Dead Cap for our FA additions If we cut them

[BronxColtNYC]

I've been Getting a lot of questions about dead cap, if we released our FA additions for whatever reason.

You're correct. Let's break it down. Here's the 2014 cap hit for our FA pickups.

2014 http://overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=Colts&Year=2014

2015 http://www.overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=Colts&Year=2015

The only thing you need to look at is the dead money hit. That means if we cut him. What's our cap penalty?

RJF:Let's look at RJF first. His dead cap is $1,066,668. That's is fairly cheap. (For reference, we are still carrying 5 mil in Gary brackett's dead cap.

Toler: dead cap is $666,667 just above 500k.

Thomas: dead cap is $750,000

Cherilus, Landry, Walden: Now the last 3 you are right about cherilus has an 8 mil. Landry 5.2 mil. Walden 4.75 mil but you see those numbers drastically reduce in 2015.

Cherilus goes down to 6. Landry to 3 mil And WALDEN to 500k. So you are we can essentially cut everyone except for Landry and cherilus and not blink an.eye.

The longer you keep a player, the less cap issue he becomes.

[Balzer40]

Cherilus will be here for 3 yrs. and then will be cut. No way he ever see's those last 2 yrs. on his contract. He'll cost too much.

[BronxColtNYC]

Cherilus will be here for 3 yrs. and then will be cut. No way he ever see's those last 2 yrs. on his contract. He'll cost too much.

9 mil is steep. We could extend or restructure. If he plays pro bowl level, he'll get it, if he doesn't jes cut or restructured/extended.

[Balzer40]

9 mil is steep. We could extend or restructure. If he plays pro bowl level, he'll get it, if he doesn't jes cut or restructured/extended.

 

 

 

He'll be pushing 32 yrs. old at that point, and I just don't see a restructure in his future with us. More than likely we'll draft his replacement in a couple of yrs. and let him go after that 3rd yr. of his contract.

[BronxColtNYC]

He'll be pushing 32 yrs. old at that point, and I just don't see a restructure in his future with us. More than likely we'll draft his replacement in a couple of yrs. and let him go after that 3rd yr. of his contract.

Good point, I didn't take age into effect.

[ztboiler]

 Walden 4.75 mil but you see those numbers drastically reduce in 2015.

 

 

I don't read the Walden contract to have this much dead money.  Walden only represents 4.75 mill dead if he is on the roster 5 days into the next league year.  Walden essentially signed a 1 year $4 million contract with us.

[BronxColtNYC]

I don't read the Walden contract to have this much dead money.  Walden only represents 4.75 mill dead if he is on the roster 5 days into the next league year.  Walden essentially signed a 1 year $4 million contract with us.

Only of we decide to cut him this year. Base+prorated bonus =4.75 mil. His dead money goes down to 500k in year 2. That's if we cit.him by league year 2015.

Cap hit-cap savings =dead money.

So if I signed a 2 year 8 mil contract with a 500k bonuse my year 1 hit is 4.25. If I was cut by league year it would be 4.25 mil (cap hit)-4 mil (base savings)= 250k. Dead money is 250k.

[ztboiler]

Only of we decide to cut him this year. Base+prorated bonus =4.75 mil. His dead money goes down to 500k in year 2. That's if we cit.him by league year 2015.

Cap hit-cap savings =dead money.

So if I signed a 2 year 8 mil contract with a 500k bonuse my year 1 hit is 4.25. If I was cut by league year it would be 4.25 mil (cap hit)-4 mil (base savings)= 250k. Dead money is 250k.

 

The math works - no argument, but Walden's contract is complicated by the 2014 base unguaranteed until 5th day of 2014 league year. So, measuring his dead money as 4.75 mill is contingent on him having a good year 2013 and us keeping him going into free agency next year.  Its a 1 year deal with $750K dead as of today if we cut him after this year.  This contract, while also the lightning rod, represents the brilliance of Grigson more than any other signing.

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/erik-walden/

[BronxColtNYC]

The math works - no argument, but Walden's contract is complicated by the 2014 base unguaranteed until 5th day of 2014 league year. So, measuring his dead money as 4.75 mill is contingent on him having a good year 2013 and us keeping him going into free agency next year.  Its a 1 year deal with $750K dead as of today if we cut him after this year.

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/erik-walden/

Correct, which shows that in the link on OP under dead money for 2015. If I were cut in 2009

My dead money would carry into 2010 cap. Same argument, Maybe I phrased it wrong. Happens when pulling an all nighter.

[ztboiler]

Correct, which shows that in the link on OP under dead money for 2015. If I were cut in 2009

My dead money would carry into 2010 cap. Same argument, Maybe I phrased it wrong. Happens when pulling an all nighter.

 You didn't phrase it wrong.... but it is a both and neither type situation.  2015 just has nothing to do with it until it does.  His dead money can only be defined today by what happens to the 2014 cap if you cut him going into next year.  We are on the hook for his prorated signing bonus, 2013 base and nothing more as of right now.

[BronxColtNYC]

 You didn't phrase it wrong.... but it is a both and neither type situation.  2015 just has nothing to do with it until it does.  His dead money can only be defined today by what happens to the 2014 cap if you cut him going into next year.  We are on the hook for his prorated signing bonus, 2013 base and nothing more as of right now.

Right you are.

http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=nflnation&id=73449&src=desktop

[BronxColtNYC]

 You didn't phrase it wrong.... but it is a both and neither type situation.  2015 just has nothing to do with it until it does.  His dead money can only be defined today by what happens to the 2014 cap if you cut him going into next year.  We are on the hook for his prorated signing bonus, 2013 base and nothing more as of right now.

Base + prorated bonus= cap hit

Cap hit-base=prorated bonus=dead money into following year of cut.

[ztboiler]

Base + prorated bonus= cap hit

Cap hit-base=prorated bonus=dead money into following year of cut.

 

Sorry to split hairs.  Formula is correct, but incomplete as there can be guarantees not reflected in your formula.  Dead Cap hit = prorated bonus + unpaid portion of any guaranteed money.  Your Gary Brackett contract example is perfect for that.  I know you know that I know that you know this.

[BronxColtNYC]

Sorry to split hairs.  Formula is correct, but incomplete as there can be guarantees not reflected in your formula.  Cap hit = prorated bonus + unpaid portion of any guaranteed money.  Your Gary Brackett contract example is perfect for that.  I know you know that I know that you know this.

In most cases, the player has already received all guaranteed money by the time he's released. Signing bonuses and other guaranteed money provide protection for the player. But there are instances where that is not the case. So it may be splitting hairs but I appreciate it nonetheless. I know that you know that I know what you know.

[BronxColtNYC]

Sorry to split hairs.  Formula is correct, but incomplete as there can be guarantees not reflected in your formula.  Dead Cap hit = prorated bonus + unpaid portion of any guaranteed money.  Your Gary Brackett contract example is perfect for that.  I know you know that I know that you know this.

It would also depend on how that bonus is structured. Is it paid upfront, or divided by contract years.

Ex:3 year contract with 6 million bonus. 2 mil hit per year. Player cut after year 2, last 2 mil is dead money on cap.

[jshipp23]

I've been Getting a lot of questions about dead cap, if we released our FA additions for whatever reason.

You're correct. Let's break it down. Here's the 2014 cap hit for our FA pickups.

2014 http://overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=Colts&Year=2014

2015 http://www.overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=Colts&Year=2015

The only thing you need to look at is the dead money hit. That means if we cut him. What's our cap penalty?

RJF:Let's look at RJF first. His dead cap is $1,066,668. That's is fairly cheap. (For reference, we are still carrying 5 mil in Gary brackett's dead cap.

Toler: dead cap is $666,667 just above 500k.

Thomas: dead cap is $750,000

Cherilus, Landry, Walden: Now the last 3 you are right about cherilus has an 8 mil. Landry 5.2 mil. Walden 4.75 mil but you see those numbers drastically reduce in 2015.

Cherilus goes down to 6. Landry to 3 mil And WALDEN to 500k. So you are we can essentially cut everyone except for Landry and cherilus and not blink an.eye.

The longer you keep a player, the less cap issue he becomes.

Good info...

[Superman]

I did a dead money chart a few weeks before free agency, here: http://forums.colts.com/index.php?/topic/15416-current-colts-roster-list-with-salaries/?p=411560

 

Breaks down our cap penalties and our June 1 options as well. But I haven't updated it to include any of our free agent signings. I'm going to wait until we sign our draft picks.

[BronxColtNYC]

I did a dead money chart a few weeks before free agency, here: http://forums.colts.com/index.php?/topic/15416-current-colts-roster-list-with-salaries/?p=411560

 

Breaks down our cap penalties and our June 1 options as well. But I haven't updated it to include any of our free agent signings. I'm going to wait until we sign our draft picks.

Good idea. Feel free to merge.

[bahhummbug]

He'll be pushing 32 yrs. old at that point, and I just don't see a restructure in his future with us. More than likely we'll draft his replacement in a couple of yrs. and let him go after that 3rd yr. of his contract.

I agree to keep the team strong you need to draft not over pay,not saying he is not worth it now but in 3 years he might be just a burden.

[bahhummbug]

I just want to jump in and Ty for your time for giving us this information.Use to be Undecidedfrog and cannot remember who else posted all these numbers.Ty for your time again

[BronxColtNYC]

I just want to jump in and Ty for your time for giving us this information.Use to be Undecidedfrog and cannot remember who else posted all these numbers.Ty for your time again

Thank you guys for discussing and debating. Grigson can break the mold by not keeping players past their time and drafting replacement and readying them to replace. Keeps cap low and keeps us from overpaying veterans.

[Larry Horseman]

Good info...

Mother issues?