Dont Feel Manning And Luck Can Coexist

[tonychen]

I just never buy the idea of "sitting and learning from a great". Some people keeps taking Rodgers-Favre example and claiming Rodgers learn a lot from Favre, but from what we have seen Favre keeps finding ways to get back to the division and revenge I cannot assume it was a nice teaching-learning experience. Also it is pretty obvious the two play different types of football. If there is anything Rodgers learned from Favre, I would say it is "not to throw into tight coverage like Favre did and instead use the safer back-shoulder approach and timing routes".

From what Luck said in the post-game interview yesterday, of course he said whatever situation he ends up in, he'll do the best as he can, but he also said he just wants a chance to

play

professional football. The tone dose not sound like he will be excited for sitting and learning.

Also keeping two franchise QB is a waste of resource especially when your team have many other positions needing to be filled. Not to mention the big FA contract decisions on Mathis and Wayne etc.

[Rich Cannon]

I happen to agree with the notion of keeping both qb's but if we trade the pick away we will have an abundance of pics to make us a real superbowl contender. And find Mannings replacement either this yr or next yr with draft picks we acquire from trading Luck

[WSO]

I happen to agree with the notion of keeping both qb's but if we trade the pick away we will have an abundance of pics to make us a real superbowl contender. And find Mannings replacement either this yr or next yr with draft picks we acquire from trading Luck

I agree with you but this guy is literally a once in a lifetime prospect. It would pain me to see the Colts not take Luck and to see Luck have a great career somewhere else.

[presto123]

I've heard two people on ESPN today say that as hard as it would be we should release Manning and draft Luck and build towards the future..That's how sold the experts are on Luck. Financially I don't know if they can coexist without handicapping the franchise.This might be the hardest decision this off-season ever made by a FO and owner.

[Rich Cannon]

I agree with you but this guy is literally a once in a lifetime prospect. It would pain me to see the Colts not take Luck and to see Luck have a great career somewhere else.

Yea i know thatas the tricky part about this situation...I remember all the hype about Manning. He def surpassed it with his greatness.

[Bond Shane]

I agree with you but this guy is literally a once in a lifetime prospect. It would pain me to see the Colts not take Luck and to see Luck have a great career somewhere else.

Once in a lifetime?. If you are talking a lifetime of a dog ( 10-14 yrs ), yeah.

We have had great QBs in the last 40 yrs and will continue have great ones in the future.

His stats are not even better than RG III. Same generation, same year.

Once in a lifetime, you kidding me, once in a lifetime?. ( Once in a lifetime = playoffs with Mora )

[tonychen]

I happen to agree with the notion of keeping both qb's but if we trade the pick away we will have an abundance of pics to make us a real superbowl contender. And find Mannings replacement either this yr or next yr with draft picks we acquire from trading Luck

The thing is there has never been a more "sure thing" than Luck in a decade and it does not look like there will be any college QB as close as him to "replace" Manning (just nobody can ever replace him) coming soon. I would not be against the idea of trading Manning even if he is healthy. From what we have seen from Luck's reaction, it is not a big problem coming to a team lacking talent, while sitting might be a bigger problem for him.

It then makes perfect sense for Bill Polian to suggest to Manning he shoud delay his medical checking point to March, since every team needing a QB will keep an eye on how well he recovers. He should only show his status when he is 100% because it is not only an issue of Colts own QB but also a public issue affecting the next decade of the entire NFL. If Colts have decided to keep him, he should get onto the field asap and show how much he can do. Otherwise he should wait and not risk his own trade value.

[Peyton and Eli fan]

I agree with you but this guy is literally a once in a lifetime prospect. It would pain me to see the Colts not take Luck and to see Luck have a great career somewhere else.

How much will it pain you to see Manning have success elsewhere?

[FireJimCaldwell]

Irsay is sold on Luck. Keeping them both is a waste of $ and resources.

If this happens, Don Draper will petition to change Madison Avenue to Manning Avenue.

[presto123]

Even if Manning stays he has maybe 3 or 4 years left best case scenario? Plus we would still be in rebuilding mode. The chances of another SB with Manning I would say are extremely thin. Maybe it IS time to start the rebuild with Luck? Like I said before keeping them both we would have too much money tied up in one position.

[Rich Cannon]

The thing is there has never been a more "sure thing" than Luck in a decade and it does not look like there will be any college QB as close as him to "replace" Manning (just nobody can ever replace him) coming soon. I would not be against the idea of trading Manning even if he is healthy. From what we have seen from Luck's reaction, it is not a big problem coming to a team lacking talent, while sitting might be a bigger problem for him.

It then makes perfect sense for Bill Polian to suggest to Manning he shoud delay his medical checking point to March, since every team needing a QB will keep an eye on how well he recovers. He should only show his status when he is 100% because it is not only an issue of Colts own QB but also a public issue affecting the next decade of the entire NFL. If Colts have decided to keep him, he should get onto the field asap and show how much he can do. Otherwise he should wait and not risk his own trade value.

Well thats an aspect i never looked at. Interesting

[BmoreColt]

I posted this in another thread but seriously this is why you cant have both:

Having Luck and Manning means that the salary cap is going to have a fair amount of money, more than any other NFL team invested in the QB position. Even given the rookie wage scale, that is a problem especially with all the holes on the team. Even with the Colts picking early in the draft, typically the first few rounds have instant starters, and this team needs some instant starters. The problem is by having both, you are kind of playing for the future, but hanging on to the past in Manning, while sort of competing for Super Bowls. Manning is good enough to lead the team back into the playoffs but I still see this team as a few players short of getting back to Super Bowl contention. Having Manning around also means veterans will be retained, and this will be a very similar roster to last years. Obviously that doesn’t infuse the team with young or even impactful talent, that choosing one or the other would bring. Going for the future and taking Luck in cutting ties with Manning means, freed up cap space to get free agents, and many of the older players leaving the Colts. It means rebuild mode for the next four to five seasons with Luck! Money to pursue free agents and continue to put pieces in place to make Luck successful. Trading the pick means infusing the team with young talent, while keeping some of the current veteran players. So that the team can compete again for Super Bowls, and have a good strong young nucleus of players from all the draft picks post Manning making the transition much smoother for the future QB. You cannot be successful by blending the two together. I am not saying Luck is a bad decision for Indy, especially if Manning isn’t healthy it’s a no brainer. I am saying to be successful you go all in on one or the other.

[tonychen]

How much will it pain you to see Manning have success elsewhere?

I will be happy for him and this is what he deserves after lifting an inept team for over a decade. He should be given a chance to show what he can do with a better defense and running game.

[tonychen]

Well thats an aspect i never looked at. Interesting

Yes and this is one thing makes me feel the team is leaning toward trading him rather than keeping him.

[WSO]

How much will it pain you to see Manning have success elsewhere?

I will not doubt that Manning will continue to have success somewhere else if he is released or whatever but moreso for how long? Would you rather take Manning having success for 3 or 4 or even 5 more years, or Andrew Luck for 10 or 15 years. This is all hypothetical of course.

[Rich Cannon]

I will be happy for him and this is what he deserves after lifting an inept team for over a decade. He should be given a chance to show what he can do with a better defense and running game.

And seeing him win with someone else will prob be the hardest thing, because i kno its almost fact if Manning gets a D like the ravens you can wrap up the Lombardi Trophy for him

[presto123]

I will be happy for him and this is what he deserves after lifting an inept team for over a decade. He should be given a chance to show what he can do with a better defense and running game.

I almost agree with this. LOL! If Peyton only has say 3 or 4 years left does he want to spend it here with this team that needs serious rebuilding? I know he's a good guy and loyal but the best thing for BOTH sides might be to let him go to a playoff team and start rebuilding NOW. I can't believe I'm saying this. Once again this will probably be the biggest decision ever made by a FO and owner.

[BmoreColt]

I will doubt that Manning will continue to have success somewhere else if he is released or whatever but moreso for how long? Would you rather take Manning having success for 3 or 4 or even 5 more years, or Andrew Luck for 10 or 15 years. This is all hypothetical of course.

Manning and the bounty Luck would bring! We know what Manning means to the Colts.. If Manning was released he could go to the 49ers who ahve $17 million free in cap space, and they would become instant Super Bowl favorites!

[WSO]

Once in a lifetime?. If you are talking a lifetime of a dog ( 10-14 yrs ), yeah.

We have had great QBs in the last 40 yrs and will continue have great ones in the future.

His stats are not even better than RG III. Same generation, same year.

Once in a lifetime, you kidding me, once in a lifetime?. ( Once in a lifetime = playoffs with Mora )

Stats in college hardly mean anything. Manning didn't have spectacular stats in college and this year Case Keenum has insane stats yet is not projected to be a high pick at all.

Also once in a lifetime prospect meaning this is as close as to a sure thing you can get in a QB. Of course there was, are, and will be great QBs but how many have been touted as a once in a lifetime prospect? Very few.

[Rich Cannon]

I almost agree with this. LOL! If Peyton only has say 3 or 4 years left does he want to spend it here with this team that needs serious rebuilding? I know he's a good guy and loyal but the best thing for BOTH sides might be to let him go to a playoff team and start rebuilding NOW. I can't believe I'm saying this. Once again this will probably be the biggest decision ever made by a FO and owner.

This decision will effect the entire NFL, one team immediatley becomes a contender while our teams future should be set for the next 10-12 years

[WSO]

Manning and the bounty Luck would bring! We know what Manning means to the Colts.. If Manning was released he could go to the 49ers who ahve $17 million free in cap space, and they would become instant Super Bowl favorites!

sorry in that post i meant to put I would not doubt. I whole-heartily think even if Manning isn't on the Colts he will still play at a high level somewhere else.

[WSO]

I almost agree with this. LOL! If Peyton only has say 3 or 4 years left does he want to spend it here with this team that needs serious rebuilding? I know he's a good guy and loyal but the best thing for BOTH sides might be to let him go to a playoff team and start rebuilding NOW. I can't believe I'm saying this. Once again this will probably be the biggest decision ever made by a FO and owner.

excellent point

I don't know why fans assume the Colts will be superbowl bound if we get Manning back. The team still has holes, F/A's to re-sign, overpaid players, even possibly an entire new defensive philosiphy. It would put an even bigger burden on Manning.

[tonychen]

And choosing this timing to let go the Polians who are in a war against local media is also interesting.

If the team goes into rebuilding mode and Manning is no longer here, the entire Colts public image is taking a big hit and as an owner Irsay will need to find ways to keep the club moving forward and earn money. If keeping Manning for another 3 years and he does not win as many games, the team does not get anything from a possible trade, and the local fans will more than likely lose their interest in Colts football. If they decide to take Luck, there will be an entirely new marketing plan for pomoting the young star and draw people's attention for another decade or so. Of course the beginning couple of years will be filled with many Ls and Irsay will then need complete support from local fans and media. Polians just need to be sacrificed for pleasing their 'enemies' from this city.

[Rich Cannon]

excellent point

I don't know why fans assume the Colts will be superbowl bound if we get Manning back. The team still has holes, F/A's to re-sign, overpaid players, even possibly an entire new defensive philosiphy. It would put an even bigger burden on Manning.

Absolutley but i honestley dont think our D can get any worse with the playcalling we just had. Seriously.

[tonychen]

excellent point

I don't know why fans assume the Colts will be superbowl bound if we get Manning back. The team still has holes, F/A's to re-sign, overpaid players, even possibly an entire new defensive philosiphy. It would put an even bigger burden on Manning.

Looking back into the decade Peyton Manning have played here I feel only the 05 team was close to "superbowl bound". They were unluckily eliminated and the football God compensated them by aligning every star in 06 and let a much worse team win the superbowl. Other years the team had obvious holes (not only one but many holes) that led them to the early exits they well deserved.

For a team to win playoff football, it is generally not your strength but your weaknesses deciding how far you can go. We know what kind of team we really have after this 2-14 season, and we understand why there were always issues here and there driving us out of the playoff: cannot covnvert short yardage, bad special team, cannot stop the run, etc.

[Peyton and Eli fan]

The question is not can they co-exist, but should they. I don't think it's in Manning's, Luck's, or the Colts' best interest to have both on the team.

[doogansquest]

Either scenario is possible.

One gives us the best chance to win now, and in the near future, with potential for long term gains.

The other gives us potentially another QB after Manning, while restricting our ability to win now, or in the near future.

Winning for the next 3-4 years is more important to the health/wealth of the franchise than hoping to win nearly a decade from now. We won't be able to have both if both QB's are on the team. Instead, we will wallow in mediocrity.

[tonychen]

The question is not can they co-exist, but should they. I don't think it's in Manning's, Luck's, or the Colts' best interest to have both on the team.

Correct.

For Manning, he wants to play for SB rings instead of teaching a young QB in the last 3-4 years of his career.

For Luck, he wants to play as soon as possible.

For the organization it would be great to have both QBs, but they have other issues that need to be addresses asap.

The best interest is to keep only one, and for the future decade it is better to trade Manning away for picks.

[IndyTrav]

Winning for the next 3-4 years is more important to the health/wealth of the franchise than hoping to win nearly a decade from now. We won't be able to have both if both QB's are on the team. Instead, we will wallow in mediocrity.

Why would spending $5.5 mill a year on a backup QB, have us 'wallow in mediocrity'?!?!!? Is that $5 that much more important than the $3.5 Addai was/is getting? Or Brackett? Do we even want to get into Freeney? Or is this not monetary based?

[tonychen]

Why would spending $5.5 mill a year on a backup QB, have us 'wallow in mediocrity'?!?!!? Is that $5 that much more important than the $3.5 Addai was/is getting? Or Brackett? Do we even want to get into Freeney? Or is this not monetary based?

Addai's contract looks like a huge mistake, especially in this year Brown showed he was a much more explosive runner. But when they were working on the contract they assumed there were no RB better than Addai in picking up blitz and protecting the QB in this system (which was true). Unfortunately there was no Peyton Manning to protect.

Poor Polians are having a tough year.

[JoKeR]

how much rebuilding do some of you think this team needs? Even after Luck the team will have plenty of picks to address G, T, CB, and SS. Then after that there's always FA and next years draft. As far as the cap goes I can see Manning restructuring some and Lucks salary would be almost equal to Collins contract for the first year. I don't see the absolute conclusions some of you are coming too. IMO the situation is somewhat flexible.

[ConBro]

how much rebuilding do some of you think this team needs? Even after Luck the team will have plenty of picks to address G, T, CB, and SS. Then after that there's always FA and next years draft. As far as the cap goes I can see Manning restructuring some and Lucks salary would be almost equal to Collins contract for the first year. I don't see the absolute conclusions some of you are coming too. IMO the situation is somewhat flexible.

Same. Peyton is the kind of guy who is willing to take less money in the best interest of the team. When he signed his new contract, he took less money, and also he said he always wanted to retire a Colt. I see him flexing once again, honestly.

[WSO]

how much rebuilding do some of you think this team needs? Even after Luck the team will have plenty of picks to address G, T, CB, and SS. Then after that there's always FA and next years draft. As far as the cap goes I can see Manning restructuring some and Lucks salary would be almost equal to Collins contract for the first year. I don't see the absolute conclusions some of you are coming too. IMO the situation is somewhat flexible.

Re-signing Mathis, Wayne, Garcon,Saturday comes to mind. If we don't, then we have to get a quality DE to take Mathis' spot because Hughes is not the answer. Without Garcon and Wayne, the Colts have Collie, Gonzalez, White. Assuming we re-sign either Garcon or Wayne as I don't think the Colts can afford both, if one of them gets injured, there isn't a lot of talent behind them. Gonzo and Collie have both suffered injuries the past few years and if someone goes down, it will be like 2010 during that stretch where Manning threw a ton of picks.

Behind Powers there is no solid corner. Lacey has regressed and could be a nickel corner at best from what I saw this season. Bullitt has had injury problems now for a couple of seasons, if Bullit goes down who will play safety? If Saturday retires, is Pollack the answer at center?

Its not only the problem of starters but because this team has been so injury ridden for the past half of the decade, we have to take into account their backups as well.

We haven't even gotten into signing other draft picks or outside F/As. Manning + Luck would seriously handicap the franchise and this team the way it is going into next season is not SB bound Manning or not.

Also why should Manning be asked to restructure? He worked his butt off for 12 years and he of all people should take less money? On top of that he could leave the Colts and make more money elsewhere than restructure his contract. There are other players who should be restructuring such as Freeney, Brackett, or Clark. They have been non-existant or injured this entire year.

[Adriancolts18]

I agree with you but this guy is literally a once in a lifetime prospect. It would pain me to see the Colts not take Luck and to see Luck have a great career somewhere else.

Or end up at a worse team like the Rams. I don't think Luck would be good with Manning, and would get all the blame for losing games just like Cam Newton thanks to their "wonderful" defense. I say we give up some "Luck" and get our defense on a roll, the only way this is going to start though is if Irsay would be smart and get rid of Caldwell.

[JoKeR]

Or end up at a worse team like the Rams. I don't think Luck would be good with Manning, and would get all the blame for losing games just like Cam Newton thanks to their "wonderful" defense. I say we give up some "Luck" and get our defense on a roll, the only way this is going to start though is if Irsay would be smart and get rid of Caldwell.

Wow Can Newton openly blames his defense for loses? He might have physical skills but his leadership is nothing to envy. A gifted QB with no leadership ability is a bust IMO.