Collin Kaepernick allegedly being investigated for sexual assault.

[Shane Bond]

Nah, your last post you replied to me. And before that I quoted you like I have been quoting people all throughout this thread as I see fit. So you like to poke but not be poked back I see. Like you said, let's leave it at your last post: You're lost, even though you set yourself up there with your comments in the first place.

My first post was to AMF to which you commented.

 

Anyways, its not surprising you want to provoke. Thats what you do with dirty/petty talks.

[Qwiz]

My first post was to AMF to which you commented.

 

Anyways, its not surprising you want to provoke. Thats what you do with dirty/petty talks.

I'm exercising my right to post on this forum, and that includes quoting whoever I like. Feel free to ignore my quoting if you want, but that's not going to stop me from doing it. Show me where I provoked you if you want to continue this, but frankly I'm not seeing it. If anything your response to my post was the one that seemed provoking, not that I'm one to whine about such things.

[OffensivelyPC]

You do realize that serial rapists are fairly rare right?  Like most murders, most rapists only really have raped one person.  

 

In fact, serial rapists is a rarer occurrence than murders.  When I was in law school, I did a report on Haley's law and the sex offender registry in general.  I dont' remember the numbers, but when I studied it a few years ago...it was something like murderers recidivate like 8% of the time and rapist like 5%.  Of the most violent crimes, serial rapists were actually one of the lowest.  Yet, we don't put murderers who get out of prison on any offender registry where the entire world can see them, it's relaly kind of pathetic.  Chalk that one up to congress responding to a celbrity case as fast as humany possible in the worst way just to pacify the general public.

 

If the person did in fact assault or rape a person and this could either be a male or female then knowing their name and identity would be paramount to ensure that those that come in contact with them know they have been accused of a crime. I know if I was dating someone, I would want to know if he was being accused of rape and/or assault. Guys like Sharper have enough money for bail to be out on the streets drugging women while awaiting the legal process ...

I disagree with this on a molecular level.  The sex offender registry ahs served mroe as a basis for vigilantism than it has as a protective measure.  I get that people need to be able to take protective measures if they deem it necessary.  But to know a person's identity and residence goes way to far.  And that's where the sex offender registry causes more problems than it really helps.  People who get charged with public indecency simply because they took a leak on a tree within 500 feet of a public playground (even if he was attempting to conceal himself is ridiculous.  There's an abundance of crimes that land you in the offender registry which aren't true sex crimes, much less violent ones.  Yet these people get put on the registry and are, in the eyes of the public, viewed the same as rapist because the crime isn't distinguished on the website.  All the public knows is that you and your residence are on the registry.  I wouldn't have such a problem with it, if perhaps the registry simply stated that a sex offender lives within a mile of your residence, but it doesn't.  Given that the largest percent of convicted offenders don't repeat, you really put these types of offenders at a disadvantage to really rehabilitate.  They made their mistake, and I get that they should pay for it.  Thta's what prison is for.  They shouldn't have to pay for it for the rest of their lives.  If it happened again, the 5% should just be put away for life, that ot me is a better compromise.

[amfootball]

In fact, serial rapists is a rarer occurrence than murders.  When I was in law school, I did a report on Haley's law and the sex offender registry in general.  I dont' remember the numbers, but when I studied it a few years ago...it was something like murderers recidivate like 8% of the time and rapist like 5%.  Of the most violent crimes, serial rapists were actually one of the lowest.  Yet, we don't put murderers who get out of prison on any offender registry where the entire world can see them, it's relaly kind of pathetic.  Chalk that one up to congress responding to a celbrity case as fast as humany possible in the worst way just to pacify the general public.

 

I disagree with this on a molecular level.  The sex offender registry ahs served mroe as a basis for vigilantism than it has as a protective measure.  I get that people need to be able to take protective measures if they deem it necessary.  But to know a person's identity and residence goes way to far.  And that's where the sex offender registry causes more problems than it really helps.  People who get charged with public indecency simply because they took a leak on a tree within 500 feet of a public playground (even if he was attempting to conceal himself is ridiculous.  There's an abundance of crimes that land you in the offender registry which aren't true sex crimes, much less violent ones.  Yet these people get put on the registry and are, in the eyes of the public, viewed the same as rapist because the crime isn't distinguished on the website.  All the public knows is that you and your residence are on the registry.  I wouldn't have such a problem with it, if perhaps the registry simply stated that a sex offender lives within a mile of your residence, but it doesn't.  Given that the largest percent of convicted offenders don't repeat, you really put these types of offenders at a disadvantage to really rehabilitate.  They made their mistake, and I get that they should pay for it.  Thta's what prison is for.  They shouldn't have to pay for it for the rest of their lives.  If it happened again, the 5% should just be put away for life, that ot me is a better compromise.

To your first point, who is to say that the person being accused for the first time is not on his/her way to becoming a serial rapist? Who wants to take that chance? I know I don't and I certainly would not want to be dating a man who is accused of such a crime. Sharper is a great example. Did anyone on the planet think he was drugging and having sex with women in all over the country? You have to err on the side of caution as far as the accused vs the accuser.

 

To your second point, I get the part of the sex offender registry and wish there were separate categorizations. But you are right in the day and age we live in, folks won't take chances when it comes to a person who has committed this type of crime even once. I realize it is unfortunate but there are some actions which have lifelong consequences.

[sweetsurrender]

 I never knew there is a law existed like that. Marital rape.

 

I think we need to be classified as "endangered species".

What on earth!????

[Valpo2004]

You are doing an awful lot of assuming. It does not matter if serial rapists are rare or not. We are talking about protection for the victim and society at large. You have to err on the side of safety given the nature of the crime. I do think that if a woman or man is found to be lying about charges then they should be prosecuted for slander, etc. But society needs to know if a person is being accused of such a crime. And like you said to have bail denied is hard to get passed so even more reason to make the person's name known.

 

Actually I said getting no bail with the clear and convincing evidence should be easy considering they need a higher burden of proof to convict.  

 

I disagree. . . we shouldn't do things based on the nature of the accusations but on the existence of evidence. 

 

I could accuse you of any crime I wish. . . Should we lock you up and have your name put out there as having been accused of these crimes despite the fact that I don't have any evidence?  

[Shane Bond]

What on earth!????

Excuse me?.

[Shane Bond]

I'm exercising my right to post on this forum, and that includes quoting whoever I like. Feel free to ignore my quoting if you want, but that's not going to stop me from doing it. Show me where I provoked you if you want to continue this, but frankly I'm not seeing it. If anything your response to my post was the one that seemed provoking, not that I'm one to whine about such things.

See that last line, another petty talk calling me whining. 

 

Try to stay classy, if you can.

[OffensivelyPC]

To your first point, who is to say that the person being accused for the first time is not on his/her way to becoming a serial rapist? Who wants to take that chance? I know I don't and I certainly would not want to be dating a man who is accused of such a crime. Sharper is a great example. Did anyone on the planet think he was drugging and having sex with women in all over the country? You have to err on the side of caution as far as the accused vs the accuser.

 

To your second point, I get the part of the sex offender registry and wish there were separate categorizations. But you are right in the day and age we live in, folks won't take chances when it comes to a person who has committed this type of crime even once. I realize it is unfortunate but there are some actions which have lifelong consequences.

The simple fact of the matter is, you interact with people who probably have been accused of it at some point.  And the answer to your question is really quite simple.  If you had befriended or even dated someone convicted of rape and were close with them, would learning the information change your mind abotu who they are?  I dont' know about you, but I highly doubt that any time someone think about dating someone, or even have casual sex, they would look on the sex offender registry before doing so.  Rape is a terrible thing to have happen to someone, but the bottom line is, no one is ever prepared for it, nor does anyone ever see it coming.  The sex offender registry won't prevent anyone from being violated, it just serves as a tool to avoid those that already are, irrespective of how they may have moved on from that part of their history. 

[amfootball]

Actually I said getting no bail with the clear and convincing evidence should be easy considering they need a higher burden of proof to convict.  

 

I disagree. . . we shouldn't do things based on the nature of the accusations but on the existence of evidence. 

 

I could accuse you of any crime I wish. . . Should we lock you up and have your name put out there as having been accused of these crimes despite the fact that I don't have any evidence?  

For me to get locked up there would need to be evidence though. You are really taking this to extremes. You or I could "accuse" each other of anything under the sun but for an arrest or conviction there has to be evidence. That is why this woman has only filed a report and there has not been any arrest. There has to be evidence for the arrest. 

[Valpo2004]

In fact, serial rapists is a rarer occurrence than murders.  When I was in law school, I did a report on Haley's law and the sex offender registry in general.  I dont' remember the numbers, but when I studied it a few years ago...it was something like murderers recidivate like 8% of the time and rapist like 5%.  Of the most violent crimes, serial rapists were actually one of the lowest.  Yet, we don't put murderers who get out of prison on any offender registry where the entire world can see them, it's relaly kind of pathetic.  Chalk that one up to congress responding to a celbrity case as fast as humany possible in the worst way just to pacify the general public.

 

I disagree with this on a molecular level.  The sex offender registry ahs served mroe as a basis for vigilantism than it has as a protective measure.  I get that people need to be able to take protective measures if they deem it necessary.  But to know a person's identity and residence goes way to far.  And that's where the sex offender registry causes more problems than it really helps.  People who get charged with public indecency simply because they took a leak on a tree within 500 feet of a public playground (even if he was attempting to conceal himself is ridiculous.  There's an abundance of crimes that land you in the offender registry which aren't true sex crimes, much less violent ones.  Yet these people get put on the registry and are, in the eyes of the public, viewed the same as rapist because the crime isn't distinguished on the website.  All the public knows is that you and your residence are on the registry.  I wouldn't have such a problem with it, if perhaps the registry simply stated that a sex offender lives within a mile of your residence, but it doesn't.  Given that the largest percent of convicted offenders don't repeat, you really put these types of offenders at a disadvantage to really rehabilitate.  They made their mistake, and I get that they should pay for it.  Thta's what prison is for.  They shouldn't have to pay for it for the rest of their lives.  If it happened again, the 5% should just be put away for life, that ot me is a better compromise.

 

Not to mention all of the living zones that the sex offender registry requires which essentially zones previous offenders out of all humanity.  

[Valpo2004]

For me to get locked up there would need to be evidence though. You are really taking this to extremes. You or I could "accuse" each other of anything under the sun but for an arrest or conviction there has to be evidence. That is why this woman has only filed a report and there has not been any arrest. There has to be evidence for the arrest. 

 

You are correct that you usually have to have evidence for an arrest (it actually hasn't always worked out that way.  See Brian Banks, only evidence to have him hauled before a prosecutor giving a 17 y/o kid 15 minutes to decide his fate was an accusation.

 

But my point is that Kap's name is out there with a sexual assault accusation that as of now has no evidence.  Heck they are not even sure a crime even occured.  

 

So zero evidence, not even an accusation, just a investigation and he will now be called "Colin *" by some people for the rest of his life.  

[amfootball]

The simple fact of the matter is, you interact with people who probably have been accused of it at some point.  And the answer to your question is really quite simple.  If you had befriended or even dated someone convicted of rape and were close with them, would learning the information change your mind abotu who they are?  I dont' know about you, but I highly doubt that any time someone think about dating someone, or even have casual sex, they would look on the sex offender registry before doing so.  Rape is a terrible thing to have happen to someone, but the bottom line is, no one is ever prepared for it, nor does anyone ever see it coming.  The sex offender registry won't prevent anyone from being violated, it just serves as a tool to avoid those that already are, irrespective of how they may have moved on from that part of their history. 

If I was friends with Darren Sharper, I would not get within a country mile of him. ;)

 

But I get your point overall. We come in contact with criminals all the time but that still does not preclude the fact that society at large has a right to know if someone accused of rape or murder is living in their area. As someone with small children, I appreciate the heads up and often check my local listings for people living near my street or elementary school.

 

And let's be honest too that the only people that are really hurt by their names being made public are celebrities. Common everyday people who are accused and not arrested or convicted lead their lives normally.

[Qwiz]

See that last line, another petty talk calling me whining. 

 

Try to stay classy, if you can.

I didn't say you whined, I said I wouldn't whine. Stop being so defensive man, it's just a message board lol.

[amfootball]

You are correct that you usually have to have evidence for an arrest (it actually hasn't always worked out that way.  See Brian Banks, only evidence to have him hauled before a prosecutor giving a 17 y/o kid 15 minutes to decide his fate was an accusation.

 

But my point is that Kap's name is out there with a sexual assault accusation that as of now has no evidence.  Heck they are not even sure a crime even occured.  

 

So zero evidence, not even an accusation, just a investigation and he will now be called "Colin *" by some people for the rest of his life.  

That is the price of celebrity though. I don't like it either. But the guy was also being worshipped as one of the greatest young QBs after only playing 10 games last year. So it goes both ways. And don't forget smoking pot in FL is illegal and against NFL substance policy so has that too along with putting himself in a bad position by attending this party with drugs and undressing a woman.

[Shane Bond]

I didn't say you whined, I said I wouldn't whine. Stop being so defensive man, it's just a message board lol.

Enjoy your day dude

[Qwiz]

Enjoy your day dude

You as well.

[Valpo2004]

If I was friends with Darren Sharper, I would not get within a country mile of him. ;)

 

But I get your point overall. We come in contact with criminals all the time but that still does not preclude the fact that society at large has a right to know if someone accused of rape or murder is living in their area. As someone with small children, I appreciate the heads up and often check my local listings for people living near my street or elementary school.

 

And let's be honest too that the only people that are really hurt by their names being made public are celebrities. Common everyday people who are accused and not arrested or convicted lead their lives normally.

 

Except many of them have faced Vigilante attacks.  Or in this case if someone heard somewhere that you might maybe be a sex offender.   

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2478285/Innocent-man-burned-death-vigilante-neighbours-mistook-paedophile.html

 

I don't have a problem with a notification if a pedophile lives in the area.  But what the registry does is a bit too much.

 

This moral panic really needs to subside a lot.  

[Valpo2004]

That is the price of celebrity though. I don't like it either. But the guy was also being worshipped as one of the greatest young QBs after only playing 10 games last year. So it goes both ways. And don't forget smoking pot in FL is illegal and against NFL substance policy so has that too along with putting himself in a bad position by attending this party with drugs and undressing a woman.

 

Yeah but most people don't give a crap if he smokes weed.  Big difference between the two.  

 

And undressing a woman?  I undress a woman quite often, she's my wife.  

 

He's not allowed to have sexual relationships now?

 

Besides why should we blame him for this crap?  It's like we're inventing ways to feel ok with the fact that people are gonna call him Colin * now when it doesn't look like he did anything of the sort.  Why don't we instead put our energies into protecting the privacy of the innocent?

[amfootball]

Except many of them have faced Vigilante attacks.  

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2478285/Innocent-man-burned-death-vigilante-neighbours-mistook-paedophile.html

This is an extreme example and probably speaks more about the people in that neighborhood then the legal system. It is not perfect for sure but people are flawed too.

[amfootball]

Yeah but most people don't give a crap if he smokes weed.  Big difference between the two.  

 

And undressing a woman?  I undress a woman quite often, she's my wife.  

 

He's not allowed to have sexual relationships now?

What? It doesn't matter if people care or not. He was smoking an illegal drug which violates FL law and the NFL substance abuse policy.

 

This woman was not his wife and she passed out after. BIG Difference.

 

I have to ask, is Kaep your favorite player? You seem to be going to big extremes to try to brush this whole thing off. Not sure why. There is def. something here that needs to be sorted out.

[sweetsurrender]

Yeah but most people don't give a crap if he smokes weed.  Big difference between the two.  

 

And undressing a woman?  I undress a woman quite often, she's my wife.  

 

He's not allowed to have sexual relationships now?

 

Besides why should we blame him for this crap?  It's like we're inventing ways to feel ok with the fact that people are gonna call him Colin * now when it doesn't look like he did anything of the sort.  Why don't we instead put our energies into protecting the privacy of the innocent?

How often do you undress your wife and NOT have sex with her? Something does not smell right here. Why did he leave the room and his buddies peek in and then she passes out?

[Valpo2004]

What? It doesn't matter if people care or not. He was smoking an illegal drug which violates FL law and the NFL substance abuse policy.

 

This woman was not his wife and she passed out after. BIG Difference.

 

I have to ask, is Kaep your favorite player? You seem to be going to big extremes to try to brush this whole thing off. Not sure why. There is def. something here that needs to be sorted out.

 

No actually I think he's an overrated game manager.  

 

The problem I have is we are under a major moral panic when it comes to sex offenders including rapists and it's led to the destruction of the presumption of innocence and many innocent people being victimized by it.  

 

As far as it not being his wife who cares?  He had a previous relationship with her.  The fact that she passed out is her fault, no one made her drink or get high.  

 

The only thing you got on him is that he was at a party and there was weed.  So apparently he deserves to be treated like a rapist because he was at a party and there was weed there.  

[Valpo2004]

How often do you undress your wife and NOT have sex with her? Something does not smell right here. Why did he leave the room and his buddies peek in and then she passes out?

 

I agree that's a strange thing if true.  

[amfootball]

No actually I think he's an overrated game manager.  

 

The problem I have is we are under a major moral panic when it comes to sex offenders including rapists and it's led to the destruction of the presumption of innocence and many innocent people being victimized by it.  

 

As far as it not being his wife who cares?  He had a previous relationship with her.  The fact that she passed out is her fault, no one made her drink or get high.  

 

The only thing you got on him is that he was at a party and there was weed.  So apparently he deserves to be treated like a rapist because he was at a party and there was weed there.  

And this is the part that baffles me. Why did you pick this thread to air this grievance you have with society? Just in the past few weeks both Ray Rice and Darren Sharper have been involved in heinous behavior for which they are being charged/tried. And now we have this story on Kaepernick where the details are vague to say the least and you are up in arms that folks are jumping to unfounded conclusions? It is possible that he may have drugged her, undressed her and he and/or his buddies had sex with her. The previous relationship has no bearing on this incident. It is also possible that he undressed her for NO reason and just left her passed out while his buddies peeped in. Either way 2+2 does not equal 4. Something is very sorted about this and the police are doing the right thing by investigating. To get riled up about folks who are most likely Seahawks fans calling him a rapist is out of place in this discussion.

[jvan1973]

And this is the part that baffles me. Why did you pick this thread to air this grievance you have with society? Just in the past few weeks both Ray Rice and Darren Sharper have been involved in heinous behavior for which they are being charged/tried. And now we have this story on Kaepernick where the details are vague to say the least and you are up in arms that folks are jumping to unfounded conclusions? It is possible that he may have drugged her, undressed her and he and/or his buddies had sex with her. The previous relationship has no bearing on this incident. It is also possible that he undressed her for NO reason and just left her passed out while his buddies peeped in. Either way 2+2 does not equal 4. Something is very sorted about this and the police are doing the right thing by investigating. To get riled up about folks who are most likely Seahawks fans calling him a rapist is out of place in this discussion.

there was a seahawk involved

[amfootball]

there was a seahawk involved

Yeah, he was an ex-niner player though.

[Valpo2004]

And this is the part that baffles me. Why did you pick this thread to air this grievance you have with society? Just in the past few weeks both Ray Rice and Darren Sharper have been involved in heinous behavior for which they are being charged/tried. And now we have this story on Kaepernick where the details are vague to say the least and you are up in arms that folks are jumping to unfounded conclusions? It is possible that he may have drugged her, undressed her and he and/or his buddies had sex with her. The previous relationship has no bearing on this incident. It is also possible that he undressed her for NO reason and just left her passed out while his buddies peeped in. Either way 2+2 does not equal 4. Something is very sorted about this and the police are doing the right thing by investigating. To get riled up about folks who are most likely Seahawks fans calling him a rapist is out of place in this discussion.

 

It mostly bothers me because of how easily one loses the reputation through something like this.  My first objection was people starting to call him Colin *.  Everything spiraled out from there.  

[amfootball]

It mostly bothers me because of how easily one loses the reputation through something like this.  My first objection was people starting to call him Colin *.  Everything spiraled out from there.  

Yeah, it is lousy. I used to work in PR several years ago. I am happy to not be in it anymore. Social media is so hard to control and everything goes viral in a heartbeat. It really is a losing proposition. And athletes have to be so, so careful.

 

I do hope nothing comes of this and that Kaep gets his rep back. I really like him as a player, his game and his swag.

[jvan1973]

Yeah, he was an ex-niner player though.

practice squad guy the niners

[OffensivelyPC]

How often do you undress your wife and NOT have sex with her? Something does not smell right here. Why did he leave the room and his buddies peek in and then she passes out?

You must not be married.  Undressing your wife and actually having sex with your wife has about a 5% success rate after about 3 years of marriage.  She has sex with you, you don't have sex with her. lol

[NFLfan]

I didn't say you whined, I said I wouldn't whine. Stop being so defensive man, it's just a message board lol.

Please quit this. I am interested in reading what your thoughts are on the topic. Thanks, QuizBoy.

[dgambill]

The simple fact of the matter is, you interact with people who probably have been accused of it at some point.  And the answer to your question is really quite simple.  If you had befriended or even dated someone convicted of rape and were close with them, would learning the information change your mind abotu who they are?  I dont' know about you, but I highly doubt that any time someone think about dating someone, or even have casual sex, they would look on the sex offender registry before doing so.  Rape is a terrible thing to have happen to someone, but the bottom line is, no one is ever prepared for it, nor does anyone ever see it coming.  The sex offender registry won't prevent anyone from being violated, it just serves as a tool to avoid those that already are, irrespective of how they may have moved on from that part of their history. 

Just wondering if perhaps things like being put on these registries and having publicly being outed so to speak is a reason why there are fewer serial rapists or repeat rapist...because people are aware of avoid or do not allow these people to be in places that may allow them to commit these crimes again. Not saying that is the lone reason but I can't help think there could be a correlation. Not getting into the whole categories of those listed...I do think common sense should previal in most cases but sometimes some of these lesser crimes if gone unpunished/reported etc might allow someone to move on to the next level in their degradation. Say example I find it difficult to believe that a majority of rapists etc first crime is the rape...I would imagine but I have no proof so take that for what it is that these people have grown enbolded by doing smaller things first...peeping tom, child porn on the internet etc before moving on to more serious crimes. Also given how many rapes go unreported/prosecuted every year...of course there is going to be less serial rapists. They never got caught the first time or prosecuted...the social stigma that women face after going through something like this needs to stop...anything to encourage them to step forward and follow through with putting these men away would do society a great justice. Things like groping a women (assualt) and so called date rape etc I feel often go unpunished and enbolden further worse acts. If people learned to respect women and society would get its act together and teach some morals the specialness of sex between men and women might cause people to not act the way they do. Cheaping sex the way we have...we almost have condoned these acts unfortunately. No wonder in many cultures men were castrated for far less...can't say I would have an issue...that might deter a few people if they thought that was a possibility.

[dgambill]

Yeah, it is lousy. I used to work in PR several years ago. I am happy to not be in it anymore. Social media is so hard to control and everything goes viral in a heartbeat. It really is a losing proposition. And athletes have to be so, so careful.

 

I do hope nothing comes of this and that Kaep gets his rep back. I really like him as a player, his game and his swag.

The solution is to obstain from ALL appearances of evil. I don't condone one bit judging someone but the best way to make sure your name/honor is clean and clear...don't behave or run around with those that act immorally. You can keep out of trouble and have a very very enjoyable life...most do it. That said people shouldnt jump to presume anything and should be open minded BOTH ways in this situation that either party could be telling the truth. To me he is innocent until proven guilty and at the same time she was assulted until otherwise shown....we can believe both if you keep an open mind.

[dgambill]

You must not be married.  Undressing your wife and actually having sex with your wife has about a 5% success rate after about 3 years of marriage.  She has sex with you, you don't have sex with her. lol

Quoted for truth lol. I have found Graveling and Complementing her beauty can often raise that success rate significantly...however if she has a headache....its still 0 lol.

 

Oh and a good foot massage doesn't hurt as I found out last night!! ZING!!! : )

[NFLfan]

And this is the part that baffles me. Why did you pick this thread to air this grievance you have with society? Just in the past few weeks both Ray Rice and Darren Sharper have been involved in heinous behavior for which they are being charged/tried. And now we have this story on Kaepernick where the details are vague to say the least and you are up in arms that folks are jumping to unfounded conclusions? It is possible that he may have drugged her, undressed her and he and/or his buddies had sex with her. The previous relationship has no bearing on this incident. It is also possible that he undressed her for NO reason and just left her passed out while his buddies peeped in. Either way 2+2 does not equal 4. Something is very sorted about this and the police are doing the right thing by investigating. To get riled up about folks who are most likely Seahawks fans calling him a rapist is out of place in this discussion.

I agree with Valpo. You don't have to be a fan of a player to defend him. I believe that it is because the "details are vague at best" that Valpo and any fair person would be "up in arms that folks are jumping to unfounded conclusions". Why aren't fans jumping to another conclusion, like perhaps it is not true, etc. Like some have said, I will wait until there is more substantive evidence before passing judgment. Regardless of the outcome, I will not call him any name other than his given name.

[chad72]

If people learned to respect women and society would get its act together and teach some morals the specialness of sex between men and women might cause people to not act the way they do. Cheaping sex the way we have...we almost have condoned these acts unfortunately. No wonder in many cultures men were castrated for far less...can't say I would have an issue...that might deter a few people if they thought that was a possibility.

 

Yep, I feel that way about porn (hard or soft) across all possible media outlets in our lives. There has been a de-sensitization towards treating women/men (in some cases) for what they deserve i.e. respect as human beings instead of objects of lust.

 

Combine that with a society that gets more and more withdrawn (heck, people would rather text someone across the room instead of having a conversation) without personal relationships, the de-sensitization with more solitude multiplies, IMO.

 

Heck, that Cleveland kidnapper of those 3 girls, even though he blamed porn as a last resort, may not have been that off base with what he said regards to porn having an impact on his attitude towards life. Like a former President said "if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen."

 

Every man needs to be aware and scared of his own possible depravity and has to guard against it all the time.

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Topics like this confirms why people like Manning are so well respected and is considered the face of the league.

 

* a female trainer deserves some respect.  

[chad72]

* a female trainer deserves some respect.  

 

Don't make this a Manning vs Brady glass house thing, stones will start flying. ;)

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I actually astonished at how many men have so little respect for women.

Maybe I do because I grew up with 4 sistersw and all of their friends hanging around the house.