Colts released Shaq Leonard

[w87r]

4 hours ago, NFLfan said:

 

That's fantastic. Thanks for sharing.

 

His comment that he got "fired on my day off" indicates to me that this was not his decision.

Probably not but, that is just a reference people love to use, so it was probably just some comedic relief. Help him hide some pain in the moment.

 

 

It's got to be hard, whether it was the team, his or a mutual decision.

[shasta519]

45 minutes ago, 1959Colts said:

Too much is credit given to these internet grades. Just from watching, one could see, Leonard's play was no better than any of our LBs who have played this season.

My guess is Olubi will not be the replacement for Leonard, at least not right away,  he has been used as the backup to Franklin at MLB position.

 

Now that Leonard has been cut, we'll all find out soon enough, how he stacked up in comparison to our other players.

 

I was surprised they cut him, but I'm looking forward to seeing how the defense now performs without him.

All season I felt Leonard was not getting it done, and believed our other LBs, would never get a chance to show if they could do better, due to Shaq's reputation, contract and the Colts blind loyalty.

 

That will almost certainly be the narrative that will be spun...that the LB room doesn't need him because there's other young talent that needs to play. In reality, Franklin will be 28 next year and Speed will be 29. I think this move is more about financials.

[2006Coltsbestever]

12 hours ago, Rhodelesstraveled said:

Best move the FO has made in four years.  Now dump/trade Nelson and I am a believer again.  

You need to change Avatar now though.  

[2006Coltsbestever]

10 hours ago, HOZER said:

Pretty awesome for him to still do this….

 

https://www.wrtv.com/news/local-news/shaquille-leonard-gives-away-turkeys-hours-after-release-from-colts?fbclid=IwAR0T5nZoPMX1Uy9aXBiR-KGknVTPgwLUWVO3R-_yLk4tzi6tuXQtGJLqD9g_aem_AckvH0IjVX8H6_rmxOueXRZ1-98tHDVfhtPDjoFwjKH6LtRg4wBq2fLQFKQI5kMBKVY

The NFL can be a cruel business sometimes brother. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

As bad as this jabs me in my fat Homer belly - it was probably the right move, the timing of it just bothers me. 

[shasta519]

3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I think Q is playing good this season. Why would you want him gone. Our O.Line has been a bright point all season.

 

Q has played ok, but certainly not to the level that he is paid.

 

And I don't want him gone in a vacuum. Should also clarify...it can't even be done after this season anyways because of the dead cap hit. But after next season, there is an out. And if he's not playing at a PB or AP level, I would like to see the Colts take it.

 

I was more speaking to Colts loyalty to their guys still being a big thing. I find it refreshing that they are willing to make moves like this.

[DougDew]

10 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

I would love to see them stop doing that. Hell, release Q after this season too. Pay $25M AAV for a LG who is maybe top 10 at the position is wild.

 

Off-topic to your post, but I didn't want to dig around 12 pages of comments. I seem to recall a lot of discussions we had about Leonard's body type and how that could impact his career. Got a lot of flack for it too. But I think this could be it for him. 

Yeah, I forgot about that.  Seems like those of us who thought he might struggle because of body type have some support at this point...also by the way he played upon his return.

[DougDew]

7 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Q has played ok, but certainly not to the level that he is paid.

 

And I don't want him gone in a vacuum. Should also clarify...it can't even be done after this season anyways because of the dead cap hit. But after next season, there is an out. And if he's not playing at a PB or AP level, I would like to see the Colts take it.

 

I was more speaking to Colts loyalty to their guys still being a big thing. I find it refreshing that they are willing to make moves like this.

The difference between Q and Darius is that there is really no one to take over for Q like there was for Leonard.  You can't just cut somebody for financials unless you have a player of equal caliber to replace him. 

 

Even if he is overpaid, I don't see a ready replacement for Q on the roster.  Cutting Leonard really didn't hurt the team given the other LBers already here.

[w87r]

1 hour ago, Defjamz26 said:

Franklin and Speed have been fine.

Not really, LB core has been pretty bad all year.

 

Shaq included.

 

 

 

Franklin is going to asking for a big raise next year. He only has 1yr $3.39m left on deal. He claimed he was #1 LB in the league a month back or so.

 

He going to be asking for $15m+ next year. I wouldn't even give him $5m.

 

 

Just the thought of that alone makes me hope we move on from Gus after the year(Gus loves Franklin). Can't fathom paying big money to Franklin.

 

40 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

The whole thing is shocking more than anything. 1 minute the guy is passing out Turkey's for the underprivilege, then gets kicked to the curb.

Think it was the other way around.

 

 

Got booted, then went and handed out Turkeys.?

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, w87r said:

Not really, LB core has been pretty bad all year.

 

Shaq included.

 

 

 

Franklin is going to asking for a big raise next year. He only has 1yr $3.39m left on deal. He claimed he was #1 LB in the league a month back or so.

 

He going to be asking for $15m+ next year. I wouldn't even give him $5m.

 

 

Just the thought of that alone makes me hope we move on from Gus after the year(Gus loves Franklin). Can't fathom paying big money to Franklin.

 

Think it was the other way around.

 

 

Got booted, then went and handed out Turkeys.?

It was, my bad. Still sad. Leonard is a great guy. 

[w87r]

18 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

the timing of it just bothers me

It is weird, not sure if you've read through whole thread to catch up or not?

 

I posted a couple times thatI think the Colts did Shaq a solid here, if he wasn't going to play here, we are allowing him to move and and find a place to catch on to and play the rest of the season.

 

He wants to play, no doubt, if he was going to be inactive here, it makes sense for him to get some PT somewhere else.

 

 

Like I've said it's hard regardless who's decision it was.

 

Shaq will realize when he is out on the field elsewhere, that is waiving him was the best for him, and most likely the team, so everyone can move on.

 

 

Just wish there would of been better dialogue back and forth, from the meeting to the time of release.

 

Doesn't seem to be.

[w87r]

3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

It was, my bad. Still sad. Leonard is a great guy. 

No doubt, that's why it's disheartening to see people still shaming him.

 

 

Let it go, it's the end of an Era(error, some might say)

 

 

He is a great guy with high character, just because he got a big contract after playing elite ball, then injuries derailed his career, that doesn't make him a bad guy.

 

 

I'm appreciative of the time Leonard gave us.

[2006Coltsbestever]

2 minutes ago, w87r said:

It is weird, not sure if you've read through whole thread to catch up or not?

 

I posted a couple times thatI think the Colts did Shaq a solid here, if he wasn't going to play here, we are allowing him to move and and find a place to catch on to and play the rest of the season.

 

He wants to play, no doubt, if he was going to be inactive here, it makes sense for him to get some PT somewhere else.

 

 

Like I've said it's hard regardless who's decision it was.

 

Shaq will realize when he is out on the field elsewhere, that is waiving him was the best for him, and most likely the team, so everyone can move on.

 

 

Just wish there would of been better dialogue back and forth, from the meeting to the time of release.

 

Doesn't seem to be.

Yeah, I didn't even find out about this until like 11 last night because I slept all day, because I work nights. I seen where you mentioned that when I was skimming through the posts, and I agree. He now has opportunity to go elsewhere and play in a system he may love. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

20 minutes ago, w87r said:

Not really, LB core has been pretty bad all year.

 

Shaq included.

 

 

 

Franklin is going to asking for a big raise next year. He only has 1yr $3.39m left on deal. He claimed he was #1 LB in the league a month back or so.

 

He going to be asking for $15m+ next year. I wouldn't even give him $5m.

 

 

Just the thought of that alone makes me hope we move on from Gus after the year(Gus loves Franklin). Can't fathom paying big money to Franklin.

 

Think it was the other way around.

 

 

Got booted, then went and handed out Turkeys.?

Bad? 

[2006Coltsbestever]

23 minutes ago, w87r said:

Not really, LB core has been pretty bad all year.

 

Shaq included.

 

 

 

Franklin is going to asking for a big raise next year. He only has 1yr $3.39m left on deal. He claimed he was #1 LB in the league a month back or so.

 

He going to be asking for $15m+ next year. I wouldn't even give him $5m.

 

 

Just the thought of that alone makes me hope we move on from Gus after the year(Gus loves Franklin). Can't fathom paying big money to Franklin.

 

Think it was the other way around.

 

 

Got booted, then went and handed out Turkeys.?

Frankiln has been good this year IMO.

[Zoltan]

I was listening to Zach Hicks podcast and he was calling Franklin a top LB in the league, which I don’t really agree with. I mean I would say he’s an above average run stopper but his pass defense isn’t good. 
 

He did emphasize though that Bradley’s system just isn’t a good fit for Leonard because Leonard needs to be able to follow his instincts to make plays and turnovers but Bradley’s system is pretty much the opposite. Where you have to strictly follow the rules set for the position. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 minutes ago, Zoltan said:

I was listening to Zach Hicks podcast and he was calling Franklin a top LB in the league, which I don’t really agree with. I mean I would say he’s an above average run stopper but his pass defense isn’t good. 
 

He did emphasize though that Bradley’s system just isn’t a good fit for Leonard because Leonard needs to be able to follow his instincts to make plays and turnovers but Bradley’s system is pretty much the opposite. Where you have to strictly follow the rules set for the position. 

The one thing in defense of Bradley’s system is eberflus system was dependent on turnovers. If they couldn’t get a turnover they were bad and couldn’t stop anyone. Yes Leonard was great but I don’t want a defensive system that can only stop the other team by a turnover.

[w87r]

8 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Bad? 

Yeah, BAD.

 

6 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Frankiln has been good this year IMO.

I know everyone doesn't agrees with PFF grades, but he is #60/81 LBs.

 

Bottom quarter of the league.

 

Speed is the #43.

 

 

Franklin has been middle to bottom of the pack LB.

[Solid84]

10 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Bad? 

Have you seen how often they get burned on passing downs? That's not just a Leonard thing. They all get burned and too often at that. In a passing league that's a big problem.

[RollerColt]

2 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

The one thing in defense of Bradley’s system is eberflus system was dependent on turnovers. If they couldn’t get a turnover they were bad and couldn’t stop anyone. Yes Leonard was great but I don’t want a defensive system that can only stop the other team by a turnover.

This defense is also depending on turnovers. Had we not picked off Mac Jones we would’ve lost. 

[w87r]

Just now, Solid84 said:

Have you seen how often they get burned on passing downs? That's not just a Leonard thing. They all get burned and too often at that. In a passing league that's a big problem.

The hate for Shaq has left people blind to just how average to below average Franklin is.

[Superman]

2 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

there are countless examples of far better players at more premium positions not getting a 2nd contract. 

 

Like who?

[Solid84]

1 minute ago, w87r said:

The hate for Shaq has left people blind to just how average to below average Franklin is.

He has a high motor and is involved a lot. That and he hits people hard. That's what fans see, then disregard everything else.

 

I still have nightmares about how Kamara made him look like a chump - TWICE - in the Saints game.

[RollerColt]

I wish All-22s were more readily available (cheaper) so people can truly see how bad our defense can be at times. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

3 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

This defense is also depending on turnovers. Had we not picked off Mac Jones we would’ve lost. 

Not quite. We actually were very good on the red zone that game forcing field goals.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Just now, RollerColt said:

I wish All-22s were more readily available (cheaper) so people can truly see how bad our defense can be at times. 

This is an offensive league that is won and lose mostly by quarterback play. We have had a lot of obstacles with this defense this year. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

7 minutes ago, w87r said:

The hate for Shaq has left people blind to just how average to below average Franklin is.

I don’t think that’s the case. Franklins name is called a ton by announcers every game because of a great play.  If your into pff grades his grade has been really good I believe.

[w87r]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

This is an offensive league that is won and lose mostly by quarterback play. We have had a lot of obstacles with this defense this year. 

Try and remember this next time you are flip flopping with your opinion in the game day threads.

[RollerColt]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

I don’t think that’s the case. Franklins name is called a ton by announcers every game because of a great play. 

No it’s because the defensive line is struggling. We’ve seen this before during the Pagano days where the line can’t do anything, meaning it’s up to the linebackers to make a stop. That’s not sustainable football. 

[RollerColt]

4 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Not quite. We actually were very good on the red zone that game forcing field goals.

Against the worst red zone offense in the entire NFL… 

[w87r]

1 minute ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

I don’t think that’s the case. Franklins name is called a ton by announcers every game because of a great play. 

Of course there going to say his name, they've done little research on the team coming in and talking about the guy who was leading the league in tackles when he makes one 20yds down the field.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Just now, RollerColt said:

No it’s because the defensive line is struggling. We’ve seen this before during the Pagano days where the line can’t do anything, meaning it’s up to the linebackers to make a stop. That’s not sustainable football. 

Cover and rush go hand in hand. If corners can’t cover long enough the rush can’t get there. If you can’t rush the passer corners have to hang on longer. It’s really that simple. This CB room has been very beat up. I remind everyone how good the pass rush was before the CB room got decimated. 

[Solid84]

7 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

I don’t think that’s the case. Franklins name is called a ton by announcers every game because of a great play.  If your into pff grades his grade has been really good I believe.

His grades can be found here: Franklin - defense

I recommend anyone just slightly interested to subscribe - it's not the end all be all, but it's grades based on every single snap by individual players and the team as a whole. It's not just grades based on the big plays or the bad plays.

 

Franklin's stats:

Overall: 61.2 - Average

Run Defense: 58.6 - Average

Tackling: 56.6 - Average (barely)

Passrush: 61.1 - Average

Coverage: 63.2 - Average

 

@w87r posts these accumulated grades every week.

[RollerColt]

3 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Cover and rush go hand in hand. If corners can’t cover long enough the rush can’t get there. If you can’t rush the passer corners have to hang on longer. It’s really that simple. This CB room has been very beat up. I remind everyone how good the pass rush was before the CB room got decimated. 

And that philosophy allows a struggling Derek Carr to shred you to pieces.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

1 minute ago, RollerColt said:

And that philosophy allows a struggling Derek Carr to shred you to pieces.

He carved us up because of lack of cornerbacks. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

[w87r]

1 minute ago, Solid84 said:

His grades can be found here: Franklin - defense

I recommend anyone just slightly interested to subscribe - it's not the end all be all, but it's grades based on every single snap by individual players and the team as a whole. It's not just grades based on the big plays or the bad plays.

 

Franklin's stats:

Overall: 61.2 - Average

Run Defense: Run defense - Average

Tackling: 56.6 - Average (barely)

Passrush: 61.1 - Average

Coverage: 63.2 - Average

 

@w87r posts these accumulated grades every week.

Just the overall grades.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I have said multiple times I would be all for Shane  changing DC if he thinks that’s best for the team. This year has just been a little out of Bradley’s control.

[shasta519]

56 minutes ago, DougDew said:

The difference between Q and Darius is that there is really no one to take over for Q like there was for Leonard.  You can't just cut somebody for financials unless you have a player of equal caliber to replace him. 

 

Even if he is overpaid, I don't see a ready replacement for Q on the roster.  Cutting Leonard really didn't hurt the team given the other LBers already here.

 

A big part of that is because they haven't even tried to find a replacement or even legit depth at LG.

 

But Speed is only a replacement because Leonard's play hasn't been good. Speed is not some star being held back.

 

And the Q of the past 2+ years is very much replaceable...at a position that is not too difficult to address. So given two offseasons, I think there would be a replacement option. 

 

But again, it's more about the direction the team is taking. It's not anything against Q.

[shasta519]

6 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

His grades can be found here: Franklin - defense

I recommend anyone just slightly interested to subscribe - it's not the end all be all, but it's grades based on every single snap by individual players and the team as a whole. It's not just grades based on the big plays or the bad plays.

 

Franklin's stats:

Overall: 61.2 - Average

Run Defense: 58.6 - Average

Tackling: 56.6 - Average (barely)

Passrush: 61.1 - Average

Coverage: 63.2 - Average

 

@w87r posts these accumulated grades every week.

 

I don't think most Colts fans would like what they see haha. It would certainly be a reality check.