Wes Welker considering retirement

[amfootball]

This isn't really a question of overall GM cap management AMF. It's a question of taking care of special guys like Welker & Wilfork who did remarkable things to help your franchise almost win 2 SBs against the NY Giants. It's about recognizing Wes's 5 year contributions from 2007-2012. INDY faces the same issue with WR Reggie Wayne. Do we offer him a 1 year extension or say thanks for the memories & cut him loose soon? What you're essentially talking about is productivity vs sentimentally...AKA the Colts Bob Sanders situation: Salary vs injury...

 

My argument though is this: I break my cut throat production rule with Wes because of what he meant to NE when he 1st arrived there in 2007. It's like Kobe Bryant to the LA LAkers; You pay beloved athletes for their esteemed status & noteriety among the fan masses. You don't do this for all star athletes just a select few; Welker is 1 of those illustrious few. If Wilfork got his money, why not Welker? It's a smart public relations move. 

They did offer Welker a two year deal at $16 mil the year prior and he declined. That is a ton of money for a slot receiver as usually outside receivers are the only ones that make close to $10 mil a year. He turned it down thinking the market would pay him more and then they franchised him at $9.5 mil so he did get paid from the Pats. Then they offered him the second deal at age 31 and of course it was less as he was a year older and they had just paid him the $9.5. I think if you look at it from the Patriots perspective, they saw all three years connected. The 9.5 mil for one year and then 10 mil over the next two years so that equals about $7mil a year over 3 years and remember the two year 10 mil had incentives where he could have earned $16 mil and was a guaranteed two year contract. Denver only guaranteed the first year for him not the second.

 

So, I am not sure where you think the Pats low balled him or were not fair to him. He had NO suitors other than Denver when he turned down the two year 10 mil deal from the Pats and Denver only he offered him a mil more per year with only the first year guaranteed.

[amfootball]

It's hard to not take contract negotiations personal when a player's respect is tied to how much money you are finally offered though. That's the problem: The player doesn't alter their routine. They still lift weights, breakdown film, attend WR & general team meeting just like they have always done & yet management who doesn't take the hits or sweat in practice can tell a WR since you lost a step I can pay you less money now? It's like reporters with a HOF vote who never played professional football who decide at their leisure who goes into Canton & gets a yellow jacket. It's kind of a circus & lame to boot. 

 

Also, if a organization doesn't wanna pay you a lot they offer you an incentive laden deal & they make sure you don't touch the ball enough to get a salary bump. My point is that the franchise has all the power here in terms of enforcement not the player themselves.

 

Personally, I think Welker left NE to play with 2 future HOF QBs throughout his NFL career. A nice feathure on his WR resume. Yeah, CTE is no laughing matter & he would be wise to walk away while he still can. 

I think Welker's agent grossly misjudged the market for him. He was a slot receiver in the perfect offense for him to shine. I never blame a player for making as much as he can but a team is under no obligation to pay a player for past performance. That would be counter productive in the cap era where value is everything. It is up to the player and agent to determine what they want to do. And in Welker's case as I said in my previous post, he had no suitors offering him a deal two years ago other than Denver. He went there for a mil more a year which is good for him but in no way reflects poorly on the Pats. Every team asks aging players to restructure and few any players make the same money at age 30 or older as when they were in their 20's.

[ViriLudant]

He did go to his 3rd SB appearance with the Broncos under the Manning regime. Had Brady lost to Seattle in early February, a distinct possibility BTW, would you still claim Wes would have been better served by remaining put on the Patriots roster? I highly doubt that.

I'm very protective of Welker who was 1 hades of a WR that never got enough credit for keeping NE drives alive IMO. I don't like how some NFL fans are so dismissive of his value on 2 premium rosters playing for 2 HOF QBs. It royally ticks me off TBH with you.

I get what you're saying given his age & head trauma episodes, but it bothers me when people use age & concussions to downplay how valuable Wes was to 2 elite football programs in Boston & Denver. A lot of WRs don't play in 1 SB let alone 3; a remarkable achievement.

Welker's biggest mistake was going to Denver. Manning got him killed multiple times with his soft passes over the middle.

Welker in NE: zero concussions , zero "wobbly" episodes.

Welker in Denver (in half the time): three major diagnosed concussions.

[southwest1]

One thing to keep in mind with Welker is that they made him an offer the year before he became a free agent that would have paid him more than he made with the Broncos, but he and his agent held out and wanted to test the market.. They vastly over estimated his value on the open market, they were thinking it would be around $9 million a year but no one would touch him at that, so he took $6 million from the Broncos but if he had just taken the deal the Pats offered 1 year prior, he would have not only made more money but would have got himself a Super Bowl ring as well and arguably less concussions given the QBs throwing styles.

Yes JM51, there's always a gamble when you leave money on the table & test the open market very true. It's strange because NE usually tells their free agents go see what you're worth on the open market 1st & then once that ballpark figure is determined we can resume talks & hammer out a deal. What's ironic here is that the organization usually tells the player to test the free agency waters outright to ensure that they aren't breaking the bank & overpaying a star athlete on their roster. It's odd to see Welker get burned for taking a position that the franchise typically adopts from a cap space perspective 95% of the time anyway. 

 

You do make a valid point about Peyton's tendency to throw the ball high which got Austin Collie hurt, Jacob Tamme hurt, Emmanuel Sanders hurt, & Dallas Clark hurt. Brady does a better job of hitting his WRs & TEs in stride with the ball in by their jersey numbers so they can get down, protect themselves, lower the frequency of fumbles, & reduce head trauma. 

 

It was a razor thin margin by which NE won their 4th SB ring with a 28-24 final score but I guess that easier to handle than a beatdown score of 43-8 against the Seattle Seahawks I suppose the 2013 season. 

[GoPats]

Agents are supposed to be pitbulls & not warm & fuzzy. That's why athletes pay top dollar for rigorous representation. NE's problem, if they have one, is believing that they can constantly insert new pieces on their squad & still fire on all cylinders without a glitch. Look, I trust Bill who clearly knows what the hades he's doing. But, until they signed Revis Island, NE isn't exactly overly generous on the payroll to get their team over the playoff Lombardi hurdle. 

 

Yes, Welker is tougher than steel & as long as he gets inducted into NE's ring of honor I will be pleased in the longrun too GP. 

 

Oh sure... an agent's job is to get the best deal they can for their client. But of course they're not all created equal, and they don't all negotiate in the same manner. There was definitely some lingering bad feelings with Welker's reps, and how that may impact any Patriots who use the same agent is something I'm obviously not sure of. Writers who cover the team have mentioned it as a concern, that's all. 

[southwest1]

Oh sure... an agent's job is to get the best deal they can for their client. But of course they're not all created equal, and they don't all negotiate in the same manner. There was definitely some lingering bad feelings with Welker's reps, and how that may impact any Patriots who use the same agent is something I'm obviously not sure of. Writers who cover the team have mentioned it as a concern, that's all. 

It's cool GP. I wasn't upset at you or anything. I just laugh when people say stuff like Welker broke off contract talks because the player is rarely in the room when contract negotiation are underway. It's usually just the GM, owner, maybe the head coach, & the player's agent. True, the player ultimately decides to accept or decline an offer based on the base salary, signing bonus, & duration of the deal, but at the end of the day, I just wanted Wes Welker to get 1 ring with either NE or Denver.

 

Oh well, such is life I guess. You can't always get what you want I guess. Wes Welker can't have a Championship as much I wanted him to get 1, little dudes in stature can't always secure a place in the Lombardi record books, & just because I think actress Zoe Saldana is extremely attractive alas she will never be my wife. Darn it.  Just Kidding! She is pretty though, but I digress. 

[southwest1]

Welker's biggest mistake was going to Denver. Manning got him killed multiple times with his soft passes over the middle.

Welker in NE: zero concussions , zero "wobbly" episodes.

Welker in Denver (in half the time): three major diagnosed concussions.

Part of me thinks Wes just wanted a change of scenery. Take on a new challenge, a new city, & a different coaching regime. Plus, like I said in other entries in this thread, the allure of playing with 2 HOF QBs in a WR's career is a very strong pull or motivating factor. Most WRs if they are lucky only get to play with 1 good QB, let alone 2 elite QBs destined to receive a yellow HOF jacket. 

 

I won't argue that Manning had some ball placement issues in his career from a safety perspective that's completely true VL. I just don't like playing the retroactive you should have stayed put in NE game after Welker's WR career is systematically over now. It is frivolous debate with no meaningful purpose in the longrun with no value other than posterity & overall NFL legacy. 

[JerodMayo51]

Yes JM51, there's always a gamble when you leave money on the table & test the open market very true. It's strange because NE usually tells their free agents go see what you're worth on the open market 1st & then once that ballpark figure is determined we can resume talks & hammer out a deal. What's ironic here is that the organization usually tells the player to test the free agency waters outright to ensure that they aren't breaking the bank & overpaying a star athlete on their roster. It's odd to see Welker get burned for taking a position that the franchise typically adopts from a cap space perspective 95% of the time anyway.

You do make a valid point about Peyton's tendency to throw the ball high which got Austin Collie hurt, Jacob Tamme hurt, Emmanuel Sanders hurt, & Dallas Clark hurt. Brady does a better job of hitting his WRs & TEs in stride with the ball in by their jersey numbers so they can get down, protect themselves, lower the frequency of fumbles, & reduce head trauma.

It was a razor thin margin by which NE won their 4th SB ring with a 28-24 final score but I guess that easier to handle than a beatdown score of 43-8 against the Seattle Seahawks I suppose the 2013 season.

It's just unfortunate because I think he had a falling out with BB that influenced his decision. He said that BB was riding him hard and he felt singled out.

Julian Edelman just joked on a late night show that he was in Belichicks doghouse for 6 years lol, but if you heard him right after the super bowl during the trophy ceremony edelman says to Belichick that he loves him and would do anything for him.

I wish Welker and BB could have worked things out, he was one of my favorite players and was tough as nails.

As for Bradys throwing style, I don't think hes any more accurate than Manning hitting guys on the number, but Brady will often throw the ball very low and force the receivers to have to bend down and reach for it, which naturally protects them better.

Brady does that for 2 reasons I believe, 1 is to protect his receivers (I can't think of a receiver that has had a concussion from receiving a pass from him) and also 2 because if they drop it, there's no chance it gets deflected into the air for a pick

Manning has precision accuracy, but after that neck surgery he lost some of that steam on his throws.. and it was very very obvious the 2nd half of last year. . He could put it dead on the money, but it took awhile to get to that spot and allowed the defender an extra half second or so to close on the receiver.. and even a half a second for an athlete that can run 15 to 20 mph, that is the difference of a few yards

[Moose Of Woe]

Always been a fan of WW since his NE days, but it might be that time...he looked like he hit a wall last season.

[bap1331]

Ill always remember that brady overthrown pass to wes welker on the final drive against the giants. Yet ppl refuse to blame brady and blame welker for not being inches taller.

Brady has choked many times and never blamed. To me the mvps of the super bowl were

2001-vinatieri

2003-some defensive guy

2004-vinatieri

2014-butler

Yet brady gets all the credit...

[ViriLudant]

Ill always remember that brady overthrown pass to wes welker on the final drive against the giants. Yet ppl refuse to blame brady and blame welker for not being inches taller.

Brady has choked many times and never blamed. To me the mvps of the super bowl were

2001-vinatieri

2003-some defensive guy

2004-vinatieri

2014-butler

Yet brady gets all the credit...

Right, because Vinatieri kicked an 80 yard FG.

Oh, and Welker's drop hit him in both hands.

Never mind that Brady led his team to the best 4th quarter comeback in SB history.

But haters refuse to look at logic.

[-JJ-]

Ill always remember that brady overthrown pass to wes welker on the final drive against the giants. Yet ppl refuse to blame brady and blame welker for not being inches taller.

Brady has choked many times and never blamed. To me the mvps of the super bowl were

2001-vinatieri

2003-some defensive guy

2004-vinatieri

2014-butler

Yet brady gets all the credit...

Pease tell me when has a kicker gotten an MVP lol. They do their job- its a percentage- given to the coach at the beginning of each game from various distances and each end of the field.

 

FG to win. Oh lets get a TD instead with seconds left. You're funny.

[amfootball]

Pease tell me when has a kicker gotten an MVP lol. They do their job- its a percentage- given to the coach at the beginning of each game from various distances and each end of the field.

 

FG to win. Oh lets get a TD instead with seconds left. You're funny.

The most enjoyable aspect of this past SB for me was Brady leading not one but two TD drives for the win against the best defense in the league. Just awesome.

[oldunclemark]

Always been a fan of WW since his NE days, but it might be that time...he looked like he hit a wall last season.

Always been a fan of WW since his NE days, but it might be that time...he looked like he hit a wall last season.

How many wide recievers in the NFL are older than Wes?

Reggie Wayne

[JerodMayo51]

Ill always remember that brady overthrown pass to wes welker on the final drive against the giants. Yet ppl refuse to blame brady and blame welker for not being inches taller.

Brady has choked many times and never blamed. To me the mvps of the super bowl were

2001-vinatieri

2003-some defensive guy

2004-vinatieri

2014-butler

Yet brady gets all the credit...

Lol

2001-vinatieri Yea let's give it to a kicker for making 1 45 yard field goal, not the QB that drove them down the field with less than a minute to go with Madden suggesting he kneel and play for OT.. lol!

2003-some defensive guy. Lol what? That game was a total shootout in the 2nd half, they were scoring touchdowns left and right, there wasn't a single defender that had a memorable game

2004-vinatieri Did you even watch that game? There was no game winning field goal in that one against the Eagles... and deion branch won MVP lol

2014-butler how much of a hater can you be. Brady scored 4 touchdowns against the NFLs best defense over the last 3 years, the same defense the Broncos managed only 1 touchdown against in garbage time the year before with an historic offense. 2 of those touchdowns by Brady were in the 4th quarter where he went 13 of 15, 130 yards and 2 tds to lead the biggest 4th quarter comeback in superbowl history.. lol! Yea Brady definitely didn't deserve the MVP!

Wow good stuff, comedic gold.. thanks I needed that laugh after a long week

[GoPats]

Right, because Vinatieri kicked an 80 yard FG.

Oh, and Welker's drop hit him in both hands.

Never mind that Brady led his team to the best 4th quarter comeback in SB history.

But haters refuse to look at logic.

 

I bet he says that yet probably still blames Reggie Wayne for the INT in the Super Bowl against the Saints. 

 

[oldunclemark]

Wes Welker is now saying he is NOT considering retirement and will play in 2015.

Just where: I'm not sure.

San Diego?

[amfootball]

Wes Welker is now saying he is NOT considering retirement and will play in 2015.

Just where: I'm not sure.

San Diego?

I heard that too. He is a FA so he can go anywhere he wants. Can't imagine he would command much of a salary at this point. I could see San Diego or the Giants or the Niners potentially. Not sure how much interest from any of those teams but possibilities.

[GoPats]

I heard that too. He is a FA so he can go anywhere he wants. Can't imagine he would command much of a salary at this point. I could see San Diego or the Giants or the Niners potentially. Not sure how much interest from any of those teams but possibilities.

 

Maybe a good but receiver-needy team takes a flier on him. You mentioned the 49ers... maybe Seattle would give him a one-year offer? 

[amfootball]

Maybe a good but receiver-needy team takes a flier on him. You mentioned the 49ers... maybe Seattle would give him a one-year offer? 

Yeah. You can get him on the cheap given his age and injury history. I am surprised he is not considering retirement.

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

Not surprised concussions!

[oldunclemark]

Yeah. You can get him on the cheap given his age and injury history. I am surprised he is not considering retirement.

Would Peyton ask that Welker be resigned?

[amfootball]

Would Peyton ask that Welker be resigned?

 

That is a great question. I don't know.