manziel or RG3

[dw49]

Arians had to use Moore's system being on the same team, right?  However, both are from the Air Coryell tree anyway, right? They have similar offensive views.  So while Peyton's OC was Moore, the Arians was part of that philosophy. And Manning enjoyed that under Moore (and Arians). But thanks for making the Moore factoid the focal point when the posts in the thread were totally illustrating something else; that your correction did not dispute.  despite your quips about Peyton's quotes being goof

 

 

Yeah , Arains used Moore's system for the 3 years he was on the Colt staff , otherwise he would have been shown the door. I don't know what "tree " they are from. I know Arians will have a downfield passing attack no matter what. I remember Tom More as a guy that utilized Peyton Manning's skills. Air Coryell tree... gosh I don't know. Most of these guys coach and scheme to move the ball through the air. Ya know... all I did was say that Manning never played under an "Arians offense." I didn't make a huge deal out of it. You found it necessary to defend your mistake and just casually toss in that it was not a relevant correction. I get corrected all the time on this forum. It's just the nature of the beast. When I see that i misspoke or maybe misquoted or read a stat wrong ... I say my bad and thanks. Look.. I realize your a board monitor and are probably trying to goad me into something but it's not going to happen. Adois...

[ColtsBlueFL]

Yeah , Arains used Moore's system for the 3 years he was on the Colt staff , otherwise he would have been shown the door. I don't know what "tree " they are from. I know Arians will have a downfield passing attack no matter what. I remember Tom More as a guy that utilized Peyton Manning's skills. Air Coryell tree... gosh I don't know. Most of these guys coach and scheme to move the ball through the air. Ya know... all I did was say that Manning never played under an "Arians offense." I didn't make a huge deal out of it. You found it necessary to defend your mistake and just casually toss in that it was not a relevant correction. I get corrected all the time on this forum. It's just the nature of the beast. When I see that i misspoke or maybe misquoted or read a stat wrong ... I say my bad and thanks. Look.. I realize your a board monitor and are probably trying to goad me into something but it's not going to happen. Adois...

 

My first words to you were that's " True." I had  acknowledged. Again, Tom Moore was Peyton's OC and Arians 'just' his QB coach. I'll repeat, you are right on that point.  Good now?

[dw49]

My first words to you were that's " True." I had  acknowledged. Again, Tom Moore was Peyton's OC and Arians 'just' his QB coach. I'll repeat, you are right on that point.  Good now?

 

 

LOL. Of coarse I was right on that point . I was responding to all the nonsense that followed that with the remark that it wasn't relevant and all the poop you put up explaining why it wasn't relevant.  Other words in case you don't understand... just say opps and leave out all the other stuff you wasted our time with. You good now ?

[ColtsBlueFL]

Technically correct, and i agreed, but  not a point breaker as Arians worked under Moore with Peyton, then later Moore worked under Arians with Palmer..  their systems and philosophies tied to one another and stemmed from the same coaching tree. The main point of discussion was not who's name was on the system but how players felt playing under Arians as a coach.  i acknowledged your point, then tried to direct back or tie back in to the point of focus of the mentioned QB's playing with Arians and how they felt discussion. If you don't wish to participate or debate in that part of the discussion, fine, don't respond to it {being just poop and nonsesnse}.  Now I'm good.

[dw49]

Good to know your OK champ and thanks for all this inside dope on which QB's love which coaches. Also the I found the great research you did on the Air Coryall "coaching tree " very helpful in my understanding coaching trees and which coaches are from the same mold.. or would they be considered derivatives from the tree ? Now I'm good too. 

[amfootball]

Sorry Jack but a guy that;s been benched in his 3rd year of the league is in real trouble going into the last year of his contract. If he goes on to be a great QB .. of coarse he's not a bust . But at this point in his career , being benched for a back up QB on a 3-7 team , he qualifies a a bust .. a huge bust. Can he reverse this .. yes. Will he ..doubt it.

I am not sure you are giving enough consideration to just how bad the Redskins are as an organization. Remember they gave up all those picks to get RG and then fired Shanny and brought in Jay Gruden. Jay. Gruden. Awful hire IMO which I said at the time he was hired. Now granted RG has been bad but what he showed in his rookie season was pretty good so I think he does have the goods in the right system just like every other QB. Somehow Mark Sanchez overcame his butt fumble legacy and is poised to lead the Eagles to the East title. I think RG could succeed somewhere else in the right situation. He is a "bust" in DC for sure but his career could rebound.

[dw49]

I am not sure you are giving enough consideration to just how bad the Redskins are as an organization. Remember they gave up all those picks to get RG and then fired Shanny and brought in Jay Gruden. Jay. Gruden. Awful hire IMO which I said at the time he was hired. Now granted RG has been bad but what he showed in his rookie season was pretty good so I think he does have the goods in the right system just like every other QB. Somehow Mark Sanchez overcame his butt fumble legacy and is poised to lead the Eagles to the East title. I think RG could succeed somewhere else in the right situation. He is a "bust" in DC for sure but his career could rebound.

 

 

Sure he could but forget year one because that offense is done in the NFL. Strange how the talking heads said it was indefensible and two years later RG3 is benched for Colt McCoy and Kapernick is struggling mightily. What's troubling about RG3 is every part of his game looks terrible right now. Plus there are big questions about his work ethic and leadership. But I have absolutely no problem with what you have as you say right now he is a bust in DC. If he works hard and is lucky enough to hook on with the right team , you could see him climb off the garbage heap in I'd guess 2016.

[amfootball]

Sure he could but forget year one because that offense is done in the NFL. Strange how the talking heads said it was indefensible and two years later RG3 is benched for Colt McCoy and Kapernick is struggling mightily. What's troubling about RG3 is every part of his game looks terrible right now. Plus there are big questions about his work ethic and leadership. But I have absolutely no problem with what you have as you say right now he is a bust in DC. If he works hard and is lucky enough to hook on with the right team , you could see him climb off the garbage heap in I'd guess 2016.

Apparently Chip Kelly's system is plug and play for any QB. I guess we will see what could work for RG.

 

Do you think a team will trade for him to be a starter? I think not. I think he may be a back up like Sanchez.

[dw49]

Apparently Chip Kelly's system is plug and play for any QB. I guess we will see what could work for RG.

 

Do you think a team will trade for him to be a starter? I think not. I think he may be a back up like Sanchez.

 

 

Gosh... what team and where on the depth chart RG finds himself starting 2015 to me is no less than intriguing. What does Washington do ? To me looks like a 4th and 25 and they have to just punt RG away. I'm of the belief that Gruden has pretty much ended all chances of RG3 succeeding in Washington. He really just tossed RG under a train (forget a bus) and I can't believe RG3 would ever resign (contract up 2015) with him the head coach. I thought his play was borderline atrocious but I still don't think Gruden had to say he had a big mouth and then pretty much say he's horrible. Did he really need to say he has terrible footwork , terrible pocket presence and wasn't finding receivers running open. I mean .. God what's left ? Other than taking the snap . he said he stunk at everything. 

 

Do I think a team will trade for him as a starter ? By that you have to mean maybe a team like Tenn. bringing him in to compete with Mettenberger ? That's possible. But if you mean something like St Louis letting Bradford go and signing RG3 with the intent of him being the favorite to start... I would say right around zero chance. 

[amfootball]

Gosh... what team and where on the depth chart RG finds himself starting 2015 to me is no less than intriguing. What does Washington do ? To me looks like a 4th and 25 and they have to just punt RG away. I'm of the belief that Gruden has pretty much ended all chances of RG3 succeeding in Washington. He really just tossed RG under a train (forget a bus) and I can't believe RG3 would ever resign (contract up 2015) with him the head coach. I thought his play was borderline atrocious but I still don't think Gruden had to say he had a big mouth and then pretty much say he's horrible. Did he really need to say he has terrible footwork , terrible pocket presence and wasn't finding receivers running open. I mean .. God what's left ? Other than taking the snap . he said he stunk at everything. 

 

Do I think a team will trade for him as a starter ? By that you have to mean maybe a team like Tenn. bringing him in to compete with Mettenberger ? That's possible. But if you mean something like St Louis letting Bradford go and signing RG3 with the intent of him being the favorite to start... I would say right around zero chance. 

Gruden's tirade was the worst I have ever heard a HC lambast any player, forget a franchize QB. Not sure he is long for DC either but what else is new in the nations capital?

 

I agree about RG. His best bet would be to get behind a solid starter so he could learn and be somewhat sheltered from the media. I think that helped Sanchez a lot. He had to get away from NY and Ryan and that mess and Chip Kelly was the perfect landing place for him behind Foles.

[jvan1973]

both will still be on the bench this week

[Qwiz]

Thanks. Actually, I have been mostly pleased with my guys. The defense has played better than I ever expected. Some of our young guys are playing very well (Xavier Rhodes, Harrison Smith, and Sharif Floyd). Last week, we played an all-around solid game -- offense, defense, & special teams. We blocked two punts for scores. Teddy is coming along...I just wish the coaching staff would let him throw more. We don't have much of a running game but we all know what happened there.

Returning to the topic... Manziel is not going anywhere. So, RG3 will be the first of the two to start for a new team. Your suggestion of Arizona is a good one. It would be interesting to see him go to the Rams who received all the draft picks for RG3. Jeff Fisher went to the Super Bowl with the late Steve McNair... It is just a thought.

Yeah, they are starting to come together. They are going to be a force to reckon with after another offseason together, and with Teddy having an offseason preparing as the starter after having plenty of game experience on his plate. The arrow is pointing up.

But yeah it would be poetic justice if Griff ended up with the Rams. They would have definitely won that 2012 Draft lol.

[jvan1973]

Yeah, they are starting to come together. They are going to be a force to reckon with after another offseason together, and with Teddy having an offseason preparing as the starter after having plenty of game experience on his plate. The arrow is pointing up.

But yeah it would be poetic justice if Griff ended up with the Rams. They would have definitely won that 2012 Draft lol.

they didn't end up with Luck or Wilson so they didn't win the draft. But they certainty got over on the redskins, that's for sure

[Qwiz]

they didn't end up with Luck or Wilson so they didn't win the draft. But they certainty got over on the redskins, that's for sure

That's kind of what I meant, they would have won the Draft deal between the two teams.

[jvan1973]

That's kind of what I meant, they would have won the Draft deal between the two teams.

they already did

[Qwiz]

they already did

That's debateable. As far as we know Colt could end up back on the bench or the situation can be reevaluated by season's end and Griffin could be starting again next season.

[jvan1973]

That's debateable. As far as we know Colt could end up back on the bench or the situation can be reevaluated by season's end and Griffin could be starting again next season.

He isnt good, second year in a row he ended up on the bench without an injury

[Qwiz]

He isnt good, second year in a row he ended up on the bench without an injury

You already know why he was benched last year...to protect the franchise. There was no need in him getting hurt when the season was already lost, coupled in with the fact that he and Shanahan didn't get along so well.

[jvan1973]

You already know why he was benched last year...to protect the franchise. There was no need in him getting hurt when the season was already lost, coupled in with the fact that he and Shanahan didn't get along so well.

So if the season is lost teams bench their starters? Please tell me any other team that employs that philosophy.

[Qwiz]

So if the season is lost teams bench their starters? Please tell me any other team that employs that philosophy.

Well this is in the other direction but Peyton Manning, for one. I'm sure you remember that.

[jvan1973]

Well this is in the other direction but Peyton Manning, for one. I'm sure you remember that.

when was Manning ever benched when they were eliminated from the playoffs? The colts had two losing while he was here. He played all 16 games those seasons ( not counting the neck surgery season)

[Qwiz]

when was Manning ever benched when they were eliminated from the playoffs? The colts had two losing while he was here. He played all 16 games those seasons ( not counting the neck surgery season)

No, that's why I said the opposite direction. As in, season is over, no need to be perfect, so a dismantling by the Jets ensues...in any case, players getting benched to minimize injury risk isn't something new.

[jvan1973]

No, that's why I said the opposite direction. As in, season is over, no need to be perfect, so a dismantling by the Jets ensues...in any case, players getting benched to minimize injury risk isn't something new.

for teams with their playoff seeding already determined. Not for teams eliminated from the playoffs. Only poor performance gets you benched in those scenarios

[Qwiz]

for teams with their playoff seeding already determined. Not for teams eliminated from the playoffs. Only poor performance gets you benched in those scenarios

Says who? And it is no secret that Shanahan and Robert clashed like Titans. He knew he would be losing his job and decided to go out "strong" I suppose.

[jvan1973]

Says who? And it is no secret that Shanahan and Robert clashed like Titans. He knew he would be losing his job and decided to go out "strong" I suppose.

It seems his current coach also wants nothing to do with him. Two offensive coaches in a row thinks he is garbage

[Qwiz]

It seems his current coach also wants nothing to do with him. Two offensive coaches in a row thinks he is garbage

Completely different system, completely different coach.

[jvan1973]

Completely different system, completely different coach.

exactly, and nether one thinks he is any good

[Qwiz]

exactly, and nether one thinks he is any good

Well, one guy got fired after watching Griffin play hurt through a whole season. I'm sure the next guy doesn't want to suffer the same fate and is getting rid of Robert ASAP lol.

[Defjamz26]

Manziel would probably start for the Cowboys since Jones seems to regret not drafting him. But I wonder if either of them will start anywhere else. When you can't beat out Brian Hoyer for a starting job, there is trouble. I can't believe all those people for the Browns FO watched all of the drama unfold with RGIII and still traded up for Manziel. When will people learn smh.