As a owner would you hire Polian as gm based on the Indy era?

[JCPatriot]

Well looking at the stats for Peterson right now, Peterson had one very productive year for us, that very next year he is playing in Jacksonville

[JCPatriot]

Ironic but I didnt say 12 with Andrew in mind, some reason thats one of my favorite numbers, I dont know why but I expect there will be a reason why soon enough

[Gavin]

I can kind of see where you're coming from here. I've got a question for you, though. Do you think that they should have paid to keep Peterson? It is hard to accept an argument that letting a player go was a mistake when you are also arguing that the guy shouldn't have been drafted in the first place. I can see the argument that they didn't get much production for that 2nd round pick, though.....which is the ultimate metric.

[JCPatriot]

I know that, But what is the purpose?

[FireJimCaldwell]

My guess is that he is planning to assign each NFL team a number based on alphabetical order or something like that and then take a look at the draft history of the GMs of the five teams that correlate to the random numbers that we generate. The random numbers are a preemptive way to dispel the accusation that he cherry picked to come to the conclusion that he wanted instead of selecting the data set objectively. Just my guess, though. Maybe he actually just planning to buy a lottery ticket.

[JCPatriot]

That is close. Far too much effort than I was willing to put into it, but very close.

[Gavin]

My guess is that he is planning to assign each NFL team a number based on alphabetical order or something like that and then take a look at the draft history of the GMs of the five teams that correlate to the random numbers that we generate. The random numbers are a preemptive way to dispel the accusation that he cherry picked to come to the conclusion that he wanted instead of selecting the data set objectively. Just my guess, though. Maybe he actually just planning to buy a lottery ticket.

[Superman]

I am going to have to agree that he can build a team,problem is he cannot maintain it thru the draft and is 1 sided offense offense offense.But as for 5 years I agree he can build but his drafting by 5 years would kill the team he built.Must add for some reason personal or whatever his contract signings of his favorite players not the greatest kills a team by 5 years.By signing his overrated high priced nobodies to big contracts Hayden?I can go on and on.

For every player like Hayden, there's a player like Freeney.

Bill Polian has not historically been an offensive dominated GM. The Colts decided they would spend resources on surrounding their franchise quarterback with weapons. That doesn't mean Bill Polian won't draft good defenders. Some of his best personnel picks have been defensive players.

[FireJimCaldwell]

On which count, the draft analysis or the lottery ticket? ;)

[Superman]

One might be able to argue it as an incentive, but I would treat it as a roster bonus based on when he plays. If he doesn't play, it's not earned.

If it were x per game played, then it would clearly be an incentive.

I've never seen a roster bonus treated as an incentive whether LTBE or NLTBE.

You're more versed in matters like these, but it's my understanding that a roster bonus is paid if a player is on the roster at a certain date, not if he's on the active roster and certainly not if he's playing. That's the difference between a bonus and an incentive. What you're describing sounds very clearly like a games played incentive, and I think CBA rules would have it count against the cap.

[FireJimCaldwell]

You're more versed in matters like these, but it's my understanding that a roster bonus is paid if a player is on the roster at a certain date, not if he's on the active roster and certainly not if he's playing. That's the difference between a bonus and an incentive. What you're describing sounds very clearly like a games played incentive, and I think CBA rules would have it count against the cap.

[Superman]

Thats what I am saying, I know its not fair where a person is drafted which puts demands on them to produce but thats how it is, as for keeping Peterson, its hard to tell, I favored Peterson over Morris by alot but if we kept Peterson and he kept producing who knows if we draft Angerer

What in the world does Mike Peterson have to do with Pat Angerer? Peterson's contract with the Jaguars was done by the time Angerer was drafted. He's older than Gary Brackett, the player Angerer was drafted to replace, and all those years ago when he was a Colt, he played outside linebacker, not middle. He's about as relevant to Angerer as Marvin Harrison is to TY Hilton.

[Superman]

It might be a contract that the NFL and NFLPA would butt heads about, and it might need to be worded very carefully. It is true that active and playing are two different terms. That might make it more of an incentive.

Give us a # 1-32.

#27

[FireJimCaldwell]

#27

[Gramz]

18, 12,19,27 and now we need one more...

[FireJimCaldwell]

you pick one, call it over, stop the suspense..

[FireJimCaldwell]

18,12,19,27 & 6

Sum of 82

Average of 16.4

Team # 16 A to Z = Kansas City Chiefs.

[FireJimCaldwell]

Chiefs draft history 98-11

http://www.nfl.com/d...=2310&type=team

2011 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2011 1 26 Jonathan Baldwin WR Pittsburgh
2011 2 55 Rodney Hudson C Florida State
2011 3 70 Justin Houston LB Georgia
2011 3 86 Allen Bailey DE Miami (Fla.)
2011 4 118 Jalil Brown DB Colorado
2011 5 135 Ricky Stanzi QB Iowa
2011 5 140 Gabe Miller LB Oregon State
2011 6 199 Jerrell Powe NT Mississippi
2011 7 223 Shane Bannon FB Yale

2010 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2010 1 5 Eric Berry SS Tennessee
2010 2 36 Dexter McCluster WR Mississippi
2010 2 50 Javier Arenas DB Alabama
2010 3 68 Jon Asamoah G Illinois
2010 3 93 Tony Moeaki TE Iowa
2010 4 142 Cameron Sheffield LB Troy
2010 5 136 Kendrick Lewis FS Mississippi

2009 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2009 1 3 Tyson Jackson DE Louisiana State
2009 3 67 Alex Magee DT Purdue
2009 4 102 Donald Washington DB Ohio State
2009 5 139 Colin Brown T Missouri
2009 6 175 Quinten Lawrence WR McNeese State
2009 7 212 Javarris Williams RB Tennessee State
2009 7 237 Jake O'Connell TE Miami (Ohio)
2009 7 256 Ryan Succop K South Carolina

2008 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2008 1 5 Glenn Dorsey DT Louisiana State
2008 1 15 Branden Albert T Virginia
2008 2 35 Brandon Flowers CB Virginia Tech
2008 3 73 Jamaal Charles RB Texas
2008 3 76 Brad Cottam TE Tennessee
2008 3 82 DaJuan Morgan SAF North Carolina State
2008 4 105 Will Franklin WR Missouri
2008 5 140 Brandon Carr CB Grand Valley State
2008 6 170 Barry Richardson T Clemson
2008 6 182 Kevin Robinson WR Utah State
2008 7 210 Brian Johnston DE Gardner-Webb
2008 7 239 Mike Merritt TE Central Florida

2007 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2007 1 23 Dwayne Bowe WR Louisiana State
2007 2 54 Turk McBride DE Tennessee
2007 3 82 Tank Tyler DT North Carolina State
2007 5 148 Kolby Smith RB Louisville
2007 5 160 Justin Medlock K UCLA
2007 6 196 Herb Taylor T Texas Christian
2007 7 231 Michael Allan TE Whitworth

2006 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2006 1 20 Tamba Hali DE Penn State
2006 2 54 Bernard Pollard DB Purdue
2006 3 85 Brodie Croyle QB Alabama
2006 5 154 Marcus Maxey CB Miami (Fla.)
2006 6 186 Tre' Stallings G Mississippi
2006 6 190 Jeff Webb WR San Diego State
2006 7 228 Jarrad Page DB UCLA

2005 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2005 1 15 Derrick Johnson OLB Texas
2005 3 99 Dustin Colquitt P Tennessee
2005 4 116 Craphonso Thorpe WR Florida State
2005 5 138 Boomer Grigsby LB Illinois State
2005 5 147 Alphonso Hodge CB Miami (Ohio)
2005 6 187 Will Svitek T Stanford
2005 6 199 Khari Long DE Baylor
2005 7 229 James Kilian -- Tulsa
2005 7 238 Jeremy Parquet T Southern Mississippi

2004 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2004 2 36 Junior Siavii DT Oregon
2004 2 61 Kris Wilson TE Pittsburgh
2004 3 93 Keyaron Fox LB Georgia Tech
2004 4 105 Samie Parker WR Oregon
2004 4 126 Jared Allen DE Idaho State
2004 6 195 Jeris McIntyre WR Auburn
2004 7 231 Kevin Sampson T Syracuse

2003 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2003 1 27 Larry Johnson RB Penn State
2003 2 47 Kawika Mitchell MLB South Florida
2003 3 92 Julian Battle CB Tennessee
2003 4 113 Brett Williams T Florida State
2003 5 153 Jordan Black G Notre Dame
2003 6 189 Jimmy Wilkerson DE Oklahoma
2003 7 230 Montique Sharpe DT Wake Forest
2003 7 252 Willie Pile DB Virginia Tech

2002 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2002 1 6 Ryan Sims DT North Carolina
2002 2 43 Eddie Freeman DT Alabama-Birmingham
2002 4 107 Omar Easy RB Penn State
2002 5 143 Scott Fujita OLB California
2002 7 221 Maurice Rodriguez -- Fresno State

2001 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2001 3 75 Eric Downing DT Syracuse
2001 3 77 Snoop Minnis WR Florida State
2001 4 107 Monty Beisel DE Kansas State
2001 4 108 George Layne RB Texas Christian
2001 5 141 Billy Baber TE Virginia
2001 5 150 Derrick Blaylock RB Stephen F. Austin St.
2001 6 176 Alex Sulfsted T Miami (Ohio)
2001 7 212 Shaunard Harts DB Boise State
2001 7 243 Terdell Sands DT Tennessee-Chattanooga

2000 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
2000 1 21 Sylvester Morris WR Jackson State
2000 2 54 William Bartee CB Oklahoma
2000 3 85 Greg Wesley SS Arkansas-Pine Bluff
2000 4 115 Frank Moreau RB Louisville
2000 5 153 Dante Hall RB Texas A&M
2000 5 162 Pat Dennis CB Louisiana-Monroe
2000 6 188 Darnell Alford T Boston College
2000 7 208 Desmond Kitchings WR Furman

1999 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1999 1 14 John Tait T Brigham Young
1999 2 54 Mike Cloud RB Boston College
1999 3 75 Gary Stills LB West Virginia
1999 3 84 Larry Atkins DB UCLA
1999 4 108 Larry Parker WR USC
1999 7 220 Eric King -- Richmond

1998 - KANSAS CITY CHIEFS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1998 1 27 Victor Riley T Auburn
1998 3 88 Rashaan Shehee RB Washington
1998 4 120 Greg Favors ILB Mississippi State
1998 5 128 Robert Williams DB North Carolina
1998 6 181 Derrick Ransom DT Cincinnati
1998 7 216 Eric Warfield DB Nebraska
1998 7 224 Ernest Blackwell -- Missouri

Another reference point where the players can be looked at statistically.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/kan/draft.htm

General Managers

Carl Peterson 1998-2008

Scott Pioli 2009-2011

This one actually fits as a fairly decent comparison since some want to give Chris Polian credit for the past couple of Colts drafts....

[Gramz]

My brain hurts from too much reading today. Can you "summarize" the above for me..??

[FireJimCaldwell]

My brain hurts from too much reading today. Can you "summarize" the above for me..??

I was just providing the information for those that are so critical of Polian to take a look at a random team and constructively criticize that draft. I'll add some thoughts on it later, after I compare and contrast it a bit.

[Gramz]

I was just providing the information for those that are so critical of Polian to take a look at a random team and constructively criticize that draft. I'll add some thoughts on it later, after I compare and contrast it a bit.

[funktacious2]

No, but not because I dislike him (well because I really don't anyways), but because he's just at the point where he's old enough to the point where he needed to retire soon anyways. lol If I were an owner and had a GM spot to fill I'd want to start fresh with a younger, talented GM.

[SilentHill]

At this time, I would not hire Bill Polian, mainly because his days as an effective GM are over, in his hay-day It would be a different scenario that would require much more thinking. I give most of the credit to Chris Polian for the Colts collapse, he should never GM anywhere ever again.

[Gavin]

Colts All Pros since '98

1-Peyton Manning-5 times '03, '04, '05, '08, '09

2-Marvin Harrison-3 times 1999, '02, '06

3-Edgerrin James-1 time '99

4-Mike VanderJagt-1 time '03

5-Bob Sanders-2 times '05, '07

6-Dwight Freeney-3 times '04, '05, '09

7-Reggie Wayne-1 time, 2010

8-Dallas Clark-1 time '09

9-Jeff Saturday-2 times '05, '07

Chiefs All Pros since '98

1-Will Shields-2 times, 2002, 2003

2-Jared Allen-1 time-2007

3-Jamal Charles-1 time, 2010

4-Tony Gonzales-5 times, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2003, 2008

5-Dante Hall-1 time 2003

6-Priest Holmes-3 times 2001, 2002, 2003

7-Brian Waters-2 times 2004, 2005

8-Willie Roaf-1 time 2004

9-Larry Johnson-1 time 2006

10-Derrick Johnson-1 time 2011

One would have to go much deeper into it then All Pros alone though, such as number of games played started for example especially in regards to those that draft picks were backups. Also I never said Polian didnt make great picks that would be dumb to say that , But far to many that didnt produce given there draft status

[Superman]

But far to many that didnt produce given there draft status

That's the point of the exercise. How many of the Chiefs picks reached an acceptable number of games played/started in comparison with the Colts?

[Gavin]

That's the point of the exercise. How many of the Chiefs picks reached an acceptable number of games played/started in comparison with the Colts?

[Superman]

Acceptable is in the eye of the beholder isn't it at the end of the day? what may be acceptable to one may not be acceptable to another

So determine the metric and apply it across the board. What percentage of games/starts? What kind of stat rankings?

It would also help to acknowledge that the Chiefs drafted higher than the Colts for the majority of the past 13 years.

[Gavin]

So determine the metric and apply it across the board. What percentage of games/starts? What kind of stat rankings?

It would also help to acknowledge that the Chiefs drafted higher than the Colts for the majority of the past 13 years.

[Superman]

Also Polian traded out of a couple of 1st round picks, I believe a couple 1st rounders but I will have to go back and double check but thanks for the advice

I think he always traded up in a previous year, so it's probably fair to treat the player traded for as a first rounder. Like Tony Ugoh. Which doesn't bode well for that particular trade.

[Gavin]

I think he always traded up in a previous year, so it's probably fair to treat the player traded for as a first rounder. Like Tony Ugoh. Which doesn't bode well for that particular trade.

Nope, its unfair I know to the player when they are drafted in the 1st or even 2nd and they have no business being that high up but unfortunately thats life in the NFL and draft, something I think Tannehill will likely find out all to fast but thats just my opinion

[rabidfan77]

Most media and ex players never liked the way the Colts were put together too small to be physical but fast. Whispers are that Bill's eye for talent is slipping and that he's a hard guy to deal with wanting total control in all matters. Going in you know his son Chris (not liked by many based on inside reports) will come along in some capacity. Do you view him as the guy who masterminded the Colts to the most wins in a decade in NFL history? Or a guy who the game is passing by and simply rode the Peyton express. I ponder those thoughts after watching franchise guys like Brady, big Ben and Eli win multiple rings with the TEAMS & coaching staff that their gms assembled. Add to the fact that Brees and Rogers along with the trio mentioned have time to add more 's which brings me back to Bill. He deserves credit (by drafting the GOAT alone) for the turnaround of the franchise but he also carries MUCH of the blame for the many playoff failures that diminished the record regular season wins by failing or refusing to address team needs that sent flawed teams yearly to the postseason with weak o-lines (3rd and 1's anybody), undersized defenses that relied way too much on Freeney and Mathis or Bob to be healthy, horrendous special team play that seemed to get worse every year and a subpar coaching staff. To me Polian's ego was his worst enemy. Poor draft picks in the end, with undrafted FA all over the roster and no backup qb (led to 2-14 last year) but still winning (even a SB a few yrs back) was a testament to the greatness and durability of 18 despite the above mentioned problems. So me personally I would pass for a young upstart with room to grow and fresh ideas than a guy set in his ways believing his own hype that wants to control the coach, media etc. BUT on a bad team with nothing to lose I might give him a shot short term.

NO there's a reason Lucas Oil Stadium is called the " The House that Peyton Built". I wasn't happy with the change at qb but now that Manning is a Bronco and Luck is officially a Colt I'm starting to think about how the off season decison's have set this franchise in a better direction. I would rather release the GOAT and get rid of the Polian's than continue to have the same organizational setup Irsay just dumped. It is a tragedy that in 14 years of the Manning era this "Team" only made 2 SB appearance's with 1 title, it's hard to imagine how many titles the Colts would've won if we had a GM who could've build a defense as good as the offense. The thing that excite's me the most is not how Luck and the offense is going to do, but how the new defense is going to play, most of those playoff losses were on the O-line and defense. As great as Peyton IS no 1 team can win a SB with just a great qb, which New England is finding out with Brady.

[southwest1]

NO there's a reason Lucas Oil Stadium is called the " The House that Peyton Built". I wasn't happy with the change at qb but now that Manning is a Bronco and Luck is officially a Colt I'm starting to think about how the off season decison's have set this franchise in a better direction. I would rather release the GOAT and get rid of the Polian's than continue to have the same organizational setup Irsay just dumped. It is a tragedy that in 14 years of the Manning era this "Team" only made 2 SB appearance's with 1 title, it's hard to imagine how many titles the Colts would've won if we had a GM who could've build a defense as good as the offense. The thing that excite's me the most is not how Luck and the offense is going to do, but how the new defense is going to play, most of those playoff losses were on the O-line and defense. As great as Peyton IS no 1 team can win a SB with just a great qb, which New England is finding out with Brady.

Yup, defensive prowess is what really matters plain & simple. Oh, how I do love the full blitz package as well. It always puts a diabolical smirk on my face too.

[Gavin]

Chiefs wide receivers averaged 62.2 catches per season from 1998 to 2011 (I didnt include Tight Ends)

[dacoats]

I would never hire a guy that ridicules the fans, can't accept the fact he is wrong, has a son who has no tolerance because he never had to face any serious adversity who needs to be a part of everything dad does cause he can't do things on his own with out messing them up

No way would I hire Bill Polian, but lets ask the pundits and prognosticators first!!!!!!

[Vinny BoomBatz]

I'm a little late to the party but no I would not hire him. He is too stringent in his views regarding developing a team or at least he was in Indy. Too often Free Agents (whether they where affordable or not) that could have helped the team were passed on because "they didn't fit the system"....same goes for draft picks. If a player is better than who you have playing the current position you find a way to utilize his talents...not pass on him because he doesn't fit your system. During this years draft Polian said Chapman was a good player but they wouldn't have drafted him under his control...why not? Unless i am mistaken the Tampa 2 works best with one under tackle and one nose tackle(preferably one who can pass rush)...this kid can and to say you wouldn't have drafted him...especially where Indy did...shows the game passed him by and at best he won't adapt.

Also the utilization of the Tampa 2 defense as a base defense with no wrinkles was ridiculous! You have to adapt in today's NFL and I sincerely hope that adaptation works with the current regime.

[southwest1]

Of course, it's almost impossible to stop a few contracts from not expiring at the time. I never said any GM can prevent it as a hard & fast rule. It boils down to signing bonuses, how many contracts are front & back loaded payment wise, restructured deals, & paying guys that are either injury prone, can't grasp the playbook, or see diminished playing time as a result of nagging/repeating injuries.

Knowing when to cut a player when their production slips drastically is crucial i.e. Bob Sanders & Gary Brackett for starters. It took Polian forever to release the "dead weight." Yes, cutting them at the wrong time can count heavily against a team's draft space & I realize of course I wasn't the Colts Chief Financial Officer or in GM meetings either. NE is masterful at cutting players slightly passed their prime & getting lower round draft picks from other NFL franchises. We are abysmal at this organizational strategy personally.

I respect Bill Polian for getting our squad a Championship Ring & for his crucial role in building Playoff contenders in Carolina & 4 SB appearances in Buffalo. But, Polian as a front office guru let a lot to be desired. The man knows football no question. Massaging cap space ABSOLUTELY NOT IMO.

You made a very specific statement, and I thought you were talking about a very specific set of circumstances. I don't know what you mean when you say that having a lot of expiring contracts in one offseason is evidence that he doesn't know how to manage the cap.

I don't ever remember the Colts being hit with a barrage of notable free agents in one offseason. And even if that did happen, I don't think that's necessarily an indication that he didn't do a good job with the cap. The questions at that point become "did we have the cap space necessary to retain the players we wanted to," and "if we didn't have a lot of cap space, were we able to manipulate our situation to retain our players."

I've never heard this being used as a metric by which you grade a GM. Contracts expire. The question is what do you do when that happens.

I disagree wholeheartedly. We cut both Sanders and Brackett before their cap figures got out of hand. Sanders cap hit in 2010 was $2.3 million, nothing to get worked up over for a player who can change the game when healthy. The fact that it was going up to $5 million in 2011 made it necessary to stop putting any hope in him, because it was prohibitively expensive, and that's when we cut him. Brackett's cap hit in 2011 was $2 million. Again, not prohibitively expensive. We cut him mostly because that cap hit was going up to $5 million in 2012. Both of them were cut at the right time.

Polian was one of the chief architects of the cap. I'm curious as to what specific cap mismanagement you can point to.

Look Superman,

Some Colts fans are well versed in draft & contract matters of nearly every player on our roster going back several years. I am not one of those people nor do I any desire to become one. Decimal points, dollar signs, & statistics in reference to contracts are not of paramount significance to me. Bill Polian refused to acknowledge glaring weaknesses for years & he always seemed to pay players that were either injure prone or way too much money for the roles they were being asked to fill on the field of play.

"I've never heard this being used as a metric by which you grade a GM. Contracts expire." Really? Fiscal management of a team's revenue isn't being scrutinized as a GM? If that were true, no GM would ever be terminated, fired, or let go. Pieces must be brought in, voids must be filled, & players must be paid. Give the wrong set of players too much money who are unproductive or fail to give the playmakers what they deserve & not only will you not obtain Championships you will set your franchise behind the 8th ball for 7-10 years. Look A.J. Smith in San Diego right now. His handling of WR Vincent Jackson's contract a few years ago took a vital weapon away from Phillip Rivers & certainly affected Playoff outcomes for the Charges based on contract discussion breakdowns IMO.

[Coffeedrinker]

Would I hire a 6 time Executive of the Year to run my franchise. H!@# yeah. I read one comment that his small, fast player philosophy doesn't work in the NFL. That was not his philosophy that was the coaches philosophy. Look at how he drafted/fa with the Bills, Panthers and Colts with Mora. 300+ DTs 290+ DEs, Washington was considered big for a LB, Morris was considered Protypical size, same with Peterson for an OLB.

He did not start finding the small and fast players until Dungy became the coach... not because that was the type of player Polian wanted it's because that is the type of player Dungy wanted. When Dungy left and Caldwell took over the Colts tried drafting/signing bigger guys, especially up front on both lines.

Also I don't remember which poster did it but listed some players that were disappointments because their play did not match their draft status. One he mentioned Steve McKinney who was the Colts starting guard for 4 years before he went to Houston as part of their suplmental draft. And that person also mentioned Brandon Burlsworth. I'm sorry I may be banned or a warning for this but what kind of * would fault Polian for Brandon Burlsworth? The guy gets drafted by the Colts, then at home before training camp starts he dies in a car accident on his way to a church meeting. Yeah, how dare Polian draft a guy, couldn't he see that coming. Or how about Polian is a bad GM look at the money he gave Fred Lane as a free agent and he never produced anything for that money.

That is the difference between knowing what the heck you are talking about and looking stuff up on the internet and drawing conclusions based on what you looked up.

[Superman]

Look Superman,

Some Colts fans are well versed in draft & contract matters of nearly every player on our roster going back several years. I am not one of those people nor do I any desire to become one. Decimal points, dollar signs, & statistics in reference to contracts are not of paramount significance to me. Bill Polian refused to acknowledge glaring weaknesses for years & he always seemed to pay players that were either injure prone or way too much money for the roles they were being asked to fill on the field of play.

By no means am I an expert, but I have paid some attention to those matters. And that's why I can say that the Sanders and Brackett contracts are not an example of allowing a player to eat up cap space or continue on as "dead weight." For instance, Sanders cap hits were 2008: $2.427m; 2009: $2.442, and 2010: $4.097m. Sanders' contract took up no more than 2% of the cap at any point (and there was no cap in 2010). Similar numbers hold true for Brackett's contract.

Sanders was definitely injury prone, but he was given that contract the year after he played 15 games and won DPOY, and the year before that, he was instrumental in our defensive turnaround in the playoffs, on the way to the Super Bowl. It's easy to look back and see how a contract worked out and then be critical of it, but unless you were saying that we shouldn't be resigning one of our best defenders when he got that contract, the criticism rings hollow.

And I don't mean to pick on your criticism of either of these contracts; that's why I asked for other examples. But, coming from someone who has at least a tiny bit of understanding of the cap and how contracts work, those contracts were handled about as well as you can handle them by the Colts. We cut Sanders at the perfect time, and while Polian got fired before Brackett's contract became a problem, I'm relatively certain we would have cut him as well if Polian were still in charge. I believe he set the Brackett contract up specifically to be addressed after a couple of years. It's called a decision point, and I think you'll find that a lot of the bigger contracts Polian did had them. I believe this is the decision point year for Freeney, and the fact that it came in the same offseason that Mathis' contract was up is probably not a coincidence.

A better criticism of the Brackett contract is Polian's failure to draft a suitable replacement for him before his contract came due (Donald Brown vs. James Laurinitis, for instance).

As for the thought that Polian refused to acknowledge weaknesses, I don't think that's true either. For instance, the offensive line started falling apart in 2008, the same year Polian used three draft picks on linemen, a year after he traded up for Tony Ugoh. Again, a better criticism would be that he didn't do a good job filling those needs, not that he ignored them.

"I've never heard this being used as a metric by which you grade a GM. Contracts expire." Really? Fiscal management of a team's revenue isn't being scrutinized as a GM? If that were true, no GM would ever be terminated, fired, or let go. Pieces must be brought in, voids must be filled, & players must be paid. Give the wrong set of players too much money who are unproductive or fail to give the playmakers what they deserve & not only will you not obtain Championships you will set your franchise behind the 8th ball for 7-10 years. Look A.J. Smith in San Diego right now. His handling of WR Vincent Jackson's contract a few years ago took a vital weapon away from Phillip Rivers & certainly affected Playoff outcomes for the Charges based on contract discussion breakdowns IMO.

You're miscategorizing my position. I am not suggesting that fiscal management isn't a key component of a GM's job; obviously it is. I'm saying that I've never heard anyone suggest that having a lot of expiring contracts in one offseason is evidence of poor fiscal management.

All that you say about giving money to the wrong players, filling voids, etc., is true. I hate -- HATE -- the way AJ Smith handled the Vincent Jackson and Marcus McNeil RFA situations, but I don't think that's the reason the Chargers didn't do more in the playoffs. And I hate the fact that Polian refused to give any attention to free agency for so long, but I don't think that's because of the way he managed the cap.

I'm not trying to be stubborn. I just disagree with your categorizing specific contracts as mishandled by Polian, particularly Sanders and Brackett. And my query about expiring contracts in one offseason was an honest one, because I don't know how having X number of expiring contracts in the same year says one thing or another about a GM's cap management.

[southwest1]

By no means am I an expert, but I have paid some attention to those matters. And that's why I can say that the Sanders and Brackett contracts are not an example of allowing a player to eat up cap space or continue on as "dead weight." For instance, Sanders cap hits were 2008: $2.427m; 2009: $2.442, and 2010: $4.097m. Sanders' contract took up no more than 2% of the cap at any point (and there was no cap in 2010). Similar numbers hold true for Brackett's contract.

Sanders was definitely injury prone, but he was given that contract the year after he played 15 games and won DPOY, and the year before that, he was instrumental in our defensive turnaround in the playoffs, on the way to the Super Bowl. It's easy to look back and see how a contract worked out and then be critical of it, but unless you were saying that we shouldn't be resigning one of our best defenders when he got that contract, the criticism rings hollow.

And I don't mean to pick on your criticism of either of these contracts; that's why I asked for other examples. But, coming from someone who has at least a tiny bit of understanding of the cap and how contracts work, those contracts were handled about as well as you can handle them by the Colts. We cut Sanders at the perfect time, and while Polian got fired before Brackett's contract became a problem, I'm relatively certain we would have cut him as well if Polian were still in charge. I believe he set the Brackett contract up specifically to be addressed after a couple of years. It's called a decision point, and I think you'll find that a lot of the bigger contracts Polian did had them. I believe this is the decision point year for Freeney, and the fact that it came in the same offseason that Mathis' contract was up is probably not a coincidence.

A better criticism of the Brackett contract is Polian's failure to draft a suitable replacement for him before his contract came due (Donald Brown vs. James Laurinitis, for instance).

As for the thought that Polian refused to acknowledge weaknesses, I don't think that's true either. For instance, the offensive line started falling apart in 2008, the same year Polian used three draft picks on linemen, a year after he traded up for Tony Ugoh. Again, a better criticism would be that he didn't do a good job filling those needs, not that he ignored them.

You're miscategorizing my position. I am not suggesting that fiscal management isn't a key component of a GM's job; obviously it is. I'm saying that I've never heard anyone suggest that having a lot of expiring contracts in one offseason is evidence of poor fiscal management.

All that you say about giving money to the wrong players, filling voids, etc., is true. I hate -- HATE -- the way AJ Smith handled the Vincent Jackson and Marcus McNeil RFA situations, but I don't think that's the reason the Chargers didn't do more in the playoffs. And I hate the fact that Polian refused to give any attention to free agency for so long, but I don't think that's because of the way he managed the cap.

I'm not trying to be stubborn. I just disagree with your categorizing specific contracts as mishandled by Polian, particularly Sanders and Brackett. And my query about expiring contracts in one offseason was an honest one, because I don't know how having X number of expiring contracts in the same year says one thing or another about a GM's cap management.

[Superman]

We must all factor into account the fact that Manning and Freeney took up at least 30% of the teams cap space the last few years.

Manning's contract never (NOT EVER) took up anywhere near 30% of the cap. Even on the $23 million franchise tag in 2011, that would have been 19% of the $120 million cap, and that would have been, by far, the highest percentage of the cap his deal ever accounted for. As it stands, his cap hit was brought down to $16 million, representing 13% of the cap. In 2009, his $14 million cap hit took up 11.4% of the cap.

Those percentages are high. Manning spent a lot of his time in Indy as one of the highest paid players in the league. This presented cap management issues for the team. But this can be expressed without exaggerating his impact. It was never anywhere near 30%. It was always less than half of that.