Colts offseason discussion / Ballard Grievances (merge)

[ColtStrong2013]

Just now, Yoshinator said:

90% of the forum liked the Buckner trade at that time. We were getting an elite player to help the team, and that was a 1st rounder we were giving up in addition to paying him immediately. This is a 3rd round pick essentially we would be giving up in addition to paying him. Again, the guaranteed money is nothing. Yes, he has injury concerns. Who cares. He's as close to a guarantee as you can get for a 3rd round pick. 

 

The only competition for Sneed was the Titans. If the Chiefs kept him and Sneed said he'd rather stay, it'd be different. That wasn't the case though. He went to an inferior team in the Titans. I'm pretty sure he would come here if given the opportunity. 

the difference between buck and Sneed is that the options at dt that year in the draft was lousy. That is not the case for cornerback this year. At all. And top corners over the past few seasons have done very well their rookie years. 
 

the guaranteed money is nothing? I beg to differ. Entirely…

[Rhodelesstraveled]

I'm Ok with losing Sneed, because I think the season wholly depends on Richardson development.  I will say this.  Houston is the class of the division now and TN has fixed a lot of holes and they are giving Levis every chance to prove he is the guy.  I think Jax has slipped big time and we are in a holding pattern until the draft comes out.  All in all, the division is going to be nasty and competitive.  The QB play this year will determine who wins the South.  Right now, I give Stroud the edge, but I do think Levis and Richardson could break out.  I think Lawrence is solid but nothing spectacular, as last year showed.  He has had a ton of weapons and still could not bring a title home.  

[Yoshinator]

1 minute ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

my argument against minshew is that he had better production in Jacksonville in 2020 and only won 1 game that year… He was not responsible for winning games here. 
 

the nfl is strange when it comes to qb’s. His age and position is the reason he is making more. Flacco was brought on as a qb2. Minshew possibly might be qb1. It’s not a knock against minshew, I’m happy we had him. And yes I am assuming Richardson will do better, because he is better. 

Why is Richardson better? Draft position? Potential? He is a raw QB right now. He has proven nothing. His accuracy is bad. He is a playmaker yes, but he has proven nothing. He could still be a bust as of now. 

 

Also, if you feel that way that he is better than Minshew, then you should have been in favor of signing Sneed as you think AR is a hit already and we should be building around him as he should be viewed as a hit. You support my viewpoint without realizing it. If Ballard feels the same (which he says AR was the best player in the draft last year), then he should have done the same and build a team around AR that's ready to win now without forcing AR to "prove" himself a year first.

[Rhodelesstraveled]

AR ceiling is higher than Minshew that is why.  

[NFLfan]

21 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Ballard going after a 31 year old psss rusher instead of improving the secondary is all you need to know about how bad his team building is.

 

If your pass rush is not good, your secondary will not be as good as it should be, regardless of the players, JMO. If the pass rush does not put enough pressure on the QB, the secondary will break down. No? Someone will eventually get open if there is not enough pressure on the QB. 

 

It is a complementary game.

[w87r]

23 minutes ago, Yoshinator said:

We won 9 games with Gardner Minshew at QB. That's not an assumption, that's a fact. Assuming we will be better with Richardson is an assumption as of now until proven otherwise.

Actually if you want to get into facts. Gardner Minshew is credited for 7 wins, 2 of those go to Richardson.

 

 

 

And your first sentence, should give everyone hope, going into next year.

 

 

This team was good enough as a whole to make the playoffs/ + win the division with Minshew at QB last year. Browns game and a bad pass on 4th down by Minshew against Texans.

 

 

Need to get guys healthy, retain our own and add a few pieces here and there.

15 minutes ago, NFLfan said:

 

I think folks over-emphasize this no taxes thing

It's not a minor thing. 

 

Indiana has a 3.15% state tax rate.

 

Let's take that for Hunter (these are just estimates)

$24.5m x 3.15% = $771,500 a season.

 

So over that 2 year contract he loses out on upwards of $1.5m.

 

 

It's a big advantage for teams in no state tax states. 

 

15 minutes ago, NFLfan said:

I think all the best players would go to Texas (Cowboys, Texans) and Florida (Dolphins, Jags, Bucs) if that was always the case. Have the Dolphins done much this offseason?

?  

 

The Dolphins started like $40m over the cap. Hard to spend money when you have to move KT around just to make it work. They still have added some talent though

 

 

 

 

There is also the Raiders, Seahawks and Titans that have no state tax.

 

3 teams in Colts division have no state tax.

[ColtStrong2013]

Just now, Yoshinator said:

Why is Richardson better? Draft position? Potential? He is a raw QB right now. He has proven nothing. His accuracy is bad. He is a playmaker yes, but he has proven nothing. He could still be a bust as of now. 

 

Also, if you feel that way that he is better than Minshew, then you should have been in favor of signing Sneed as you think AR is a hit already and we should be building around him as he should be viewed as a hit. You support my viewpoint without realizing it. If Ballard feels the same (which he says AR was the best player in the draft last year), then he should have done the same and build a team around AR that's ready to win now without forcing AR to "prove" himself a year first.

Because he can make plays that Minshew doesn’t. He scored 7 touchdowns in 4 games. I think he fits Steichen’s offense far better. His accuracy is bad? So was Minshew’s… remember that 4th and 1 pass with the division on the line? AR can attack that situation far better and proved to make those throws (remember the Rams game?) 

 

and no it doesn’t prove your argument. Because I don’t believe Ballard wants to spend outside the organization. He explored the option and passed on it. The 4 year deal might have been what he passed on. Everyone signed is on 3 year deals- and that ties out with Richardson’s rookie contract (aside from the 5th year). Ballard’s methodical, far more than anyone on here will give him credit for. Hes not just thinking short term of 2024… 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I don’t even care about the rest this year. I have no unrest in watching rookies struggle again because the second year guys get injured or don’t take a leap. 

[w87r]

8 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

The no state tax thing is only good for home games and other games in states where there is no state tax.  For example. When the Texans play the Colts in Indy, they have to pay 3% state tax to indiana.   If they play in California it can be a much as 12%.   They have to file in every state they play in that has state tax.   

Yeah, I'm aware.

 

That's why in my next post I put estimated. Because it depends where they play.

[Yoshinator]

3 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

the difference between buck and Sneed is that the options at dt that year in the draft was lousy. That is not the case for cornerback this year. At all. And top corners over the past few seasons have done very well their rookie years. 
 

the guaranteed money is nothing? I beg to differ. Entirely…

Top corners may be easier to hit on the last few years, but not for Ballard specifically. That's one of his weaknesses in the draft. We kinda hit on Rodgers, and he's gone. Kenny Moore was a practice squad guy we took from the Pats. JuJu is decent, but unproven still. Jaylon Jones was kind of a hit, but he fell off a bit. Ballard hasn't hit on a true no1 CB in the draft. He may not even draft a CB in the first round. That's another assumption a lot of people are making, and it may not happen. 

 

The guaranteed money really isn't a big deal. No. Every big contract has guaranteed money. The risk Vs reward Sneed offers is worth it. The Chiefs did the work of discovering Sneed. We would have benefitted in that case only because they have another elite CB in McDuffie. It's not because Sneed wasn't worth it. You allocate your resources, and that's what the Chiefs were doing. We could have benefitted, and we didn't.

[Yoshinator]

15 minutes ago, Rhodelesstraveled said:

AR ceiling is higher than Minshew that is why.  

Then we should build around him as if he's the guy. That's the major issue I have, that we aren't doing that.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

3 minutes ago, w87r said:

Actually if you want to get into facts. Gardner Minshew is credited for 7 wins, 2 of those go to Richardson.

 

 

 

And your first sentence, should give everyone hope, going into next year.

 

 

This team was good enough as a whole to make the playoffs/ + win the division with Minshew at QB last year. Browns game and a bad pass on 4th down by Minshew against Texans.

 

 

Need to get guys healthy, retain our own and add a few pieces here and there.

It's not a minor thing. 

 

Indiana has a 3.15% state tax rate.

 

Let's take that for Hunter (these are just estimates)

$24.5m x 3.15% = $771,500 a season.

 

So over that 2 year contract he loses out on over $1.5m.

 

 

It's a big advantage for teams in no state tax states. 

 

?  

 

The Dolphins started like $40m over the cap. Hard to spend money when you have to move KT around just to make it work. They still have added some talent though

 

 

 

 

There is also the Raiders, Seahawks and Titans that have no state tax.

 

3 teams in Colts division have no state tax.

Thdy played scrubs at QB. Assuming they are going to win more games with a ramped up schedule is a mistake. We won’t be playing scrubs at QB this year. Thst schedule is why we won 9 games.

[ColtStrong2013]

1 minute ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Thdy played scrubs at QB. Assuming they are going to win more games with a ramped up schedule is a mistake. We won’t be playing scrubs at QB this year. Thst schedule is why we won 9 games.

there is truth in that. And if things go the way we hope, those teams won’t be playing scrubs at qb against the colts either. 

[jvan1973]

4 minutes ago, w87r said:

Yeah, I'm aware.

 

That's why in my next post I put estimated. Because it depends where they play.

What I mean is,   Texans players pay state tax when they pay away games. 

[ShuteAt168]

1 hour ago, RollerColt said:

If GMs and Owners listened to the fans coaches and players would be let go on a yearly, possibly game by game basis. 

Probably. Whoever Ballard HAS been been listening to for the past seven years has helped him go sub .500. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

With the upgraded schedule it is a mistake assuming AR will win more games. If we couldn’t stop scrubs how we stopping the good QB this year.

[NFLfan]

22 minutes ago, w87r said:

Actually if you want to get into facts. Gardner Minshew is credited for 7 wins, 2 of those go to Richardson.

 

 

 

And your first sentence, should give everyone hope, going into next year.

 

 

This team was good enough as a whole to make the playoffs/ + win the division with Minshew at QB last year. Browns game and a bad pass on 4th down by Minshew against Texans.

 

 

Need to get guys healthy, retain our own and add a few pieces here and there.

It's not a minor thing. 

 

Indiana has a 3.15% state tax rate.

 

Let's take that for Hunter (these are just estimates)

$24.5m x 3.15% = $771,500 a season.

 

So over that 2 year contract he loses out on over $1.5m.

 

 

It's a big advantage for teams in no state tax states. 

 

?  

 

The Dolphins started like $40m over the cap. Hard to spend money when you have to move KT around just to make it work. They still have added some talent though

 

 

 

 

There is also the Raiders, Seahawks and Titans that have no state tax.

 

3 teams in Colts division have no state tax.

 

I hear what you're saying. You may be right and I read that all the time. The Devil's Advocate in me wants to question everything. I would love to see/read something examining that. Greenard signed with the Vikings and not the Texans. Perhaps the Texans did not want him back but who knows. It would be good to see who were the first people who were reported to have signed last Monday. One of the guys Ballard did not re-sign last year, Okereke, went to New York/New Jersey, which have some of the highest taxes around.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

3 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

there is truth in that. And if things go the way we hope, those teams won’t be playing scrubs at qb against the colts either. 

This isn’t about AR. This is about the secondary.

[ColtStrong2013]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

This isn’t about AR. This is about the secondary.

Which will be addressed in the next month or so… It is about AR- the team’s success will be determined by his health and playmaking. When you are playing top qb’s, a great secondary only takes you so far. You better have pass rush and the ability to move chains on offense (and most importantly finish drives with points to keep pace.)

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 minute ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

Which will be addressed in the next month or so… It is about AR- the team’s success will be determined by his health and playmaking. When you are playing top qb’s, a great secondary only takes you so far. You better have pass rush and the ability to move chains on offense (and most importantly finish drives with points to keep pace.)

Drafting rookies does not immediately improve the team. Adding more rookies to unproven guys will eventually have Ballard fired after the season.

[ShuteAt168]

Holder says the Colts viewed Sneed as very good but not great, so here we are again: Other teams are dumb for paying market value and Chris sub .500 Ballard knows best. If CB had drafted Sneed, he’d be a Horseshoe Guy and Ballard would have paid what Tenn paid and proudly said “we pay our own.” 54-60-1 

[Yoshinator]

2 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

Which will be addressed in the next month or so… It is about AR- the team’s success will be determined by his health and playmaking. When you are playing top qb’s, a great secondary only takes you so far. You better have pass rush and the ability to move chains on offense (and most importantly finish drives with points to keep pace.)

The Chiefs played the Dolphins, Bills, and Ravens in the playoffs and I'm pretty sure their secondary took them far. Including the regular season where Mahomes had a bad year by his standards and the defense was elite and helped win them a SB last season.

[NFLfan]

14 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

I don’t even care about the rest this year. I have no unrest in watching rookies struggle again because the second year guys get injured or don’t take a leap. 

 

Are you sure about that? I don't think that is true.

[Yoshinator]

Just now, ShuteAt168 said:

Holder says the Colts viewed Sneed as very good but not great, so here we are again: Other teams are dumb for paying market value and Chris sub .500 Ballard knows best. If CB had drafted Sneed, he’d be a Horseshoe Guy and Ballard would have paid what Tenn paid and proudly said “we pay our own.” 54-60-1 

This 1000X. Absolutely hit the bullseye here!

[NFLfan]

1 minute ago, ShuteAt168 said:

Holder says the Colts viewed Sneed as very good but not great, so here we are again: Other teams are dumb for paying market value and Chris sub .500 Ballard knows best. If CB had drafted Sneed, he’d be a Horseshoe Guy and Ballard would have paid what Tenn paid and proudly said “we pay our own.” 54-60-1 

 

Don't forget that Ballard was from the Chiefs. He may know people there that influenced his decision.

[BProland85]

1 hour ago, Dingus McGirt said:

We can blame the Colt's GM if we want...but, what if he didn't WANT to come here?

Again that would reflect on Ballard if there was a culture issue with the Colts but I have heard nothing to support there is a problem there, especially with Steichen as HC. And why would someone choose the Titans over the Colts? Titans are a worse team with a worse QB. 

[BProland85]

My only reasoning as to why he went for so cheap compensation is that KC was scared of his medicals with his knees and simply wanted to part with him. Why else would KC deal him away for 0 return in 2024 when they are trying for a 3peat?

[Yoshinator]

Just now, BProland85 said:

My only reasoning as to why he went for so cheap compensation is that KC was scared of his medicals with his knees and simply wanted to part with him. Why else would KC deal him away for 0 return in 2024 when they are trying for a 3peat?

They can't pay the contract. Though I'm sure the injury concerns were part of it. They are also paying Chris Jones and Marquise Brown.

[Zoltan]

52 minutes ago, Yoshinator said:

We don't know this though. AR may be worse than Minshew win-wise. So may Flacco. We may not get 9 wins with either of them without upgrading the team. That is an assumption. AR is still a raw rookie by all accounts, and Flacco was on a much better Browns team last year and is a year older now. 

 

Yes, we have the draft. So does every other team though. We also only have a middle-of-the-road pick and only 7 picks as of now. Ballard is a solid drafter, but we have no significant advantage right now except maybe position need fits the draft. Our division is better. The AFC is the tougher conference. We did nothing to get better as of now. 

 

37 minutes ago, Yoshinator said:

We won 9 games with Gardner Minshew at QB. That's not an assumption, that's a fact. Assuming we will be better with Richardson is an assumption as of now until proven otherwise.

 

Its funny that you are talking about assumptions because you are assuming we will be worse next year. Yes AR may be worse than Minshew although from what we saw last year I doubt it, and yes we may win less but we also may win more than last year and we could even make the super bowl. We just don't know because it hasn't happened, so at this point its just point of view. Heck I mean I could see AR winning MVP next year, because the voters tend to like to vote for dual threat QBs that have a strong arm. It's all just guessing right now.

[Lifetime Colt]

7 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Drafting rookies does not immediately improve the team. Adding more rookies to unproven guys will eventually have Ballard fired after the season.

Good thing the Texans don't follow your rules for team building in last years draft. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

7 minutes ago, ShuteAt168 said:

Holder says the Colts viewed Sneed as very good but not great, so here we are again: Other teams are dumb for paying market value and Chris sub .500 Ballard knows best. If CB had drafted Sneed, he’d be a Horseshoe Guy and Ballard would have paid what Tenn paid and proudly said “we pay our own.” 54-60-1 

Holder doesn’t get it. Why not go get another option for less money thst st least gives insurance and upgrades the roster.

[richard pallo]

Just now, BProland85 said:

My only reasoning as to why he went for so cheap compensation is that KC was scared of his medicals with his knees and simply wanted to part with him. Why else would KC deal him away for 0 return in 2024 when they are trying for a 3peat?

My guess so they can use the 20m cap space he was using up to add a player they could really use to help them 3peat.

[BProland85]

1 minute ago, Yoshinator said:

They can't pay the contract. Though I'm sure the injury concerns were part of it. They are also paying Chris Jones and Marquise Brown.

Mahomes restructured to where they could. 

[ColtStrong2013]

6 minutes ago, BProland85 said:

Again that would reflect on Ballard if there was a culture issue with the Colts but I have heard nothing to support there is a problem there, especially with Steichen as HC. And why would someone choose the Titans over the Colts? Titans are a worse team with a worse QB. 

because Nashville > Indianapolis…

[Jason_]

24 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

I don’t even care about the rest this year. I have no unrest in watching rookies struggle again because the second year guys get injured or don’t take a leap. 

 

[jvan1973]

3 minutes ago, Yoshinator said:

They can't pay the contract. Though I'm sure the injury concerns were part of it. They are also paying Chris Jones and Marquise Brown.

They are paying brown 7 million

[NFLfan]

2 minutes ago, Zoltan said:

 

 

Its funny that you are talking about assumptions because you are assuming we will be worse next year. Yes AR may be worse than Minshew although from what we saw last year I doubt it, and yes we may win less but we also may win more than last year and we could even make the super bowl. We just don't know because it hasn't happened, so at this point its just point of view. Heck I mean I could see AR winning MVP next year, because the voters tend to like to vote for dual threat QBs that have a strong arm. It's all just guessing right now.

 

I would trade my best skill player for AR. I like everything about him. (I said skill player because I want to keep Darrisaw and O'Neill, my two tackles.)

[ColtStrong2013]

12 minutes ago, ShuteAt168 said:

Holder says the Colts viewed Sneed as very good but not great, so here we are again: Other teams are dumb for paying market value and Chris sub .500 Ballard knows best. If CB had drafted Sneed, he’d be a Horseshoe Guy and Ballard would have paid what Tenn paid and proudly said “we pay our own.” 54-60-1 

[Yoshinator]

1 minute ago, Zoltan said:

 

 

Its funny that you are talking about assumptions because you are assuming we will be worse next year. Yes AR may be worse than Minshew although from what we saw last year I doubt it, and yes we may win less but we also may win more than last year and we could even make the super bowl. We just don't know because it hasn't happened, so at this point its just point of view. Heck I mean I could see AR winning MVP next year, because the voters tend to like to vote for dual threat QBs that have a strong arm. It's all just guessing right now.

I'm saying the only fact we know is that we won 9 games last year with Minshew as the starting QB (Richardson technically was credited with 2 wins, but he didn't finish the games). Anything with AR is assumption right now. Again, it doesn't help when you don't improve the team and just throw Richardson in there with a bad secondary. 

 

The odds of making the SB are very low. You have to look at possibility Vs probability. It's possible we make the SB or win it. It's also possible I can hit a jackpot on a slot machine. The probability is very low, and that probability stays low when we don't trade for guys like Sneed when getting the chance to do so. Realistically, we are probably the 8th-10th best team in the AFC. Right on the outside of playoff contention. Probably the 2nd-3rd best team in the division. That's not good enough. It's an insult to AR that Ballard says he's the best player in the draft last year, and won't build an elite team around him. Get Sneed, and maybe AR won't have to score 30 points a game to win.

[richard pallo]

It’s the weekend and that means any moves of any consequence won’t happen until Monday at the earliest.  Unfortunately that’s the plain truth for the Colts.