength of the draft,  but it's NOT that good.  

 

Take a deep breath.....    slow your roll....       Remember,  32 teams,  and there aren't even 32 total players -- any players --- with a first round grade.     There will be NO guys going in the 3rd who would've been 1st rounders in other years....       it's NOT that kind of draft....       Really.     I promise.

 

Maybe 3rd round is a little much, but the second round is full of DEFENSIVE players that would be 1st rounders in a LOT of years..Teams in need of offense are gonna reach for offensive players even if better defensive players are there...If you don't think this is one of the best defensive drafts in a long time I question your knowledge at this point....

[NewColtsFan]

1 minute ago, jshipp23 said:

Maybe 3rd round is a little much, but the second round is full of DEFENSIVE players that would be 1st rounders in a LOT of years..Teams in need of offense are gonna reach for offensive players even if better defensive players are there...If you don't think this is one of the best defensive drafts in a long time I question your knowledge at this point....

 

 

Defense is the strength of the draft.     It's an above average defensive draft.    If you want to call it well above average -- fine.     But it isn't great.    It isn't legendary.     It isn't in a class of it's own.

 

No one is saying this.     No reputable media outlet is saying what you're claiming.

 

In any given recent draft there are maybe 16-24 players with first round grades.    I think ESPN currently has about 16.      That means roughly 16 players are going to be taken in the first round that have second round grades according to them.

I agree this is one of the better defensive classes in a while....   but I still wouldn't get too carried away.

 

Oh,  and this defensive class is a good reason to save taking a RB until the 4th round.    Let's grab this very good defensive players while we can.

 

[jshipp23]

1 minute ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

 

Defense is the strength of the draft.     It's an above average defensive draft.    If you want to call it well above average -- fine.     But it isn't great.    It isn't legendary.     It isn't in a class of it's own.

 

No one is saying this.     No reputable media outlet is saying what you're claiming.

 

In any given recent draft there are maybe 16-24 players with first round grades.    I think ESPN currently has about 16.      That means roughly 16 players are going to be taken in the first round that have second round grades according to them.

I agree this is one of the better defensive classes in a while....   but I still wouldn't get too carried away.

 

Oh,  and this defensive class is a good reason to save taking a RB until the 4th round.    Let's grab this very good defensive players while we can.

 

Or it means we could take a RB early because there is so much defensive depth we will get quality players in even the later rounds..If you don't think RB is a major need I don't know what to tell you..It is very rare to find a great back in the later rounds ..For every 10 there might be 1...Its much more of a certainty to get that guy early..WE NEED THAT FRANCHISE BACK...You need to repeat this mantra in your head daily until it sinks in..

[jshipp23]

double post

[NewColtsFan]

7 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

Or it means we could take a RB early because there is so much defensive depth we will get quality players in even the later rounds..If you don't think RB is a major need I don't know what to tell you..It is very rare to find a great back in the later rounds ..For every 10 there might be 1...Its much more of a certainty to get that guy early..WE NEED THAT FRANCHISE BACK...You need to repeat this mantra in your head daily until it sinks in..

 

Of course I think it's a major need.    I've only been posting that for nearly a year!    

 

Look at the NFL,  you can find a franchise back well after the first round.     It's all over the league.

 

We can find a good quality back after the first round.    Even all the way down in R4, which is my desired spot.

 

Put another way,  I think in another thread,  you voiced your approval for Mike Shannahan to be our HC.    Mike is famous for finding a good RB in the late rounds....   most typically R6.   

 

Good RB's can be found later....    you need to repeat this mantra in your head daily until it sinks in....   

[Jason_]

3 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

Or it means we could take a RB early because there is so much defensive depth we will get quality players in even the later rounds..If you don't think RB is a major need I don't know what to tell you..It is very rare to find a great back in the later rounds ..For every 10 there might be 1...Its much more of a certainty to get that guy early..WE NEED THAT FRANCHISE BACK...You need to repeat this mantra in your head daily until it sinks in..

 

no, no to almost all of that

[VocableLoki]

Why do we need a franchise back? Sure, maybe a young runner who can pick up good yards but it's much more important to develop the line and build the defense up. Out of the four teams left right now only one really has a "franchise back" in the sense that we are talking about. Of the top teams in the league, I can only think of a handful that have a truly franchise back. I don't see the need to invest a 1st round pick in that position right now IMHO.

[jshipp23]

15 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Of course I think it's a major need.    I've only been posting that for nearly a year!    

 

Look at the NFL,  you can find a franchise back well after the first round.     It's all over the league.

 

We can find a good quality back after the first round.    Even all the way down in R4, which is my desired spot.

 

Put another way,  I think in another thread,  you voiced your approval for Mike Shannahan to be our HC.    Mike is famous for finding a good RB in the late rounds....   most typically R6.   

 

Good RB's can be found later....    you need to repeat this mantra in your head daily until it sinks in....   

Let me put this in metaphorical form in the hope you and others can understand my position...The odds of Fournette or Cook making an Elliot or Laveon Bell impact on our team are much higher then say taking an OLB at 15..That OLB could easily be another Dion Jordan or Mingo and basically be a bust...I seriously doubt Fournette or Cook bust unless they get hurt...If we get Cook or Fournette we are a top 5 offense and will average 30 points a game and will allow our defense to rest and play with the lead which has a major impact on defense..Also, if we average 30 a game we are in every ballgame much like the Manning era Colts...It usually takes linebackers time to develop if they even develop at all..We have 5 other  rounds in the draft to focus solely on defense as well as free agency.....I doubt Pittsburgh or Dallas are kicking themselves wishing they had taken a CB instead of Bell or Elliott. ..For every David Johnson or Alfred Morris, there are 10 Kenyan Drakes or Josh Robinsons'....Can you see the forest through the trees yet?

[CheezyColt]

29 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

Let me put this in metaphorical form in the hope you and others can understand my position...The odds of Fournette or Cook making an Elliot or Laveon Bell impact on our team are much higher then say taking an OLB at 15..That OLB could easily be another Dion Jordan or Mingo and basically be a bust...I seriously doubt Fournette or Cook bust unless they get hurt...If we get Cook or Fournette we are a top 5 offense and will average 30 points a game and will allow our defense to rest and play with the lead which has a major impact on defense..Also, if we average 30 a game we are in every ballgame much like the Manning era Colts...It usually takes linebackers time to develop if they even develop at all..We have 5 other  rounds in the draft to focus solely on defense as well as free agency.....I doubt Pittsburgh or Dallas are kicking themselves wishing they had taken a CB instead of Bell or Elliott. ..For every David Johnson or Alfred Morris, there are 10 Kenyan Drakes or Josh Robinsons'....Can you see the forest through the trees yet?

To the bolded: it works both ways.  They could easily be another Trent Richardson while the OLB could have a Freeney impact. There are two valid sides to this argument. Honestly, Grigs has wasted a first rounder on a RB and OLB, so it's going to be interesting if he goes either route.

[NewColtsFan]

35 minutes ago, jshipp23 said:

Let me put this in metaphorical form in the hope you and others can understand my position...The odds of Fournette or Cook making an Elliot or Laveon Bell impact on our team are much higher then say taking an OLB at 15..That OLB could easily be another Dion Jordan or Mingo and basically be a bust...I seriously doubt Fournette or Cook bust unless they get hurt...If we get Cook or Fournette we are a top 5 offense and will average 30 points a game and will allow our defense to rest and play with the lead which has a major impact on defense..Also, if we average 30 a game we are in every ballgame much like the Manning era Colts...It usually takes linebackers time to develop if they even develop at all..We have 5 other  rounds in the draft to focus solely on defense as well as free agency.....I doubt Pittsburgh or Dallas are kicking themselves wishing they had taken a CB instead of Bell or Elliott. ..For every David Johnson or Alfred Morris, there are 10 Kenyan Drakes or Josh Robinsons'....Can you see the forest through the trees yet?

 

For the record,  you and I have already had this conversation....    and it wasn't that long ago...

 

I've already said that if the Colts wind up taking Fournette or Cook,  I'll be OK with that.    They're clearly worth the pick.

 

But,  I strongly suspect that we won't get the chance....   that both will be taken before it's our turn.   

 

And that will allow us to take the best defensive player available which is what I hope for.

 

I don't think there's another RB worth using the 14/15 overall pick on.    

 

So, I hope we go defense......

 

 

[Andrew Luck fan club]

1 hour ago, jshipp23 said:

Let me put this in metaphorical form in the hope you and others can understand my position...The odds of Fournette or Cook making an Elliot or Laveon Bell impact on our team are much higher then say taking an OLB at 15..That OLB could easily be another Dion Jordan or Mingo and basically be a bust...I seriously doubt Fournette or Cook bust unless they get hurt...If we get Cook or Fournette we are a top 5 offense and will average 30 points a game and will allow our defense to rest and play with the lead which has a major impact on defense..Also, if we average 30 a game we are in every ballgame much like the Manning era Colts...It usually takes linebackers time to develop if they even develop at all..We have 5 other  rounds in the draft to focus solely on defense as well as free agency.....I doubt Pittsburgh or Dallas are kicking themselves wishing they had taken a CB instead of Bell or Elliott. ..For every David Johnson or Alfred Morris, there are 10 Kenyan Drakes or Josh Robinsons'....Can you see the forest through the trees yet?

I just don't know how you think that. I don't understand taking a skill position again in the 1st, when we just ranked 31st in secondary and 30th in front seven. So your plan to win games is to always be scoring 30 points? Come on man. I'm using my crystal ball right now and it's saying there's not a chance in hell we draft a halfback 1st round. 

[Andrew Luck fan club]

In Kiper’s mock draft there’s a whopping 10 defensive backs projected in the first round, with six cornerbacks and four safeties. That would be a record amount, topping the nine defensive backs taken in the first round of the 2014 NFL draft

Record amount, I'd say amazing lol

[jshipp23]

48 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

For the record,  you and I have already had this conversation....    and it wasn't that long ago...

 

I've already said that if the Colts wind up taking Fournette or Cook,  I'll be OK with that.    They're clearly worth the pick.

 

But,  I strongly suspect that we won't get the chance....   that both will be taken before it's our turn.   

 

And that will allow us to take the best defensive player available which is what I hope for.

 

I don't think there's another RB worth using the 14/15 overall pick on.    

 

So, I hope we go defense......

 

 

I agree if they aren't there..

[Andrew Luck fan club]

1 minute ago, jshipp23 said:

I agree if they aren't there..

We aren't taking them anyway jship! Lol I won't let it happen!

[krunk]

Gimme Tak Mckinley!

[jshipp23]

21 minutes ago, Majin Vegeta said:

I just don't know how you think that. I don't understand taking a skill position again in the 1st, when we just ranked 31st in secondary and 30th in front seven. So your plan to win games is to always be scoring 30 points? Come on man. I'm using my crystal ball right now and it's saying there's not a chance in hell we draft a halfback 1st round. 

Man we got all our other picks and free agency to get defense...Im not saying to pick all offense I just want to use a 1st or 2nd on Fournette, Cook or McCafferey, Foreman..If they aren't there Im with ya,  go defense defense defense and ride out another year with old man Gore and Turbin and hope we are in position to get a great RB like Saquon Barkley next year..

[Andrew Luck fan club]

1 minute ago, jshipp23 said:

Man we got all our other picks and free agency to get defense...Im not saying to pick all offense I just want to use a 1st or 2nd on Fournette, Cook or McCafferey, Foreman..If they aren't there Im with ya,  go defense defense defense and ride out another year with old man Gore and Turbin and hope we are in position to get a great RB like Saquon Barkley next year..

We really need FA to get here, things will get a lot easier then. And you got me loving that Barkley..

[krunk]

Oh we gon take a back this year.  One of these rounds.  I like the Williams kid Defjamz posted about.

[jshipp23]

1 hour ago, CheezyColt said:

To the bolded: it works both ways.  They could easily be another Trent Richardson while the OLB could have a Freeney impact. There are two valid sides to this argument. Honestly, Grigs has wasted a first rounder on a RB and OLB, so it's going to be interesting if he goes either route.

Everybody brings up trich...Other than him name some other 1st round backs that BUSTED in last 5 years? I can give you a giant list of linebackers or cornerbacks or defensive linemen etc etc...The odds of a first round rb busting are much slimmer than any other position because they are special players to be considered in the first..That is my point..