Does it bother anyone else when Indy and Baltimore Colts records are combined?

[The Old Crow]

I have contemporaries? Oh please do tell lol.

It's no secret you love talking about this. No need to mask it by being the defender of all truth and justice that is the Baltimore Colts.

I just find it funny. Lots of people do. Because everyone knows. You were coming into this thread , despite saying nothing you haven't said dozens upon dozens of times, with or without me.

Speaking of a long time. Since you're playing the victim. How long has it been since I've mentioned your obsession with the move?

I do like how you went from "I haven't talked about it in a long time", to "Oh yeah well obviously I had to bring it up in a thread that had nothing to do with the Colts or Baltimore." Like the Colts are the only team to have moved ever.

Keep looking for hidden meanings and my, "embarrassments" though. It's funny that you think I care about the move a fraction of what you care.

To me, the move, and records are two different things. When I first came onto the forum, I probably had a more hardened approach, but it's definately tempered though discussion with you fine folks. Sure I like talking about it , because I love NFL history which this is a part of.

Honestly , looking at it , I'm happy with the move because we got the Ravens, and have good ownership and a ton of success. You guys have your Indy Colts and are carving out a nice history for yourself. My only gripes, for the record, is that I would like to see the Baltimore Colt records retired, and our Hall of Famers under a Baltimore Colts moniker, although it doesn't have to be under the Ravens. That's my opinion, and probably of most in Baltimore , but not necessarily your opinion, Jim Irsay's , or others in Indy. It is what it is, but it seems some of your younger Indy Colt fans don't like the records mixed. I didn't start the thread, but understand how some of the young Colt fans feel.

[The Old Crow]

Not many Baltimore records exist anymore anyway

True, at least the individual ones don't. However, from 1958- 1971 the Baltimore Colts carved out one of the most successfully winning and Championship eras in NFL history , except for maybe the 1960's Packers, and 1970's Steelers.

Not to knock Indy, but it was a much more successful record than the Manning era, and also better than the current Baltimore Raven's era with two Championships in 2000 and 2012. The Luck era has started strong, but as with the Manning era Colts, the greatest teams are judged by Championships.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

Old Crow's bitter rants usually go too far and this is about that time where I should point to The Move To Indianapolis - The True Story.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

Does it bother anyone else when Indy and Baltimore Colts records are combined?

 

No

[HarassedOffTheSite]

Crow-"Well Jim Irsay should change the name of the Colts because it's not appropriate to Indiana, and also his daddy stole my childhood."

 

LOL!!!!

[The Old Crow]

I have contemporaries? Oh please do tell lol.

It's no secret you love talking about this. No need to mask it by being the defender of all truth and justice that is the Baltimore Colts.

I just find it funny. Lots of people do. Because everyone knows. You were coming into this thread , despite saying nothing you haven't said dozens upon dozens of times, with or without me.

Speaking of a long time. Since you're playing the victim. How long has it been since I've mentioned your obsession with the move?

I do like how you went from "I haven't talked about it in a long time", to "Oh yeah well obviously I had to bring it up in a thread that had nothing to do with the Colts or Baltimore." Like the Colts are the only team to have moved ever.

Keep looking for hidden meanings and my, "embarrassments" though. It's funny that you think I care about the move a fraction of what you care.

By the way , you're the one that called me out on this thread. You obviously wanted me to answer for some cheap set up where you thought you could gain some points. For the record, I don't really care what agenda you think I have, I answer all threads as objectively as I can.

You don't see me on threads calling on House to regale us, then complain when you defended yourself.

[The Old Crow]

Old Crow's bitter rants usually go too far and this is about that time where I should point to The Move To Indianapolis - The True Story.

Hey, great to hear from you. You must have been on a long vacation !!!

[The Old Crow]

Old Crow's bitter rants usually go too far and this is about that time where I should point to The Move To Indianapolis - The True Story.

Only in Indianapolis. That article is in the green filing cabinet in Baltimore !

[Adonai]

Old Crow's bitter rants usually go too far and this is about that time where I should point to The Move To Indianapolis - The True Story.

 

That is such a great piece. I've kind of heard the story. Growing up in Northern Virginia I heard a lot of the recalcitrant arguments against Robert Irsay. But something always rang maliciously hollow. I did not know the truth and the details surrounding it. But what you've written closes the circle.

 

Thank you again.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

Hey, great to hear from you. You must have been on a long vacation !!!

 

What's up Bro. Good to see you're still here. Yeah I got tired of being harassed by Nadine. So I checked out for the off-season. But, the season begins tonight so....

[House]

By the way , you're the one that called me out on this thread. You obviously wanted me to answer for some cheap set up where you thought you could gain some points. For the record, I don't really care what agenda you think I have, I answer all threads as objectively as I can.

You don't see me on threads calling on House to regale us, then complain when you defended yourself.

Called you out? No. I predicted this thread would peak your interest. And you would post the same stuff that you always do.

I don't need points, whatever that means. I just know your posting habits, and knew you couldn't resist.

Was I wrong?

[The Old Crow]

What's up Bro. Good to see you're still here. Yeah I got tired of being harassed by Nadine. So I checked out for the off-season. But, the season begins tonight so....

Glad you're here. It's a more boring forum without you.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

That is such a great piece. I've kind of heard the story. Growing up in Northern Virginia I heard a lot of the recalcitrant arguments against Robert Irsay. But something always rang maliciously hollow. I did not know the truth and the details surrounding it. But what you've written closes the circle.

 

Thank you again.

 

Thanks Adonai. And I appreciated the Private Message too.

 

Yeah...I grew up hearing the same bologne. the storyline just didn't feel correct to me. And after awhile I decided to look into for myself. Sure enough...the details make clear that the elected politicians in Baltimore and Maryland assisted in creating the atmosphere of controversy and ultimately the actual move itself.

 

It is unfortunate. But....we live in a democracy and we deserve the leaders we get. And if that is true, then we deserve the decisions that they make. The people of Baltimore allowed themselves to be hoodwinked by a group of nitwit politicians and their enablers/excuse makers/water carriers within the local media. For them it really is a sad story. And I comprehend the reasons why many of them would default to making it a personal problem. But the fact is, it wasn't personal. It was business. And Irsay made some very intelligent business decisions where the move is concerned.

[The Old Crow]

Called you out? No. I predicted this thread would peak your interest. And you would post the same stuff that you always do.

I don't need points, whatever that means. I just know your posting habits, and knew you couldn't resist.

Was I wrong?

Alright House, we all know I like the topic just like AM Football is like a moth to a spygate flame up. I guess we all have topics we enjoy more than others. In fairness, I have commented on many topics, many highly complimentary of the Colts, but I guess they get lost in the wash , that's all I'm saying.

[Adonai]

Was I wrong?

 

It appears not.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

Glad you're here. It's a more boring forum without you.

 

I appreciate you saying that. Glad to be back.

[House]

Alright House, we all know I like the topic just like AM Football is like a moth to a spygate flame up. I guess we all have topics we enjoy more than others. In fairness, I have commented on many topics, many highly complimentary of the Colts, but I guess they get lost in the wash , that's all I'm saying.

So we both agree that someone like yourself would be drawn to a topic like this, yet somehow I've called you out?

Interesting logic I guess.

[The Old Crow]

It appears not.

Great, you guys win a cookie !

[HarassedOffTheSite]

Alright House, we all know I like the topic just like AM Football is like a moth to a spygate flame up.

 

Amen!!!!! Hahaha speaking of, did anyone see the Eagles' receiver who called them* out for it this off-season? Awesome!!!

[GoColts8818]

Same old argument different thread...

[Adonai]

Great, you guys win a cookie !

 

I do not win one. But House certainly does. He did call it!

[The Old Crow]

So we both agree that someone like yourself would be drawn to a topic like this, yet somehow I've called you out?

Interesting logic I guess.

As you a drawn to certain topics. It's like picking a subject you like when picking a book . We all have preferences. Your prognostication would have probably been correct, but you did invoke my name. Anyway, I think I'm pretty fair on the subject , although I understand it's the minority view in Indy . Would you prefer a totally Indy-Centric forum ?

[Adonai]

Same old argument different thread...

 

I suspect that it will continue until the old Baltimore fans die off. Then there will not be enough people left to shout down the truth.

[The Old Crow]

I do not win one. But House certainly does. He did call it!

Awesome Adonai. I'll send him a copy of when the Colts were Baltimore's by John Steadman as a reward.

[Adonai]

Amen!!!!! Hahaha speaking of, did anyone see the Eagles' receiver who called them* out for it this off-season? Awesome!!!

 

I did! And loved every second of it.

[The Old Crow]

I suspect that it will continue until the old Baltimore fans die off. Then there will not be enough people left to shout down the truth.

A young Indy fan started the thread , not a dying old Baltimore Colt fan ! I think you guys secretly love the subject.

[The Old Crow]

I did! And loved every second of it.

I think it was ex- Ravens cornerback Cary Williams .

[House]

As you a drawn to certain topics. It's like picking a subject you like when picking a book . We all have preferences. Your prognostication would have probably been correct, but you did invoke my name. Anyway, I think I'm pretty fair on the subject , although I understand it's the minority view in Indy . Would you prefer a totally Indy-Centric forum ?

Do you think AM needs to come here to defend herself because you called her out by name?

You like the story you tell, and many others see things differently. I mean there are many recollections in Great Britain's history of them giving us the colonies. History is anything but objective.

Or those like me who don't understand the big deal in the first place. I'm not attached to sports teams because of the city they operate in.

[pacolts56]

As a Colts fans since 1962....hailing from neither Baltimore or Indianapolis.....

 

 

[HarassedOffTheSite]

LOL

[The Old Crow]

Do you think AM needs to come here to defend herself because you called her out by name?

You like the story you tell, and many others see things differently. I mean there are many recollections in Great Britain's history of them giving us the colonies. History is anything but objective.

Or those like me who don't understand the big deal in the first place. I'm not attached to sports teams because of the city they operate in.

Well in AM's case, the more the merrier. I guess that is the point of it with history. There are certainly different interpretations. I don't want to get into all that stuff again, because Brian and I have a few threads where there is a lot of info on the move stuff, from both points of view . The bottom line for me is that I enjoy Baltimore Colts and Ravens history, NFL history, and yes even Indy Colts history.

[Adonai]

A young Indy fan started the thread , not a dying old Baltimore Colt fan ! I think you guys secretly love the subject.

 

I do not per se. But it was refreshing to see Brian Casserly's piece linked on another thread. I think over the years, I had subconciously dismissed the arguments I heard eminating from Baltimore because somewhere, something did not ring true. And now I know that it was the personal animosity steered toward Robert Irsay that muddied the picture. After reading Brian's piece it is pretty clear what happened and why.

 

Come on, you have to admit that he has some pretty good detaisl in there that cannot be refuted.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

I think you guys secretly love the subject.

 

 

Come on, you have to admit that he has some pretty good detaisl in there that cannot be refuted.

 

Interested to see the response.

[The Old Crow]

I do not per se. But it was refreshing to see Brian Casserly's piece linked on another thread. I think over the years, I had subconciously dismissed the arguments I heard eminating from Baltimore because somewhere, something did not ring true. And now I know that it was the personal animosity steered toward Robert Irsay that muddied the picture. After reading Brian's piece it is pretty clear what happened and why.

Come on, you have to admit that he has some pretty good detaisl in there that cannot be refuted.

I was pretty hard on Brian in some of the earlier threads, but he did a nice job with the article. It's not that the facts are incorrect, but there is a lot more detail about Irsay's relationship with Baltimore, the effects of the legal case with Al Davis and the NFL, and some of the reasons why attendance fell in Baltimore. To me, those details are important to a greater story, but I think Brian really wanted to give it to Baltimore's politicians.

Most people in Baltimore didn't like their politicians then , and don't like then now. The only politician that tried to make everyone happy and failed , was Mayor Schaeffer. That was a sad story. I don't think you'll get that bad of an argument from Baltimore that our politicians did a crappy job, and we should have built a stadium. Yes, the fans were discouraged, but like all fan bases would come back with some hope. I've witnessed this currently with the Orioles. It's basically a cautionary tale for all cites, currently Oakland, as we discussed.

[crazycolt1]

I think I said that, you didn't read .

In a later post you said it. Sorry.

[Adonai]

I was pretty hard on Brian in some of the earlier threads, but he did a nice job with the article. It's not that the facts are incorrect, but there is a lot more detail about Irsay's relationship with Baltimore, the effects of the legal case with Al Davis and the NFL, and some of the reasons why attendance fell in Baltimore. To me, those details are important to a greater story, but I think Brian really wanted to give it to Baltimore's politicians.

Most people in Baltimore didn't like their politicians then , and don't like then now. The only politician that tried to make everyone happy and failed , was Mayor Schaeffer. That was a sad story. I don't think you'll get that bad of an argument from Baltimore that our politicians did a crappy job, and we should have built a stadium. Yes, the fans were discouraged, but like all fan bases would come back with some hope. I've witnessed this currently with the Orioles. It's basically a cautionary tale for all cites, currently Oakland, as we discussed.

 

I think it may be that the Baltimore people identify with this issue emotionally. But the rest of us do not.

 

If that is the case, it is understandable that many of the Baltimore people want the issues that touch on their emotions to be added to if not dominate the narrative . Whereas everyone else, though we can understand the feelings we do not place them over or on par with the actual facts. I think that is the disconnect for you and others like you.

 

His peice discusses the facts behind the move. But does not include the emotional background. And that is not wrong. Perhaps the two of you should get together and put something together. But his facts to me appear to be unassailable.

[Adonai]

What's up Bro. Good to see you're still here. Yeah I got tired of being harassed by Nadine. So I checked out for the off-season. But, the season begins tonight so....

 

You know, I had a strange run in with her the other day. She shut down a thread I had created. Something having to do with her superstitions. idk but it was odd.

 

I have never seen any of your posts here until today - but I welcome you back as well.

[The Old Crow]

I think it may be that the Baltimore people identify with this issue emotionally. But the rest of us do not.

If that is the case, it is understandable that many of the Baltimore people want the issues that touch on their emotions to be added to if not dominate the narrative . Whereas everyone else, though we can understand the feelings we do not place them over or on par with the actual facts. I think that is the disconnect for you and others like you.

His peice discusses the facts behind the move. But does not include the emotional background. And that is not wrong. Perhaps the two of you should get together and put something together. But his facts to me appear to be unassailable.

I know what you're saying , and like I said , I added on in previous threads. I would disagree that it is all emotion and no facts on the Baltimore side, but I don't want to get into all that again because we pretty much went through all the details previously. It was a tough break for Baltimore , but I think the move worked out well for everyone.

[GwinnettColt]

The Baltimore Colts name means everything to NFL history. Start with the greatest game ever played, to the historic loss in Super Bowl 3. The current incarnation , despite some great Manning years, still doesn't quite hold up to the earlier era.

 

I get sentimental about some things, too, so I understand what you mean.  

 

But you have to face the reality that the Baltimore Colts don't exist anymore.  They live in Indianapolis now.  I used to live in Nashville; Richmond, Virginia; Atlanta, Georgia (still haven't updated my profile); San Antonio, Texas; and Kuwait.  I don't live there anymore.  Although I look back and think, "those years were great," they are in my memory...a metaphorical museum in my mind.  

[tomloge]

Doesn't bother me one bit.  I've been a Colts fan since around '65.  The Colts are the Colts to me.