Jump to content
Indianapolis Colts
Indianapolis Colts Fan Forum

Patriots Free Agents


Recommended Posts

The Patriots have 16 players heading to free agency this year. They are currently almost 8 million over the cap (meaning they're in the red) if you count the huge option on Revis' contract. Their free agents include a lot of contributors and even stars- Revis, Devin McCourty, Ridley and Vereen, Gostkowski, Dan Connoly, Alan Branch, and more. Belicheck will presumably pull some dark magic and get more out of this than he should, but the fact is they won't be able to keep everyone together. This will be one of the more interesting parts of the offseason to watch IMO. Who would you be interested in if available? What are they worth?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

More and more, I'm thinking McCourty goes. Just a feeling. We'll see, come tomorrow, if he gets the tag.

 

But keep in mind, they might get a $10m cap credit for Hernandez's bonus money. And they'll probably void Revis' option, taking another $20m off the books. I think they'll re-sign Revis for something around $12-15m/year, but that can be arranged to free up space in 2015 so they can keep the FAs they want.

 

They won't keep both Vereen and Ridley; I think Vereen is the more specialized player and has more value to them. 

 

Connoly is probably gone. Gostkowski is replaceable, and if he isn't tagged, I think there are teams that will offer him top 5 kicker money (how badly do the Lions need a reliable kicker?) 

 

I think they know the sharks are circling, and will do their best to hang on to their core guys and make another run in 2016. I don't think they'll be quite as willing to watch good players leave as the Ravens were after 2012. But I think they'll be very resistant to the idea of paying McCourty $8-10m/year, which I think is his FA value.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

More and more, I'm thinking McCourty goes. Just a feeling. We'll see, come tomorrow, if he gets the tag.

 

But keep in mind, they might get a $10m cap credit for Hernandez's bonus money. And they'll probably void Revis' option, taking another $20m off the books. I think they'll re-sign Revis for something around $12-15m/year, but that can be arranged to free up space in 2015 so they can keep the FAs they want.

 

They won't keep both Vereen and Ridley; I think Vereen is the more specialized player and has more value to them. 

 

Connoly is probably gone. Gostkowski is replaceable, and if he isn't tagged, I think there are teams that will offer him top 5 kicker money (how badly do the Lions need a reliable kicker?) 

 

I think they know the sharks are circling, and will do their best to hang on to their core guys and make another run in 2016. I don't think they'll be quite as willing to watch good players leave as the Ravens were after 2012. But I think they'll be very resistant to the idea of paying McCourty $8-10m/year, which I think is his FA value.

 

Just asking....

 

If McCourtey comes free,  (A) do you want him and (B) at how much on the contract?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just asking....

 

If McCourtey comes free,  (A) do you want him and (B) at how much on the contract?

 

I'd want him. I wanted him more a few weeks ago, but now I'm thinking he's not quite the kind of player that would really benefit our secondary. We really need a guy who can cover TEs and slot receivers man up, and who can also support the run. McCourty isn't great in man coverage, which is partly why he moved to safety, and he's not a physical run defender. Certainly not weak in either area, but not outstanding, either.

 

I was previously okay with doing $8m/year for him. I don't know if I still feel the same way.

 

My first choice at safety is Da'Norris Searcy. I'd rather do the $8m/year for him. And he doesn't come with the Super Bowl tax.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd want him. I wanted him more a few weeks ago, but now I'm thinking he's not quite the kind of player that would really benefit our secondary. We really need a guy who can cover TEs and slot receivers man up, and who can also support the run. McCourty isn't great in man coverage, which is partly why he moved to safety, and he's not a physical run defender. Certainly not weak in either area, but not outstanding, either.

 

I was previously okay with doing $8m/year for him. I don't know if I still feel the same way.

 

My first choice at safety is Da'Norris Searcy. I'd rather do the $8m/year for him. And he doesn't come with the Super Bowl tax.

 

 

Wow,  you think Searcy could command 8Mill per year,  or is that a misread on your meaning?

 

I thought he'd be much cheaper...   like perhaps $4-5 Mill per year...?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd want him. I wanted him more a few weeks ago, but now I'm thinking he's not quite the kind of player that would really benefit our secondary. We really need a guy who can cover TEs and slot receivers man up, and who can also support the run. McCourty isn't great in man coverage, which is partly why he moved to safety, and he's not a physical run defender. Certainly not weak in either area, but not outstanding, either.

 

I was previously okay with doing $8m/year for him. I don't know if I still feel the same way.

 

My first choice at safety is Da'Norris Searcy. I'd rather do the $8m/year for him. And he doesn't come with the Super Bowl tax.

Searcy is my choice too! :)

 

McCourty will establish Searcy's value very quickly on the market.

 

Searcy is the kind of player that Grigson has been known to go after and will be had for 40-50 percent less cash(assuming).

 

That saved money could be used to lure Tyvon Branch to the Colts to rehab his value(and his body) as our SS.

 

Even if our safety corps were more of a rotational bunch... the talent we could have in the game would be decent. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow, you think Searcy could command 8Mill per year, or is that a misread on your meaning?

I thought he'd be much cheaper... like perhaps $4-5 Mill per year...?

Probably $6m for Searcy. But if McCourty gets tagged or gets $8m+, I think Searcy benefits. Ward got $5.5m last, and Searcy is better.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd want him. I wanted him more a few weeks ago, but now I'm thinking he's not quite the kind of player that would really benefit our secondary. We really need a guy who can cover TEs and slot receivers man up, and who can also support the run. McCourty isn't great in man coverage, which is partly why he moved to safety, and he's not a physical run defender. Certainly not weak in either area, but not outstanding, either.

I was previously okay with doing $8m/year for him. I don't know if I still feel the same way.

My first choice at safety is Da'Norris Searcy. I'd rather do the $8m/year for him. And he doesn't come with the Super Bowl tax.

so got a question Supe since your way more qualified with cap related issues then me. With our cap space could we get Rahim Moore, Terance Knighton/Dan Williams (whoever we could get cheaper), and Justin Houston and still have a decent amount for the 2012 class? Also I would add a cheap 1 year prove it deal for Tyvon Branch

Ps not trying to hijack the thread but seen superman talking potential contracts for players

Link to comment
Share on other sites

so got a question Supe since your way more qualified with cap related issues then me. With our cap space could we get Rahim Moore, Terance Knighton/Dan Williams (whoever we could get cheaper), and Justin Houston and still have a decent amount for the 2012 class? Also I would add a cheap 1 year prove it deal for Tyvon Branch

Ps not trying to hijack the thread but seen superman talking potential contracts for players

Yup.

Moore at $5-6m, Williams or Knighton at $6-7m, Houston at $15m. That's less than $30m on average, but it will cost you some of our own FAs this year and next.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yup.

Moore at $5-6m, Williams or Knighton at $6-7m, Houston at $15m. That's less than $30m on average, but it will cost you some of our own FAs this year and next.

I just feel that would fill alot of holes and could really upgrade the D. Would it be smart in your opinion?

Also who could we possibly lose like you said?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Probably $6m for Searcy. But if McCourty gets tagged or gets $8m+, I think Searcy benefits. Ward got $5.5m last, and Searcy is better.

 

McCourtneys # is 9.6 mill and I don't think tree's any chance they let him walk. Their window is as long as age doesn't catch up with Brady , so they probably feel they have 1 -2 years of Tom Brady type QB play. So by hook or crook they keep the safety. Even if it means structuring Revis in a way they get hit down the road .

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just feel that would fill alot of holes and could really upgrade the D. Would it be smart in your opinion?

Also who could we possibly lose like you said?

I don't think it's smart. It's too much money concentrated on three guys. And arguably the weakest spot on the defense, ILB, is still weak in coverage.

Speaking of which, you'd probably lose Freeman, who is better in coverage than Jackson. Reitz, probably. Adams and Brown walk, but you're signing two safeties. Butler, probably. Next year, you probably have to choose between Fleener and Allen.

JMO

Link to comment
Share on other sites

McCourtneys # is 9.6 mill and I don't think tree's any chance they let him walk. Their window is as long as age doesn't catch up with Brady , so they probably feel they have 1 -2 years of Tom Brady type QB play. So by hook or crook they keep the safety. Even if it means structuring Revis in a way they get hit down the road .

We'll know more tomorrow. But if they don't tag him, look out.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think it's smart. It's too much money concentrated on three guys. And arguably the weakest spot on the defense, ILB, is still weak in coverage.

Speaking of which, you'd probably lose Freeman, who is better in coverage than Jackson. Reitz, probably. Adams and Brown walk, but you're signing two safeties. Butler, probably. Next year, you probably have to choose between Fleener and Allen.

JMO

well if we did sign them I would like to get a ILB in the 1st to help there and possibly OT in the 2nd I'd prolly be ok with losing most of them cause they could be replaced but honestly would wanna keep both Fleener and Allen tho
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Thread of the Week

  • Topics

  • Posts

    • I think this is probably deserving of it's own thread, but I'll leave this initial response here. I'm happy to continue the conversation in another thread.   There are a couple of pertinent details that I don't think you're considering.   First, signing bonuses are due upon signing. They aren't necessarily paid upon signing. This article suggests signing bonuses can be paid over the course of 12-18 months. Some signing bonuses are paid in installments. So just because a player contract includes a $20m signing bonus doesn't mean the team is paying the player $20m the day he signs; the player might not receive that $20m for several months, a year, or longer. The pay dates for signing bonuses are almost never reported.   Second, a more comprehensive look at the contracts you mentioned would include roster bonuses. For example, while Buckner's contract did not include a signing bonus, it did include an $11m roster bonus. Spotrac shows the roster bonus was due to be paid on 3/20/2020, which was four days after Buckner's contract was signed. For cash flow purposes, there isn't necessarily a difference. (Ryan Kelly, $10m roster bonus; Kenny Moore, $8m; Mo Alie-Cox, $5.1m.)   Take a closer look at this. Buckner signed a four year extension for $84m, on top of his 5th year option, for a total value of five years, $96.4m. No signing bonus, but the $11m roster bonus, plus a base salary of $12.4m in 2020. The total cash paid to Buckner in the first year was $23.4m. The same day the Colts signed Buckner, the Niners signed Arik Armstead. His contract was five years, $85m, and included a $17.5m signing bonus (no details on the pay dates of the signing bonus). His base salary in 2020 was $2.5m. So the cash paid to Armstead in the first year was $20m, and that's assuming all of his signing bonus was paid out in 2020. In both cases, the Year 1 cash was about 24% of the total value of the contract.   Another example from the same year: Myles Garrett signed for five years, $125m, and his signing bonus and salary totaled $22m, less than 18% of the total value. The previous year, Frank Clark signed with the Chiefs for five years, $104m, with a $19m signing bonus, and a salary + incentives of $1.3m, totaling $20.3m in Year 1 cash, less than 20% of the total value.    There's also the funding rule, which requires that deferred money and fully guaranteed money is placed in escrow when the contract is signed, minus $15m. So if the Colts were offsetting lower signing bonuses with a higher percentage of guaranteed money, they would still need to fund the guaranteed money upfront. So there's really no cash flow benefit to the team; in fact, it would potentially cost the team more to fund the larger guarantees.    All of this put together, I don't think that the Colts are avoiding signing bonuses for cash flow reasons. I'm sure Irsay doesn't have the cash flow of the Rams or Broncos, etc., but I don't think the Colts are using contract structure to help cash flow. 
    • Nothing contradicts anything.   J’Ville if bad reckless spending and it got them one year of success out of 10.   No contradictions here.     As for Ballard, as he said at his year ender, the problem hasn’t been the FA spending or the roster.   The problem has been not being to get the quarterback right.  If Wentz had worked out, we wouldn’t be having this conversation.      I have no idea why you’d think Ballard should have considered the 4 big name players who Ballard didn’t pursue.   They went for HUGE money.   Ballard has zero interest in those guys.  As a fan who follows football closer than most I had zero interest in any of them.   And I had zero interest BEFORE they signed and it was expected they’d go for less.   I didn’t want them at most any price they would’ve wanted.    Of your longer list….  Frankie Luvu had some interest for me.  Maybe Geno stone.  Otherwise I believe there’s a list of safeties who are still available.   Remember Rodney McCloud?   Ballard signed him and he had perhaps the best year of his career.  Graded in the low 80’s for 1.7 mill.   That’s a Ballard signing.   People forget them.   They want bright lights and shiny new toys.     We should all know by now that’s not Ballard’s way.  
    • So spending to cover flaws works now? Seems to contradict you comment about the Jaguars.   To be clear, I don't want or expect Ballard to sign $35m/year players left and right. But there are plenty mid-range (pay-wise) guys who sign with other teams EVERY year that could've improved this roster.   This year OTOH: Frankie Luvu Sheldon Rankins Geno Stone Patrick Queen Jeremy Chinn Kevin Byard Jordan Fuller Sean Murphy-Bunting Kamren Curl   And several more expensive guys: Arik Armstead Christian Wilkins Bryce Huff Xavier McKinney Every year guys like these pass us by.
    • Off the top of my head….    Once.  Justin Houston who got 2/23.5.   And that worked out well.   
    • And those are about the best signings the Colts have done under Ballard in 8 years.    Has Ballard even spent over $10+m once in a FA? Gilmore maybe? That’s once. In going on 8 years.    Noone does what Ballard does and he hasn’t had success doing it, so noone’s trying to replicate it. 
  • Members

    • OhioColt

      OhioColt 385

      Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • Zoltan

      Zoltan 3,102

      Senior Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • Solid84

      Solid84 6,064

      Senior Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • Superman

      Superman 20,074

      Moderators
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • Hammer

      Hammer 327

      Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
    • NewColtsFan

      NewColtsFan 20,793

      Senior Member
      Joined:
      Last active:
×
×
  • Create New...