Cba Says Colts Can't Watch Manning Throw

[Fx Stryker]

Can they reasonably determine if PM can make all the NFL throws at NFL velocity and accuracy?

That is there job. I think they know more than Irsay.

[UndecidedFrog]

That is there job. I think they know more than Irsay.

No, I don't think it is the doctors' job to know if Peyton can make all the NFL throws at NFL velocity.

[Fx Stryker]

No, I don't think it is the doctors' job to know if Peyton can make all the NFL throws at NFL velocity.

Is it not the job of team doctors to evaluate players?

[UndecidedFrog]

Is it not the job of team doctors to evaluate players?

It is the job of the team doctors to medically evaluate players.

[Fx Stryker]

It is the job of the team doctors to medically evaluate players.

Who else would Irsay consult?

[UndecidedFrog]

Who else would Irsay consult?

I would rather Irsay consult with the trainers and coaches who would know better how PM was throwing. However, apparently, the CBA rules prohibit that during the off-season.

[Fx Stryker]

I would rather Irsay consult with the trainers and coaches who would know better how PM was throwing. However, apparently, the CBA rules prohibit that during the off-season.

I am aware of that, but these doctors do evaluate every player. We also have new trainers and coaches. So in a way the doctors know more about Peyton then they do.

[UndecidedFrog]

I am aware of that, but these doctors do evaluate every player. We also have new trainers and coaches. So in a way the doctors know more about Peyton then they do.

Somehow I very much doubt that the docs will know more about required NFL velocity and accuracy than the trainers and coaches, no matter how new these trainers and coaches may be to their Colts job.

I have no doubt that the docs know more about Peyton medically. But then, that is not what I am talking about.

[Fx Stryker]

Somehow I very much doubt that the docs will know more about required NFL velocity and accuracy than the trainers and coaches, no matter how new these trainers and coaches may be to their Colts job.

I have no doubt that the docs know more about Peyton medically. But then, that is not what I am talking about.

I don't know how it all works. I would assume for Peyton to pass his physical he has to throw seeing it is his job.

[Peyton and Eli fan]

Somehow I very much doubt that the docs will know more about required NFL velocity and accuracy than the trainers and coaches, no matter how new these trainers and coaches may be to their Colts job.

I have no doubt that the docs know more about Peyton medically. But then, that is not what I am talking about.

Where do trainers fit in? I'd put them with the medical staff rather than the coaching staff.

[UndecidedFrog]

I don't know how it all works. I would assume for Peyton to pass his physical he has to throw seeing it is his job.

Yes, if this were in-season, there would be no problems for the docs, the trainers, the coaches and whoever else wants to within the Colts organization to watch PM throw.

However, this is not in-season, and therefore this CBA prohibition makes it more difficult to come to an informed conclusion about the status of PM's arm.

This may all be moot anyway. Nobody in the Colts organization should care about PM's arm status if Irsay and PM cannot come to an agreement about the contract.

[UndecidedFrog]

Where do trainers fit in? I'd put them with the medical staff rather than the coaching staff.

I don't know. It all depends on how strict you want to interpret the CBA.

From my perspective, the rules in the CBA that prohibit off-season workouts were never intended for a case like this,

In which case, the lawyers will tell me that the intent of the agreement overrules the wording. However, if I were the Colts, I am not sure I want to bring this up for arbitration.

[JCPatriot]

However, if I were the Colts, I am not sure I want to bring this up for arbitration.

....because, I am guessing, it gives them an excuse in the public eye to do what you think that they want to do anyway.

[UndecidedFrog]

....because, I am guessing, it gives them an excuse in the public eye to do what you think that they want to do anyway.

No, there is simply not enough time to get a ruling on the intent of the CBA prohibitions between now and March 8.

[JCPatriot]

No, there is simply not enough time to get a ruling on the intent of the CBA prohibitions between now and March 8.

Ahhhh....that makes sense. I didn't think about that. The legal system is far too sluggish to come to a decision in time.

[subvet]

The majority of the forum says IT IS a done deal, so learn to read. As far as the outside world: they have absolutely no clue what is going on, as is evidenced by the fact that they have been 100% incorrect at every turn during this whole process. What in the world would make you think this assumption from them is correct? Especially when Irsay has said no such thing, Peyton has said no such thing, Condon has said no such thing.

There you go interrupting the flow of a conversation with facts again.

[Fx Stryker]

Yes, if this were in-season, there would be no problems for the docs, the trainers, the coaches and whoever else wants to within the Colts organization to watch PM throw.

However, this is not in-season, and therefore this CBA prohibition makes it more difficult to come to an informed conclusion about the status of PM's arm.

This may all be moot anyway. Nobody in the Colts organization should care about PM's arm status if Irsay and PM cannot come to an agreement about the contract.

They can watch, but ultimately the doctors are the ones to pass him. So the CBA is just prohibiting the trainers, coaches, and whoever else wants to watch that really don't make the decision.

[UndecidedFrog]

They can watch, but ultimately the doctors are the ones to pass him. So the CBA is just prohibiting the trainers, coaches, and whoever else wants to watch that really don't make the decision.

I think Mr, Irsay would be more interested in the feedback that coaches can give him regarding the status of Peyton's arm, if he can execute NFL throws with NFL velocity, moreso than what doctors can say, that his arm seems able to function and throw the ball with full range of motion. But maybe that's just me?

[Blue Horseshoe]

I know this has been a hot topic lately in several threads but I just saw it reported by Phil B. and Chap who work for the Indy Star that the Colts can NOT watch Manning throw till May because of the CBA.

http://twitter.com/#!/mchappell51

While I don't think this makes it a lock that Peyton is coming back this is clearly not the death nail that some had made it out to be that because the Colts hadn't seen Manning throw that it ment it was he out of here. I am not saying he wont still be released this is just not a sign that some have made it out to be.

Mods if you want to merge this that's cool I just figured since it was in so many threads it should have it's own thread.

Why couldn't he go to some public place like a park or high school field, throw passes to some friends called Reggie and Dallas, and the Colts staff just happen to drive by with video equipment they use for their bird watching hobby?

[Jaric]

I would rather Irsay consult with the trainers and coaches who would know better how PM was throwing. However, apparently, the CBA rules prohibit that during the off-season.

They should be able to get enough information to relay to Irsay et all to make a decently informed decision. Obviously not ideal but there should be ways for the doctors to determine if he's regenerated enough arm strength to make "NFL Throws."

[Coffeedrinker]

http://www.azcentral...ntSomers/156050

"At least that’s the way I read the CBA, which contains much legalese.

According to Section 21 of the CBA, players are not allowed to participate in workouts, practices or meetings supervised by club officials until the official off-season program begins.

There are limitations even when the nine-week off-season program begins. During the first two weeks of that program, strength and conditioning coaches are the only coaches who can be on the field with players. I couldn’t find exceptions for injured players.

Quaterbacks can throw to receivers then, but the coach and position coaches can’t be there.

Violation of those rules could be costly. A head coach is subject to a $100,000 fine for the first violation and $250,000 for the second. The team is subject to a $250,000 fine for the first violation and $500,000 for the second.

Violations of the rules governing the off-season also can result in teams forfeiting off-season practices."

There you go

I wonder how that applies to Irsay since he is not a coach?

[Vance]

He probably falls under the 'team' category.