Why Were Kevin Thomas And Jerry Hughes Inactives?

[Ramblinwreck7]

That was a very bad decision by our coaching staff or whoever set the gameday roster. We has 3 CB on the roster in Powers, Lacey, and Rucker! When Powers got injured we has 2! What sane person allows their team to have 2 CB's available against a spread offense like the Patriots??? That doesn't make any sense and I am wondering why Kevin Thomas wasn't playing.

Also, how about Jerry Hughes? He was inactive after having 3 tackles against Carolina and playing for several weeks in a row. If we are trying to develop him then what dumb person once again prevents him from getting any playing time? How is he supposed to become our 3rd pass rusher if he doesn't even suit up?

Why the heck are there inactives anyways if they are healthy? That's got to be the stupidest list I have ever heard of. What if we have injuries to some of our DE's and CB's? The colts are so unprepared that they don't know what they are doing half the time. The only time this should happen is if a guy gets into serious legal trouble or breaks serious team rules.

[braveheartcolt]

That was a very bad decision by our coaching staff or whoever set the gameday roster. We has 3 CB on the roster in Powers, Lacey, and Rucker! When Powers got injured we has 2! What sane person allows their team to have 2 CB's available against a spread offense like the Patriots??? That doesn't make any sense and I am wondering why Kevin Thomas wasn't playing.

Also, how about Jerry Hughes? He was inactive after having 3 tackles against Carolina and playing for several weeks in a row. If we are trying to develop him then what dumb person once again prevents him from getting any playing time? How is he supposed to become our 3rd pass rusher if he doesn't even suit up?

Why the heck are there inactives anyways if they are healthy? That's got to be the stupidest list I have ever heard of. What if we have injuries to some of our DE's and CB's? The colts are so unprepared that they don't know what they are doing half the time. The only time this should happen is if a guy gets into serious legal trouble or breaks serious team rules.

Because it gave us a better chance of a win......

[Ramblinwreck7]

Because it gave us a better chance of a win......

...Are you being serious? I can't tell because it seems sarcastic to me. There is no way that having 2 CB's would give a better chance to win though...

[bavanlan]

Before I respond further; you are aware that, except for an emergency QB, you can only have 45 active players on gameday despite having 53 on your roster, right?

[Ramblinwreck7]

Before I respond further; you are aware that, except for an emergency QB, you can only have 45 active players on gameday despite having 53 on your roster, right?

Thanks, that helps, but why? That doesn't seem to make very much sense to me. Your telling me that we will always have to have 8 inactive players at every game? I think Jerry Hughes has earned the chance to get more playing time and we definitely need more than 3 active CB's on a gameday roster.

[JoKeR]

Just more evidence that Caldwell needs to go.

Polian shouldn't have to proof read Jim's work but maybe he should.

[bavanlan]

Thanks, that helps, but why? That doesn't seem to make very much sense to me. Your telling me that we will always have to have 8 inactive players at every game?

Yes.

I think Jerry Hughes has earned the chance to get more playing time and we definitely need more than 3 active CB's on a gameday roster.

Then which active players would you have made inactive?

[Superman]

Thanks, that helps, but why? That doesn't seem to make very much sense to me. Your telling me that we will always have to have 8 inactive players at every game? I think Jerry Hughes has earned the chance to get more playing time and we definitely need more than 3 active CB's on a gameday roster.

Yes. You have a 53 man roster, and a 46 man game day roster. The full roster was expanded years ago so that you can make adjustments to account for injuries.

It's up to each staff to figure out how to use their personnel on game day. Going into a game with just three corners isn't a good idea, but we had four active (Terrance Johnson). Sometimes you're forced to make tough decisions because of injuries. Manning, Clark, Eldridge, Mahaffey and Nevis all count against the 53 man roster because they're not on IR. You have to figure who is going to have the biggest impact on the game, and Thomas and Hughes were the odd men out. Neither would have made a difference for most of the game because we were playing off the receivers, which completely neuters your pass rush and your coverage.

All in all, not a big deal, but I would like to see them both active in every game for the rest of the season.

[MAC]

As Superman alluded to, Johnson was active as well. Four CBs is obviously a normal complement, so no issue there. Then Powers and Johnson got hurt. Whoops.

I do wonder why Thomas sat, however. My opinion was that the defense had played well enough to win over the previous four games - much better than earlier in the season - and that this coincided with Thomas being named starter. I'm no expert, and I don't have the luxury of watching the film that the coaches study, but I really don't understand why he was being made an example of. All we did for the first few games was flinch as Lacey got torched repeatedly. Thomas was actually attempting to deflect passes and make interceptions instead of standing there waiting to make a tackle. I thought it was a step in the right direction, and I was HOPING that as a third round talent he was on his way to developing into a starter.

[HGRekks]

Hughes was likely inactive because Addison practiced his mind out. For a FA who just arrived in Indy, he had a solid game.

[Fx Stryker]

Jerry Hughes isn't going to be a Colt next year. No need for him to be active.

[Ramblinwreck7]

Hughes was likely inactive because Addison practiced his mind out. For a FA who just arrived in Indy, he had a solid game.

Addison did practice his mind out? Or is that just speculation.

[Ramblinwreck7]

Jerry Hughes isn't going to be a Colt next year. No need for him to be active.

He needs to be playing right now. He has been playing better and I want to see him on the field more. Tyler Brayton played pretty badly against Carolina so I figured that Hughes would get more playing time.

[Smitto]

All i know is whoever is evaluating the players at practice sucks and needs to be fired.

[braveheartcolt]

...Are you being serious? I can't tell because it seems sarcastic to me. There is no way that having 2 CB's would give a better chance to win though...

Not sure I was being serious, but I wasn't being sarcastic either. Hughes is worthless, and will be cut, so he's not worth a spot. Thomas has showed me very little, and in fact I'd say he won't make it to camp next year either, therefore making non impact players inactive, it gives us a better chance of a win. Only my unexpert pov though....

[GrizzColt]

All i know is whoever is evaluating the players at practice sucks and needs to be fired.

When undrafted agents on defense play against undrafted players on offense, it's hard to tell who's NFL good. The only real test is when our tackles have to block Freeney in practice.

[Larry Horseman]

Not sure I was being serious, but I wasn't being sarcastic either. Hughes is worthless, and will be cut, so he's not worth a spot. Thomas has showed me very little, and in fact I'd say he won't make it to camp next year either, therefore making non impact players inactive, it gives us a better chance of a win. Only my unexpert pov though....

IDK...Thomas has looked promising in spurts, which is what I would expect for a 3 round draft pick playing his first year in the league. If anything, not having him active consistently this year has impeded his progress. I suppose with Powers out for the year, we will find out more. For the record, I like the way Rucker looks out there too...both him and Thomas are tall and physical, particularly for Colts standards.

[basketballsteve]

Why did they keep Hughes instead of Chick?

Why did they keep Gonzo, why do they suit him up, yet he never sees a snap?

Why does Sims only play in the nickle (until Pat got hurt yesterday)?

Why was Tamme so underused (until yesterday) after what he proved he was capable of last year?

How does Lacey go from starter to healthy inactive and back to starter?

Why is Caldwell such a bad coach? Oh wait, I know that one......see above

[Smitto]

When undrafted agents on defense play against undrafted players on offense, it's hard to tell who's NFL good. The only real test is when our tackles have to block Freeney in practice.

Well its not always that easy, the colts have players with talent on offense castonzo, saturday, pollack... those are some pretty solid guys. some of the guys on defense just cant get it done no matter what defense they play.

[MAC]

Why did they keep Hughes instead of Chick?

Why did they keep Gonzo, why do they suit him up, yet he never sees a snap?

Why was Tamme so underused (until yesterday) after what he proved he was capable of last year?

I don't think Chick is anything special - they are trying to develop him. They may well dump him, but preseason of this year was probably way too early.

Gonzo is battling petty injuries. That alone may cost him his job this offseason, but considering that they haven't needed him to play it's largely irrelevant. He's just been a spare part, and if they dumped him they would have to replace him with an UFA spare part. The guy has a lot of talent if he could just stay in one piece.

Tamme plays the same role as Clark. There is no reason to sit an All Pro caliber player just to use him.

[colts52761]

All year our coaching staff has sucked as far as getting our young guys on the field. This is the year to see what they can do. I'm interested to Rucker and Thomas at CB together. I'd like to see them move Hughes around and see if he can contribute anywhere.

[GoColts8818]

Why did they keep Hughes instead of Chick?

Why did they keep Gonzo, why do they suit him up, yet he never sees a snap?

Why does Sims only play in the nickle (until Pat got hurt yesterday)?

Why was Tamme so underused (until yesterday) after what he proved he was capable of last year?

How does Lacey go from starter to healthy inactive and back to starter?

Why is Caldwell such a bad coach? Oh wait, I know that one......see above

Colts held out hope their first round pick from last year would come around, it's almost unheard of to give up on a guy after only one year. Frankly I would have kept Chick and cut Brayton but that's another issue.

I've wondered this about Gonzo if we aren't going to play him why not cut him and keep Smith to help out on Special teams? It's not like we couldn't use the help there.

Wheeler and Conner have been playing extremely well this season. Conner has gotten lost in Angerer shadow but two weeks ago was leading the league in tackles behind the line of scrmidge. Frankly if nothing else this seaosn we have developed depth at the linebacking spot.

I don't think Painter could make the throws to him, it's not like Clark was getting a lot of action with Painter in there. To me that's more of a QB issue.

The reports I heard yesterday Lacey had a good game so maybe the coaches got that right, at least he back half.

[basketballsteve]

I don't think Chick is anything special - they are trying to develop him. They may well dump him, but preseason of this year was probably way too early.

Gonzo is battling petty injuries. That alone may cost him his job this offseason, but considering that they haven't needed him to play it's largely irrelevant. He's just been a spare part, and if they dumped him they would have to replace him with an UFA spare part. The guy has a lot of talent if he could just stay in one piece.

Tamme plays the same role as Clark. There is no reason to sit an All Pro caliber player just to use him.

Caldwell didn't know Hughes was a bust by the end of preseason (that was his judgement) but if you look at Hughes&Chick's stats for the season it's clear who is the better player (and I would guess Chick's contract was cheaper as well). Judgement call.

Gonzo has had success at WR and in the slot. Garcon and Wayne are extremely durable WR's but Collie was a question mark so Gonzo was the best spare part as a 4th receiver perhaps for skill set or if you expected injuries especially in the slot. But Gonzo is not not a good special teams player so if he is not going to play in a 4 wide set or as an occasional sub for Collie then Taj Smith would have been a better keep as the spare part (he was one of our best special teams players). Additionally, once you're 0-6, 0-7, 0-8 shouldn't you then play Gonzo some snaps to see if he still has skills and if he is able to take hits and answer the questions about him? Is there still tread on the tire? The only target I saw him get was a 4th quarter 4th down play last drive of the game (bumped on the route, incomplete, then he's never seen again). Again a judgement call on several levels.

Like Clark, the Pats Gronkowski will be an all pro this year but that does not cause them to sit Hernandez down and say I guess we can't play him. Gronkowski and Hernandez take snaps together. You can have 2 very good receiving TE's play at the same time and as per Peyton Manning "It's a copy cat league, this NFL". BP himself argued that the reason Tamme didn't see the field for snaps his first 2 years was because he was a duplicate of Clark and Clark was just too good to come off the field (translation seems to be only one receiving TE at a time) but didn't the Pats prove that wrong last year? Judgement call.

Perhaps none of the judgement calls are even Caldwells (maybe he's told what to do, who to play, whom to cut) or it's a "staff" (group) decision. I have a hard time with that one when you look at how many times he has flubbed strategy decisions with a time out that gave away a game to Jacksonville, a time out that handed the Jets a playoff win. If his judgement isn't good on the field in public then I also doubt it in behind closed door meetings.

Caldwell in not an NFL caliber head coach.

[Ramblinwreck7]

Caldwell didn't know Hughes was a bust by the end of preseason (that was his judgement) but if you look at Hughes&Chick's stats for the season it's clear who is the better player (and I would guess Chick's contract was cheaper as well). Judgement call.

Gonzo has had success at WR and in the slot. Garcon and Wayne are extremely durable WR's but Collie was a question mark so Gonzo was the best spare part as a 4th receiver perhaps for skill set or if you expected injuries especially in the slot. But Gonzo is not not a good special teams player so if he is not going to play in a 4 wide set or as an occasional sub for Collie then Taj Smith would have been a better keep as the spare part (he was one of our best special teams players). Additionally, once you're 0-6, 0-7, 0-8 shouldn't you then play Gonzo some snaps to see if he still has skills and if he is able to take hits and answer the questions about him? Is there still tread on the tire? The only target I saw him get was a 4th quarter 4th down play last drive of the game (bumped on the route, incomplete, then he's never seen again). Again a judgement call on several levels.

Like Clark, the Pats Gronkowski will be an all pro this year but that does not cause them to sit Hernandez down and say I guess we can't play him. Gronkowski and Hernandez take snaps together. You can have 2 very good receiving TE's play at the same time and as per Peyton Manning "It's a copy cat league, this NFL". BP himself argued that the reason Tamme didn't see the field for snaps his first 2 years was because he was a duplicate of Clark and Clark was just too good to come off the field (translation seems to be only one receiving TE at a time) but didn't the Pats prove that wrong last year? Judgement call.

Perhaps none of the judgement calls are even Caldwells (maybe he's told what to do, who to play, whom to cut) or it's a "staff" (group) decision. I have a hard time with that one when you look at how many times he has flubbed strategy decisions with a time out that gave away a game to Jacksonville, a time out that handed the Jets a playoff win. If his judgement isn't good on the field in public then I also doubt it in behind closed door meetings.

Caldwell in not an NFL caliber head coach.

This is not true considering that John Chick was starting because of injuries in front of him while Jerry Hughes get minimal playing time. John Chick should have better stats than Jerry Hughes.

[basketballsteve]

This is not true considering that John Chick was starting because of injuries in front of him while Jerry Hughes get minimal playing time. John Chick should have better stats than Jerry Hughes.

John Chick's stats this year 11 games, 0 games started, 8 tackles, 2.5 sacks, 1 FF, 2 PD

Hughes stats 9 games, 0 games started, 11 tackles, 1 sack, 0 FF, 0 PD

I have no basis to judge # of snaps between the 2 players I would guess that Chick has more snaps although Hughes when active has been a regular part of the d-line rotation (I've seen him get enough snaps to show something I've never seen him make a play and I've watched every snap this year). Hughes plays ample special teams and I can't judge how much Chick plays there. I would look at the stats and again say I think Chick grades out as the better player, with a clear role as a pass rusher (also was the CFL defensive player of the year with the Roughriders where he really did show that he can rush the passer).

[MAC]

John Chick's stats this year 11 games, 0 games started, 8 tackles, 2.5 sacks, 1 FF, 2 PD

Hughes stats 9 games, 0 games started, 11 tackles, 1 sack, 0 FF, 0 PD

I have no basis to judge # of snaps between the 2 players I would guess that Chick has more snaps although Hughes when active has been a regular part of the d-line rotation (I've seen him get enough snaps to show something I've never seen him make a play and I've watched every snap this year). Hughes plays ample special teams and I can't judge how much Chick plays there. I would look at the stats and again say I think Chick grades out as the better player, with a clear role as a pass rusher (also was the CFL defensive player of the year with the Roughriders where he really did show that he can rush the passer).

I hadn't looked at the stats previously. From the way that many have talked I would have assumed a much much larger discrepancy. It hardly proves your point to demonstrate that Hughes has more tackles in less games - particularly when I have also watched every snap, and am aware of the fact that he barely plays. A game or two ago he was at Right DE so much early on that I was anxiously waiting for word on whether Freeney was injured. Prior to the DT injuries pushing Brayton/Anderson inside more, he was the fifth DE, and hardly took a snap. And there have been a few plays where he has made a positive impression. Granted, not as many as the ones where he has made a negative impression ;p , but the point of this is to compare him to Chick. To my knowledge Chick had such a big window open in front of him due to injuries that some Colts fans were dreading him playing against us. Half a season later, apparently he has done virtually nothing with the opportunity. Therefore I'm satisfied with the Colts decision to keep the 23 year old with first round talent, rather than the 29 year old who is just getting his first sniff of NFL action.

[MAC]

Gonzo was the best spare part as a 4th receiver perhaps for skill set or if you expected injuries especially in the slot. But Gonzo is not not a good special teams player so if he is not going to play in a 4 wide set or as an occasional sub for Collie then Taj Smith would have been a better keep as the spare part (he was one of our best special teams players). Additionally, once you're 0-6, 0-7, 0-8 shouldn't you then play Gonzo some snaps to see if he still has skills and if he is able to take hits and answer the questions about him?

Like Clark, the Pats Gronkowski will be an all pro this year but that does not cause them to sit Hernandez down and say I guess we can't play him. Gronkowski and Hernandez take snaps together. You can have 2 very good receiving TE's play at the same time and as per Peyton Manning "It's a copy cat league, this NFL".

I love Gonzo and think he is better than Garcon and Collie when healthy, but he is never healthy. I absolutely agree that he should play as much as possible, but I'm still reading about niggling injuries. Tough decision for the Colts, but regardless of Smith's value on special teams, he is largely useless as a wide receiver. The talent gap between the two is enormous. I wouldn't take dumping Gonzo so lightly.

The Colts play two TE sets on a constant basis, and both tight ends are frequently targeted. Eldridge looks like a fine player when healthy (where have we heard that before). Therefore the Colts DO play two tight ends who can receive, they just refuse to simultaneously play two tight ends who can't block. I think the difference between the two teams is that the Patriots better "receiving" tight end (Gronkowski) is as big as the Colts blocking tight end (Eldridge). It's not a philosophical difference, or a lack of imagination, it's the benefit of one superior player.

[basketballsteve]

I hadn't looked at the stats previously. From the way that many have talked I would have assumed a much much larger discrepancy. It hardly proves your point to demonstrate that Hughes has more tackles in less games - particularly when I have also watched every snap, and am aware of the fact that he barely plays. A game or two ago he was at Right DE so much early on that I was anxiously waiting for word on whether Freeney was injured. Prior to the DT injuries pushing Brayton/Anderson inside more, he was the fifth DE, and hardly took a snap. And there have been a few plays where he has made a positive impression. Granted, not as many as the ones where he has made a negative impression ;p , but the point of this is to compare him to Chick. To my knowledge Chick had such a big window open in front of him due to injuries that some Colts fans were dreading him playing against us. Half a season later, apparently he has done virtually nothing with the opportunity. Therefore I'm satisfied with the Colts decision to keep the 23 year old with first round talent, rather than the 29 year old who is just getting his first sniff of NFL action.

Well I guess you say tomato i say tomato. As the stats show Chick is not starting (as you said) and as for a tackle equaling a pass defended, a forced fumble or a sack...well that is just laughable. DE's are paid and their success is measured by sacks, pressures, pd's, ff's but not tackles. Freeney is a good example his tackle numbers are always low (the most he has ever had in a season is 41 and that was 2002 his first year) most years he is in the 20's for the season (1.5 to 2 per game). It's just not how you measure a DE's value. I am glad that you're happy with Hughes and nothing would make me happier than for his lack of impact in 2 years to be the result of limited play but my underlying point was Caldwell's judgement is a problem and if Hughes is really talented and Caldwell has not found a way to give him snaps in 2 years with a team that is totally out of contention then my underlying point is still the same.

[MAC]

Well I guess you say tomato i say tomato. As the stats show Chick is not starting (as you said) and as for a tackle equaling a pass defended, a forced fumble or a sack...well that is just laughable. DE's are paid and their success is measured by sacks, pressures, pd's, ff's but not tackles. Freeney is a good example his tackle numbers are always low (the most he has ever had in a season is 41 and that was 2002 his first year) most years he is in the 20's for the season (1.5 to 2 per game). It's just not how you measure a DE's value. I am glad that you're happy with Hughes and nothing would make me happier than for his lack of impact in 2 years to be the result of limited play but my underlying point was Caldwell's judgement is a problem and if Hughes is really talented and Caldwell has not found a way to give him snaps in 2 years with a team that is totally out of contention then my underlying point is still the same.

Except that I'm saying tomato, and your saying apple. What are you talking about? I said nothing about Chick starting, nor did I say a word about passes defended, forced fumbles or sacks. You might want to direct your laughter elsewhere.

If you were attempting to (rudely) express the fact that in your opinion tackles are irrelevant to a DE, and that you really only meant to push the other items on your list, I will take it a step further and say that in my opinion all statistics for a DE (amongst many other defenders) are largely irrelevant. Freeney and Mathis have provided constant pressure in every game this season like the all-pros they are, yet many here look at the lack of sacks and conclude that they have regressed. All you are showing is that (aside from tackles) Chick has had an impact on 6 plays this season. I think it's fair to say that this doesn't prove all that much. You'd need to actually watch every game to have a realistic idea. My larger issue was that regardless of talent, he is only a couple of years younger than Freeney/Mathis. Hughes was drafted in anticipation of replacing one of them. Whether he succeeds or not is still up in the air, but regardless the idea of dropping him in favor of someone who will be 30 next season (and this year is ALL about preparing for the future) is pointless. More interesting is the fact that they sat Hughes in favor of Addison. He is only 24, and judging by how they lunged to grab him for a position where there wasn't an opening suggests that they think they might have caught lightening in a bottle. It would be nice.

I was intentionally ignoring your Caldwell comments. There are enough Caldwell threads here and the arguments are usually circular, ugly, and pointless. Suffice it to say that I disagree with your conclusion.

[Jay Roland]

one question how does one get better besides practice i say we put Hughes in and let him play and see what he has for the rest against his own teammates in practice then how can he get better the rest the season. what little he has played he has gotten somewhat better but unless someone plays in a game and not just in practice. Just my opinion.