Should we try to swing a trade with Dallas?

[rock8591]

Morris Claiborne sucks, the trade would be heavily in Dallas's favor if they agree to it.

[braveheartcolt]

...

Just, no.

This discussion is over. You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

Typical 'John Waylon'. You must agree with all I say, or your opinion is worthless. Although your discussion over comment is correct. Bye.

[John Waylon]

Typical 'John Waylon'. You must agree with all I say, or your opinion is worthless. Although your discussion over comment is correct. Bye.

You have no idea how well he played last season (spoiler alert: he put up double digit sacks) and you claim that of he DID look good it was because he's in buffalo.

I didn't have to invalidate your opinion. You did it yourself by talking about something you knew NOTHING about.

A simple google search would have sufficed.

[braveheartcolt]

You have no idea how well he played last season (spoiler alert: he put up double digit sacks) and you claim that of he DID look good it was because he's in buffalo.

I didn't have to invalidate your opinion. You did it yourself by talking about something you knew NOTHING about.

A simple google search would have sufficed.

Stats? Get a grip. I don't know any fan who rates players on just stats. And seriously, if you are going to post on forums like this, try and differentiate between the heart felt opinions (my dislike of Jerry Hughes as a Colts player), and the light hearted ones (not hard standing out if you play for Buffalo).

[SteelCityColt]

Ah, the blame everyone else routine. Not only was he pretty ineffective when he got on the field, he was a flag waiting to happen as well.

 

 

Right.

And now, for your next trick, explain why he played so well in buffalo last season.

 

You can't really argue that he was at the least one of the must frustrating players to wear the Shoe, the only debate is to as why he was so poor for us. What I find telling is not one but two regimes here couldn't get any consistent production out of him even after shifting back to a D that should have better suited his play. His parting shot comments also spoke to me of a very fractured relationship with the team/FO which might explain things partly. 

 

Add into this as well in the only year we play 3-4 with him on the team he's STILL behind Freeney on the depth chart and I'd say our D-Line wasn't exactly the best at this point and again I don't think we've got a recipe for success. Compare to the Bills, and despite BHC's tongue in cheek (I assume it was!) put down they weren't exactly the worst D in the league by any stretch. Solid against the run, decent secondary, I'm far from surprised that he performed much better. 

 

Long and short of it, I think he was misused here and wasn't part of a very good D overall but a lot of issues seem to have stemmed from his own attitude. 

[SteelCityColt]

You have no idea how well he played last season (spoiler alert: he put up double digit sacks) and you claim that of he DID look good it was because he's in buffalo.

I didn't have to invalidate your opinion. You did it yourself by talking about something you knew NOTHING about.

A simple google search would have sufficed.

 

Simply saying "he put up double digit sacks" and saying this is a yard stick of having a great seasons is not entirely true. I'm not suggesting this was the case for the Bills but for example if they had put up 100+ team sacks that suddenly doesn't look so impressive. Point being one stat taken without any context doesn't tell enough of the story. 

 

I don't think anyone can argue that he performed better for the Bills, but this shouldn't excuse his poor showing for us. You previous posts infer you think that we would have got the same sort of production of him hence it was a bad trade but really I could at most of seen him making 4 maybe 5 sacks for us. He'd have still sat behind Matthis given how our D was set up, and clearly there were personality clashes with the FO/Coaches. Sometimes it's best for both player and team if they move on. 

[Chucklez]

you trust Claiborne more then toler? atleast when healthy toler can play. claiborne hasnt proven he can play at all

My thoughts exactly.... Claiborne has been a total bust and there has been nothing to suggest that he will suddenly turn the switch on either. I would rather stick with the guy I know than an unknown and risky entity...

[Jason_]

Simply saying "he put up double digit sacks" and saying this is a yard stick of having a great seasons is not entirely true. I'm not suggesting this was the case for the Bills but for example if they had put up 100+ team sacks that suddenly doesn't look so impressive. Point being one stat taken without any context doesn't tell enough of the story. 

 

I don't think anyone can argue that he performed better for the Bills, but this shouldn't excuse his poor showing for us. You previous posts infer you think that we would have got the same sort of production of him hence it was a bad trade but really I could at most of seen him making 4 maybe 5 sacks for us. He'd have still sat behind Matthis given how our D was set up, and clearly there were personality clashes with the FO/Coaches. Sometimes it's best for both player and team if they move on. 

 

 

That's what I've been thinking as well.  People like to rip Grigson for that trade because of how well Hughes played in Buffalo, but it doesn't seem like people are taking into consideration that perhaps performance had nothing to do with the reason they traded Hughes away and that perhaps it was his attitude or lack of passion that they look for in players.  Grigson has said a number of times that it's not just about talent but about their personality and the chemistry they'll have in the locker room.  

[BrentMc11]

I am shocked by the anti-Harvey   on here.  I guess nobody cares about special teams or only watches a game or two a year.  Besides Sergio, he was the best on ST the last 3 years (until injury)  THAT is why he has made the team, and will be the advantage he does have this year.  It WILL be tough to make this club for both Mario and Studebaker.

[Carl Dzienkiewicz]

rather trade sheppard for draft choice

[YOUR GM]

Simply saying "he put up double digit sacks" and saying this is a yard stick of having a great seasons is not entirely true. I'm not suggesting this was the case for the Bills but for example if they had put up 100+ team sacks that suddenly doesn't look so impressive. Point being one stat taken without any context doesn't tell enough of the story. 

 

I don't think anyone can argue that he performed better for the Bills, but this shouldn't excuse his poor showing for us. You previous posts infer you think that we would have got the same sort of production of him hence it was a bad trade but really I could at most of seen him making 4 maybe 5 sacks for us. He'd have still sat behind Matthis given how our D was set up, and clearly there were personality clashes with the FO/Coaches. Sometimes it's best for both player and team if they move on. 

 

I think we could have got more out of Hughes than we ever will from Werner, in terms of pass rushing ability. The trade was pointless. Created a void and didn't adequately fill it, OR get a decent return on the player we traded him for. Sheppard likely won't even be on the roster by this time next year  

[SteelCityColt]

I think we could have got more out of Hughes than we ever will from Werner, in terms of pass rushing ability. The trade was pointless. Created a void and didn't adequately fill it, OR get a decent return on the player we traded him for. Sheppard likely won't even be on the roster by this time next year  

 

Ahh unfortunately now we're into crystal ball territory but I can't really disagree with you aside from I don't think for whatever reason we would have got the best from Hughes here. As you say though if we'd got a decent player in return, even a productive player even then this trade doesn't look nearly as bad regardless of what Hughes has done. 

[GoColts8818]

I am sure if Grigson feels like he can gain something he will try it.  He has proven he isn't exactly shy to explore trades.

 

With that said I've felt for a while that as much as the forum dislikes Toler he likes Toler and isn't looking to part with him/look for an upgrade for him. 

 

If we ship them a linebacker I am guessing we would get some kind of draft pick back for it. 

[GoColts8818]

I think we could have got more out of Hughes than we ever will from Werner, in terms of pass rushing ability. The trade was pointless. Created a void and didn't adequately fill it, OR get a decent return on the player we traded him for. Sheppard likely won't even be on the roster by this time next year  

I am going to say first in fairness to you I don't know where you stood on Hughes before the trade so what I am going to say might not apply to you but people as a whole here have really flipped their opinion on Hughes since he got to Buffalo. 

 

The vast majority of this forum spent their time bashing Jerry Hughes including calling for him to be flat out released the past two years in training camp and then we move him and the forum celebrates him leaving and then it turns out the guy doesn't stink as much as the forum thought he did and then they bash the GM for moving the guy when in reality the forum has spent years calling for the guy to be dumped.  Tim Jennings is another good example of this where the forum couldn't stand a guy till he got to another team and then try to act like our GM was a fool for letting him go. 

[rabidfan77]

Shoot, I say trade for Sean Lee. Dude is injury prone, he'd fit right in here in Indianapolis. We love us some injury riddled people. 15+ on IR last season? Man that's nothing. We're going for 25 this season!!!

You better be knocking on wood when you posted that ...because your getting blamed if it happens

[rabidfan77]

As one of the few defenders of Jerry Hughes during his career with the Colts (I thought he became a convenient whipping boy for frustrated fans here) I looked up his stats for last year and found this.

 

"His 10 sacks represent the most obvious statistic, but according to Pro Football Focus he also had nine quarterback hits and 39 quarterback hurries on the season. With just over 300 pass rush snaps on the season Hughes ranked number one in the NFL in PFF’s Pass Rush Productivity metric with a rating of 15.4."

 

He was only used on passing downs playing about 55% of the snaps.  Sounds like Verner to me.  So yeah, I'd say Grigs might be regretting that trade. 

First off the 2013 Bills Def Line was way better than Indy's its like comparing apples to oranges. So in Indy our front 7 consisted of Mathis, Redding, RJF, Franklin, Walden, Warner, Freeman, Chapman, and a trio of back up players at the other inside linebacker postion. Whereas the Bills front 7 consisted of Mario Williams, Kyle Williams, Marcell Dareus, Alan Branch, Manny Lawson, Arthur Moats, and Kiko Alonso (Hughs was a rotational player on passing downs within the Bills front 7). So for Indy we can safely say these following players along the front 7 have proven to be productive starters in the NFL- Mathis, Freeman, Redding, and RJF (I'm on the fence about him because he's not consistent enough). But for the Bills- Mario and Kyle Williams (both pro-bowlers), Marcell Dareus (pro-bowler), Manny Lawson, Kiko Alonso (pro-bowl potential talent), Alan Branch (although his best days are behind him he still is productive in the trenches). Now keep in mind hughs was a situational player, with a talent front 7 around him he was able to be productive in an aggressive def; I think that's great for hughs and your right he didn't get close to a fair shot in Indy from the FO, coaches, or fans. But he played in a defensive system that allowed him to make plays because the guys in the trenches were eating up blockers, that type of solid def line play is something that Indy has been searching for since 2005 ( the 2006 SB season the run defense was horrible during the reg season so the playoff run that Indy's def had was magical, but it doesn't really count ). My point is the Bills are a much better situation for hughs, Indy is starting to make solid progress towards rebuilding the def front 7 with quality starters and depth this year.