It will never happen, but...

[ColtStrong2013]

16 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

AR is not an accomplished college player or an accomplished NLF player. He is a LOW floor player with MASSIVE potential.

 

I don't see him as a low floor player. I keep seeing people saying this, but I'm not buying it. I think there is a strong chance we are seeing his floor, and that's debatable if it's as low as you are insinuating. I think he has a rather high floor. He is no where near a complete package at qb, where players like Young were supposed to be NFL ready and can't even line up behind the center properly. AR's size, athleticism, and arm strength raise his floor quite a bit as a quarterback, in my opinion. He's going to make the mistakes that vast majority of young players make and it's part of the learning process. I will reserve my full opinion until we see how he does over the course of the season, especially against lesser teams. He's been up against two playoff caliber teams so far. His performance against the Texans was strong, and the Packers defense isn't a cupcake by any standard. 

[Flash7]

3 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

I don't see him as a low floor player. I keep seeing people saying this, but I'm not buying it. I think there is a strong chance we are seeing his floor, and that's debatable if it's as low as you are insinuating. I think he has a rather high floor. He is no where near a complete package at qb, where players like Young were supposed to be NFL ready and can't even line up behind the center properly. AR's size, athleticism, and arm strength raise his floor quite a bit as a quarterback, in my opinion. He's going to make the mistakes that vast majority of young players make and it's part of the learning process. I will reserve my full opinion until we see how he does over the course of the season, especially against lesser teams. He's been up against two playoff caliber teams so far. His performance against the Texans was strong, and the Packers defense isn't a cupcake by any standard. 

He has the lowest completion percentage of any starting QB in the NFL, currently at 49.1%. That's lower than last year's rookies and this year's rookies. 

 

Being the QB with the lowest completion percentage is a low floor type of guy.

[ColtStrong2013]

43 minutes ago, Dingus McGirt said:

I believe he "survives."  The ownership core - Jim Irsay and his daughters appear to be pretty hands-off at this time - possibly due to serious health concerns outweighing their obligations to the team and fans.  As long as the franchise is financially viable and the money flows - they won't move on from their team's GM.

I agree with you. I've been a Ballard supporter from day 1, and while my current feelings on the state of the roster are not as optimistic as they have been, I think he was given a fresh slate when Frank was fired. Landing Steichen was impressive, no matter what your feelings were. He bought in to Ballard's bit, when he had opportunities including rolling it back with the Eagles which would have likely opened up even more. The core he has drafted over the last couple years at key positions have to develop, and Ballard has to open up to being more aggressive with the roster. If that happens, I don't see him leaving any time soon. 

We could be entirely wrong. I just don't know that I see a rebuild happening in the next few years, and that's what it would be. 

[Patrick Miller]

9 hours ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Every QB drafted is a project 

Usually not to this extent and usually not starting right off the bat.

[ColtStrong2013]

3 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

He has the lowest completion percentage of any starting QB in the NFL, currently at 49.1%. That's lower than last year's rookies and this year's rookies. 

 

Being the QB with the lowest completion percentage is a low floor type of guy.

 

Trevor Lawrence, who has been in the league for 4 years is 51% and 1 Touchdown. Bo Nix, who is 2 years older than AR, is at 60% completion but has thrown 4 interceptions and 0 touchdowns. AR has 4 touchdowns total. Don't use a single statistic to insinuate he's the worst qb in the league, which is what your post is trying to say. This is his floor, and it's better than a lot of qb's floors. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

5 minutes ago, Patrick Miller said:

Usually not to this extent and usually not starting right off the bat.

AR has enough talent where his floor can win  the colts games. Steichen just has to use it until his passing game gets better. His floor is very high if Steichen develops the right game plan. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

3 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

Trevor Lawrence, who has been in the league for 4 years is 51% and 1 Touchdown. Bo Nix, who is 2 years older than AR, is at 60% completion but has thrown 4 interceptions and 0 touchdowns. AR has 4 touchdowns total. Don't use a single statistic to insinuate he's the worst qb in the league, which is what your post is trying to say. This is his floor, and it's better than a lot of qb's floors. 

You’re probably never going to be able to look at completion percentage and know the true impact he had. Texans game was a good example. 

[Flash7]

Just now, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

Trevor Lawrence, who has been in the league for 4 years is 51% and 1 Touchdown. Bo Nix, who is 2 years older than AR, is at 60% completion but has thrown 4 interceptions and 0 touchdowns. AR has 4 touchdowns total. Don't use a single statistic to insinuate he's the worst qb in the league, which is what your post is trying to say. This is his floor, and it's better than a lot of qb's floors. 

I'm not making the claim that he's the worst QB in the league. I am, however, pointing out that he's a LOW floor type of player.

 

I understand he has immense talents and a ton of potential. But without a doubt, he's a low floor QB with a very high ceiling. That's why everyone is saying to be patient. He's a project QB.

 

 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

13 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

He has the lowest completion percentage of any starting QB in the NFL, currently at 49.1%. That's lower than last year's rookies and this year's rookies. 

 

Being the QB with the lowest completion percentage is a low floor type of guy.

No it isn’t a low floor guy. If all AR could do was be a pocket passer you would be right. Go look at the Texans game. That completion percentage did not show the impact he had on the game. 

[Flash7]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

No it isn’t a low floor guy. If all AR could do was be a pocket passer you would be right. Go look at the Texans game. That completion percentage did not show the impact he had on the game. 

AR threw 4 - 5 deep passes in the Texans game. He did not have that opportunity in the GB game. They took that away after seeing the film.

 

What were we left with?

[Patrick Miller]

2 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

AR has enough talent where his floor can run the colts games. Steichen just has to use it until his passing game gets better. His floor is very high if Steichen develops the right game plan. 

So you think Steichen should just run  designed qb runs and deep throws since AR is inaccurate with short to intermediate throws? Lean on Taylor more? I can agree with the Taylor part…..

[ColtStrong2013]

Just now, Flash7 said:

I'm not making the claim that he's the worst QB in the league. I am, however, pointing out that he's a LOW floor type of player.

 

I understand he has immense talents and a ton of potential. But without a doubt, he's a low floor QB with a very high ceiling. That's why everyone is saying to be patient. He's a project QB.

 

 

Respectfully disagree. His Low floor can make game altering plays and will win ball games for this franchise. Low floor qb's cannot do that. I don't think you are looking at it from the proper angle, which is comparing an entire rookie qb slate on any given year, especially the last two years from a playmaking perspective. You are using a single statistic and his inaccuracy as a measurement. He's basically a rookie, and a young one (the youngest actually) at that. Every analyst that covered the throw against the Texans said that there are very few if any that can make that type of throw. The things he can do with his legs is incredible, and hasn't even been utilized. His low floor is substantially higher than others low floor. 

2 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

AR threw 4 - 5 deep passes in the Texans game. He did not have that opportunity in the GB game. They took that away after seeing the film.

 

What were we left with?

 

A coach that abandoned his runningback who was chewing them up...

[Patrick Miller]

It’s funny Ballard called AR a pocket passer. Farthest from the truth.

[RollerColt]

22 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

Understood. But he's not a rookie is my point. We're evaluating him as a rookie because he was injury prone in college and ....surprise, he was injured in his first year in the NFL.

 

He's a second year player with the worst completion percentage of any starting QB, even when compared to today's rookies. But he has the most potential.

I don't know what to tell you. 

 

Considering how negativity wins the day most of the time and all the doubters are usually proven right, I guess we should just give up. 

 

Why do I even come back to this site? I'm like an addict stuck on a harmful substance... Like a fool I just keep comin' back for more. 

[RollerColt]

12 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

Trevor Lawrence, who has been in the league for 4 years is 51% and 1 Touchdown. Bo Nix, who is 2 years older than AR, is at 60% completion but has thrown 4 interceptions and 0 touchdowns. AR has 4 touchdowns total. Don't use a single statistic to insinuate he's the worst qb in the league, which is what your post is trying to say. This is his floor, and it's better than a lot of qb's floors. 

 

No one is talking about the proverbial golden boy. He's safe from criticism for some reason, even though he was touted as the next Andrew Luck and the most highly rated prospect over all QBs since 2012... 

 

And he's struggled mightily all 4 years. 

[Flash7]

1 minute ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

Respectfully disagree. His Low floor can make game altering plays and will win ball games for this franchise. Low floor qb's cannot do that. I don't think you are looking at it from the proper angle, which is comparing an entire rookie qb slate on any given year, especially the last two years from a playmaking perspective. You are using a single statistic and his inaccuracy as a measurement. He's basically a rookie, and a young one (the youngest actually) at that. Every analyst that covered the throw against the Texans said that there are very few if any that can make that type of throw. The things he can do with his legs is incredible, and hasn't even been utilized. His low floor is substantially higher than others low floor. 

 

A coach that abandoned his runningback who was chewing them up...

It may help to define terms. To me, a low floor player is someone who has immense flaws. A high ceiling player is someone who has immense traits/talent that if fully developed can be amongst the best at the position.

 

When I point out that AR has the lowest completion percentage of any starting QB, I'm simply pointing out a flaw. When you state that he's the youngest QB in the league, you are actually stating my case. He is inexperienced and thus, lowering his floor.

 

And when you point out his amazing throws and what he can do with his legs and running ability, I agree with you. That's his immense talent and ability. He has a high ceiling due to those abilities.

 

That's why I see him as a low floor (project QB) that has a very high ceiling.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

12 minutes ago, Patrick Miller said:

So you think Steichen should just run  designed qb runs and deep throws since AR is inaccurate with short to intermediate throws? Lean on Taylor more? I can agree with the Taylor part…..

That isn’t what I said. You know you can run rollouts ect. Now every pass has to be directly from the pocket. We also had a great RB that Steichen needs to use

[Flash7]

7 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

I don't know what to tell you. 

 

Considering how negativity wins the day most of the time and all the doubters are usually proven right, I guess we should just give up. 

 

Why do I even come back to this site? I'm like an addict stuck on a harmful substance... Like a fool I just keep comin' back for more. 

I don't see it as simply being negative for pointing out the truth.

 

Was AR injury prone in college? Yes.

 

Was AR injured in his first year? Yes

 

Does he currently have the worst completion percentage in the NFL of any starting QB? Yes

 

Does he have immense potential and an opportunity to improve? Yes.

[ColtStrong2013]

2 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

It may help to define terms. To me, a low floor player is someone who has immense flaws. A high ceiling player is someone who has immense traits/talent that if fully developed can be amongst the best at the position.

 

When I point out that AR has the lowest completion percentage of any starting QB, I'm simply pointing out a flaw. When you state that he's the youngest QB in the league, you are actually stating my case. He is inexperienced and thus, lowering his floor.

 

And when you point out his amazing throws and what he can do with his legs and running ability, I agree with you. That's his immense talent and ability. He has a high ceiling due to those abilities.

 

That's why I see him as a low floor (project QB) that has a very high ceiling.

 

I understand that. I just see it differently. I see his playmaking ability as something other qb's don't have, which raises his floor comparatively. Especially as an inexperienced qb (which is what they all are when they come into the league and don't have many games under their belts). I think his ceiling is very high if he can put it all together, especially a better touch on his throw and improved accuracy. I just think his floor is substantially higher than a lot of young qb's because of his playmaking ability. 

[runthepost]

11 hours ago, coltsblue1844 said:

I also think we are 2-0 right now with Flacco starting. Nothing personal against Richardson, but I'm so sick of losing that. I did not want to draft a project, and now I don't want to sit and lose for a few more years, trying to figure out if he's the guy or not.

 

Maybe the Manning years spoiled me, but I'm so freaking tired of losing. No week 1 wins in a decade...no division titles...no playoff wins..no threat to win a Super Bowl etc

 

I'd be thrilled with a new GM...then they can decide what to do at QB, coaches etc.

 

It seems like so many other teams have turned things around so quickly while we are still treading water.

Flacco isn’t stopping teams from running for 200 + yards in back to back weeks. Did you see how he looked in the playoffs last year?

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 minute ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

I understand that. I just see it differently. I see his playmaking ability as something other qb's don't have, which raises his floor comparatively. Especially as an inexperienced qb (which is what they all are when they come into the league and don't have many games under their belts). I think his ceiling is very high if he can put it all together, especially a better touch on his throw and improved accuracy. I just think his floor is substantially higher than a lot of young qb's because of his playmaking ability. 

This is 100% correct. He has play making ability others don’t have.

[Flash7]

2 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

This is 100% correct. He has play making ability others don’t have.

So he has a high ceiling?

[DougDew]

If the Colts wanted to trade AR because the team questions his development, no other team will give up a 1st round pick.  The value of an NFL question mark goes down pretty rapidly.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

We are two games in. Last week AR had the ball with a chance to run the game. The week before I feel in my heart had the defense made a stop he would have won that game. If you watch close this kid already has the ability to lead this team and put them on his back. 

4 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

So he has a high ceiling?

When a QB has play making ability they have a high floor end high ceiling. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 minute ago, DougDew said:

If the Colts wanted to trade AR because the team questions his development, no other team will give up a 1st round pick.  The value of an NFL question mark goes down pretty rapidly.

You really have something up your butt about this kid. I guarantee a team would.

[DougDew]

11 hours ago, Dobbinblitz said:

The 2025 QB draft class is weak.

IU QB Kurtis Rourke looked like an NFL QB against UCLA.  But he'll probably get labeled a statue and not be worth better than a 4th round pick to the current coaching regimes.

[Flash7]

3 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

We are two games in. Last week AR had the ball with a chance to run the game. The week before I feel in my heart had the defense made a stop he would have won that game. If you watch close this kid already has the ability to lead this team and put them on his back. 

When a QB has play making ability they have a high floor end high ceiling. 

Did Tim Tebow have a high floor and high ceiling? Big strong guy with play making ability.

[DougDew]

7 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

You really have something up your butt about this kid. I guarantee a team would.

Nothing up my butt about him.  Just trying to root out bias towards him by others who try to lay blame for failure on anybody else except their favorite stars.

 

Why would another team think AR is better than the Colts think?  We're talking about a terribly rare landscape where the Colts would have given up on him in a short time.  That part, the giving up part, means there is something different about AR as a prospect than how he is thought of today.   Its called abstract thinking that takes into account "what if".  And yes, at that time, no team would give a first.  

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 minute ago, DougDew said:

Nothing up my butt about him.  Just trying to root out bias towards him by others who try to lay blame for failure on anybody else except their favorite stars.

 

Why would another team think AR is better than the Colts think?  We're talking about a terribly rare landscape where the Colts would have given up on him in a short time.  That part, the giving up part, means there is something different about AR as a prospect than how he was thought of today.   Its called abstract thinking that takes into account "what if".  And yes, at that time, no team would give a first.  

You are just wrong. 

[shasta519]

34 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

No it isn’t a low floor guy. If all AR could do was be a pocket passer you would be right. Go look at the Texans game. That completion percentage did not show the impact he had on the game. 

 

The HOU game wasn't his floor though...it was his ceiling until he develops the rest of his game.   

[ColtStrong2013]

17 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

Did Tim Tebow have a high floor and high ceiling? Big strong guy with play making ability.

 

Thank you for bringing him up, because yes he did have a high floor. He won a playoff game did he not? No one's floor is good enough to be a franchise qb, and Tim Tebow was not. He did not put it together and get past his floor. AR very well might not either. That doesn't mean he doesn't have a higher floor than others. It means his floor is capable of doing things and winning games others cannot early on. 

AR's ceiling is not his playmaking ability. His ceiling is when he becomes a complete qb, and is an absolute nightmare week in and week out to gameplan against because he can beat you in a multitude of ways... and yes, it is higher than others because of his athleticism, big arm, and playmaking ability. 

[DougDew]

8 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

You are just wrong. 

No I'm not.  Its called unbiased observation even if it results in an answer I don't like.

 

When the shine wore off of Baker Mayfield and the team that drafted him thought he was no longer the guy, what was his trade value?  Sam Darnold? Zack Wilson?  Trey Lance?    You have to account for the part where the team that drafted him gives up on him.

[ColtStrong2013]

5 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

The HOU game wasn't his floor though...it was his ceiling until he develops the rest of his game.   

 

I don't think you understand the meaning of a ceiling... If he develops the rest of his game, what happened to the ceiling you are referring to? It just disappeared?

[RollerColt]

16 minutes ago, DougDew said:

IU QB Kurtis Rourke looked like an NFL QB against UCLA.  But he'll probably get labeled a statue and not be worth better than a 4th round pick to the current coaching regimes.

Let's see how our Hoosiers fare in October when the real games happen. 

[richard pallo]

If I was Carolina I would literally laugh Ballard off the phone if he called and made me that offer.  

[Flash7]

4 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

 

Thank you for bringing him up, because yes he did a high floor. He won a playoff game did he not? No one's floor is good enough to be a franchise qb, and Tim Tebow was not. He did not put it together and get past his floor. AR very might not either. That doesn't mean he doesn't have a higher floor than others. It means his floor is capable of doing things and winning games others cannot early on. 

AR's ceiling is not his playmaking ability. His ceiling is when he becomes a complete qb, and is an absolute nightmare week in and week out to gameplan against because he can beat you in a multitude of ways... and yes, it is higher than others because of his athleticism, big arm, and playmaking ability. 

Yup, we see things differently.

 

The floor to me is your weakest ability, which right now for AR (similar to Tebow) is his ability to pass effectively on a consistent basis.

 

The ceiling is reaching your full potential. In AR's case, he would absolutely be a nightmare for opposing teams if he met his full potential. As would have Tebow.

[DougDew]

6 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

Let's see how our Hoosiers fare in October when the real games happen. 

I agree, We'll see.

 

He looks like he's got great accuracy and decision making, the two most important traits for a QB. (like Stroud did).  And at 6'5" (listed) he has height, which is probably the third most important trait.

[ColtStrong2013]

Just now, Flash7 said:

Yup, we see things differently.

 

The floor to me is your weakest ability, which right now for AR (similar to Tebow) is his ability to pass effectively on a consistent basis.

 

The ceiling is reaching your full potential. In AR's case, he would absolutely be a nightmare for opposing teams if he met his full potential. As would have Tebow.

 

Apparently so. A qb's floor cannot be their single weakest ability. If a qb can score more than others that don't have a weaker ability in any single component, they have a higher floor overall. AR's ability to run and throw accurate bombs downfield raise his floor past his weakest trait of not throwing intermediate throws with accuracy. If he didn't have that ability, he would have a substantially lower floor correct? 

[RollerColt]

1 minute ago, DougDew said:

I agree,  He looks like he's got great accuracy and decision making, the two most important traits for a QB.  And at 6'5" (listed) he has height, which is probably the third most important trait.

I definitely like him a lot. From what I've seen in person he looks legit. 

 

I want to see how he fares against the meat and potatoes of the schedule. It's just brutal... Nebraska on October 19th, then Washington, MI State, Michigan, Ohio State and as always end at Purdue. 

 

If they split wins with that final stretch, that's one hell of an accomplishment. 

[ColtStrong2013]

3 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I agree, We'll see.

 

He looks like he's got great accuracy and decision making, the two most important traits for a QB. (like Stroud did).  And at 6'5" (listed) he has height, which is probably the third most important trait.

 

I think Young's fiasco is going to ruin the small quarterbacks future in the league.