Polians grades for free agents we signed

[Dustin]

You really think I use logic?

No.

[Smonroe]

I respect your comments. But Manning has 1 ring, when his ability should have put him up there with Montana and Brady etc. 2009 disgraced the franchise. And will always cast a shadow over our great org. Always......

 

I'm sorry, but that opinion always chafed me.  That's your opinion, you're welcome to it, and you always have good posts (and I got the 'Joey' reference).  Why did we deserve to win more than one ring?

 

Isn't this opinion just as valid - there was one year, 05, where we were the best team in the league and didn't win the SB.  Polian built those teams, fighting the salary cap the entire time, into elite contenders and gave us a chance to win it by making it to the playoffs.  In just about every case, we faced better teams and didn't win the SB.  Did any other team have as many chances as the Colts did during the Polian reign?  Maybe one?

 

The year we had the ring, we weren't the best team, just the hottest.

[The Old Crow]

I'm sorry, but that opinion always chafed me.  That's your opinion, you're welcome to it, and you always have good posts (and I got the 'Joey' reference).  Why did we deserve to win more than one ring?

 

Isn't this opinion just as valid - there was one year, 05, where we were the best team in the league and didn't win the SB.  Polian built those teams, fighting the salary cap the entire time, into elite contenders and gave us a chance to win it by making it to the playoffs.  In just about every case, we faced better teams and didn't win the SB.  Did any other team have as many chances as the Colts did during the Polian reign?  Maybe one?

 

The year we had the ring, we weren't the best team, just the hottest.

 

 

Very true. Many times the best team doesn't win the Super Bowl, but the hot team does. The 2006 Colts, 2011 Giants, and 2012 Ravens are examples of this. You see Newsome in Baltimore fighting the salary cap this year, well Polian was fighting it much of the time. If you're in the playoffs that many times, you may get hot and win a few. The Colts only got one, but that was one more than the Irsays had ever gotten in the past.

[wabbwubb]

Back to the original post it's good that these guys checked out before we signed them I like knowing that some one other than grigson thought high of them. The walden & sidbury grading out as B guys is what I liked since we view them as gambles.

[braveheartcolt]

Very true. Many times the best team doesn't win the Super Bowl, but the hot team does. The 2006 Colts, 2011 Giants, and 2012 Ravens are examples of this. You see Newsome in Baltimore fighting the salary cap this year, well Polian was fighting it much of the time. If you're in the playoffs that many times, you may get hot and win a few. The Colts only got one, but that was one more than the Irsays had ever gotten in the past.

Your hatred of the Irsay clan makes my dislike for Polian look like a kindergarden spat.......  

[braveheartcolt]

I'm sorry, but that opinion always chafed me.  That's your opinion, you're welcome to it, and you always have good posts (and I got the 'Joey' reference).  Why did we deserve to win more than one ring?

 

Isn't this opinion just as valid - there was one year, 05, where we were the best team in the league and didn't win the SB.  Polian built those teams, fighting the salary cap the entire time, into elite contenders and gave us a chance to win it by making it to the playoffs.  In just about every case, we faced better teams and didn't win the SB.  Did any other team have as many chances as the Colts did during the Polian reign?  Maybe one?

 

The year we had the ring, we weren't the best team, just the hottest.

I'm not even sure we were the hottest. We got a lucky PO 'schedule' that year. Bar the AFCCG, the opposition was pretty weak.....

[NewColtsFan]

I respect your comments. But Manning has 1 ring, when his ability should have put him up there with Montana and Brady etc. 2009 disgraced the franchise. And will always cast a shadow over our great org. Always......

 

First,  what happened to the "Joey" comment?!    I still want to know that story!     

 

Second...   I assume 2009 is the SB loss to New Orleans?     Look, I'm not going to tell you not to be disappointed.   You're a great fan and a loss like that is hard to get over.   I get that.   But you didn't lose to a bad team.    You may have been the favorite,  but the Saints were a very good team.   And, frankly,  they had the better coach.     What can I tell you?   The best team doesn't always win.    It's the beauty and agony of sports.    Stuff happens......

 

I still hope you'll clue me in on "Joey"....

[Fx Stryker]

I am surprised I am "agreeing" with Braveheart.

 

I am not really agreeing, but I see his point.

 

Polian refused to build a defense, and for that we have 7 one and dones. Now Peyton has the tag of being a terrible post-season QB.

[Smonroe]

I'm not even sure we were the hottest. We got a lucky PO 'schedule' that year. Bar the AFCCG, the opposition was pretty weak.....

 

Against the Bears, true.  The Chiefs were running over everyone and we stopped the run.  Ravens at their place, no favor to us either.

 

Ahh that championship game!  It was on again a few weeks ago and even though I have it on DVD, I had to watch it again!

 

NCF - Maybe some Friends will clue you in on Joey.

[NewColtsFan]

Against the Bears, true.  The Chiefs were running over everyone and we stopped the run.  Ravens at their place, no favor to us either.

 

Ahh that championship game!  It was on again a few weeks ago and even though I have it on DVD, I had to watch it again!

 

NCF - Maybe some Friends will clue you in on Joey.

 

Hey,  you're a friend!    So send me a private message and clue me in!!!!

[The Old Crow]

To be perfectly honest with you, I'm not a big Bob Irsay fan , obviously. I don't have those same ill feelings for Jimmy, and I do give him and Polian credit for the good years in Indy following the drafting of Manning. That being said, I would be concerned as a Colt's fan with Irsay's revisionist history with Polian, his odd tweets, and even that strange picture he put up on his twitter account. As an NFL owner, he has an image to keep up as a leader in the Indianapolis community. I just hope he doesn't end up like the old man, or Jerry Jones. If he keeps with professional football people, he will be alright. We'll see how the new GM does long-term.

[Fx Stryker]

But I still appreciate everything Polian did for the team.

[braveheartcolt]

Stop.I'm arguing with posters I really like. My gripe is not about Bill's ability to find good talent. He clearly picked some good 'uns. I was pretty much a loan anti Bill guy way before he became unpopular on here. Some of the old guard will remember those days. When he really stank it up, he was an easy target. It went back to the Ed Johnson decision. Zero Tolerance was the stance. Ed then screwed up, but because we were short of players, we gave him yet another chance....then it went really downhill and week 15 finished me off. Then his pathetic contracts. His tirades against his fans. His nepotisim. His pathetic drafting laterly. Throwing the Line under the bus after the SB. Etc.  

 

Educating me on all his great drafts, and his 4 SB loses at Buffalo do not make me think any better of him.  

 

Plus I'm Scottish, what the heck do I know about American Football. (soccer was called football before Grid Iron was invented, so no cat calls please)...

[HarassedOffTheSite]

Manning...ability should have put him up there with Montana and Brady

 

Unlike Peyton Manning, Tom Brady has not won a single Super Bowl ring that is NOT tainted by the Patriots'* cheating scandal.

 

When Brady wins one post scandal Super Bowl ring, gimme a call.

 

And as a Colts fan, you should know better.

[Smonroe]

Hey,  you're a friend!    So send me a private message and clue me in!!!!

 

LOL!  No need for a PM.  "Joey" was a horrible failed sitcom spin off from Friends.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

Now Peyton has the tag of being a terrible post-season QB.

 

IMO he earned that tag....and continues to.

[braveheartcolt]

Hey,  you're a friend!    So send me a private message and clue me in!!!!

Joey Tribianna? Come on! Clues every where....'folded like a hooker, punched hard in the stomach by a fat guy with sores all over his face'....get it now?

[braveheartcolt]

Unlike Peyton Manning, Tom Brady has not won a single Super Bowl ring that is NOT tainted by the Patriots'* cheating scandal.

 

When Brady wins one post scandal Super Bowl ring, gimme a call.

 

And as a Colts fan, you should know better.

Whilst we all use it as a good bit of smack, Spygate is just a piece of useless propaganda which had no bearing on any game. Unless GoPats is reading this, then it made all the difference, clearly.....

[The Old Crow]

Unlike Peyton Manning, Tom Brady has not won a single Super Bowl ring that is NOT tainted by the Patriots'* cheating scandal.

 

When Brady wins one post scandal Super Bowl ring, gimme a call.

 

And as a Colts fan, you should know better.

 

 

I'm with you on that one. The Ravens only have a little bit of deer antler spray on their second Lombardi Trophy . LOL

[bahhummbug]

no bearing except every playoff and superbowl they have been in since,is that what you mean

[John Dee]

First....   sorry,  but I didn't get the "Joey" reference??   That maybe a Laugh Out Loud moment, and I didn't want it to pass me by, so, please clue me in!!

 

Second....   while I am NEW Colts fan, I'm not a new fan to football.  I've been following it closely for 45 years.  And I covered it professionally for a living for roughly 20-25 years.    I know football.

 

The Colts reputation is anything but ruined.   It's one of the finest franchises in football.   One 2-14 season doesn't ruin a team's hard earned reputation.    

 

Third....   Peyton Manning's reputation is Gold.   It is as safe can be.   He's a first ballot Hall of Famer.   And nothing that happened while he was a Colt has changed that.    Peyton is a living football God.   It was his injury that changed things here.   

 

If Peyton had been healthy and had a great 2011 season,  then the Colts wouldn't have had a bad season, and wouldn't have been in position to draft either Luck or RG3.     But he got hurt.   That's not Polian's fault, nor Irsay's fault.    It's just football.

 

Bad things happen in this game.   Even to great players and great people, and Peyton is both.

 

No reputations have been tarnished....   not even a little bit.

 

Really.    Seriously.    I give you my word.

NCF just likes to tell OLD Colt fan how they should think.. . . 

 

He gets bossy a bit.....

[The Old Crow]

Stop.I'm arguing with posters I really like. My gripe is not about Bill's ability to find good talent. He clearly picked some good 'uns. I was pretty much a loan anti Bill guy way before he became unpopular on here. Some of the old guard will remember those days. When he really stank it up, he was an easy target. It went back to the Ed Johnson decision. Zero Tolerance was the stance. Ed then screwed up, but because we were short of players, we gave him yet another chance....then it went really downhill and week 15 finished me off. Then his pathetic contracts. His tirades against his fans. His nepotisim. His pathetic drafting laterly. Throwing the Line under the bus after the SB. Etc.  

 

Educating me on all his great drafts, and his 4 SB loses at Buffalo do not make me think any better of him.  

 

Plus I'm Scottish, what the heck do I know about American Football. (soccer was called football before Grid Iron was invented, so no cat calls please)...

 

 

Think of it this way, Earl Weaver only won one World Series with the Orioles, yet he was beloved, and we put up a statue for him. Polian was a pretty dog gone good GM who made some mistakes, but had you guys in contention for many years. I think the Orioles could have won more Championships in those years, but you need some luck also. It's hard to win Championships. It beats being the Lions !

[Fx Stryker]

IMO he earned that tag....and continues to.

 

Because a defense failing to stop the Chargers twice. The Super Bowl even if Peyton didn't throw the pick and scored. It would have been 24-24 with like 3 minutes remaining. Our defense didn't stop the Saints since the middle of the second quarter. Brees would have easily drove down the field and killed the clock. 2010, Caldwell TO, need I say more, and 2012 Raheem Moore. 2000 against the Dolphins Vanderjagt missed game winning field goal all after the funky Jim Mora coaching.

 

There is six losses Peyton is not responsible for. I'll give you the Pats and maybe the first Jets game. I'll even give you the SB for the INT, but the game was lost before then.

[The Old Crow]

Because a defense failing to stop the Chargers twice. The Super Bowl even if Peyton didn't throw the pick and scored. It would have been 24-24 with like 3 minutes remaining. Our defense didn't stop the Saints since the middle of the second quarter. Brees would have easily drove down the field and killed the clock. 2010, Caldwell TO, need I say more, and 2012 Raheem Moore. 2000 against the Dolphins Vanderjagt missed game winning field goal all after the funky Jim Mora coaching.

 

There is six losses Peyton is not responsible for. I'll give you the Pats and maybe the first Jets game.

 

 

Peyton never got the benefit of the " Tuck Rule" that gave Brady and the Patriots a Super Bowl they never should have won. Like I said, you need to get hot at the right time, and you need a little luck to win the Championship. Manning had some real bad breaks along the way that were not his fault, like this year in Denver.

[NewColtsFan]

NCF just likes to tell OLD Colt fan how they should think.. . . 

 

He gets bossy a bit.....

 

Really?

 

Have you followed this thread at all?? 

 

Did you see the part about "ruining the reputation of the Colts and of Peyton Manning"???

 

And you're OK with that?     

 

You think a comment like that should go un-responded to?

 

By any objective measure, there isn't an ounce of truth in that statement.   And your contribution to this thread is tell people here that I'm a little bossy and telling others how they should think.....

 

Thanks for that....      

[NewColtsFan]

Joey Tribianna? Come on! Clues every where....'folded like a hooker, punched hard in the stomach by a fat guy with sores all over his face'....get it now?

 

 

OK, ok...    I'm a little slow on the uptake...

 

Honestly, I'm one of the few people in this country that never really got into "Friends"....    don't know why, but I didn't.

 

And as a result,  I certainly never got into "Joey"...    I know who Matt LeBlanc is, and I know about his short-lived show....

 

Just wasn't on my radar....   at all...

 

Sorry....  

[hoosierhawk]

Didn't see an evaluation on Thomas or Tolar.

[braveheartcolt]

Really?

 

Have you followed this thread at all?? 

 

Did you see the part about "ruining the reputation of the Colts and of Peyton Manning"???

 

And you're OK with that?     

 

You think a comment like that should go un-responded to?

 

By any objective measure, there isn't an ounce of truth in that statement.   And your contribution to this thread is tell people here that I'm a little bossy and telling others how they should think.....

 

Thanks for that....      

 

 

Really?

 

Have you followed this thread at all?? 

 

Did you see the part about "ruining the reputation of the Colts and of Peyton Manning"???

 

And you're OK with that?     

 

You think a comment like that should go un-responded to?

 

By any objective measure, there isn't an ounce of truth in that statement.   And your contribution to this thread is tell people here that I'm a little bossy and telling others how they should think.....

 

Thanks for that....      

We  were scoffed at by most non Colts fans for resting our starters in 2009. They don't think PM, they think 'quitters' Maybe that sits comfortably on your shoulders...

[John Dee]

Really?

 

Have you followed this thread at all?? 

 

Did you see the part about "ruining the reputation of the Colts and of Peyton Manning"???

 

And you're OK with that?     

 

You think a comment like that should go un-responded to?

 

By any objective measure, there isn't an ounce of truth in that statement.   And your contribution to this thread is tell people here that I'm a little bossy and telling others how they should think.....

 

Thanks for that....      

Yes....  I read the WHOLE thread... 

 

And IMO ......   YOU pop off on issues YOU really need not.

 

Where is ALL YOUR 45 years of practical "internet experience" 

 

Whatever...      YOUR opinion means about as much as MINE>>...........

[wabbwubb]

Didn't see an evaluation on Thomas or Tolar.

They didn't even grade them out as C players but he may just not think highly of them

[John Dee]

OK, ok...    I'm a little slow on the uptake...

 

Honestly, I'm one of the few people in this country that never really got into "Friends"....    don't know why, but I didn't.

 

And as a result,  I certainly never got into "Joey"...    I know who Matt LeBlanc is, and I know about his short-lived show....

 

Just wasn't on my radar....   at all...

 

Sorry....  

JOEY.?  

 

That is like a decade old...      right?

[HarassedOffTheSite]

Because adyadyada

 

I guess it is time to start blaming Denver's defense for Manning's failures.

[wabbwubb]

So colts fan shouldn't fight with colts fans, this forums gotten more snippy lately let's try to wrap all that up. We all love the colts and want the best for them can't we all be friends! ;)

[NewColtsFan]

Feeling foolish is not alien to me, for sure. Would you like me to trot out all the pathetic failures as well? They really do even themselves out. He clutched his so called glory from one no brainer pick, and the foolish (your word) declare him the messiah. Did you watch the last 5 years of his tenure, or was that Irsay's fault? Luck, Avery, Allen, Hilton. It's not that hard, is it?

 

The last 5 years of Polians tenure had 4 double-digit win seasons, 1 SB appearance and one terrible year.   One.

 

Grigson's 1st draft is not a typical draft.   If you think he's going to draft that well every year,  you're kidding yourself.   And I'm the biggest Grigson fan there is.     Drafting is incredibly hard.   That's why most teams don't have the kind of luck that Grigson had last year.

 

It's hard.

 

Players get hurt.   They under-perform.   They lose focus from having lots of money for the first time in their lives.   They can't handle responsibility.   They get poor coaching.   The player fights with his girlfriend, or wife, or both.  He has kids out of wedlock.   He does drugs and/or alcohol.  All sorts of things happen to have players not pan out.   That kind of stuff happens all the time.

 

Sustaining greatness is the hardest thing to do in professional sports.   THE hardest thing to do -- BY FAR!    And it's even harder in a salary cap world.   The draft and a salary cap are designed to level the playing field for all teams.   Polian's teams have sustained greatness.   In Buffalo and Indy and his Panthers team made it to the SB before he left.    The guy is a 6-time NFL Executive of the Year.    That's unheard of in most any sport.   And for football it's downright amazing.

 

All I'm trying to do here is to give you some perspective,  another view that you might not have considered before...

 

What you do with this is completely up to you....

 

Heaven forbid I be accused of telling you -- or any Colts fan -- what to think!     

[NewColtsFan]

Yes....  I read the WHOLE thread... 

 

And IMO ......   YOU pop off on issues YOU really need not.

 

Where is ALL YOUR 45 years of practical "internet experience" 

 

Whatever...      YOUR opinion means about as much as MINE>>...........

 

Well.....   if that's your view,  then I guess we should all do away with every fan website there is, because no one's view means anything and no one should ever offer up an opinion.

 

Let's just completely eliminate the internet.

 

Thanks for your contribution.

 

You take your personal issues with me -- and that's what this is -- and you hijack the thread into something it didn't need to be.

 

Nice job.

[Fx Stryker]

Peyton never got the benefit of the " Tuck Rule" that gave Brady and the Patriots a Super Bowl they never should have won. Like I said, you need to get hot at the right time, and you need a little luck to win the Championship. Manning had some real bad breaks along the way that were not his fault, like this year in Denver.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFoT7FpEAcs

 

The look on Peyton's face at 2:54 is definitely how his career has went. It's a perfect reaction.

[John Dee]

SIGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhh

 

Get over it .......

 

 

Some of us have lived it for the LAST DECADE...        GET over your self NCF.......................

[The Old Crow]

The last 5 years of Polians tenure had 4 double-digit win seasons, 1 SB appearance and one terrible year.   One.

 

Grigson's 1st draft is not a typical draft.   If you think he's going to draft that well every year,  you're kidding yourself.   And I'm the biggest Grigson fan there is.     Drafting is incredibly hard.   That's why most teams don't have the kind of luck that Grigson had last year.

 

It's hard.

 

Players get hurt.   They under-perform.   They lose focus from having lots of money for the first time in their lives.   They can't handle responsibility.   They get poor coaching.   The player fights with his girlfriend, or wife, or both.  He has kids out of wedlock.   He does drugs and/or alcohol.  All sorts of things happen to have players not pan out.   That kind of stuff happens all the time.

 

Sustaining greatness is the hardest thing to do in professional sports.   THE hardest thing to do -- BY FAR!    And it's even harder in a salary cap world.   The draft and a salary cap are designed to level the playing field for all teams.   Polian's teams have sustained greatness.   In Buffalo and Indy and his Panthers team made it to the SB before he left.    The guy is a 6-time NFL Executive of the Year.    That's unheard of in most any sport.   And for football it's downright amazing.

 

All I'm trying to do here is to give you some perspective,  another view that you might not have considered before...

 

What you do with this is completely up to you....

 

Heaven forbid I be accused of telling you -- or any Colts fan -- what to think!     

 

Absolutely on the mark. His record is unimpeachable for the longevity of competitive and winning seasons. Where is Buffalo and Carolina after Polian left ? Grigson did well his first year, but we'll see if he has the kind of career Polian had.

[Fx Stryker]

I guess it is time to start blaming Denver's defense for Manning's failures.

 

Everyone and anyone who watch the game KNEW it was over.

 

I bet you Old Crow even thought they lost

[NewColtsFan]

We  were scoffed at by most non Colts fans for resting our starters in 2009. They don't think PM, they think 'quitters' Maybe that sits comfortably on your shoulders...

 

Why should you give a rip what non-Colts fans think?    Who cares?

 

You disagree with the decision that was made.   Fine.   But fans have no responsibility and they always want it both ways.   If the Colts had played everyone and gone for perfect season, and someone had gotten hurt in those games and that led to losing in the playoffs,  fans here would've gone crazy for that.    Maybe not you, maybe not everyone,  but most would've.   That's the nature of being a fan.

 

That's not a Colts fans issue,  that the same with all fans of all teams in all sports.   They want things both ways so they're never wrong.     That's a fan issue.