Venturi tells the truth

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

13 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

They would have had more chances for explosive plays, but I don't buy the hypothetical that they are definitely a  much better offense with AR this year. Have to get to the RZ for RZ % to matter first of all.

 

And even with that RZ %, they hardly scored more points with AR on the field per drive. The difference was like .1 points/drive...and that's with Gay sucking and missing 7 FGs.

 

AR's EPA/play of .057 is certainly better, but not that much higher than Minshew (.022). Success rate is identical too.  

 

Those differences are not enough to make it obvious that the offense would have been far better with AR than Minshew, especially as they began to actually play good defenses and there was more tape of AR.

 

For reference, AR played the #13, #14 (for 1.5 quarters), #20 and #28 (for 1.5 quarters) defenses.

 

Minshew also played the #13 and #14 teams...and played 7 games against defenses better than any AR faced (including the #1, #2, #5, #7, #8, #9). 

 

I think it's presumptive to assume that AR would wouldn't have struggled against better defenses. Yes, he can throw downfield, but so could Wentz. And most of the big pass plays we saw were in one half of that LAR game when they were trying to make a comeback. The sample size is just really small. 

 

Teams adjust to tape and find weaknesses, especially with rookie QBs. Minshew has his own weaknesses too, but he also has experience and familiarity. Ultimately, I don't think we see an appreciably better offense with AR than Minshew this season.

 

But it doesn't matter because AR didn't even last 4 games. That's another reason why I think Minshew should get more credit...availability. Some teams were on their 3rd and 4th QBs, but the was out there every Sunday. And yet, he's criticized from weirdos like Zack Hicks. 

 

 

Colts have no issue getting to the red zone with AR. Seems like some on here are trying hard to discredit how Richardson looked.

[shasta519]

1 hour ago, chad72 said:

 

This is also why I am not ruling out a good pass rusher at No.15 if we get our hands on one that is rated Top 10 that drops slightly. 

 

Verse looks legit. Drafting an FSU ER gives me bad flashbacks, but at least this one won't run a 4.8 40. 

[stitches]

19 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Seems like the top of the draft will skew toward offensive players this year.

Yeah... a lot of QBs(3-4), WRs(3-4?), TE, OT(2-3?) might go before our pick... I kind of wish one of the top receivers to be there for us to have a chance to pick him. 

[harrisoncolts88]

2 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

I think the only way to do it would be to let some of the free agents walk, make a couple splashing signings...and just hope you can replace your outgoing FAs with draft picks on the cheap

Yea. I mean we could probably get really crazy with ideas to get a lot of folks that people may want. But you would have to pay the piper (in this case, lose some talent, to get the talent). I honestly believe you can have weapons to use:
You got 15th picks. You can probably get another first by trade Pittman after franchise tag. And you could get another first round by trading this years second and next years second. I think we may actually be in the spot that Washington was that year they did it. So if you want to think about it, we could have potentially (if you have a trade partner), the 15th, the 18th, and 26th pick. And still have next years first to dangle in a trade. Gotta love the armchair GM decisions,

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

7 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

There's some hindsight with Stroud now. But there also was a path.

 

The Colts held the #4 pick in the draft. CHI had the #1 pick and was open for business. Moving from #4 to #1 is not that crazy of a leap.

 

And IF the Colts wanted Stroud, they could have become a pretty attractive trade partner for CHI, as they wouldn't have had to move all the way to #9 (however, it has worked out in their favor).

 

But it would still would have been a huge deal...unlike anything we have seen Ballard do. 

 

The move he should have made was trading up and drafting Jordan Love back in 2020...right, @stitches? It's been a long time, but vindication is finally ours!

Colts could have had the first pick if they wanted. Bur giving up that much to move up a few spots was too much. Plus it seems they wanted Richardson and would of taken him at one too.

 

We have a good QB. We should not be looking at hindsight. Colts are going to be just fine. I hate he got injured and this even had to be a topic for discussion. 

[shasta519]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Colts have no issue getting to the red zone with AR.

 

Ok. Then how come they didn't score so many more points with AR than Minshew? Serious question.

 

If they have no issue getting to the RZ with AR and then they can convert at a ridiculously high rate, it stands to reason that they would be scoring a lot more points per drive. Hell, they probably should have been scoring every drive. But that didn't happen in the very small sample size we have. And I think we are getting ahead of ourselves assuming these things.

[shasta519]

4 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Colts could have had the first pick if they wanted. Bur giving up that much to move up a few spots was too much. Plus it seems they wanted Richardson and would of taken him at one too.

 

We have a good QB. We should not be looking at hindsight. Colts are going to be just fine. I hate he got injured and this even had to be a topic for discussion. 

 

If they would have taken AR at #1, then they would have moved up to #3 to make sure ARI didn't trade him to somebody else during the draft. I think they were content with AR and Levis (depending on what happened).

 

Because that's how Ballard rolls. He wasn't going to trade up for a QB. 

[Superman]

1 hour ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

JMV on the radio a few minutes ago trashing colts for not taking stroud. I am getting really sick of his angry middle aged angry takes.

 

What will it take for you to stop listening?

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

4 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Ok. Then how come they didn't score so many more points with AR than Minshew? Serious question.

 

If they have no issue getting to the RZ with AR and then they can convert at a ridiculously high rate, it stands to reason that they would be scoring a lot more points per drive. Hell, they probably should have been scoring every drive. But that didn't happen in the very small sample size we have. And I think we are getting ahead of ourselves assuming these things.

Thdy settled for FG with Minshew. Once we got to the red zone it was over. We couldn’t score TD. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Just now, Superman said:

 

What will it take for you to stop listening?

I should. lol. Lately  I have just been listening  to the media segments on the podcast.

[KB]

13 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Ok. Then how come they didn't score so many more points with AR than Minshew? Serious question.

 

If they have no issue getting to the RZ with AR and then they can convert at a ridiculously high rate, it stands to reason that they would be scoring a lot more points per drive. Hell, they probably should have been scoring every drive. But that didn't happen in the very small sample size we have. And I think we are getting ahead of ourselves assuming these things.

He had a much easier time scoring against Houston than Minshew did. Our number of explosive plays went down after Minshew became the starter. Do you think Minshew could of brought us back in the game against the Rams? I highly doubt it. 

 

With this logic it never made sense for the Colts and Patriots to have a kicker or a punter. The two greatest QBs of all time and both of them needed Adam V to score points when they pushed it down the field.

 

What does it matter if fans get ahead of themselves thinking someone is an answer at QB or any position. If someone wants to say they believe in Richardson then good for them. It hold zero weight when it actually comes to what happens with the team. Right, wrong, apathetic, or overly caring it makes no difference.

 

Unless we're gonna go out and try and get another QB to compete for a starting apot, then it's fine for people to believe in AR, and think he is good at passing the ball. He actually is.

[VikingsFanInChennai]

4 hours ago, Goatface Killah said:

I agreed we need more pressure. I never said we didnt. 

 

This all started as a response to moose who claimed our pass rush was awful. It isnt. The sack production proves that. If our pressure rate matched pur sack output, we would be undeniably elite. 

 

We are somewhere between those 2 extremes. 

Sack production only proves that they were good at getting to the QB, which may not be replicated year after year. Especially, when you extrapolate that to remain constant and pressure rate to improve around that next year to be elite, it doesn't always work out that way. Especially with the defense, that doesn't do a lot of disguise or stunt and rely on the front defensive linemen to get to the QB.

 

I'm actually impressed with the amount of sacks, turnovers, TDs this defense got this year all of which aren't gonna be attainable next year without some improvement. That kind of production may point to the talent, and when you have that, you need your DC to get more creative to help the talent achieve more results. Easier (said than done) way to do so is to get more ways to pressure the QB. 

[husker61]

1 hour ago, GoColts8818 said:

 They could 100% use that superstar like Freeney or Mathis was but other than QB that’s probably the hardest thing to find in football.  

 
both of them were great pass rushers, but were terrible against the run. How many times did they get pushed upfield by the tackle with one hand because they went for the outside speed rush and then the tackle was free to take out a lb for big runs. That used to drive me crazy. Probably one of the reasons the colts didn’t win more super bowls with manning. 

[Solid84]

7 minutes ago, KB said:

What does it matter if fans get ahead of themselves thinking someone is an answer at QB or any position. If someone wants to say they believe in Richardson then good for them. It hold zero weight when it actually comes to what happens with the team. Right, wrong, apathetic, or overly caring it makes no difference.

 

Unless we're gonna go out and try and get another QB to compete for a starting apot, then it's fine for people to believe in AR, and think he is good at passing the ball. He actually is.

Ballard himself said we shouldn't go and stamp him yet - don't crown him. It's not fair to AR to expect all these things of him when he hasn't proven anything yet and when he still has far to go.

 

It matters because you know how this will turn out if AR has a bad stretch of games next season. These people will lynch him for not being the GOAT they themselves made him out to be...

 

It's fine to be hopeful, but Chloe is stating her hopes for AR as facts. There's not support for her claims.

[VikingsFanInChennai]

40 minutes ago, harrisoncolts88 said:

You got 15th picks. You can probably get another first by trade Pittman after franchise tag. And you could get another first round by trading this years second and next years second. I think we may actually be in the spot that Washington was that year they did it. So if you want to think about it, we could have potentially (if you have a trade partner), the 15th, the 18th, and 26th pick. And still have next years first to dangle in a trade. Gotta love the armchair GM decisions,

Lol, if only first round picks are easily pluckable like that 

[cdgacoltsfan]

43 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Colts have no issue getting to the red zone with AR. Seems like some on here are trying hard to discredit how Richardson looked.

Let the naysayers have their moment...the same ones had the Colts winning 2 or 3 games. They are clueless.

[Superman]

26 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Ok. Then how come they didn't score so many more points with AR than Minshew? Serious question.

 

If they have no issue getting to the RZ with AR and then they can convert at a ridiculously high rate, it stands to reason that they would be scoring a lot more points per drive. Hell, they probably should have been scoring every drive. But that didn't happen in the very small sample size we have. And I think we are getting ahead of ourselves assuming these things.

 

There's a lot more variance with Richardson than with Minshew, and that's good and bad. But what it really boils down to is that he's a rookie with so little experience, and we only scratched the surface with him. You're right, there's a lot of premature extrapolating and assuming based on the little bit of him that we saw, but what's very obvious is that he can do things that Minshew could never dream of doing.

 

I'm not one who's saying the offense definitely would have been better with Richardson, but I do think the potential was there. Whereas with Minshew, we know what he can and can't do, and we probably just saw the ceiling of what the offense can do with him.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

7 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

Ballard himself said we shouldn't go and stamp him yet - don't crown him. It's not fair to AR to expect all these things of him when he hasn't proven anything yet and when he still has far to go.

 

It matters because you know how this will turn out if AR has a bad stretch of games next season. These people will lynch him for not being the GOAT they themselves made him out to be...

 

It's fine to be hopeful, but Chloe is stating her hopes for AR as facts. There's not support for her claims.

You think Texans fans were saying that before the season. It’s not over the top at all. We drafted him at 4. We should have high expectations. Also it’s not like he sucked when he played. Most fans including me was kind of shocked how he looked with so little college games.

[shasta519]

2 minutes ago, KB said:

He had a much easier time scoring against Houston than Minshew did. Our number of explosive plays went down after Minshew became the starter. Do you think Minshew could of brought us back in the game against the Rams? I highly doubt it. 

 

With this logic it never made sense for the Colts and Patriots to have a kicker or a punter. The two greatest QBs of all time and both of them needed Adam V to score points when they pushed it down the field.

 

What does it matter if fans get ahead of themselves thinking someone is an answer at QB or any position. If someone wants to say they believe in Richardson then good for them. It hold zero weight when it actually comes to what happens with the team. Right, wrong, apathetic, or overly caring it makes no difference.

 

Unless we're gonna go out and try and get another QB to compete for a starting apot, then it's fine for people to believe in AR, and think he is good at passing the ball. He actually is.

 

No, AR did not have an "easier time" scoring in the HOU game. Minshew had a higher EPA/play in that game. After two TDs (one on a short field) and then two 3-and-outs, Minshew took over and went TD (76 yds), TD (75 yds), FG (56 yds).

 

Maybe they aren't down 23-0 against the LAR if Minshew was playing. Doesn't matter anyway because they lost that game. 

 

Not sure why were are talking about kick, but I only mentioned it because it's not Minshew's fault that his K missed 7 FGs.

 

I have no issue with people believing in AR going forward or that he will be great. I just disagree with these presumptive statements that the Colts would have been so much better THIS year with AR vs. Minshew. We don't know that at all. We will get to find out, but we don't know right now. And really, I think Minshew has been torn down a bit to lift up AR, despite AR only playing 15% of the snaps this year. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Just now, shasta519 said:

 

No, AR did not have an "easier time" scoring in the HOU game. Minshew had a higher EPA/play in that game. After two TDs (one on a short field) and then two 3-and-outs, Minshew took over and went TD (76 yds), TD (75 yds), FG (56 yds).

 

Maybe they aren't down 23-0 against the LAR if Minshew was playing. Doesn't matter anyway because they lost that game. 

 

Not sure why were are talking about kick, but I only mentioned it because it's not Minshew's fault that his K missed 7 FGs.

 

I have no issue with people believing in AR going forward or that he will be great. I just disagree with these presumptive statements that the Colts would have been so much better THIS year with AR vs. Minshew. We don't know that at all. We will get to find out, but we don't know right now. And really, I think Minshew has been torn down a bit to lift up AR, despite AR only playing 15% of the snaps this year. 

We were up 14-0 when Richardson left with a concussion. The two drives we scored on were very easy. 

[KB]

3 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

Ballard himself said we shouldn't go and stamp him yet - don't crown him. It's not fair to AR to expect all these things of him when he hasn't proven anything yet and when he still has far to go.

 

It matters because you know how this will turn out if AR has a bad stretch of games next season. These people will lynch him for not being the GOAT they themselves made him out to be...

 

It's fine to be hopeful, but Chloe is stating her hopes for AR as facts. There's not support for her claims.

I get where it's not fair, but that's the life of a highly drafted QB. Yes if he has a stretch of bad games next year and looks like he has regressed the fans are gonna start a lynch mob. That's gonna happen weather we crown him or not. 

 

As far as fans go, we can crown him or hate him. It makes zero difference. It only sets us up for disappointment or that begrudged feeling people get when they were wrong but so sure they had it right. It really dosnt matter. If someone wants to crown him as better than Tom Brady, we'll good for them. Has zero sway on what happens in colts headquarters. If Chloe states something as facts, she is well within her rights.

 

As far as the team, no Ballard isn't going to come out and say we have the next GOAT when he had alot to learn coming into the season. He did say that we have more flexibility with the cap having our QB on a rookie deal. So while he isn't saying AR is the next best thing, he is saying we have our guy and are going to build around him. If we're building around him, that really says everything we need to know.

[Solid84]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

You think Texans fans were saying that before the season. It’s not over the top at all. We drafted him at 4. We should have high expectations. Also it’s not like he sucked when he played. Most fans including me was kind of shocked how he looked with so little college games.

I think Stroud was MUCH more ready for the NFL than AR was or is.

 

I thought he looked good too, better than I expected, but I also realise he still has a lot to learn and now others team have NFL level tape on him.

[harrisoncolts88]

7 minutes ago, VikingsFanInChennai said:

Lol, if only first round picks are easily pluckable like that 

Lol, yea I was just giving examples of first round picks acquisitions that have happened that were almost similar. Ala, AJ Brown (franchised tag) traded for a 1st and 4th. And then Washington trading pick #46 and next year 2nd for the 26th pick. May not be easier as each year is different, but possible as it's been done recently

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Just now, Solid84 said:

I think Stroud was MUCH more ready for the NFL than AR was or is.

 

I thought he looked good too, better than I expected, but I also realise he still has a lot to learn and now others team have NFL level tape on him.

Again we drafted him at 4. Then add how good he looked. Yes I have high expectations for next year. He sat and was able to learn the game which is only going to help him too. 

[KB]

3 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

No, AR did not have an "easier time" scoring in the HOU game. Minshew had a higher EPA/play in that game. After two TDs (one on a short field) and then two 3-and-outs, Minshew took over and went TD (76 yds), TD (75 yds), FG (56 yds).

 

Maybe they aren't down 23-0 against the LAR if Minshew was playing. Doesn't matter anyway because they lost that game. 

 

Not sure why were are talking about kick, but I only mentioned it because it's not Minshew's fault that his K missed 7 FGs.

 

I have no issue with people believing in AR going forward or that he will be great. I just disagree with these presumptive statements that the Colts would have been so much better THIS year with AR vs. Minshew. We don't know that at all. We will get to find out, but we don't know right now. And really, I think Minshew has been torn down a bit to lift up AR, despite AR only playing 15% of the snaps this year. 

I mention kicks from the statement of why didn't they score all the time. Even the greatest ever didn't score all the time. Unless there is a turnover or a TD, drives end with kicks usually. If your consistently scoring, you don't need a punter or kicker, except to kick off.

[Solid84]

5 minutes ago, KB said:

I get where it's not fair, but that's the life of a highly drafted QB. Yes if he has a stretch of bad games next year and looks like he has regressed the fans are gonna start a lynch mob. That's gonna happen weather we crown him or not. 

 

As far as fans go, we can crown him or hate him. It makes zero difference. It only sets us up for disappointment or that begrudged feeling people get when they were wrong but so sure they had it right. It really dosnt matter. If someone wants to crown him as better than Tom Brady, we'll good for them. Has zero sway on what happens in colts headquarters. If Chloe states something as facts, she is well within her rights.

 

As far as the team, no Ballard isn't going to come out and say we have the next GOAT when he had alot to learn coming into the season. He did say that we have more flexibility with the cap having our QB on a rookie deal. So while he isn't saying AR is the next best thing, he is saying we have our guy and are going to build around him. If we're building around him, that really says everything we need to know.

I'm just trying to temper expectations man. You know there will be comparisons to Stroud next season. If people realized AR is less ready than Stroud and has a ways to go it would save us all from SO much whining....

 

Also I don't think Ballard believes anything for certain yet. All they are doing is what any capable GM would - build around the guy they hope is the future. If Ballard left AR on an island now that would show us absolutely nothing about what AR potentially can do and what he can become. That would just set him up to fail. The offense needs to be as good as Ballard can realistically make it, so we know we're evaluating AR and not a deficient offense.

[shasta519]

4 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

There's a lot more variance with Richardson than with Minshew, and that's good and bad. But what it really boils down to is that he's a rookie with so little experience, and we only scratched the surface with him. You're right, there's a lot of premature extrapolating and assuming based on the little bit of him that we saw, but what's very obvious is that he can do things that Minshew could never dream of doing.

 

I'm not one who's saying the offense definitely would have been better with Richardson, but I do think the potential was there. Whereas with Minshew, we know what he can and can't do, and we probably just saw the ceiling of what the offense can do with him.

 

Agree. The potential and ceiling were there for this year...and will be next year as well. So we will get to find out. I just think fans have a tendency to get hung up on traits (or lack thereof) or certain highlights and make presumptions.

 

It's obviously not a totally similar comp, but does remind me a bit of the Rivers vs. Wentz conversations from a couple years ago. Wentz had clear superior athletic traits, but a ton of variance, where as Rivers was limited, but much more experienced and knew how to run an offense within those limitations.

 

Minshew isn't Rivers on any level, but it's also fair to say that AR hasn't shown the level that Wentz did at one time. So I just think Minshew deserves more credit for handling that schedule and the offense as he did. And I don't think we can assume AR would have done the same with how good DCs can be.  

[shasta519]

15 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

We were up 14-0 when Richardson left with a concussion. The two drives we scored on were very easy. 

 

They were up 14-7 when AR left with the game.

 

One of those two TDs was a short field (HOU's 15 yard line) after a sack fumble. Then there were two 3-and-outs.  

[NewColtsFan]

11 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

I think Stroud was MUCH more ready for the NFL than AR was or is.

 

I thought he looked good too, better than I expected, but I also realise he still has a lot to learn and now others team have NFL level tape on him.

I think we should all get prepared for the probability that Stroud is much better than even his biggest supporters thought he’d be.   He might just be great.  Honestly. 
 

Stroud just carved up a great Cleveland defense and made them look like nothing.  
 

Meanwhile, Richardson, who I love, has a lot to learn these next two years.  All the things he was supposed to learn this year, he still has to get those snaps.  He still is terribly inexperienced.   

[shasta519]

15 minutes ago, KB said:

I mention kicks from the statement of why didn't they score all the time. Even the greatest ever didn't score all the time. Unless there is a turnover or a TD, drives end with kicks usually. If your consistently scoring, you don't need a punter or kicker, except to kick off.

 

True, but Gay missed one FG when AR was playing. He missed 7 with Minshew. I think they both have could use that as a reason. Hopefully, Gay is much better next year.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

8 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

I'm just trying to temper expectations man. You know there will be comparisons to Stroud next season. If people realized AR is less ready than Stroud and has a ways to go it would save us all from SO much whining....

 

Also I don't think Ballard believes anything for certain yet. All they are doing is what any capable GM would - build around the guy they hope is the future. If Ballard left AR on an island now that would show us absolutely nothing about what AR potentially can do and what he can become. That would just set him up to fail. The offense needs to be as good as Ballard can realistically make it, so we know we're evaluating AR and not a deficient offense.

Stroud and AR are different QB. They are going to win in different ways. No one should be comparing them.  I will say yes there is a chance Texans will be ahead of colts in building because they got their rookie QB the entire year. We will see if that ends up true. I don’t think Richardson will struggle but it might take some games for him to reach his ceiling.

 

The fact Richardson got injured saying stroud was automatically going to be ahead of Richardson can’t be proven. 

[KB]

2 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

True, but Gay missed one FG when AR was playing. He missed 7 with Minshew. I think they both have could use that as a reason. Hopefully, Gay is much better next year.

Yeah hopefully that was just the hip injury, but he hasn't been the model of consistency since coming into the league. Seems to kick well when his backs against the wall, then relaxes and waivers.

[NewColtsFan]

10 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Stroud and AR are different QB. They are going to win in different ways. No one should be comparing them.  I will say yes there is a chance Texans will be ahead of colts in building because they got their rookie QB the entire year. We will see if that ends up true. I don’t think Richardson will struggle but it might take some games for him to reach his ceiling.

 

The fact Richardson got injured saying stroud was automatically going to be ahead of Richardson can’t be proven. 

Im sorry, but…

Quarterbacks don’t reach their ceiling in a number of games.   Quarterbacks reach their ceiling over a number of years.   No position is more dependent on experience than quarterback. Experience is everything to a quarterback. 

[Superman]

3 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Agree. The potential and ceiling were there for this year...and will be next year as well. So we will get to find out. I just think fans have a tendency to get hung up on traits (or lack thereof) or certain highlights and make presumptions.

 

It's obviously not a totally similar comp, but does remind me a bit of the Rivers vs. Wentz conversations from a couple years ago. Wentz had clear superior athletic traits, but a ton of variance, where as Rivers was limited, but much more experienced and knew how to run an offense within those limitations.

 

Minshew isn't Rivers on any level, but it's also fair to say that AR hasn't shown the level that Wentz did at one time. So I just think Minshew deserves more credit for handling that schedule and the offense as he did. And I don't think we can assume AR would have done the same with how good DCs can be.  

 

I get what you're saying about Rivers/Wentz, but there are so many other variables at play (age, athleticism, decision making, etc., with both sets of QBs) that I don't think it's a great comparison. It's true that Rivers was far more steady, while Wentz had greater variance. But Rivers' level of steady QB play also came with production and efficiency.

 

I've tried to be really careful about the way I talk about Minshew's play this season. I appreciate him showing up and doing his job every week, he has a great personality, etc. He kept the offense alive for almost the entire season, in a year where we saw a lot of offenses die due to bad QB play. It gets a lot worse than Minshew, and it's a good thing we had him, IMO.

 

That said, Minshew threw for about 200 yards/game, 62% completions, 15 passing TDs, 9 INTs, 6.7 YPA, passer rating 84.6. This is pedestrian, at best, in terms of production and efficiency. (We could go further if we want to discuss his play vs pressure, or his downfield numbers, or how little he offered out of structure.) Sometimes the conversation drifts into the extremes, but for the most part, I think we have a good understanding of what Minshew is, and he gets the appropriate amount of credit.

 

With Richardson, I think it's just a projection. We got proof of concept in a small sample size, and there are still questions that haven't been answered, but to me, the big one was 'can he operate and perform in the NFL,' and I think I can check that one off.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

4 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Im sorry, but…

Quarterbacks don’t reach their ceiling in a number of games.   Quarterbacks reach their ceiling over a number of years.   No position is more dependent on experience than quarterback. Experience is everything to a quarterback. 

You know what I meant.

[shasta519]

11 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Stroud and AR are different QB. They are going to win in different ways. No one should be comparing them.  I will say yes there is a chance Texans will be ahead of colts in building because they got their rookie QB the entire year. We will see if that ends up true. I don’t think Richardson will struggle but it might take some games for him to reach his ceiling.

 

The fact Richardson got injured saying stroud was automatically going to be ahead of Richardson can’t be proven. 

 

Of course they are going to be compared. They were taken two spots apart in the same draft to two teams in the same division. The only people who think Stroud hasn't proven to be better thus far are Colts fans. But it defies logic and what we have seen. 

 

If the players were reversed, and the Colts were about to play next weekend with Stroud, you wouldn't be saying what you said.

 

But nothing is written in stone. AR will have time to prove he is better...if he is.

[NewColtsFan]

7 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

You know what I meant.

Honestly no.   I’m not trying to yank your chain.   But you seem to recognize the point, so we can move on.  

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

What’s funny is Richardson was said to have poor accuracy. In the small sample size he was right about where Minshew was. It can get better but he clearly would of gotten even better there had he played more.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

17 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Of course they are going to be compared. They were taken two spots apart in the same draft to two teams in the same division. The only people who think Stroud hasn't proven to be better thus far are Colts fans. But it defies logic and what we have seen. 

 

If the players were reversed, and the Colts were about to play next weekend with Stroud, you wouldn't be saying what you said.

 

But nothing is written in stone. AR will have time to prove he is better...if he is.

You can’t box score and just look at stat lines. Thats what I meant. Because they win in different ways. 

[Superman]

3 hours ago, chad72 said:

 

Minshew started like a tease, the good, the bad and the ugly showed up early on, then more good than bad and ugly showing up as the season went on and he knew how to put the team in good spots to win. That roller coaster is probably what people held on to but you could definitely tell his turnovers and decisions got better as the season went on. One just had to temper expectations like not expecting Minshew to hit someone in stride all the time for YAC, not expecting Minshew to read blitzes like the best of them etc. and once the expectations were re-aligned, he exceeded those backup QB expectations considerably.

 

Certain limitations were amplified and kept showing up, so like I said, revised expectations would have kept folks happier overall w.r.t Minshew, IMO.

 

Even good QBs go through stretches where they turn the ball over at a high rate. 

 

I think it was after the Browns game, someone asked what should we do if Minshew keeps turning the ball over multiple times per game, and my response was 'grin and bear it.' And that was because it was easily his most productive game of the season to that point, and against a good defense. (Look at some of the Browns defensive splits, they were MUCH better at home than on the road this year.)

 

My point is I think we can find a way to work around and eventually mitigate the turnovers. But if you can't move the ball at all, there's probably no fix for that. Watch the Jets try to move the ball with Zach Wilson, it's horrendous. I'd rather have 450 yards of offense and four turnovers, than 170 yards of offense and six points. You have to have some production at some point.