the top 100

[Dustin]

Arizona's pass rush was not good...You're not serious

and I know you'll get to Peterson's kick return prowess....and how Sherman was burned by Roddy White.

You cant be the No.1 guy in the NFL when you call a guy out and get smoked by the guy you called out.

Explain.

Please. He got burned deep once by one of the top receiver s in the league so he's a chump?

In that game he was thrown at 6 times with only 1 completion. That completion was the TD where the safety didn't play his assignment correctly.

As for Arizona's pass rush, no it's not good. But it's better than Seattle's.

[Dustin]

The stats you're ignoring are from 2011 and 2010.

The 2012 stats you're ignoring are 355 carries for 1400+ yards. If you think just anyone can carry the rock like that just because they have a good line, then I think you're kidding yourself. It's not easy to be The Man and deliver year after year...

What did he do in 2012, the year IM talking about? He was bad in 2012. He was top 3 in 2011 and 2010.

What did he do good in 2012 that's not a volume stat?

[oldunclemark]

Well....   he was rehabbing 6 weeks ago and Tampa traded two draft picks -- including a 1st round pick -- for Revis....

 

Now, he's closer to being healthy than he was then....

He's still rehabbing...and Tampa didnt trade any proven starters did they?  For a pro Bowler

 

But the issue is Patrtick Peterson, who every player in the NFL apparently feels will have a better 2013 than iRchard Sherman.

 

I guess they arent afraid of him..

[Dustin]

and that's probably the first anyone's heard that Toler is better than Patrick Peterson.

Breaking news

He wasn't. Toler didn't play enough to say he was better than Peterson, but when he did play he was better in coverage.

[oldunclemark]

Please. He got burned deep once by one of the top receiver s in the league so he's a chump?

In that game he was thrown at 6 times with only 1 completion. That completion was the TD where the safety didn't play his assignment correctly.

As for Arizona's pass rush, no it's not good. But it's better than Seattle's.

Dustin it was 20-0 at the half...Whute caught 5 passes..come on now...

 

He said he'd shut out Roddy White, right?

 

Did he?

[Gavin]

4.1 YPC is mediocre. Combine that with his terrible ability as a 3rd down back and he was bad.

Mediocre as a runner+bad as a receiver+bad as a blocker= terrible.

Ill take 4.1 ypc carry any day of the week........Marcus Allens career average ypc

[Dustin]

Dustin it was 20-0 at the half...Whute caught 5 passes..come on now...

He said he'd shut out Roddy White, right?

Did he?

He was thrown at 6 times and allowed 1 completion all game. Take that for what you will.

[Dustin]

Ill take 4.1 ypc carry any day of the week........Marcus Allens career average ypc

I don't think you're understanding me. 4.1 YPC behind a good O-line, is not good. It's average.

If you think that's great then we'll just agree to disagree.

[Dustin]

ITT: Me vs. the World.

[oldunclemark]

He wasn't. Toler didn't play enough to say he was better than Peterson, but when he did play he was better in coverage.

 

I hope you're right cause Toler's in Indy.......but they didnt resign him.....so they might disgaree with you

 

Sherman is a legend in his own mind

 

Peterson..meanwhile..firmly a Top-50 player in the NFL..in the minds of NFL players/...

[That Guy]

So did Adrian Peterson, CJ Spiller,.

This point is moot. Ballard ran against 8 men in the box far more times than Foster did.

Ballard faced more stacked boxes than Foster? That statement is doubtful, at best. Do you have any stats to back that one up?

I think Bethea took up residence in the box in both of our games against Houston!

[Dustin]

I hope you're right cause Toler's in Indy.......but they didnt resign him.....so they might disgaree with you

Sherman is a legend in his own mind

Peterson..meanwhile..firmly a Top-50 player in the NFL..in the minds of NFL players/...

That list is a joke. Only something like 20%~ of players voted for it.

[oldunclemark]

He was thrown at 6 times and allowed 1 completion all game. Take that for what you will.

The stats dont lie..5 catches and a TD ...a play where he clearly wasnt thrown at because Sherman wasn't there.

 

You cant call a guy out and get burned with your season on the line

[Dustin]

Ballard faced more stacked boxes than Foster? That statement is doubtful, at best. Do you have any stats to back that one up?

I think Bethea took up residence in the box in both of our games against Houston!

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/05/08/facing-eight-in-the-box/

[Dustin]

The stats dont lie..5 catches and a TD ...a play where he clearly wasnt thrown at because Sherman wasn't there.

You cant call a guy out and get burned with your season on the line

Ok. Except that he allowed only 1 catch all game. On a play where there was supposed to be safety help over the top.

[NewColtsFan]

What did he do in 2012, the year IM talking about? He was bad in 2012. He was top 3 in 2011 and 2010.

What did he do good in 2012 that's not a volume stat?

 

 

Why is it so hard for you to say..... "He's not great.  I think he's over rated.   He's good but not great"....

 

As opposed to jumping all the way to 'terrible'....

 

I simply don't get it....

[oldunclemark]

That list is a joke. Only something like 20%~ of players voted for it.

Its not a joke to Roddy White..but the rest of us wont know because again..its a projection of 2013..not a reflection.

 

I know you know that targeting numbers are faulty..What was Richard doing while Atlanta rolled to a 20-0 lead and Matt Ryan was 24 of 35...?

 

Those who voted dont agree with Richard that he's the best defensive player in the NFL...

Maybe he'll prove it in 2013..   maybe the 20% included Peterson's status as one of the NFL"s top punt returners..??.

..

but Sherman's 0-1 record agianst Atlanta might have had something to do with it...

 

..

[Dustin]

Why is it so hard for you to say..... "he's not great. I think he's over rated. He's good but not great"....

As opposed to jumping all the way to 'terrible'....

I simply don't get it....

So he was mediocre as a runner, bad as a receiver, and bad as a pass blocker.

I'm not sure why terrible is such a stretch. It's not even like he got any YAC or forced miss tackles. He'd run through the hole and then immediately get tackled.

[Vance]

Yep, he definitely shreds us. But he was extremely inefficient last season. Please point out in my post where I was wrong.

 

Our run blocking sucked last year.

 

I believe you and I have already been over this whole 'Arian Foster sucks' thing. I think you admitted you were being extreme.

[NewColtsFan]

So he was mediocre as a runner, bad as a receiver, and bad as a pass blocker.

I'm not sure why terrible is such a stretch. It's not even like he got any YAC or forced miss tackles. He'd run through the hole and then immediately get tackled.

 

 

Somehow I suspect Houston does not share your view of Foster....

[Dustin]

Somehow I suspect Houston does not share your view of Foster....

I think I'll manage.

[Gavin]

I don't think you're understanding me. 4.1 YPC behind a good O-line, is not good. It's average.

If you think that's great then we'll just agree to disagree.

Great? No, Ideally I want something in the 4.3-4.5 range but Ill take 4.1

[Dustin]

Our run blocking sucked last year.

I believe you and I have already been over this whole 'Arian Foster sucks' thing. I think you admitted you were being extreme.

It was average at best. A guy that's apparently a top 5 RB should have a higher YPC than that. Buffalo's run blocking was on par with yours and Spiller averaged 6.0 YPC.

[Dustin]

Great? No, Ideally I want something in the 4.3-4.5 range but Ill take 4.1

Not from a "top 5" running back I wouldn't.

[That Guy]

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/05/08/facing-eight-in-the-box/

Did you read where it mentions "next we'll look at how offensive personnel impacts this?" All this stat tells me is that we ran more running plays with two tight ends. I can't remember Houston using two tight ends very often. Eight in the box to account for our nine is not considered stacking the box.

Vance, do you have a rough idea of how often Houston had in two tight ends?

[Gavin]

Not from a "top 5" running back I wouldn't.

I think your using 1 seasons worth of carries to say he is not a top 5 Back when to determine his place among the current Backs in the league you have to take into account skill set and production a sa whole based on skill set(He was also undrafted by the way but that dont really apply), He has a 4.5 ypc career average and 44 td's on 1010 attempts plus 167 receptions for 1531 yards and 6 td'sthrough 4 years

[oldunclemark]

Ok. Except that he allowed only 1 catch all game. On a play where there was supposed to be safety help over the top.

In his chance to prove his status as the self-proclaimed best defensive back in the NFL....Richard Sherman got beat for a first half score and blamed the safety?   Why would the best in the NFL need safety help to handle a guy he feel is mediocre?

 

 

He actually seems to claim that it was unfair that Atlanta suckered him...Gotta love this guy..He doenst care who won....he just a

wants to

excuse getting toasted.......what a titan of trash talk

 

Richard Sherman calls Roddy White “an easy matchup”

Posted by Michael David Smith on February 14, 2013, 6:13 PM EDT

 

 

Seahawks cornerback Richard Sherman and Falcons receiver Roddy White locked horns when their teams met in the playoffs. Sherman says that was an easy day for him.

“He’s an easy matchup. He’ll be another easy matchup next year,” Sherman said of White on NFL Live. “This is just fact.”

 

Although White caught five passes for 76 yards and a touchdown as the Falcons beat the Seahawks, Sherman said only one of those catches came while he was covering White, and that even to get that one ball to White the Falcons had to disguise what they were doing, because they knew they couldn’t just put White out there for Sherman to cover him man-to-man.

 

Richard Sherman calls Roddy White “an easy matchup”

Posted by Michael David Smith on February 14, 2013, 6:13 PM EDT

AP

Seahawks cornerback Richard Sherman and Falcons receiver Roddy White locked horns when their teams met in the playoffs. Sherman says that was an easy day for him.

“He’s an easy matchup. He’ll be another easy matchup next year,” Sherman said of White on NFL Live. “This is just fact.”

Although White caught five passes for 76 yards and a touchdown as the Falcons beat the Seahawks, Sherman said only one of those catches came while he was covering White, and that even to get that one ball to White the Falcons had to disguise what they were doing, because they knew they couldn’t just put White out there for Sherman to cover him man-to-man.

“You saw the game — he caught one pass on me the whole game,’ Sherman said. “It’s probably a lifetime achievement for him, so congratulations. It’s a rarity. It’ll rarely ever happen. I think we play them again next year. It won’t happen again. They have to hide him in the formation. They have to bring him down. He can’t just stand out there and play receiver. They have to hide him and do everything to get him open.”

[Dustin]

I think your using 1 seasons worth of carries to say he is not a top 5 Back when to determine his place among the current Backs in the league you have to take into account skill set and production a sa whole based on skill set(He was also undrafted by the way but that dont really apply), He has a 4.5 ypc career average and 44 td's on 1010 attempts plus 167 receptions for 1531 yards and 6 td'sthrough 4 years

Im talking about 2012 only. I don't know how many times I have to say this.

[oldunclemark]

^{....and I forgot..the self-proclaimed best in the NFL  fell flat on his face......in his playoff debut}

 

 

^{AP (Jan. 12, 2003) "With the Falcons already leading 13-0 in the second quarter, White may have settled their argument. The 31-year-old receiver blew by Sherman on a deep route. As Matt Ryan flung a deep ball toward White, Sherman lost his footing in pursuit and fell to the turf. White caught the ball for a 47-yard touchdown. Not only did the score stake the Falcons to a 20-0 lead but it may have momentarily quieted Sherman."}

[That Guy]

Im talking about 2012 only. I don't know how many times I have to say this.

I think your using 1 seasons worth of carries to say he is not a top 5 Back when to determine his place among the current Backs in the league you have to take into account skill set and production a sa whole based on skill set(He was also undrafted by the way but that dont really apply), He has a 4.5 ypc career average and 44 td's on 1010 attempts plus 167 receptions for 1531 yards and 6 td'sthrough 4 years

I agree with Dustin it might be better to judge RBs based on recent production (one year or two). With the nature of the position (how easily RBs can rise or fall), anything more than two years back is ancient history.

[Vance]

It was average at best. A guy that's apparently a top 5 RB should have a higher YPC than that. Buffalo's run blocking was on par with yours and Spiller averaged 6.0 YPC.

 

It is known that Buffalo utilizes the spread offense and that Spiller was vastly underused in 2012 with Chan Gailey electing to pass more often than not, this gave Spiller a propensity to gain a higher YPC due to their inclination to throw. The Texans are arguably a run-first team that uses it to set up the pass. It's completely reverse.

 

And it's funny that you say he is a terrible pass blocker and catcher. I think he is excellent in these categories. I have never seen him get blown up trying to block someone, and I've rarely seen him drop a pass. His catching ability is well known so it's interesting to hear you say he's awful at it.

[Dustin]

Did you read where it mentions "next we'll look at how offensive personnel impacts this?" All this stat tells me is that we ran more running plays with two tight ends. I can't remember Houston using two tight ends very often. Eight in the box to account for our nine is not considered stacking the box.

Vance, do you have a rough idea of how often Houston had in two tight ends?

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/05/09/facing-eight-in-the-box-with-two-or-more-wideouts/

Vs 2 wideouts. Foster was 3rd, ballard was 4th. A negligible difference.

[That Guy]

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/05/09/facing-eight-in-the-box-with-two-or-more-wideouts/

Vs 2 wideouts. Foster was 3rd, ballard was 4th. A negligible difference.

But it still reverses their positions.

[Dustin]

It is known that Buffalo utilizes the spread offense and that Spiller was vastly underused in 2012 with Chan Gailey electing to pass more often than not, this gave Spiller a propensity to gain a higher YPC due to their inclination to throw. The Texans are arguably a run-first team that uses it to set up the pass. It's completely reverse.

And it's funny that you say he is a terrible pass blocker and catcher. I think he is excellent in these categories. I have never seen him get blown up trying to block someone, and I've rarely seen him drop a pass. His catching ability is well known so it's interesting to hear you say he's awful at it.

He was 46th in YPRR and had 5 drops. Averaged 5.4 YPR.

[Dustin]

But it still reverses their positions.

Not sure what you mean.

[Dustin]

^{....and I forgot..the self-proclaimed best in the NFL fell flat on his face......in his playoff debut}

^{AP (Jan. 12, 2003) "With the Falcons already leading 13-0 in the second quarter, White may have settled their argument. The 31-year-old receiver blew by Sherman on a deep route. As Matt Ryan flung a deep ball toward White, Sherman lost his footing in pursuit and fell to the turf. White caught the ball for a 47-yard touchdown. Not only did the score stake the Falcons to a 20-0 lead but it may have momentarily quieted Sherman."}

Ok you're right, Patrick Peterson is better than All-Pro Richard Sherman. You've bested me.

[Gavin]

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/05/09/facing-eight-in-the-box-with-two-or-more-wideouts/

Vs 2 wideouts. Foster was 3rd, ballard was 4th. A negligible difference.

He faced 8 in the box or more 42 times last year out of 351 carries thats 12.5 percent and 8 more times the 2nd guy on that list Alfred Morris thats some serious respect for what he and the O Line can do

[Dustin]

He faced 8 in the box or more 42 times last year out of 351 carries thats 12.5 percent and 8 more times the 2nd guy on that list Alfred Morris thats some serious respect for what he and the O Line can do

No Foster faced 8 in the box 84 times or 23.4%. Barely above league average.

[Gavin]

No Foster faced 8 in the box 84 times or 23.4%. Barely above league average.

Where do ya see that? That a premium stat? I hate how some sites (and apparently  PFF is no different) try to make you pay to see more in depth analysis

[Dustin]

Where do ya see that? That a premium stat? I hate how some sites (and apparently PFF is no different) try to make you pay to see more in depth analysis

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/05/08/facing-eight-in-the-box/