Should Pats rest their starters for week 17?

[ViriLudant]

Not a Brady hater. I just know how Belichick and Kraft operate. Business comes first above loyalty. They've forced Brady to take pay cuts and renegotiate contracts through out his career and next year they'll force him to choose. Brady will either play for around $9 mil next year or the Pats trade him.

Nothing I posted was outlandish. Everything I posted above about Brady has been right in line with the "Patriot Way" of doing things. You either take a pay cut when told or you're gone.

Wow.

You're not a Patriots fan, that's clear.

Brady has NEVER taken a pay cut.

Never.

He's restructured, and received every single cent.

[IcEWoLF]

^ what he said, he restructured his deal to be more cap friendly each year instead of handicapping the team. Brady and LaFell are going to be even better next year; they are slowly developing a good chemistry.

[oldunclemark]

Its a good question because most players have minor injuries at this point...

....I'd sit anyone like Chandler Jones..who just came back off a hip injury...and Julian Edeleman..

If you couldnt play last week....no need to come back now..Browner should sit...a groin is rest-cure

But Tom Brady should play....as long as the staring O-line plays..

You don't want to lose at home on the final day of the year ...that doesn't help you

[MJD42]

If you only play the starters for the first half and then pull them who are all the other players to take their place on the field on a 46 man roster?  Why don't the Pats play the backups the whole game?  The way people describe a 46 man roster is as if it's impossible to have many backups starting.

 

 

Everything you posted above is based on speculation as well.  You have no proof that Brady will play for a: "EXTREMELY cap friendly deal especially for a legendary QB."  My sources at Comcast Sports Net say other wise.

 

Your quote about Brady just raised Brady's market value and his agent and the player's union won't let Brady play for $7 mil a year.  lol  You act like Brady is more loyal to you than himself.  You think a: "top 3 QB" will play for $7 mil a year when Jay Cutler plays for over $20 mil a year?  Get real.  Brady and his agent know damn well that he won't allow Cutler and Romo to make 3x as much as Brady.

 

All I'm saying is don't be surprised if the Pats and Brady come to a stalemate and can't come to an agreement and the Pats trade Brady for multiple draft picks which I would do while Brady's stock is still high enough for the future for the Pats.

 

If multiple NFL teams came calling offering a 1st rounder, two 2nd rounders and future 2nd and 3rd round picks you wouldn't go for it?  I would.  What the Redskins traded to the Rams for RG3 I would do for Brady after the season.  That would load the Pats up for years to come.

 

And how do you know someone is "unproven" until you give them a chance?  Packers had to eventually move on from Favre to Rodgers.

You really don't know much about football contracts do you? Brady's base salary is $7 mil next year. He is not playing for that amount as he was given a $33 mil bonus two years ago when he signed his $24 mil extension so he will count $13 mil against the cap. So Brady has been paid AND the Pats have a huge break on the cap next season and the following two ... it is a win/win on both sides.

 

If they cut him, they will absorb an $18 mil cap hit. Not happening as much as you want your boy Jimmy to play.

[sportsworld33]

You really don't know much about football contracts do you? Brady's base salary is $7 mil next year. He is not playing for that amount as he was given a $33 mil bonus two years ago when he signed his $24 mil extension so he will count $13 mil against the cap. So Brady has been paid AND the Pats have a huge break on the cap next season and the following two ... it is a win/win on both sides.

 

If they cut him, they will absorb an $18 mil cap hit. Not happening as much as you want your boy Jimmy to play.

 

You really don't know much about football contracts or football in general do you?

 

Brady's team-friendly salaries for 2015, 2016 and 2017 will be $7 million, $8 million and $9 million, respectively, fully guaranteed for injury only. If he were to be released due to poor performance, he makes none of the money coming to him.

 

Trading Tom Brady May Make More Sense Than the Patriots Are Willing to Admit according to Boston.com...

http://www.boston.com/sports/columnists/wilbur/2014/10/_if_forced_to_lay.html

[sportsworld33]

Wow.

You're not a Patriots fan, that's clear.

Brady has NEVER taken a pay cut.

Never.

He's restructured, and received every single cent.

 

I am a Pats fan, just not some Tommy Heinsohn "Green Teamer" **** rider.  Some of you homers are like Dennis & Callahan how you salivate over Brady.  lol

 

It's great when Felger & Mazz destroy you on the air.  lol

[ViriLudant]

You really don't know much about football contracts or football in general do you?

Brady's team-friendly salaries for 2015, 2016 and 2017 will be $7 million, $8 million and $9 million, respectively, fully guaranteed for injury only. If he were to be released due to poor performance, he makes none of the money coming to him.

Trading Tom Brady May Make More Sense Than the Patriots Are Willing to Admit according to Boston.com...

http://www.boston.com/sports/columnists/wilbur/2014/10/_if_forced_to_lay.html

Nice October 4th article.

/endsarcasm

Oh, and lol

[ViriLudant]

I am a Pats fan, just not some Tommy Heinsohn "Green Teamer" **** rider. Some of you homers are like Dennis & Callahan how you salivate over Brady. lol

It's great when Felger & Mazz destroy you on the air. lol

If you think that Felger and Mazz know what they're talking about, that says enough about your football IQ.

[sportsworld33]

If you think that Felger and Mazz know what they're talking about, that says enough about your football IQ.

 

They just know more than you do.  Which says more about you than anything else.

[amfootball]

They just know more than you do.  Which says more about you than anything else.

lol. No they don't.

[MJD42]

You really don't know much about football contracts or football in general do you?

 

Brady's team-friendly salaries for 2015, 2016 and 2017 will be $7 million, $8 million and $9 million, respectively, fully guaranteed for injury only. If he were to be released due to poor performance, he makes none of the money coming to him.

 

Trading Tom Brady May Make More Sense Than the Patriots Are Willing to Admit according to Boston.com...

http://www.boston.com/sports/columnists/wilbur/2014/10/_if_forced_to_lay.html

That clause was only true if Brady was not on the roster before the last game of this season which is what the article you referenced pointed out. Might want to read it again. Once the trade deadline came and past this season, his contract became fully guaranteed.

[sportsworld33]

lol. No they don't.

 

Yes they do.  And they know more about the Pats than you do too.  :-)  They've objective.  You're not.  You're another Tommy Heinsohn Green Teamer.

 

I give respect to the Colts fans on here on their section they criticize, critique and question their team and look for ways to improve.  You just act like you're an employee getting paid by the Pats to fight for them.  So unless you're getting paid by the Pats it's pretty useless and quite pathetic to think you're getting anything out of this.

[sportsworld33]

That clause was only true if Brady was not on the roster before the last game of this season which is what the article you referenced pointed out. Might want to read it again. Once the trade deadline came and past this season, his contract became fully guaranteed.

 

You missed a very important part.  You didn't take into consideration injury and risking injury if Brady plays in week 17, heck if Brady plays and gets hurt in the playoffs too.

 

My point is it's very risky to keep an aging QB who will be 38 next season till he's in his 40's.

 

And no one in the Boston media including those in the locker room who know Brady like Tom E Curran believe Brady will be playing for $7 mil next season especially after an MVP type season and especially if they make the super bowl and especially if they win the super bowl.

[crazycolt1]

Should Pats rest their starters for week 17?

 

I was thinking about this, the Bills/Pats game is meaningless and I think the Pats should rest their starters to limit the odds/chances of injury and give them extra rest.

 

But for certain players and their specific contracts to sit or to play could mean millions of dollars like for Wilfork.  Certain players have to play a certain number of plays to get paid and for Wilfork if he doesn't play he doesn't get $1.3 million dollars...

http://www.csnne.com/blog/patriots-talk/sit-or-play-could-mean-millions-wilfork

 

If I was the Pats organization I would just pay Wilfork the $1.3m and sit him.

 

 

If I was coach I would be sitting these players...

 

Offense...

Brady

Gronk

Edelman

Lafell

Dan Connolly (and other O-lineman that need the rest).

Blount

Gray

 

 

Defense...

Revis

Browner

Arrington

Ryan

McCourty

Wilfork

Hightower

Jones

Collins

Ninkovich

Slater

 

This would be good to get Jimmy Garoppolo in ahead of schedule and play a full regular season game.

 

If Belichick does start Brady, Gronk, Revis against the Bills I'll be irked and believe Belichick just wants to run some military boot camp instead of actually winning.  That's when I hope Kraft steps in and overrules Belichick and tells them they're not playing.

So how did that work out for the Colts a few years ago? I highly doubt that Kraft would tell BB how to run the team.

[ViriLudant]

They just know more than you do. Which says more about you than anything else.

Dan Shaugnessy posts here. Great.

[sportsworld33]

So how did that work out for the Colts a few years ago? I highly doubt that Kraft would tell BB how to run the team.

 

Because it didn't work for the Colts that means it won't work for anyone else?  Not good logic.  And two completely different teams.

[crazycolt1]

Not a Brady hater.  I just know how Belichick and Kraft operate.  Business comes first above loyalty.  They've forced Brady to take pay cuts and renegotiate contracts through out his career and next year they'll force him to choose.  Brady will either play for around $9 mil next year or the Pats trade him.

 

Nothing I posted was outlandish.  Everything I posted above about Brady has been right in line with the "Patriot Way" of doing things.  You either take a pay cut when told or you're gone.

You claim to know the business side of the Pats then why do you think Brady took a pay cut? Restructure is not a pay cut. He still got his money it was just passed out in a different manner. He got a huge signing bonus at the beginning of his contract. That is happening a little more than it use to in the NFL. Maybe you need to brush up on your knowledge of contracts, especially Brady's.

[crazycolt1]

Because it didn't work for the Colts that means it won't work for anyone else?  Not good logic.  And two completely different teams.

It was used as an example. The word 'logic' is not really compatible in the NFL. (sarcasm)

[sportsworld33]

You claim to know the business side of the Pats then why do you think Brady took a pay cut? Restructure is not a pay cut. He still got his money it was just passed out in a different manner. He got a huge signing bonus at the beginning of his contract. That is happening a little more than it use to in the NFL. Maybe you need to brush up on your knowledge of contracts, especially Brady's.

 

Maybe you should educate yourself on how the Patriots operate and how the NFL owner's do business before you try lecturing others.

 

There are NO guaranteed contracts in the NFL.  The NFL is not Major League Baseball.  "Guaranteed money" in the NFL is so disingenuous  What NFL teams do is guarantee the money for the first 2 to 3 years of a contract and then after that they can cut you at anytime they want and the contract is voided.  In the NFL there are no "No trade Clauses".  In MLB you can have a "No Trade Clause" in contracts like Alex Rodriguez's.  All players are expendable in the NFL.

 

Crazy Stat Shows How Elite NFL Players Are Getting Screwed By Non-Guaranteed Contracts...

 

NFL contracts are non-guaranteed. In general, a team can cut a player at any moment, and all the years left on his contract are voided without him receiving what he's owed...

http://www.businessinsider.com/ben-roethlisberger-contract-milestone-2013-7

 

1.)  Brady took a pay cut in the sense the Pats back loaded the contract and stretched it out, and there is no guarantee Brady will ever see that money because he could be traded before that time i.e. Logan Mankins, Richard Seymour etc.

 

2.)  If Brady tested free agency he could have gotten Jay Cutler money or even more.  So he took less than his market value and the average salary around the NFL lowered for all players.

 

http://smallbusiness.foxbusiness.com/legal-hr/2013/02/26/tom-bradys-pay-cut-should-ever-slash-your-salary-for-team/

 

At the end of the day, Brady signed a selfless team friendly naive deal partly based on Wes Welker that leaves him vulnerable to ownership decisions.  He naively believed if he signed that deal the Pats would resign Welker.  Brady's contract is a naive contract based on hypotheticals i.e. "If he stays healthy and plays all games he gets paid."  NO elite player in Major League Baseball over the last 15 years ever signed anything like that because their agent and the player's union would warn them against it.  No agent would let his client sign such a naive contract with so many loop holes for ownership to exploit.  It's loaded with loop holes.

 

That's why Brees', Cutler's, Rodgers, Flacco's and Calvin Johnson's contracts are much better.  Brady could have gotten one of those contracts on the free market.  He'd get most of his money up front right away with no strings attached.

 

In some ways Brady's contract is similar to the contract Albert Pujols signed with the Angels with the differences being...

1.)  Albert's is guaranteed.

2.)  Albert's is for many more years.

3.)  Albert has a 'No Trade Clause.'

 

lol @ Robert Kraft honoring a contract.  Sure.

[sportsworld33]

And if the Patriots win the Super Bowl and Brady wins the MVP and has to play for $7 mil next year?  lol hahaha  The Pats played him so bad!  And it would really be something if they traded him while his value is still high for multiple draft picks,

[crazycolt1]

Maybe you should educate yourself on how the Patriots operate and how the NFL owner's do business before you try lecturing others.

 

There are NO guaranteed contracts in the NFL.  The NFL is not Major League Baseball.  "Guaranteed money" in the NFL is so disingenuous  What NFL teams do is guarantee the money for the first 2 to 3 years of a contract and then after that they can cut you at anytime they want and the contract is voided.  In the NFL there are no "No trade Clauses".  In MLB you can have a "No Trade Clause" in contracts like Alex Rodriguez's.  All players are expendable in the NFL.

 

Crazy Stat Shows How Elite NFL Players Are Getting Screwed By Non-Guaranteed Contracts...

 

NFL contracts are non-guaranteed. In general, a team can cut a player at any moment, and all the years left on his contract are voided without him receiving what he's owed...

http://www.businessinsider.com/ben-roethlisberger-contract-milestone-2013-7

 

1.)  Brady took a pay cut in the sense the Pats back loaded the contract and stretched it out, and there is no guarantee Brady will ever see that money because he could be traded before that time i.e. Logan Mankins, Richard Seymour etc.

 

2.)  If Brady tested free agency he could have gotten Jay Cutler money or even more.  So he took less than his market value and the average salary around the NFL lowered for all players.

 

http://smallbusiness.foxbusiness.com/legal-hr/2013/02/26/tom-bradys-pay-cut-should-ever-slash-your-salary-for-team/

 

At the end of the day, Brady signed a selfless team friendly naive deal partly based on Wes Welker that leaves him vulnerable to ownership decisions.  He naively believed if he signed that deal the Pats would resign Welker.  Brady's contract is a naive contract based on hypotheticals i.e. "If he stays healthy and plays all games he gets paid."  NO elite player in Major League Baseball over the last 15 years ever signed anything like that.  No agent would let his client sign such a naive contract with so many loop holes for ownership to exploit.  It's loaded with loop holes.

 

That's why Brees', Cutler's, Rodgers, Flacco's and Calvin Johnson's contracts are much better.  Brady could have gotten one of those contracts on the free market.

 

In some ways Brady's contract is similar to the contract Albert Pujols signed with the Angels with the differences being...

1.)  Albert's is guaranteed.

2.)  Albert's is for many more years.

3.)  Albert has a 'No Trade Clause.'

 

lol @ Robert Kraft honoring a contract.  Sure.

You seem way to upset that Brady likes playing for the Patriots and has a close relationship with BB and Kraft. Why do you have a problem with Kraft, BB and Brady? Are you the one who should have a problem with Brady's contract? I think Brady is smart enough and man enough to handle his business with or without your approval. Sorry, JMO.

[sportsworld33]

You seem way to upset that Brady likes playing for the Patriots and has a close relationship with BB and Kraft. Why do you have a problem with Kraft, BB and Brady? Are you the one who should have a problem with Brady's contract? I think Brady is smart enough and man enough to handle his business with or without your approval. Sorry, JMO.

 

Or Kraft is a crafty sweet talking car salesman business man who knows how to work a deal like how he suckered and played the people and politicians in Connecticut and Massachusetts for his stadium deal...

http://www.friedlander2.com/writers/writing/column28.html

 

You're very naive.  It's a business.  Kraft and his son are the most shrewd business people in the NFL.  If you think the Pats are loyal to Brady and Brady will see every cent of that contract I got some ocean beach front property in Kansas I'd like sell you.  lol

 

And Brady's contract is not guaranteed.  Since there are no guaranteed contracts in the NFL.

[crazycolt1]

Or Kraft is a crafty sweet talking car salesman business man who knows how to work a deal like how he suckered and played the people and politicians in Connecticut and Massachusetts for his stadium deal...

http://www.friedlander2.com/writers/writing/column28.html

 

You're very naive.  It's a business.  Kraft and his son are the most shrewd business people in the NFL.  If you think the Pats are loyal to Brady and Brady will see every cent of that contract I got some ocean beach front property in Kansas I'd like sell you.  lol

 

And Brady's contract is not guaranteed.  Since there are no guaranteed contracts in the NFL.

Did I say there was any contract guaranteed anywhere in my comment? Brady has already been paid over 25 1/2 million in the last two years. In 2015 he is due  13 million With a 18 million dead cap.. 2016 he is due 14 million with a 12 million dead cap.. 2017 he is due 15 million with a 6 million dead cap. It make no difference if Kraft is a shrewd business man or not. Brady was paid a guaranteed signing bonus that has no bearing on his future contract. So if the Pats do trade or cut him they are responsible for the dead cap space. . If Kraft is that shrewd I highly doubt he would eat that kind on dead cap money. What you are failing to see in Brady already made is big money.

[sportsworld33]

Did I say there was any contract guaranteed anywhere in my comment? Brady has already been paid over 25 1/2 million in the last two years. In 2015 he is due  13 million With a 18 million dead cap.. 2016 he is due 14 million with a 12 million dead cap.. 2017 he is due 15 million with a 6 million dead cap. It make no difference if Kraft is a shrewd business man or not. Brady was paid a guaranteed signing bonus that has no bearing on his future contract. So if the Pats do trade or cut him they are responsible for the dead cap space. . If Kraft is that shrewd I highly doubt he would eat that kind on dead cap money. What you are failing to see in Brady already made is big money.

 

The key word is: "DUE"

 

Yes, if he's still a Patriot.  If he's traded in 2015 he doesn't see that money, not from the Patriots.

 

Brady will not be with the Patriots for the remainder of that deal.  Mark my words on it.

[crazycolt1]

The key word is: "DUE"

 

Yes, if he's still a Patriot.  If he's traded in 2015 he doesn't see that money, not from the Patriots.

 

Brady will not be with the Patriots for the remainder of that deal.  Mark my words on it.

If he is traded he will see that money. Who ever trades for him will honor that contract. The dead money will be there and divided between the two teams trading depending on the terms. If Brady plays he will be paid no matter. I have no clue as to what the Patriots will do any more than you do. What you failed in your effort to debate this is Brady has already been paid over 25 million in the last two years. So he already has his big money. no matter what him and the Patriots do. You keep saying the contracts were not guaranteed. That's true but what difference does it make when the guaranteed signing bonus was guaranteed and paid already. It's a mute point to say Brady will not see that money when it is already paid him.

[MJD42]

You missed a very important part.  You didn't take into consideration injury and risking injury if Brady plays in week 17, heck if Brady plays and gets hurt in the playoffs too.

 

My point is it's very risky to keep an aging QB who will be 38 next season till he's in his 40's.

 

And no one in the Boston media including those in the locker room who know Brady like Tom E Curran believe Brady will be playing for $7 mil next season especially after an MVP type season and especially if they make the super bowl and especially if they win the super bowl.

You missed the part where injury does not count. Only if they cut him for performance and that is done with given we are in week 17 now and he is on the roster.

 

There is less risk with Brady at 38 than most QBs given his performance this season. And what prevents the Pats from throwing some more money his way next season given his performance this season? That is a more likely scenario then him holding out or them trading him. But like I said, he is not playing for $7 mil. That is just his base salary. He got $33 when he signed the extension so he will count $13 mil against the cap.

[GoPats]

If you only play the starters for the first half and then pull them who are all the other players to take their place on the field on a 46 man roster?  Why don't the Pats play the backups the whole game?  The way people describe a 46 man roster is as if it's impossible to have many backups starting.

 

 

Well, look at that... kind of turned out exactly how I said it would. 

 

You got an extended look at your boy Jimmy yesterday. Still think the Patriots are ready to dump Brady? I don't, lol... 

[-JJ-]

Well, look at that... kind of turned out exactly how I said it would. 

 

You got an extended look at your boy Jimmy yesterday. Still think the Patriots are ready to dump Brady? I don't, lol...

Come on man- he looked good running backwards for 16 yards

Actually when I got home and saw the highlights he looked a little better than in person.

[GoPats]

Come on man- he looked good running backwards for 16 yards

Actually when I got home and saw the highlights he looked a little better than in person.

 

Jimmy was fine, looked like a first-year guy should look. He held the ball a bit too long on a lot of plays but made a few nice throws. Also showed he can run, which is something different for us.

 

I'm just glad the small contingent of "fans" who think the Patriots are ready to turn the reigns over to Garoppolo got a longer look at him yesterday against actual NFL competition and not second-half, preseason game players. 

 

If you know ANYTHING about Belichick, you know that there's no way he would do that with such an inexperienced player. 

[amfootball]

Well, look at that... kind of turned out exactly how I said it would. 

 

You got an extended look at your boy Jimmy yesterday. Still think the Patriots are ready to dump Brady? I don't, lol... 

Yeah, Jimmy needs another couple seasons learning from the master ...