Gavins Pre season+Pre Training Camp Grades

[BrentMc11]

No need to apologize.....    that kind of thing happens every day here.....    no biggie at all....    

I usually read at least most of the posts so I do not say the same thing.....try to be at least original

[jvan1973]

So giving my opinion on what a player needs to work on based on what those sites I just listed say and point out is degrading? I do hope those players are not as sensitive as you, Ill try harder.......Justice Cunningham is going to go down as the greatest TE that ever lived, He is just so fast, he can catch, the dude is a beast!........Ready? Here is another one.........Dante Hughes was just so fast on the field he made so many pass deflections and plays on the ball, the dude was a real ballhawk he is just so!!.....unemployed...and probably contemplating retiring early

there was a thread posted about a week into free agency about the worst free agent signings ever in Indy. you listed three players the colts had picked up a week earlier. so don't say all you do is point out what a player needs work on, because that is false

[ColtsBlueFL]

isnt like a draft where you get 3 starters like an amazing draft? why is this not flashy if we do get 3 starters? cause they fat (lol) ?

 

seriously, does anyone know like the percentage of starters  a team gets by draft? or what is considered a good draft and an excelent one?

 

honestly, from what i've seen the past 5 years, it seems 3 starters means one heck of a draft.

 

At first glance, I was about to nod my head, quie tly agree and move on.  But then I thought, great question!  Then I thought, what type of team and holes does it take for a draft to net 3 starters?  If your team was really solid everywhere there were no stars lined up, how many should crack the starting lineup?  So if we get 3 more, then I think that after free agency qe still had holes.  I look forward to the times where I can only picture our round one guy squeeking into the startng linrup, and the others working their way in over a few seasons af work and advancement.

[southwest1]

correct, thats a no, Scouts Inc, NFL.com and ESPN have no idea what it takes to scout players and neither do any of there former scouts or GM's or former players that work for them I cant believe they would collabarate to even dare put out a video NO MATTER the location displaying a players strengths and or weaknesses, As much time as I have wasted trying to get it through to you that all tape is not the same or video (however you want to phrase it it makes no difference) but what to look for is the same I'm gonna cut this short because I dont feel like arguing a point with you on a beautiful sunny day while you can just contact Scouts Inc, ESPN, NFL.com and all the former players, scouts and GM's that work for it and tell them that they are completely wrong and that they dont know what they are doing or what they should look for and save me in particular the trouble of these pointless back and forths like we are having now

Okay, if NFL.com, ESPN, & Scouts INC. have no idea what they are doing evaluation wise, what reputable source would you recommend for reliable draft analysis Gavin? I'm not critiquing you. I'm just asking for a website or additional resource that you trust that's all. I always though Charlie Casserly was a decent GM for the Redskins & Texans actually. JMO.

[southwest1]

Look, I'm no scout guru not by a longshot & nobody has to give me any information they don't want to. After all, intuition is a part of the evaluation process, but I am willing to listen & learn. My biggest asset is I know what my weaknesses are & when to shut & learn from people who know what they are truly talking about. Or at least people patient enough to put up with my questions anyway.    My point is: I never wanna back anybody into a corner, but I am willing to learn new skills of evaluation though. 

 

You don't have to reply Gavin. I'm cool with it either way...

[ColtsBlueFL]

you're right im sure GM' use YouTube for scouting players. the entire scouting department is sitting in a dark room with the warm glow of their monitors watching YouTube

 

Well, you never know for certain.  I also would not have thought Neal Schon would find Journey's replacement vocalist on Youtube either. Yet back somewhere around 2007...

 

http://www.wired.com/underwire/2007/12/journeys-replac/

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/journey-finds-new-singer-the-old-fashioned-way-on-the-internet-20071205

[Gavin]

there was a thread posted about a week into free agency about the worst free agent signings ever in Indy. you listed three players the colts had picked up a week earlier. so don't say all you do is point out what a player needs work on, because that is false

I'd have to see the context of the post and thread

[Gavin]

Okay, if NFL.com, ESPN, & Scouts INC. have no idea what they are doing evaluation wise, what reputable source would you recommend for reliable draft analysis Gavin? I'm not critiquing you. I'm just asking for a website or additional resource that you trust that's all. I always though Charlie Casserly was a decent GM for the Redskins & Texans actually. JMO.

The highlighted part in question was made out of sarcasm....My fault, sometimes I forget....alot....that words on a screen dont do well with conveying emotion

[BrentMc11]

Well, you never know for certain.  I also would not have thought Neal Schon would find Journey's replacement vocalist on Youtube either. Yet back somewhere around 2007...

 

http://www.wired.com/underwire/2007/12/journeys-replac/

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/journey-finds-new-singer-the-old-fashioned-way-on-the-internet-20071205

A mean guitar as well......Journey/Foreigner.....great concert in 1981.....just sayin

[Mameluc]

At first glance, I was about to nod my head, quie tly agree and move on.  But then I thought, great question!  Then I thought, what type of team and holes does it take for a draft to net 3 starters?  If your team was really solid everywhere there were no stars lined up, how many should crack the starting lineup?  So if we get 3 more, then I think that after free agency qe still had holes.  I look forward to the times where I can only picture our round one guy squeeking into the startng linrup, and the others working their way in over a few seasons af work and advancement.

sure, obviously you want your team so talented that rookies dont have to be pivotals...but i dont mean first year i mean down the road...year 3, if you got 3 starters from that draft that is a great draft imo.

 

take a look at the 49ers draft, i dont think they will start any of those guys...but down the road carradine, reid and pottentially if healthy the RB (forgot the name) will be starters IMO...even Lemonier has a chance.

[jvan1973]

Well, you never know for certain. I also would not have thought Neal Schon would find Journey's replacement vocalist on Youtube either. Yet back somewhere around 2007...

http://www.wired.com/underwire/2007/12/journeys-replac/

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/journey-finds-new-singer-the-old-fashioned-way-on-the-internet-20071205

and Justin Bieber was discovered via YouTube. but being born with talent and scouting professional athletes aren't the same

[BrentMc11]

and Justin Bieber was discovered via YouTube. but being born with talent and scouting professional athletes aren't the same

I kind of compare it to scouting 5th grade kids for college basketball...How in the h***(ck)  

[cbear]

 

1.Bjoern Werner-LOLB/DE.......A- 92%.......He plays the run well, keeping eyes on the ball most of the time, is strong at the point of attack, Tackles well.....Questions about flexibility and motor sometimes runs cold if he is not directly involved in the action, Needs to develop his pass rush rep, Was the highest rated pass rusher left on the board and the 4th highest overall all player left on the board at our selection...The others being Cordarelle Patterson 90.6....John Cyprien 90.6......Arthur Brown 90.3......Larry Warford 90.3.....All of which will be very good or great players in the league for years to come But we already have two quality starting ILB's in Angerer and Freeman and there is not point in drafting a Jerrell Freeman type linebacker that Brown is when you already have Freeman on the roster (In terms of drag down tackling technique). As for Cyprien, great player for years to come I believe but we had just signed Landry and Bethea has one more year in his deal and the off year he had last year was largely overblown....He was the only secondary player that showed up most of the season up till late

3.Hugh Thornton-G-A bit of a mauler, strong, can get to the second level quickly, good at cut blocks, Bends at the waist to often and lunges, Hand placement is suspect at times and stops churning his feet to often......My Grade B- 82%........There was 67 other players after him with a better draft grade (2 Guards, Barrett Jones-71.1...Questions whether or not he would fit our scheme, General consensus on the board was no and.....Earl Watford 68.1....Same as Jones in terms of scheme fit questions also not as technically sound

4.Khaled Homes-C-Agile, quick O Lineman who is very good at making O Line calls, always pointing out the blitz or otherwise making adjustments, Lacks alot of strength and can play to high at times but he is very quick off the snap , My Grade 79% C+.......18 players after him had better draft grades

5.Montori Hughes, strong athletic player that can play both the NT and DE positions, Has a good motor.....Inconsistent with hand placement and activity and does not always get them straightened out to jolt his man backwards....strength needs to be built and questions about his stamina...Looks to be a fine rotational NT/DE who wont wow anyone but provides depth with some potential moving forward:My Grade C.....74%.......28 players with a higher draft grades after him

6.John Boyett-Has quite a bit of experience at playing single high Safety which our defense did quite a bit of last year, Not afraid to hit someone and out his body on the line, can come up and play the run if asked, Tenacious attitude plus good hands for the interception, History of of injury concerns including operations on both knees, goes for the big hit to often and does not wrap up as much as I would like.......My Grade: C....75%....12 Players with a better draft grades after him

7.Kerwynn Williams,-Blazing speed Back, Not afraid to run between the Tackles, secure ball handler, reliable pass catcher, Quick twitch, agile rb that has the ability to make quick and sharp cuts, Inconsistennt pass blocking skills, Taken down by a defender to easily on the 1st hit, However will make a very good change of pace Back......C+ 77%....14 players after him had better draft grades

 

7.(Comp pick)Justice Cunningham-Big tall TE. with some athleticism who can catch and get open as well as block well but not overly fast and needs to work on route running C- 70%

 

 

 

Grading Scale I used: 

 

 

Letter Grade Percentage 

Points 

A+ 100 – 97 

A 96.9 – 93 

A- 92.9 – 90 

B+ 89.9 – 87 

B 86.9 – 83 

B- 82.9 – 80 

C+ 79.9 – 77 

C 76.9 – 73 

C- 72.9 – 70 

D+ 69.9 – 67 

D 66.9 – 63 

D- 62.9 – 60 

F Below 60

 

Overall Grade: C+

 

 

Not a flashy draft I think most of us would agree but we added some solid competition with 3-4 potential starters in the future

 

 

 

Thoughts?

 

 

Gavin, when you say draft grade and how many players had better grades then the person we picked, these are your grades, or are you getting them from somewhere else and just commenting on them?  Either way, nice info.

[John Dee]

Actually there is a cut of NFL games that gets around to EVERYONE....     called the coaches tape.

 

Jaws, Mayock, Cosell, Landry, Kiper, McShay, and all of them have it....

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-films-presents/09000d5d824778ce/The-secrets-of-coaching-tape

 

At 1:25 JAWS nails it....      "ALL players on the field are visible at the snap".. 

 

You Tube vids are "highlights" ..     

[TKnight24]

Actually there is a cut of NFL games that gets around to EVERYONE.... called the coaches tape.

Jaws, Mayock, Cosell, Landry, Kiper, McShay, and all of them have it....

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-films-presents/09000d5d824778ce/The-secrets-of-coaching-tape

At 1:25 JAWS nails it.... "ALL players on the field are visible at the snap"..

You Tube vids are "highlights" ..

Not all YouTube vids are highlight vids. Some show the player vs a team and every snap they took. Like typing in K Will on YouTube (our drafted RB) they have his vids against teams. I prefer those over highlights cause you see what the player does better

[funktacious2]

Good info. I especially like the "x# of players graded higher after the pick" part. Doesn`t that show Grigson picked more on need than Best Player Available? Or was that BPA at that particular position?

It could just be that Grigs, Pags, and our scouts gave these guys higher grades, though I've little doubt need played a bit into it. We didn't draft a single position that didn't need more help/depth.

[Gavin]

Actually there is a cut of NFL games that gets around to EVERYONE....     called the coaches tape.

 

Jaws, Mayock, Cosell, Landry, Kiper, McShay, and all of them have it....

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-films-presents/09000d5d824778ce/The-secrets-of-coaching-tape

 

At 1:25 JAWS nails it....      "ALL players on the field are visible at the snap".. 

 

You Tube vids are "highlights" ..     

And thats NFL All 22 film your talking about and thats available to the public as well, I watch that but the discussion or debate had to do with college players

[ColtsBlueFL]

and Justin Bieber was discovered via YouTube. but being born with talent and scouting professional athletes aren't the same

 

Nobody said NFL scouts would only use it over all else.  And I just said you don't know for certain if at some point whether they do or do not. And we still don't know all of the technology they do and do not use.  People scouting talent in any area can use any technology they feel is worthwhile.  And we would be none the wiser.

[HtownColt]

I compare Werner to Shea Mcclellin, Werner is way stronger at the point of attack though

[John Dee]

What I meant was that the college teams do the same...  only they are not run by one single entity as the NFL is.      Each individual Conf or even U's determine film rights and such.       Harder to get for obvious reasons.

 

Normally U's simply share...   I don't know how it works today but I do know we won't find Alabama's CT on U Tube.

 

The NFL is a single business entity.      Each major college football program is it's own.

 

And thats NFL All 22 film your talking about and thats available to the public as well, I watch that but the discussion or debate had to do with college players