Colts Listening To Offers For Freeney

[GoColts8818]

Simeon Rice, at his best, wasn't 2/3 of the player Freeney is now.

And really, the model for a potential Freeney trade would be the Seymour trade a few years ago. The Raiders gave up a high first for him, and since it's the Raiders, I can see downgrading the yield by a round, so getting a solid second rounder shouldn't be that outside the realm of possibility.

Rice was pretty good maybe not as good as Freeney but that wasn't the point I was trying to make. i was just saying Rice was a speed end and look at what happened to him once he lost his speed. I only sighted him as an example players might remember. I don't know when Freeney is going to lose his speed. I don't think he's lost it yet but I do think it's coming. No one can out run father time forever.

[Superman]

Rice was pretty good maybe not as good as Freeney but that wasn't the point I was trying to make. i was just saying Rice was a speed end and look at what happened to him once he lost his speed. I only sighted him as an example players might remember. I don't know when Freeney is going to lose his speed. I don't think he's lost it yet but I do think it's coming. No one can out run father time forever.

Well, of course, but I don't see him declining right now.

[GoColts8818]

Well, of course, but I don't see him declining right now.

Like I just said I don't think it's happened yet. I do think it's coming though probably in the next two to the three years.

[JWF]

I would say a mid to low 3rd is the best to expect. Maybe conditional 2nd. The team trading for him will be doing the Colts a big favor by absorbing his 14 million salary.

[chad72]

Marshal Faulk at the prime of his career only brought us a second round pick.

That was because Polian wanted him out of the AFC. The Dolphins in the same division as us would have given us a 1st round pick, Polian was having none of it. He shipped Faulk to the Rams for a 2nd and 5th but could have gotten more if he wanted.

[Superman]

I would say a mid to low 3rd is the best to expect. Maybe conditional 2nd. The team trading for him will be doing the Colts a big favor by absorbing his 14 million salary.

They wouldn't be absorbing his $14 million; they'd likely be agreeing to an extension with him.

[ColtsLegacy]

Marshal Faulk at the prime of his career only brought us a second round pick. Freeney is past the prime of his career and frankly going toward the end of his career. He's a speed player and once that goes away he just becomes an undersized end. Remember when we signed Rice in 2007 I think and he just looked like he was going in slow motion compared to other players? That's what will happen to Freeney once his speed does go away. If the Colts can get something of value for him and he is unwillingly to work with the team so they can keep him what other choice do the Colts have? Release him and get nothing for him? I don't want to see Freeney traded but unless he has a change in attitude that looks to be the way things are going.

Not sure why you quoted me here. The post I was replying to was about Angerer not being worth his draft position unless he makes 6 or more pro bowls. I was not talking about Freeney.

[Andy]

Bold is you, not bold is me.

He isn't declining at the rate you keep saying he is. Flawed premise.

13.5 to 10 to 8. Not to mention that he is in the 30s. That looks like a decline to me.

I'll give you Allen, based on the numbers, but I don't think he's as dynamic a pass rusher as Freeney is. Same for the rest.

But he gets the job done, and that's all that matters at the end of the day. He's been much more productive than Freeney and in this day and age, it's better to have an overall DE than just a pass rusher, even with the league moving in a pass heavy direction. Look at Justin Smith's impact compared to Freeney's impact.

If you don't get how playing the corners 8 yards off the line virtually every down affects the pass rush, then I don't know what to say. Freeney (and the rest of the defensive line) got >>>ed the past two seasons with a stupid scheme that allowed receivers to run unimpeded and quarterbacks to throw short, easy completions.

This scheme (Tampa 2) was in place for several years now, and we've seen him excel in it, just look at 2009 with 13.5 sacks. He's done well in this system, so the last 2 years have been a decline. It affects the line, but a lot of the time the QBs beat us is when there is no pressure on the QB and they just pick us apart. The no pass rush gives the QB time and they pick us apart with that terrible system. Who runs the pass rush, Freeney and Mathis.

We allowed quarterbacks to complete 71% of their passes against us, with first downs on 39% of their attempts. That means that it was mathematically a mistake to EVER punt against us. Teams could just throw every single down and convert for first downs whenever they wanted, due to the scheme.

So, YES, if he played in a different scheme, he'd be top three in sacks. Just like he was in 2009 before Larry Coyer lost his marbles.

That's your opinion, but you have to be a little more realistic. Top 3 in sacks this year would have been 18 sacks or better. You're telling me that in another system he gets 10 more sacks on top of the 8 got this year, NO, and it's crazy to think that. No matter what team he is on, teams will double team him and no player that gets doubled team as much as he does gets to 18. Even back in the day before Meeks and Coyer, who ran the Tampa 2, he got to double digits, but never over 17, and that was because he was young and no one double teamed him. I think he does better in another system like the system they run in Denver or NO (with Williams) as they are aggressive and have a lot of rushers, giving Freeney more one on one oppurtunities. Does he get to the top 3. No! In the past maybe, but not now, and it was easier back in the day because it wasn't as pass heavy back then.

See dgambill's post above. There are several teams with cap space that run a 4-3 base that need pass rushers.

And again, there's the flawed premise. There's no reason to believe that Freeney only has two more good years in him.

First of all, he said that the Broncos would sign him. They would never even look at Freeney. They have Dumervil who's great, and Ayers who's waking up. They're not going to throw that kind of money at Freeney just to have Ayers sit on the bench. Seattle is not really a contender, but Seattle is not an attractive place and Seattle is the kind of team that rather have several good players than one great player (you can make the case that he's not even that great anymore). Teams that are rebuilding will not pick up Freeney because he kills the cap space. Cincy is not an option as they have Johnson + Dunlap, Dunlap is great and he's young, and Johnson is like a not as good Freeney, but he's no where the same cap number as Freeney. Plus they have a great line on top of that. Keep em coming and I'll just shoot em down. He's gotta think before he throws teams at me.

Again, if you can't understand the difference between rushing from a two-point stance, from either side of the line, and rushing from a three-point stance, always on the right side of the line, then it's no wonder you're surprised. This is basic stuff. It's two different things, two different positions, and it's hard to compare the two just based on sacks numbers. Not taking anything away from Ware; he's awesome. But it's different.

I understand it, I've had to write articles about it and what not. The fact of the matter is, both rush the QB the majority of the time, both will face the tackles, whether its right of left, and both will be forced to face single teams and double teams. What's the big difference, that the the 3-4 guy is standing up. BTW, it's not called a 2 point stance, a 2 point stance is what the ILB use, that's a big difference which you seem to not know. If the 3-4 OLB is playing more conservatively and not rushing the QB, then he'll be in a 2 point stance, but with pure pass rushers, they play what is called It's lean-over strong forward position is the official name, but the general nickname is the lean-over stance. It's not that difference when you look at it which is the reason why you see a lot of DEs make an easy switch to 3-4 OLB. Everyone thought that Mario Williams would not get it right away, but in a matter of a month and a half he got it and said it wasn't that hard. There are many stories like this. Clay Matthews was another one of these people saying that it was a "good transition" from playing 4-3 at USC to playing 3-4 in GB. It's not as different as you think.

[GoColts8818]

Not sure why you quoted me here. The post I was replying to was about Angerer not being worth his draft position unless he makes 6 or more pro bowls. I was not talking about Freeney.

My fault I thought you were talking about Freeney.

[mahagga73]

Freeney is unwilling to renegotiate,that's his perogative,but that means sayonara Dwight.

[ColtsLegacy]

My fault I thought you were talking about Freeney.

Not a problem.

[JWF]

They wouldn't be absorbing his $14 million; they'd likely be agreeing to an extension with him.

Well taking it off our hands would be a better choice of words.

[Fr33UpFr33ney]

omg good, you guys are the worst fans in he whole league. I'm almost in tear mode listening to this. Over the past month i've heard people say Manning is too old, Harrison was over rated, Freeney is WAAAY over rated. Cut Wayne

you ever heard of a down year? Every player has one. The team next year is going to be unrecognizable. We've cut more starers than we have 1-4th round draft picks, and only half are likely to be starters.

It's just unbelievable.

[Superman]

omg good, you guys are the worst fans in he whole league. I'm almost in tear mode listening to this. Over the past month i've heard people say Manning is too old, Harrison was over rated, Freeney is WAAAY over rated. Cut Wayne

you ever heard of a down year? Every player has one. The team next year is going to be unrecognizable. We've cut more starers than we have 1-4th round draft picks, and only half are likely to be starters.

It's just unbelievable.

How many games did Brackett, Addai, Clark and Bullitt start in the past two seasons?

And oh, by the way, if next year's team is unrecognizable, that might not be a bad thing. We only won 2 games this year. There were some changes in order.

Lastly, you're dramatizing the release of four players. It's one thing to feel bad that our core is being moved out, but it's entirely another to call others bad fans because they understand what you fail to grasp: this change is necessary in order to be good again. You crying in your fan soup doesn't make you a better fan than anyone else.