Minshew Week 13 Analysis

[RollerColt]

 

Enjoy!

[Solid84]

It hurts seeing how open Pierce was on that 3rd play he showed - the 3rd  to Pittman. He could just have run it himself too.

 

The 4th play is just a full on display of Minshew Magic. I mean, Granson got it, but that was just too much drama.

 

Minshew makes some good throws as well - the TD to Pierce and the snag to Pittman.

 

O'Sullivan hits on something I've been thinking about for a while with our team and it probably relates to Pierce. I starts at 15:30 in the video. There's just a lack of speed. I know Pierce has tested well at the combine for top speed with a 4.41 40-yard dash, but his 10-yard split was 1.58. I can't find the split results for the 2022 combine, but if we took Pierce' 10-yard split into the 2023 combine he'd rank bottom 5. He's not explosive. He doesn't get off the line fast enough. That could also be where his trouble with separation comes from?

 

Love JT O'Sullivan's breakdowns.

 

Also, the comment on Pierce' TD celebration: "Can't quite make the jump... or the landing..." 

[John Hammonds]

Love JT O'Sullivan's videos.

 

And he highlighted what we've come to know.  Playing Minshew is like using Ron Weasley's broken wand.  Sometimes it works great.  Sometimes it blows back in your face spectacularly.

 

Minshew is the best backup QB in the league.  But he shouldn't be your starter.

[richard pallo]

1 hour ago, Solid84 said:

It hurts seeing how open Pierce was on that 3rd play he showed - the 3rd  to Pittman. He could just have run it himself too.

 

The 4th play is just a full on display of Minshew Magic. I mean, Granson got it, but that was just too much drama.

 

Minshew makes some good throws as well - the TD to Pierce and the snag to Pittman.

 

O'Sullivan hits on something I've been thinking about for a while with our team and it probably relates to Pierce. I starts at 15:30 in the video. There's just a lack of speed. I know Pierce has tested well at the combine for top speed with a 4.41 40-yard dash, but his 10-yard split was 1.58. I can't find the split results for the 2022 combine, but if we took Pierce' 10-yard split into the 2023 combine he'd rank bottom 5. He's not explosive. He doesn't get off the line fast enough. That could also be where his trouble with separation comes from?

 

Love JT O'Sullivan's breakdowns.

 

Also, the comment on Pierce' TD celebration: "Can't quite make the jump... or the landing..." 

I don’t think Pierce has problems with separation.  Everything I read states he is good at getting separation.  Very good in fact.  He is not getting thrown to.  Minchew is quick to throw over the middle or the sideline.  Maybe by design?  I don’t know.  I hope we go to him more now.

 

[chad72]

I love when he says "would you throw that slant in anticipation, I know a guy in South Florida (meaning AR) that would throw it". 

[jvan1973]

3 minutes ago, chad72 said:

I love when he says "would you throw that slant in anticipation, I know a guy in South Florida (meaning AR) that would throw it". 

Is AR rehabbing in South Florida?

[chad72]

4 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

Is AR rehabbing in South Florida?

 

I don't know. But he refers to Tua a lot in his RPO references, maybe he was referring to Tua?? Not sure.

 

But I have seen AR throw those slants in anticipation down the middle to Downs and Ogletree in the limited time that I can bet AR makes those throws too in anticipation. It was one of the things that surprised me for a rookie, such throwing down the middle in anticipation, not all of them do it easily.

[Smonroe]

3 hours ago, RollerColt said:

 

Enjoy!

 

I think it's fitting that @RollerColt posts a video for our RollerCoaster of a QB, LOL!

 

 

[John Hammonds]

19 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

I don't know. But he refers to Tua a lot in his RPO references, maybe he was referring to Tua?? Not sure.

 

But I have seen AR throw those slants in anticipation down the middle to Downs and Ogletree in the limited time that I can bet AR makes those throws too in anticipation. It was one of the things that surprised me for a rookie, such throwing down the middle in anticipation, not all of them do it easily.

He meant Tua.  He had called the play the "Tua RPO" play.

[chad72]

18 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

He meant Tua.  He had called the play the "Tua RPO" play.

 

No wonder he kept saying "don't crucify me..." because his "Tua love" showed up constantly in a Minshew video  

[Solid84]

1 hour ago, richard pallo said:

I don’t think Pierce has problems with separation.  Everything I read states he is good at getting separation.  Very good in fact.  He is not getting thrown to.  Minchew is quick to throw over the middle or the sideline.  Maybe by design?  I don’t know.  I hope we go to him more now.

 

Do you have a source maybe? I’d be very interested in that. 

He’s good in long sprints like posts and go routes. When he can get to top speed he kills. 

 

Not too long ago a tweet was posted on here with a chart showing Colts WRs separation and Pierce was deadlast with something like 1.1 yards of separation. Less than half of anyone else I believe. I’ll see if I can find it. 

[RollerColt]

His footwork kills me, and I'm glad this video exists to showcase it. A lot of his issues are because of the base. He makes unnecessary movements all over the place, even into check down throws. That said, he's the backup for a reason and he's doing enough to win games. 

 

I do think we'll eventually get caught (probably by the Texans) and really bad Minshew will appear. 

[AustexColt]

Minshew needed the bye week to recharge and chill out. He came back a rejuvenated guy and it shows. I believe Shane knows Minshew very well and is managing him like a virtuoso. His play calling and game plan has kept the opposing DC guessing as to who is going to play a larger role in our offense. Shane also adjusts his plans at halftime which none of our previous coaches or OC did very well. 

[Superman]

5 hours ago, Solid84 said:

O'Sullivan hits on something I've been thinking about for a while with our team and it probably relates to Pierce. I starts at 15:30 in the video. There's just a lack of speed. I know Pierce has tested well at the combine for top speed with a 4.41 40-yard dash, but his 10-yard split was 1.58. I can't find the split results for the 2022 combine, but if we took Pierce' 10-yard split into the 2023 combine he'd rank bottom 5. He's not explosive. He doesn't get off the line fast enough. That could also be where his trouble with separation comes from?

 

I didn't see that as a lack of speed. The corner is playing cushion to begin with, and pretty much bails, so he's in good position. Then Pierce tips the route and doesn't come out of it with any burst. It's more about change of direction, and yeah, that's not exactly his strength. I just thought the route was well covered.

 

Several other times in this game Pierce blew past his defender with a quick double move. In fact the 3rd down play with the corner blitz late in JT's video shows Pierce beating the safety with the same move. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I have been waiting for him to do one on him. From eye test Minshew was much better staying in the pocket and throwing and only had a couple chaotic scrambling moments.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 hours ago, RollerColt said:

His footwork kills me, and I'm glad this video exists to showcase it. A lot of his issues are because of the base. He makes unnecessary movements all over the place, even into check down throws. That said, he's the backup for a reason and he's doing enough to win games. 

 

I do think we'll eventually get caught (probably by the Texans) and really bad Minshew will appear. 

 

4 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

Is AR rehabbing in South Florida?

No he has been on the colts sideline.

[Solid84]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

I didn't see that as a lack of speed. The corner is playing cushion to begin with, and pretty much bails, so he's in good position. Then Pierce tips the route and doesn't come out of it with any burst. It's more about change of direction, and yeah, that's not exactly his strength. I just thought the route was well covered.

 

Several other times in this game Pierce blew past his defender with a quick double move. In fact the 3rd down play with the corner blitz late in JT's video shows Pierce beating the safety with the same move. 

I'm probably reading too much into it. I just remember seeing tweets showing a lack of separation, but I honestly don't remember if it was just one game or for the season at that point.

 

Pierce definitely has ability when he can keep up his momentum. Stop-n-go/change of direction isn't his strength.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Pierce has been open down field all year. Just a matter of taking the shots and getting the right look. He has opened a lot up for Pittman in the middle and has blocked his butt off.

[Superman]

21 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

I'm probably reading too much into it. I just remember seeing tweets showing a lack of separation, but I honestly don't remember if it was just one game or for the season at that point.

 

Pierce definitely has ability when he can keep up his momentum. Stop-n-go/change of direction isn't his strength.

 

Pierce doesn't get great separation against man coverage, unless he's able to burn his man.

 

But I don't know how separation is judged by these different outlets -- if it's max separation during the course of the play, separation when targeted, when the ball is thrown to any target, how it's judged when the receiver beats the primary defender but there's a help defender in good position (like bracketed coverage), etc. I think separation stats are misconstrued because of this ambiguity.

 

These stats are probably also somewhat overrated, given how often defenses play zone coverage. Receivers mostly get open due to speed and scheme, not necessarily route running ability. The play you're talking about is an example of how better route running would have produced better separation, but for every one of those, there's a play where Pierce is running through an open zone in the defense, and doesn't get the ball. 

[Solid84]

2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Pierce doesn't get great separation against man coverage, unless he's able to burn his man.

Yep, he short of needs to keep accelerating right now.

 

Quote

But I don't know how separation is judged by these different outlets -- if it's max separation during the course of the play, separation when targeted, when the ball is thrown to any target, how it's judged when the receiver beats the primary defender but there's a help defender in good position (like bracketed coverage), etc. I think separation stats are misconstrued because of this ambiguity.

That's actually true and I hadn't thought about that.

 

Quote

These stats are probably also somewhat overrated, given how often defenses play zone coverage. Receivers mostly get open due to speed and scheme, not necessarily route running ability. The play you're talking about is an example of how better route running would have produced better separation, but for every one of those, there's a play where Pierce is running through an open zone in the defense, and doesn't get the ball. 

I hope Wayne can get his route running improved. He's a one trick pony until that happens.

 

I do hope we call more plays with him as first read and him just legging it. We need a guy to force the defense to back off of the line.

[Boondoggle]

I love Minshew's compete.  Not gifted as a thrower but there's a lot of dog in him.  Not sure if I'm imagining it but he feels to me like he's getting better.

[RollerColt]

9 hours ago, Boondoggle said:

I love Minshew's compete.  Not gifted as a thrower but there's a lot of dog in him.  Not sure if I'm imagining it but he feels to me like he's getting better.

Not imagining it all. He's getting more comfortable with the offense and when he can stay calm and make his reads he can absolutely shred coverage. When he needs to make a play, he makes a play at those crucial moments. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

10 hours ago, Boondoggle said:

I love Minshew's compete.  Not gifted as a thrower but there's a lot of dog in him.  Not sure if I'm imagining it but he feels to me like he's getting better.

100%. When he makes a mistake he doesn’t let it affect him. He might make some stupid mistakes like Wentz did but the big difference is Wentz would fall apart after a mistake.

[compuls1v3]

On 12/7/2023 at 9:07 AM, chad72 said:

I love when he says "would you throw that slant in anticipation, I know a guy in South Florida (meaning AR) that would throw it". 

yeah that was good