Del Rio Hired by Raiders

[BOTT]

Denver didn't blitz because most games..they didn't have to..Coverage was not simple..You don't really believe that Denver had a highly rated defense despite the defensive coordinator.That doesn't happen..

Lol...the colts once had a top 5 defense under Dungy.....one of the most vanilla defenses ever.

[oldunclemark]

Vanilla isn't a message board word for bad...

..you're suggesting that blitzing and defensive complication is automatically good.

Seattle is vanilla.

Del Rio's a good coach,. has been for a long time. I dont know why its so hard to admit that when the record shows it

[Superman]

Vanilla isn't a message board word for bad...

..you're suggesting that blitzing and defensive complication is automatically good.

Seattle is vanilla.

Del Rio's a good coach,. has been for a long time. I dont know why its so hard to admit that when the record shows it

 

His record doesn't really show that. I'm not trying to bury him, I just don't know how you can bring up his 68-71 record and say he's a good coach and has been for a long time. 

[crazycolt1]

I don't know how he will turn out in Oakland but I do know Del Rio didn't have the defense ready for the Colts playoff game. Denver's defense didn't even get close to Luck all game. Everyone points the finger at Manning's health but the Bronco's defense wasn't prepared for the Colts. You would think that with two of the best pass rushers in the league they would at least put some pressure on Luck. Just my take.

[BOTT]

Vanilla isn't a message board word for bad.....you're suggesting that blitzing and defensive complication is automatically good.Seattle is vanilla.Del Rio's a good coach,. has been for a long time. I dont know why its so hard to admit that when the record shows it

I never said the broncos defense was bad and I never suggested complicated schemes were automatically better. If you like del rio that's fine, but don't put words in my mouth.

[Superman]

I don't know how he will turn out in Oakland but I do know Del Rio didn't have the defense ready for the Colts playoff game. Denver's defense didn't even get close to Luck all game. Everyone points the finger at Manning's health but the Bronco's defense wasn't prepared for the Colts. You would think that with two of the best pass rushers in the league they would at least put some pressure on Luck. Just my take.

 

It was a terrible gameplan. They didn't use their pass rushers effectively, at all, and they didn't even try to press our receivers, despite having the personnel to do so. They played a soft, conservative game, when they should have attacked the right side of our offensive line and done whatever they could to neutralize our receivers on the outside.

[oldunclemark]

I think you look at a loss and blame the coordinator when that same coordinator had success for 16 games...

That suggests to me a prejudice for the coordinator that goes way back...an a stubbornness about 17 game sof results

Its not logical...Denver went with a 4-man rush most of the year....the soft conservative game allowed 24 points to a premier offensive team..To me, its impossible to look at the Denver=Colts game and blame the Denver defense for the loss..

As a fan...I don't understand how good play is on the players and poor play by players in on the coordinator.

There seems to be a blind spot where Jack Del Rio is concerned..all faults are his..all credit elsewhere

[oldunclemark]

I don't know how he will turn out in Oakland but I do know Del Rio didn't have the defense ready for the Colts playoff game.

That just isn't true...and the results suggest the opposite

they gave up 24 points on a day when Peyton could not move the ball.

I don't know how Del Rio's 2014 accomplishments with that defense are ignored

I suspect if her leads Oakland to a winning record...the spin will be that they won inspite of him. True?

[Superman]

I think you look at a loss and blame the coordinator when that same coordinator had success for 16 games...

That suggests to me a prejudice for the coordinator that goes way back...an a stubbornness about 17 game sof results

Its not logical...Denver went with a 4-man rush most of the year....the soft conservative game allowed 24 points to a premier offensive team..To me, its impossible to look at the Denver=Colts game and blame the Denver defense for the loss..

As a fan...I don't understand how good play is on the players and poor play by players in on the coordinator.

There seems to be a blind spot where Jack Del Rio is concerned..all faults are his..all credit elsewhere

 

You're being unreasonable.

 

1) You're assuming I have some bias against JDR. I don't. I don't dislike him, I don't think he's a terrible coach who should be run out of the league. I'm only saying that he doesn't have a good record that makes him a good coach. He has an average record.

 

2) I never blamed JDR for the loss to the Colts. I think the offensive gameplan was just as bad as the defensive gameplan. But his defense made life easy for the Colts offense by not attacking their weaknesses.

 

3) There's no blame for losses, and zero credit for wins. Again, I'm not trying to scapegoat him. I just don't think he has this stellar record that you claim he has.

 

I'm assuming that your post was at least partially directed at mine. If not, well, my bad, but I think my points are still valid.

[oldunclemark]

You're being unreasonable.

 

1) You're assuming I have some bias against JDR. I don't. I don't dislike him, I don't think he's a terrible coach who should be run out of the league. I'm only saying that he doesn't have a good record that makes him a good coach. He has an average record.

 

2) I never blamed JDR for the loss to the Colts. I think the offensive gameplan was just as bad as the defensive gameplan. But his defense made life easy for the Colts offense by not attacking their weaknesses.

 

3) There's no blame for losses, and zero credit for wins. Again, I'm not trying to scapegoat him. I just don't think he has this stellar record that you claim he has.

 

I'm assuming that your post was at least partially directed at mine. If not, well, my bad, but I think my points are still valid.

You're being unreasonable.

 

1) You're assuming I have some bias against JDR. I don't. I don't dislike him, I don't think he's a terrible coach who should be run out of the league. I'm only saying that he doesn't have a good record that makes him a good coach. He has an average record.

 

2) I never blamed JDR for the loss to the Colts. I think the offensive gameplan was just as bad as the defensive gameplan. But his defense made life easy for the Colts offense by not attacking their weaknesses.

 

3) There's no blame for losses, and zero credit for wins. Again, I'm not trying to scapegoat him. I just don't think he has this stellar record that you claim he has.

 

I'm assuming that your post was at least partially directed at mine. If not, well, my bad, but I think my points are still valid.

Not just you, Supe,,.but sure..

'Making life easy' for the Colts offense produced 24 points..well below their average....obviously we don't agree

Sometimes we judge and players by records..and sometimes we look to justify preconceived notions...that's is all I' saying..

.is happening here....

I didn't 'claim' anything stellar about Jack Del Rio's record....

Del Rio's record as a head coach is what it is. he had at least two very good seasons

His record as coordinator is also not mine to alter.

Denver reached the Super Bowl in 2013 with backup defenders at 4 positions..and was top-10 (Yardage-wise) against the pass and run.

I didn't analyze those facts .......I just stated them. I don't have any notions about coaches or players performance that cant change in the light of on the field proof....but many here seem to. That's why there is debate.

Oakland is in a tough divion..4th best as of now..we can probably agree...

If they finish higher than 4th next season..I would hope that most would say they didn't do it despite the head coach

[crazycolt1]

 

I don't know how he will turn out in Oakland but I do know Del Rio didn't have the defense ready for the Colts playoff game.

That just isn't true...and the results suggest the opposite

they gave up 24 points on a day when Peyton could not move the ball.

I don't know how Del Rio's 2014 accomplishments with that defense are ignored

I suspect if her leads Oakland to a winning record...the spin will be that they won inspite of him. True?

 

That is not what I said. All I know is what I seen with my own eyes. Luck had all day behind a line that had a lot to be desired. They gave up almost 100 yards rushing yards to a team that is at the bottom of the league in rushing. Denvers defense was rated 15th in the league according to ESPN. 17th in the league according to Fox sports. Take into consideration how much money that was spent on Denvers defense they underachieved. The Broncos have two premier pass rushers and they didn't pressure Luck all game. The two picks they got were Lucks fault, not anything they did. If you like Del Rio that's fine but I don't buy into the fact he is a great coach. His record speaks for itself. He may do fine or even great in Oakland but you cant assume that will happen with his past record.

[Superman]

Not just you, Supe,,.but sure..

'Making life easy' for the Colts offense produced 24 points..well below their average....obviously we don't agree

Sometimes we judge and players by records..and sometimes we look to justify preconceived notions...that's is all I' saying..

.is happening here....

I didn't 'claim' anything stellar about Jack Del Rio's record....

Del Rio's record as a head coach is what it is. he had at least two very good seasons

His record as coordinator is also not mine to alter.

Denver reached the Super Bowl in 2013 with backup defenders at 4 positions..and was top-10 (Yardage-wise) against the pass and run.

I didn't analyze those facts .......I just stated them. I don't have any notions about coaches or players performance that cant change in the light of on the field proof....but many here seem to. That's why there is debate.

Oakland is in a tough divion..4th best as of now..we can probably agree...

If they finish higher than 4th next season..I would hope that most would say they didn't do it despite the head coach

 

The bolded might be part of the problem. All facts need to be analyzed, otherwise it's just pieces of information. What they mean and how they relate to each other is important.

 

For instance, the Broncos reached the SB in 2013, yes, but they also had one of the most prolific offenses in the history of the NFL.

 

The Colts "only" scored 24 points against the Broncos, but they also purposely slowed the game down and made it about field position when they were up by 2 scores in the third quarter.

 

The Broncos had zero sacks in that game, despite having a great pass rush tandem, and despite the Colts starting a makeshift offense line.

 

They have similar defensive personnel to the Patriots, especially in the secondary, yet they refused to press the Colts receivers, instead playing Cover 3 and Cover 4 with cushions.

 

It was a bad gameplan. Doesn't matter that the Colts "only" scored 24 points. It was a misuse of their personnel, and it didn't work. Again, it's not about JDR being a good or a bad coach. It's about how he chose to deploy his personnel in that game. At least, for me.

[oldunclemark]

That is not what I said. All I know is what I seen with my own eyes. Luck had all day behind a line that had a lot to be desired. They gave up almost 100 yards rushing yards to a team that is at the bottom of the league in rushing. Denvers defense was rated 15th in the league according to ESPN. 17th in the league according to Fox sports. Take into consideration how much money that was spent on Denvers defense they underachieved. The Broncos have two premier pass rushers and they didn't pressure Luck all game. The two picks they got were Lucks fault, not anything they did. If you like Del Rio that's fine but I don't buy into the fact he is a great coach. His record speaks for itself. He may do fine or even great in Oakland but you cant assume that will happen with his past record.

I never said he's a great coach..just not to blame when they lose..I've heard that for 2 years and it doesn't

match up with what the number show.

Did you see Indy score 24 when they averaged 31...? Did you se Luck under 300 yards?

Denver was top-10 in the NFL in rush and pass defense according to the NFL web site.

I dont see how he was inadequate in the Colts game..They scored 24 points after repeatedly being put in bad field position because

Peyton couldn't move the ball. And when you've 10-6 or 11-5...as a head coach..that's good..not bad...

Nobody loves Manning more than me...but the loss to the Colts is largely on him...not the Denver defense..that's what my eyes saw

Agree to disagree...at least it isnt a thread about the Patriots

[oldunclemark]

The bolded might be part of the problem. All facts need to be analyzed, otherwise it's just pieces of information. What they mean and how they relate to each other is important.

 

For instance, the Broncos reached the SB in 2013, yes, but they also had one of the most prolific offenses in the history of the NFL.

 

The Colts "only" scored 24 points against the Broncos, but they also purposely slowed the game down and made it about field position when they were up by 2 scores in the third quarter.

 

The Broncos had zero sacks in that game, despite having a great pass rush tandem, and despite the Colts starting a makeshift offense line.

 

They have similar defensive personnel to the Patriots, especially in the secondary, yet they refused to press the Colts receivers, instead playing Cover 3 and Cover 4 with cushions.

 

It was a bad gameplan. Doesn't matter that the Colts "only" scored 24 points. It was a misuse of their personnel, and it didn't work. Again, it's not about JDR being a good or a bad coach. It's about how he chose to deploy his personnel in that game. At least, for me.

Supe,...We saw a different game. I watched it more than once and, other than Talib, who was getting beat by TY, (They switched that assignment later) they did press them. The Btroncos didn't want the Colts to go over the top.

Remember....Andrew has 80 plays of 20 yards or more during the regulatr season.....that was the threat.

I thought the defense kept Denver in the game. On one possession the corners batted down three consecutive passes to force a 3-and-out..You probably recall that>

Now, I'm sure the goal was to hold the Colts to as few a points as possible..But 24 points and, I believe, 370 yards figured to be good enough to win. Denver didnt want to get beat deep and, except for maybe 2 plays, they didnt.

I expected more than 24 points from the Bronco offense..there was no to hold them to 13..

I just think you're wrong. I really do.

[BOTT]

I think you look at a loss and blame the coordinator when that same coordinator had success for 16 games...That suggests to me a prejudice for the coordinator that goes way back...an a stubbornness about 17 game sof resultsIts not logical...Denver went with a 4-man rush most of the year....the soft conservative game allowed 24 points to a premier offensive team..To me, its impossible to look at the Denver=Colts game and blame the Denver defense for the loss..As a fan...I don't understand how good play is on the players and poor play by players in on the coordinator.There seems to be a blind spot where Jack Del Rio is concerned..all faults are his..all credit elsewhere

I think you make things up

[Superman]

Supe,...We saw a different game. I watched it more than once and, other than Talib, who was getting beat by TY, (They switched that assignment later) they did press them. The Btroncos didn't want the Colts to go over the top.

Remember....Andrew has 80 plays of 20 yards or more during the regulatr season.....that was the threat.

I thought the defense kept Denver in the game. On one possession the corners batted down three consecutive passes to force a 3-and-out..You probably recall that>

Now, I'm sure the goal was to hold the Colts to as few a points as possible..But 24 points and, I believe, 370 yards figured to be good enough to win. Denver didnt want to get beat deep and, except for maybe 2 plays, they didnt.

I expected more than 24 points from the Bronco offense..there was no to hold them to 13..

I just think you're wrong. I really do.

You can play soft underneath, or you can use those pass rushers to disrupt the Colts passing game. Problem with the first option is the Colts were content to complete passes underneath. I understand not wanting to get beat deep, but that's why you have over $100m committed to the secondary. Let them do their jobs. If you're going to play shell coverage, you don't need Talib and Harris and Ward.

I understand we disagree. I just wanted to illustrate why "the Colts only scored 24 points" and "the Broncos were top ten in yardage allowed" aren't really defenses of how the defense was run.

[southwest1]

I agree with JJ. At least, the Raiders have hired somebody I have heard of & not an ancient re-tread from their glory years. He's not exactly a mastermind on defense, but he did take Jacksonville to the playoffs in 2005 & 2007 so it means Jack's capable of it. Plus, with Derek Carr, he should be able to win at least 9 games his 1st year. Carr is leaps & bounds better than KC's Alex Smith. 

 

I just watched Jack Del Rio introduced as the new head coach. Why was the press conference split up into 1-2 minute intervals on their official website? That was so lame. I did like watching Jack as a LB for the Vikings on TV & it was cool to see him thank Jimmy Johnson, Mike Ditka, Dennis Green, Brian Billick, & Tony Dungy as people who either coached or mentored him as both a player or coach over his NFL career. Jack did have good blocking & tackling on whatever team he coached. 

 

The press conference didn't inspire me or make me wanna run through a wall like a Rex Ryan microphone session does, but Rio does have childhood ties to the Black Hole & if Pete Carroll can depart from NE & be successful in his 2nd NFL gig, why not Jack? Peyton Manning & especially Phillip Rivers are going to be almost impossible to beat though, but resigning FS Charles Woodson should secure that Raiders secondary 1 more year & make Jack feel better though. 

[southwest1]

I don't know how he will turn out in Oakland but I do know Del Rio didn't have the defense ready for the Colts playoff game. Denver's defense didn't even get close to Luck all game. Everyone points the finger at Manning's health but the Bronco's defense wasn't prepared for the Colts. You would think that with two of the best pass rushers in the league they would at least put some pressure on Luck. Just my take.

That's an interesting take CC1. I'm not disagreeing with you, but I don't know too many DC's that get angry & in the face of his pass rushers. Here's my point: Miller & Ware are responsible for their own motors & intensity in the Divisional round of the playoffs. Maybe HC John Fox told his coordinators ride your guys hard in practice, but when game day rolls around they are big boys & need to work through their own issues on the field on their own timetable. 

 

Perhaps INDY's offensive line just gave the Broncos defensive line more fierce tenacity & swagger to dominate them in the trenches than they were used to seeing from an opponent outside their division. Just SW1's perspective on the matter my friend.