Let's give Grigs some appreciation

[Jason_]

He actually continued to start games until week 16, the Dallas game.  So the coaching staff continued to give him the start and he continued to have a decent number of touches.  A competent coaching staff does not continue to give a guy starts and touches when he's embarrassingly inept, yet ours did.  A lot of the blame for Richardson's poor contributions should go to the coaching staff, in my opinion.  Take him out of the game so he can't affect it with his horrible, painful-to-watch play

 

who cares who got the "start"?  As the bye week approached, Trent's touches were going down and Boom's were going up.  After the bye week, Boom began carrying more and more of the load.  You're also acting like they had a plethora of other options at RB.  If I recall, it was Trent, Boom and Tipton.  Did we have anyone else? 

 

I'd agree with you about blaming the coaching staff if they kept giving him 15-20+ carries per game, every week while not giving carries to the other RBs on the roster.  Neither of those things happened though.

[21isSuperman]

who cares who got the "start"?  As the bye week approached, Trent's touches were going down and Boom's were going up.  After the bye week, Boom began carrying more and more of the load.  You're also acting like they had a plethora of other options at RB.  If I recall, it was Trent, Boom and Tipton.  Did we have anyone else? 

 

I'd agree with you about blaming the coaching staff if they kept giving him 15-20+ carries per game, every week while not giving carries to the other RBs on the roster.  Neither of those things happened though.

Post bye week carries:

Pats' game:

Richardson - 6

Bradshaw - 7

 

Jacksonville:

Richardson - 13

Herron - 12

 

Redskins:

Richardson - 8

Herron - 8

 

Cleveland:

Richardson - 7

Herron - 8

 

Even a month after the bye, the coaches weren't giving Richardson the substantially fewer carries he had earned.  I understand the coaches may not have been confident in Herron's ball security.  But Tipton could have received some more reps. Even with his fumbling, I'd rather give Herron more carries than splitting them 50/50

[Jason_]

Post bye week carries:

Pats' game:

Richardson - 6

Bradshaw - 7

 

Jacksonville:

Richardson - 13

Herron - 12

 

Redskins:

Richardson - 8

Herron - 8

 

Cleveland:

Richardson - 7

Herron - 8

 

Even a month after the bye, the coaches weren't giving Richardson the substantially fewer carries he had earned.  I understand the coaches may not have been confident in Herron's ball security.  But Tipton could have received some more reps. Even with his fumbling, I'd rather give Herron more carries than splitting them 50/50

 

How do you know Tipton had a full grasp of the playbook?  Bottom line, I think you're making a much bigger deal about this regarding blaming the coaching staff than is necessary or warranted.  There were not a lot of options and they gradually phased Richardson out of the game and released him. 

[BOTT]

There's no way that anyone, including yourself, knew that that trade was going to pan out the way that it did. It was early in the season, the backfield was plagued by injuries, and desperate for a runningback. Grigson was in a tight spot and pulled the trigger. Regardless, the team was still able to make it deeper in the playoffs each season despite Richardson's woes in the backfield. Are you really holding a grudge over it?

Except that I said it was a horrible trade when it was announced. So yeah, I did kinda know.

No, I'm not holding a grudge. Another forum member started a thread and asked for opinions on the subject and I answered. Forums are neat.

[BOTT]

Not every move a GM makes will be perfect.  Trent's trade didn't work out, but it made sense at the time it was made.  Grigs took the worst team in the league and has taken us to the playoffs each year he's been here.  We are now a legitimate superbowl contender just 4  years after we were the laughing stock of the league.  Good job, Grigs.

 

 

It made sense at the time.  Ballard went out for the season.  Bradshaw was always injury prone.  Donnie Brown wasn't the back Pagano wanted in our system.  Sure the trade didn't work out, but we were stretched very thin at RB and needed to find someone.  That was a big gamble, but Trent showed promise on a crappy CLE team as a rookie and was dominant in college -- he regressed after he got here, but the trade made sense to me at the time.

 

 

Can you name any games in particular where Trent single-handedly cost us the game?  Last year, we got down to Denver and couldn't come back.  We should have beaten Philly but Luck threw a pick in the redzone near the end of the game.  We got throttled by Pittsburgh, NE, and Dallas -- blow out games where it wouldn't have mattered if Adrian Peterson, Marshawn Lynch or DeMarco Murray was in our backfield.   Not Richardson's fault.

 

2013 we got throttled by the Bengals, Cardinals, and Rams.  We lost to Miami in a game Richardson didn't play in and we got beaten in a pretty crappy game vs. San Diego.

 

What worries me most about this team, which is part of the reason Irsay said he was holding off on giving Pags a contract extension, is we simply don't show up some weeks.  Trent had some poor games, but I don't think it's fair to say we lost any games solely due to him.

Tading a #1 for a RB never makes sense. I watched TRich in Cleveland.....he wasn't promising. I really don't know what Grigson was watching......or he just stuck to his college evaluation of him.

[southwest1]

Oh my bad. In Grigson we trust, pagano for president, blah blah blah

I won't lie. I did burst out laughing when I read your post BOTT. Grigs isn't the best at drafting defensive guys. Ever since you said that, I was like man BOTT's right. He always tries to get some veteran in free agency with a couple of years left. 

 

Me? I just try to tune out Grigs's double speak press conferences which tell me nothing more or less similar to how NE LB Tedy Bruschi would close his eyes as Peyton Manning shouted dummy calls at the line of scrimmage. 

 

Ryan is good at bringing in talent all year round so I will cut him some slack even though he can't pick a defensive game changer out of college to save his life. It is what it is...

[CoachLite]

There is so much going on behind the scenes that an evaluation of Ryan Grigson, alone, is difficult to impossible. From some of his interviews, he seems to really understand what is going on.

But, that said, there are some unusual decisions coming out of the front office, scouting and coaching staff (and maybe ownership is slightly in that mix, too). A learning opportunity? Perhaps. This season should give us some answers. -- Sun Tzu's son.

[southwest1]

All I know for sure is this: Our former GM Bill Polian looked often at athletes from the Midwest like Iowa & Wisconsin while our current GM Ryan Grigson likes Stanford guys or playmakers with a Miami pedigree. 

 

I sincerely hope that this is the year gets to & wins the Big one. Time will tell I guess. 

[21isSuperman]

How do you know Tipton had a full grasp of the playbook?  Bottom line, I think you're making a much bigger deal about this regarding blaming the coaching staff than is necessary or warranted.  There were not a lot of options and they gradually phased Richardson out of the game and released him. 

It still wouldn't have hurt to give him a shot, even if he didn't completely know the playbook.  He wouldn't have gone in knowing absolutely nothing.  Regardless, it's done with now

[crazycolt1]

This was a give Grigs a little credit thread? Now it has turned into a bash TRIch and the coaching staff. I thought by now that TRich was old news and we could move on but I see people wont let things go. IMO that is one big whine. It's all old news and I think all angles have been covered.

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

This was a give Grigs a little credit thread? Now it has turned into a bash TRIch and the coaching staff. I thought by now that TRich was old news and we could move on but I see people wont let things go. IMO that is one big whine. It's all old news and I think all angles have been covered.

I agree, but that slow moving, no power stack of waste set us back a couple of years in building

a dominant team. The first rd pick we gave for him and the years to prove himself were a waste

of time and resources.

[ColtsFanMikeC]

Tading a #1 for a RB never makes sense. I watched TRich in Cleveland.....he wasn't promising. I really don't know what Grigson was watching......or he just stuck to his college evaluation of him.

 

We were trading a #1 (late round) for the previous year's #3 overall pick.  I tend to agree with you, it's not a great idea to trade high picks for RBs (unless they are extremely rare like AP).  That said, we needed RB help desperately and TRich was very well thought of (why he was the #3 overall pick) coming out of college -- he had a pretty good year (not great) but showed signs of stardom in Cleveland.  Hindsight may be 20/20 and we all know the trade ultimately failed -- but I can see why Grigs did it.  TRich seemed to fit the mold of what Grigs/Pags have envisioned -- a power back with hands.  Maybe we will have that with Josh Robinson after he has a little while to learn from Gore.

[BOTT]

We were trading a #1 (late round) for the previous year's #3 overall pick.  I tend to agree with you, it's not a great idea to trade high picks for RBs (unless they are extremely rare like AP).  That said, we needed RB help desperately and TRich was very well thought of (why he was the #3 overall pick) coming out of college -- he had a pretty good year (not great) but showed signs of stardom in Cleveland.  Hindsight may be 20/20 and we all know the trade ultimately failed -- but I can see why Grigs did it.  TRich seemed to fit the mold of what Grigs/Pags have envisioned -- a power back with hands.  Maybe we will have that with Josh Robinson after he has a little while to learn from Gore.

I really like Robinson......what I have seen of him anyway.

[GoColts8818]

It still wouldn't have hurt to give him a shot, even if he didn't completely know the playbook.  He wouldn't have gone in knowing absolutely nothing.  Regardless, it's done with now

Yeah but if you put a guy in who doesn't completely know the playbook it limits what you can call.  It also impacts the passing game as a lot of times the running back is kept in to block.  I'd take Trent at least knowing the play than Tipton not knowing the play to protect Luck even it meant a weaker running game. 

 

Like you said it's done now.  The Colts have clearly acknowledged that the running attack was broken based on the moves they have made.  Hopefully it's better this year, that's all we can really hope for.

[GoColts8818]

This was a give Grigs a little credit thread? Now it has turned into a bash TRIch and the coaching staff. I thought by now that TRich was old news and we could move on but I see people wont let things go. IMO that is one big whine. It's all old news and I think all angles have been covered.

I agree, Grigson made a bad trade.  It wasn't the first and wont be the last.  Still it's that moxy that lead him to make that trade that also lead him to make the trade for Davis.  Not every move he is going to make is going to work.  That's a fact for any General Manager ever in any sport so there is always going to be mistakes to point to and say see this didn't work. 

 

So you have to look at the overall product and in three years the Colts have gone from a 2-14 team who was clearly aging without much talent to a team that has progressed every year where it counts the most in the playoffs and is a loaded team with a tone of younger talent.  Not to shabby.  He's done a fantastic job and people who say other wise are the ones who want to see the negative and focus only on that. 

[crazycolt1]

I agree, but that slow moving, no power stack of waste set us back a couple of years in building

a dominant team. The first rd pick we gave for him and the years to prove himself were a waste

of time and resources.

Set us back a couple of years in building a dominant team? You are way over reacting. I would say the Colts are already a dominate team and have been since Grigson took the job. Luck has helped that happen but he hasn't done it without the players that Grigson brought in with him. Trading a very late #1 for a #3 overall was not that big a gamble at the time. I cant think of any forum fan that thought is was a bad deal when it went down including myself. So you want to overlook everything good that Grigson has done over the TRich deal and harp over old news? Get over it.

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

Set us back a couple of years in building a dominant team? You are way over reacting. I would say the Colts are already a dominate team and have been since Grigson took the job. Luck has helped that happen but he hasn't done it without the players that Grigson brought in with him. Trading a very late #1 for a #3 overall was not that big a gamble at the time. I cant think of any forum fan that thought is was a bad deal when it went down including myself. So you want to overlook everything good that Grigson has done over the TRich deal and harp over old news? Get over it.

I don't have a problem with Grigs as long as the lines have improved in the off season and yes, there

is talent in the late first round that could be a starter in this league.

 

Floundering around for two years waiting for him to blossom did set us back some and the inability to

stay healthy for the other RB's didn't help any.

[Jason_]

Set us back a couple of years in building a dominant team? You are way over reacting. I would say the Colts are already a dominate team and have been since Grigson took the job. Luck has helped that happen but he hasn't done it without the players that Grigson brought in with him. Trading a very late #1 for a #3 overall was not that big a gamble at the time. I cant think of any forum fan that thought is was a bad deal when it went down including myself. So you want to overlook everything good that Grigson has done over the TRich deal and harp over old news? Get over it.

 

Just to clarify, there were a lot of people that thought it was a bad deal when it went down..myself included.  I was excited about the prospect of adding Trent Richardson to our already explosive offense, but the cost of a first round pick was too much for pretty much any RB imo, and in the opinions of many others.  I don't think there were many, if any, people that predicted how bad he would suck once he got here, but there were a lot of people not happy about the idea of giving up a first round pick for him.

[FanFromtheWasteland]

Reliving the T Rich experiment makes me want to Thanks guys.

It's like that annoying fly that just won't go away

[crazycolt1]

I don't have a problem with Grigs as long as the lines have improved in the off season and yes, there

is talent in the late first round that could be a starter in this league.

 

Floundering around for two years waiting for him to blossom did set us back some and the inability to

stay healthy for the other RB's didn't help any.

I understand that but to keep dwelling on that does no good. The Colts cut bait and have moved on. Some haven't. At the time the trade was made the team was hurting bad at RB. He made a gut call and it didn't work out. So what? Not every trade or signing is going to work out and this one didn't. The thread is titled Let's give Grigs some appreciation, not let's whine about old news.

[crazycolt1]

Just to clarify, there were a lot of people that thought it was a bad deal when it went down..myself included.  I was excited about the prospect of adding Trent Richardson to our already explosive offense, but the cost of a first round pick was too much for pretty much any RB imo, and in the opinions of many others.  I don't think there were many, if any, people that predicted how bad he would suck once he got here, but there were a lot of people not happy about the idea of giving up a first round pick for him.

So what are we gonna do? Hear about this for another 2 to 5 years? It was a bad trade. It happens in the NFL and the Colts are not the only team that have made an error in judgment. The name of the thread is Let's give Grigson some appreciation, not whine about spilled milk. What more can be said or whined about that we haven't already heard over and over? I do understand what you said but what use is it at this point?

[ColtStronger]

Eagles loss was on Pep not knowing when to throw the ball and when to run it

Could also blame the refs for the blown call on the GW int from Jenkins but still, mostly Pep fault

The loss can definitely be blamed on the refs...  Landry's (non) horsecollar  TY (non) PI and I believe there was one more, but Pep didn't help the matter.  He didn't lose the game though!!

[ColtStronger]

Get off Grigs back about the trade already.  It was more of a OL problem (Herron wasn't so stellar either, neither was Tipton), rather than a bad trade! 

[Jason_]

So what are we gonna do? Hear about this for another 2 to 5 years? It was a bad trade. It happens in the NFL and the Colts are not the only team that have made an error in judgment. The name of the thread is Let's give Grigson some appreciation, not whine about spilled milk. What more can be said or whined about that we haven't already heard over and over? I do understand what you said but what use is it at this point?

 

I agree with all of that.  My only point was that you were incorrect when you said that no one had a problem with the trade when it happened.  That was not true.  Continuing to dwell on it is pointless though...I agree with you there.

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

I understand that but to keep dwelling on that does no good. The Colts cut bait and have moved on. Some haven't. At the time the trade was made the team was hurting bad at RB. He made a gut call and it didn't work out. So what? Not every trade or signing is going to work out and this one didn't. The thread is titled Let's give Grigs some appreciation, not let's whine about old news.

, fair enough.

[Defjamz26]

Set us back a couple of years in building a dominant team? You are way over reacting. I would say the Colts are already a dominate team and have been since Grigson took the job. Luck has helped that happen but he hasn't done it without the players that Grigson brought in with him. Trading a very late #1 for a #3 overall was not that big a gamble at the time. I cant think of any forum fan that thought is was a bad deal when it went down including myself. So you want to overlook everything good that Grigson has done over the TRich deal and harp over old news? Get over it.

Yeah. The first round is where you usually get impact players. The Colts could have gotten a key contributor that could have had tremendous impact. Instead we got nothing from Richardson.

See we traded a second for Vontae and got more production than any person we would have drafted could have given. That's the goal when you trade away a high round pick. When you don't get high level production that's when the pick is considered a bust.

So yeah, you could argue the pick set us years back.

[crazycolt1]

Yeah. The first round is where you usually get impact players. The Colts could have gotten a key contributor that could have had tremendous impact. Instead we got nothing from Richardson.

See we traded a second for Vontae and got more production than any person we would have drafted could have given. That's the goal when you trade away a high round pick. When you don't get high level production that's when the pick is considered a bust.

So yeah, you could argue the pick set us years back.

Years? You over react much?

[southwest1]

It's like that annoying fly that just won't go away

There, I immobilized it. Can we move on now? I'm over Trent Richardson. He's Jack Del Rio's problem now. Thank God...

 

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

There, I immobilized it. Can we move on now? I'm over Trent Richardson. He's Jack Del Rio's problem now. Thank God...

 

Somebody actually picked him up after we let him go?

[Chucklez]

Somebody actually picked him up after we let him go?

Yeah he is a Raider now.... LOL

[Defjamz26]

Years? You over react much?

I wasn't talking like 5-6 years, but more like 2-3. One player can greatly improve one aspect of a team. Enough to make that team more competitive. There are certain positions that can do that.

Lets say for example, the Colts don't trade for Richardson, and instead they get Dominique Easely or Rashede Hageman, both defensive line players. Neither one of them had made a huge splash because of the situations, but if you put them on the Colts they likely come in and help improve the run D, which may make the overall D, and team better.

Obviously this is all hypothetical, and hindsight is always 20/20, there is no sure thing when it comes to the draft,etc.... But the point of that example is that drafting the right player can put your team ahead of schedule. Without Suh, the Lions would never have been as competitive as they've been lately.

[crazycolt1]

I wasn't talking like 5-6 years, but more like 2-3. One player can greatly improve one aspect of a team. Enough to make that team more competitive. There are certain positions that can do that.

Lets say for example, the Colts don't trade for Richardson, and instead they get Dominique Easely or Rashede Hageman, both defensive line players. Neither one of them had made a huge splash because of the situations, but if you put them on the Colts they likely come in and help improve the run D, which may make the overall D, and team better.

Obviously this is all hypothetical, and hindsight is always 20/20, there is no sure thing when it comes to the draft,etc.... But the point of that example is that drafting the right player can put your team ahead of schedule. Without Suh, the Lions would never have been as competitive as they've been lately.

Big difference between where Suh was taken than at the end of the first round. Just saying. Grigson took a gamble. It didn't work. It is not the end of the world and not worth whining about for 2 years like it has become. All GMs hit and miss on every move they make. This move was made because of the injuries to the RBs. The title to the thread is not lets jump on Grigson and run him out of town because the TRich trade didn't work out. The Colts have cut bait and moved on so why cant some fans do the same? It's OLD news and we all know the result. To keep harping on it changes nothing. There have been a long history of 1st round draft picks that have never lived up to expectations. Exactly what you said. Hindsight is 20-20.