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Manning or Luck, who is the better leader?

tonychen

By tonychen
in NFL General

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tonychen Walk On

tonychen

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Mathis told people after Sunday's game that it was Colts as a team versus Manning and 52 men. It somewhat reminds me of Manning's days with Colts. As great as he was, and all fans love him, every time it felt like he was the only one held accountable when the team lose. More than ever he was that great Mr. Manning that people respect but don't get close with.

 

While Luck is like a close friend whom players love and are willing to fight extremely hard with. I have seen many times Wayne gave up on Manning's bad throws when he felt he could get hurt, while for Luck's throws he always goes full speed.

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IndyScribe Walk On

IndyScribe

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Obviously Manning right now.... for now

You can't compare Manning right now to Luck right now. Manning's obviously going to be better. He's been in the league longer. If you want to compare their 1st and 2nd year stats go ahead. I believe Luck can get to and will transcend Manning.

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tonychen Walk On

tonychen

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You can't compare Manning right now to Luck right now. Manning's obviously going to be better. He's been in the league longer. 

 

I know it is not even close on the pure football part, but emotionally Luck is a better motivator in my opinion. Players show more willingness to fight with him.

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tonychen Walk On

tonychen

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Oh, ok. That part I agree with.

 

I just see a lot of times when Manning loses a game it is him standing at the podium taking the responsibilities, and then media and fans point to mistakes made by this guy or that guy, like a failed coverage, a missed field goal, a fumble... For Luck's case it is always a team thing and even when they lose it never reaches individual's level. Never felt Colts was such a strong team except for the super bowl winning season.

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tonychen Walk On

tonychen

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Andrew.

 

He is more real to me and chill.. Peyton always seems at times to be too elite in stature for many many years....as if everyone around him plays and works for him and not with him.

 

Exactly my point. That is also why many times defense of special team players lost their focus since they were not playing with heart. Instead they were only doing a job and it was not a huge deal to lose the game and go home.

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Qwiz Practice Squad

Qwiz

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One of them is considered one of the greatest of all time and has led a franchise to the most consecutive winning seasons in history. The other is an up and coming second year guy. Come on now, these comparisons are just silly.

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IndyScribe Walk On

IndyScribe

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I just see a lot of times when Manning loses a game it is him standing at the podium taking the responsibilities, and then media and fans point to mistakes made by this guy or that guy, like a failed coverage, a missed field goal, a fumble... For Luck's case it is always a team thing and even when they lose it never reaches individual's level. Never felt Colts was such a strong team except for the super bowl winning season.

True. Luck even refers to wins as a team effort, like the Broncos win. His teammate's are feeling it to.

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IndyScribe Walk On

IndyScribe

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One of them is considered one of the greatest of all time and has led a franchise to the most consecutive winning seasons in history. The other is an up and coming second year guy. Come on now, these comparisons are just silly.

Up an coming guy who will one day surpass Manning.

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tonychen Walk On

tonychen

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No one can say that for sure. Statistically it's a pretty tough task and it's even harder to predict Super Bowl wins. We'll see one day.

 

Statistically I doubt Luck or anybody would be even close when they retire. But I do expect a couple of superbowl rings by Luck.

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supremecoltsfan300

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Well, first I disagree with notion that Peyton wasn't close to his teammates. Peyton was close to Reggie, Collie, Clark, Stokley, to name just a few.  And yes Peyton always stood up and took the blame when the team lost....that's what leaders are supposed to do. Peyton built a culture in Indy that still persists to this day...heck even Vinatieri said this before the Colts game in an interview.  Paraphrasing, he said that when everyone walks through those halls, it's like Peyton is still there.  There's a noticeable culture. 

 

That culture didn't exist before Peyton got to Indy.  And just look at the Broncos.  there is a very noticeable culture change there as well.  Guys work harder and have more focus for the game and do what they can to get better.  Peyton took the young wide receivers (decker, Thomas) and really helped them develop consistent route running. 

 

Do Peyton's teams seem to have a tendency for the players to look for Peyton to save the day? Absolutely.  But while that kind of sucks for Peyton, that's when you know you are a true leader.  When the going gets rough, everyone looks to you for answers and to get them through it.

 

Andrew is still young.  Has he shown leadership?  Absolutely.  But he still has a long way to go before he can be mentioned in the same breath as one of the greatest leaders the NFL has seen over the last two decades.

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Susie Q Walk On

Susie Q

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Well, first I disagree with notion that Peyton wasn't close to his teammates. Peyton was close to Reggie, Collie, Clark, Stokley, to name just a few.  And yes Peyton always stood up and took the blame when the team lost....that's what leaders are supposed to do. Peyton built a culture in Indy that still persists to this day...heck even Vinatieri said this before the Colts game in an interview.  Paraphrasing, he said that when everyone walks through those halls, it's like Peyton is still there.  There's a noticeable culture. 

 

That culture didn't exist before Peyton got to Indy.  And just look at the Broncos.  there is a very noticeable culture change there as well.  Guys work harder and have more focus for the game and do what they can to get better.  Peyton took the young wide receivers (decker, Thomas) and really helped them develop consistent route running. 

 

Do Peyton's teams seem to have a tendency for the players to look for Peyton to save the day? Absolutely.  But while that kind of sucks for Peyton, that's when you know you are a true leader.  When the going gets rough, everyone looks to you for answers and to get them through it.

 

Andrew is still young.  Has he shown leadership?  Absolutely.  But he still has a long way to go before he can be mentioned in the same breath as one of the greatest leaders the NFL has seen over the last two decades.

Thanks for one of the best post I have read in a long time.      :applause:   I agree with everything you said 100 %. :thmup:

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Fx Stryker Walk On

Fx Stryker

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Peyton is a control freak. Im pretty sure he has ocd. You had to walk around eggshells and demanded perfection on every play so people were afraid of him and depended more on him then on themselves.

Peyton is a control freak. Im pretty sure he has ocd. You had to walk around eggshells and demanded perfection on every play so people were afraid of him and depended more on him then on themselves.

I think I heard the commentators say something about that.

The eggshells comment was what Manning said the building was like when everyone was being cut.

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MAC Walk On

MAC

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Mathis told people after Sunday's game that it was Colts as a team versus Manning and 52 men. It somewhat reminds me of Manning's days with Colts. As great as he was, and all fans love him, every time it felt like he was the only one held accountable when the team lose. More than ever he was that great Mr. Manning that people respect but don't get close with.

 

While Luck is like a close friend whom players love and are willing to fight extremely hard with. I have seen many times Wayne gave up on Manning's bad throws when he felt he could get hurt, while for Luck's throws he always goes full speed.

Why do feel feel compelled to try so hard to elevate Luck at Peyton's expense? 

 

Your entire pretense is ridiculous, and the highlighted part is offensive.

 

The fact that Mathis's interview made it sound like he resented Peyton when he was on the Colts - after a game in which he pinned his arms and plowed him face first into the turf (which I view as an attempt to injure), and then didn't seek him out to shake is hand after the game - is something that reflects poorly on Mathis, not on Manning. It's not about Luck being a better leader, it's about Mathis having an attitude - something that anyone watching the postgame gathering noticed that Bethea (for example) clearly doesn't share.

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BOTT Walk On

BOTT

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Why do feel feel compelled to try so hard to elevate Luck at Peyton's expense? 

 

Your entire pretense is ridiculous, and the highlighted part is offensive.

 

The fact that Mathis's interview made it sound like he resented Peyton when he was on the Colts - after a game in which he pinned his arms and plowed him face first into the turf (which I view as an attempt to injure), and then didn't seek him out to shake is hand after the game - is something that reflects poorly on Mathis, not on Manning. It's not about Luck being a better leader, it's about Mathis having an attitude - something that anyone watching the postgame gathering noticed that Bethea (for example) clearly doesn't share.

.

Saying Mathis attempted to hurt Manning is a HUGE stretch

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jjcolts Walk On

jjcolts

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I am unusre why people start this thread.  Does it matter? Furthermore..I am not sure why I reply :)

 

All of a sudden, we have forgotten all that Manning has done, all the hard work he put in. HE NEVER QUIT. Now we are questioning his leadership.

Practicing with Garcon and young receivers ( I think Manning drove down to where Garcon was)... this is leadership.

 

Giving the game ball to Marvin after they broke some record...(forgot what it was) not whining to the Media about how unhappy he was when they were rested during the path to perfection.

Telling the fans to stand behind the team during this chaos.

Giving to the community.

Standing up for his brother (during one of the interviews)

 

LUCK - absolutely a great leader as well. You can just see it, it is natural.

 

So we had a great leader and have another one in the making.  Why do we need to justify who is better. 

 

Manning is in another team and Luck is here.  People act like they are both here and fighting for a job....

 

Thank you Irsay for not letting that happen...or we might have imploded by now

 

Lastly-- All Manning said about Mathis is what a great defensive guy he is...and Mathis throws a jab after his team just won.  Great culture you are starting Irsay.

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BOTT Walk On

BOTT

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I am unusre why people start this thread.  Does it matter? Furthermore..I am not sure why I reply :)

 

All of a sudden, we have forgotten all that Manning has done, all the hard work he put in. HE NEVER QUIT. Now we are questioning his leadership.

Practicing with Garcon and young receivers ( I think Manning drove down to where Garcon was)... this is leadership.

 

Giving the game ball to Marvin after they broke some record...(forgot what it was) not whining to the Media about how unhappy he was when they were rested during the path to perfection.

Telling the fans to stand behind the team during this chaos.

Giving to the community.

Standing up for his brother (during one of the interviews)

 

LUCK - absolutely a great leader as well. You can just see it, it is natural.

 

So we had a great leader and have another one in the making.  Why do we need to justify who is better. 

 

Manning is in another team and Luck is here.  People act like they are both here and fighting for a job....

 

Thank you Irsay for not letting that happen...or we might have imploded by now

 

Lastly-- All Manning said about Mathis is what a great defensive guy he is...and Mathis throws a jab after his team just won.  Great culture you are starting Irsay.

I agree about the great culture....good job jimmy!

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House Walk On

House

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I am unusre why people start this thread. Does it matter? Furthermore..I am not sure why I reply :)

All of a sudden, we have forgotten all that Manning has done, all the hard work he put in. HE NEVER QUIT. Now we are questioning his leadership.

Practicing with Garcon and young receivers ( I think Manning drove down to where Garcon was)... this is leadership.

Giving the game ball to Marvin after they broke some record...(forgot what it was) not whining to the Media about how unhappy he was when they were rested during the path to perfection.

Telling the fans to stand behind the team during this chaos.

Giving to the community.

Standing up for his brother (during one of the interviews)

LUCK - absolutely a great leader as well. You can just see it, it is natural.

So we had a great leader and have another one in the making. Why do we need to justify who is better.

Manning is in another team and Luck is here. People act like they are both here and fighting for a job....

Thank you Irsay for not letting that happen...or we might have imploded by now

Lastly-- All Manning said about Mathis is what a great defensive guy he is...and Mathis throws a jab after his team just won. Great culture you are starting Irsay.

The only reason you care he threw a jab is because it was at Peyton's expense. If it was a hated rival you'd call him tough and focused lol.

Peyton is the bad guy now. Thankfully the D treated him as such on Sunday or I doubt we get a win.

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oldunclemark

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Mathis told people after Sunday's game that it was Colts as a team versus Manning and 52 men. It somewhat reminds me of Manning's days with Colts. As great as he was, and all fans love him, every time it felt like he was the only one held accountable when the team lose. More than ever he was that great Mr. Manning that people respect but don't get close with.

 

While Luck is like a close friend whom players love and are willing to fight extremely hard with. I have seen many times Wayne gave up on Manning's bad throws when he felt he could get hurt, while for Luck's throws he always goes full speed.

I love Robert but that's a dumb comment...

He never cut down Mannings leadership when Manning wason HIS team.

Its fantasy to say that Luck is any more a friend to the Colts than Manning is to the Broncos

I've read many stories (as have you) about how the younger Broncos want badly to play well for him.

Manning's a great leader..and Luck will be too..

No way to compare accuretly.

Robert was having a great year..until, that comment...

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jjcolts Walk On

jjcolts

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The only reason you care he threw a jab is because it was at Peyton's expense. If it was a hated rival you'd call him tough and focused lol.

Peyton is the bad guy now. Thankfully the D treated him as such on Sunday or I doubt we get a win.

How do you know that...you know me? Don't put words in my mouth on how I would judge people.

 

Brady is the Colts nemesis and when Sherman talked crap to him I thought it was bush league.

 

Peyton is the "bad" guy..how old are we?

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House Walk On

House

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How do you know that...you know me? Don't put words in my mouth on how I would judge people.

Brady is the Colts nemesis and when Sherman talked crap to him I thought it was bush league.

Peyton is the "bad" guy..how old are we?

I know human psychology, and we are much more protective of our own then others. That's almost universally true lol. We also favor our own in questionable situations more than we do others. So comparing Mathis, a player if your presumably a Colts fan, a player you care about, and Sherman isn't really the same thing.

Regardless, I doubt we are having this discussion if Peyton isn't involved. You can call that putting words in your mouth, but everything involving Peyton is immediately put under a microscope.

I don't know how old you are, but clearly me using "bad guy", purposefully silly and in layman's terms, went right over your head.

Would you prefer I say enemy? Rival player? Opposing teams QB? They all mean the same thing. Which one makes me seem "old enough?"

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-JJ- Walk On

-JJ-

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I am unusre why people start this thread.  Does it matter? Furthermore..I am not sure why I reply :)

 

All of a sudden, we have forgotten all that Manning has done, all the hard work he put in. HE NEVER QUIT. Now we are questioning his leadership.

Practicing with Garcon and young receivers ( I think Manning drove down to where Garcon was)... this is leadership.

 

Giving the game ball to Marvin after they broke some record...(forgot what it was) not whining to the Media about how unhappy he was when they were rested during the path to perfection.

Telling the fans to stand behind the team during this chaos.

Giving to the community.

Standing up for his brother (during one of the interviews)

 

LUCK - absolutely a great leader as well. You can just see it, it is natural.

 

So we had a great leader and have another one in the making.  Why do we need to justify who is better. 

 

Manning is in another team and Luck is here.  People act like they are both here and fighting for a job....

 

Thank you Irsay for not letting that happen...or we might have imploded by now

 

Lastly-- All Manning said about Mathis is what a great defensive guy he is...and Mathis throws a jab after his team just won.  Great culture you are starting Irsay.

I agree with you a 100%.  Folks on message boards are just obsessed with comparisons.

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jjcolts Walk On

jjcolts

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I know human psychology, and we are much more protective of our own then others. That's almost universally true lol. We also favor our own in questionable situations more than we do others. So comparing Mathis, a player if your presumably a Colts fan, a player you care about, and Sherman isn't really the same thing.

Regardless, I doubt we are having this discussion if Peyton isn't involved. You can call that putting words in your mouth, but everything involving Peyton is immediately put under a microscope.

I don't know how old you are, but clearly me using "bad guy", purposefully silly and in layman's terms, went right over your head.

Would you prefer I say enemy? Rival player? Opposing teams QB? They all mean the same thing. Which one makes me seem "old enough?"

I know human psychology too...It was my Major in college. But I don't go boasting around here like I know what all of you are thinking.

Protective of our own? These are multi million dollar athletes we are talking about....LOL

 

This is sports and entertainment........ sports and entertainment.  So I will forever be greatful to Peyton and the Colts for giving me something to look forward to during football sunday....competition.

 

Believe me if Peyton ever said anything like that about any of the Colts or the owner.or to other teams..I would still say he is one of the greatest but that was bush league.

 

One of the things that I am so greatful for in Andrew Luck, is not only his skill and talent, but also his background and his values.  He is the company guy and the ultimate team player.

 

I feel as a Colts fan, Dang how LUCKY (no pun intended) could we be.  Two quality QB's back to back.  I don't need to knock Peyton to appreciate Luck. I sure wasn't complaining when Peyton was here..so I am not going to start whining now.

 

I don't need to compare Luck to Peyton or say one is better. 

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