The 4-3 Under Cover 3 - Converting The Defense

[John Hammonds]

I know that there are many people on these boards that know a whole lot more about coaching defense, and defensive philosophy than I do.  But I wanted to start trying to come to grips with what our change in schemes, from a Tampa-2 Hybrid to a 4-3 Under Cover 3, would look like.  And how it would change the jobs of the players we have.

If I've gotten something wrong, please feel free to let me know.  (Okay, like anyone on these boards need encouragement to do that.)

 

#1 - From 4-3 Over to 4-3 Under

It's been my observation that we've been playing the "Over" version, which means the 3-technique (Buckner) lines up in the G-T gap on the strong side of the formation, and the 1-technique (Stewart) is to his right, in the C-G gap.  In this new defense, the two guys are flipped.  Stewart would be on the left, and Buckner on the right.  What I think this means is that it will put more pressure on the LG in pass protection, because the LEO end is going to be occupying the LT.  It concentrates the pass rushing specialization, rather than spreads it out across the line.

#2 - The LEO end

In the new scheme, the weak side DE is undersized and quick, to the point of almost being a linebacker.  He'll line up waaaay wide in a 9-technique, and is the primary person responsible for pass rush.  Kwity Paye is barely 6-3 if he stands up straight, and roughly 260 pounds.  He's probably slightly heavy for a LEO, and not quite the speed demon.  But he does have a lot of power, and plays with good hand technique.  Can he play the LEO?  I guess we're gonna find out!

#3 - Cover 3: the Corners

In the Cover 3, the corners play deep, and have very little participation in run defense.  This is a change from the Tampa-2, where the corners are required to play the full outside, including being able to come forward in run support when the play goes outside.  This requires us to ask questions about our corners' abilities to play deeper coverage, to run more.  Tackling requirements are less than they would be in the Tampa-2.

#4 - Cover 3: the Safeties

From what I've seen, one safety does come forward and plays a lot of box safety.  That safety needs "enforcer" traits.  Big hits and big tackles.  And the other one plays the deep middle.  This puts a heavy requirement on that deep safety to be able to run sideline to sideline, and cover a lot of ground.  Not all that certain that our current starting pair are specialized like this.  May need to look into it.

#5 - Cover 3: the Linebackers

In the Tampa-2, the middle linebacker plays the deep middle, and needs to have a strong ability to play in space.  In the Cover 3, the middle linebacker plays closer to the line, and needs to have a lot more ability to play in traffic, take on blocks, and play Big.  Is Okereke built this way?  Regarding the weak side OLB, that position is the Big Playmaker in the Tampa-2.  They're the one that needs to always be unblocked, to swoop in and make the tackle, force the fumble, do the Big Deed.  In the Cover 3, the Will has to include in his responsibilities pass coverage in the flat, where the Tampa-2 corner used to be.  This is going to reduce his opportunities to make the Big Play all the time.  We may see Leonard's Big Play stats go down.

#6 - The strong side DE

Apparently, in the new scheme the strong side DE needs to be more of an edge setter than a pass rush specialist.  I would say this would fit the abilities of Dayo and Lewis than AQM.  We may be playing musical chairs with our DE's to figure out who fits best in what space.

 

That's what I've been able to put together so far.  I'm sure many of you can think of others, or correct me where I'm wrong.

[coming on strong]

 looks like the it will be more of the same with gus bradley average QBs will have easy completions all game

[DougDew]

I think the OPs summary is pretty accurate, but I can only account for 10 defenders.  I think he needs a SAM to cover the other flat.  If the LEO does that, then there is only three linemen.  Or, we could move OKE to SAM and drop a bigger SS into the middle.

 

I don't see Paye dropping back to cover the flat.  I don't see any other player on the roster doing that, so I'm thinking we need to add a SAM to OPs explanation of the base defense..

 

Maybe someone with more technical knowledge can correct me if we don't.

[John Hammonds]

6 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I think the OPs summary is pretty accurate, but I can only account for 10 defenders.  I think he needs a SAM to cover the other flat.  If the LEO does that, then there is only three linemen.  Or, we could move OKE to SAM and drop a bigger SS into the middle.

 

I don't see Paye dropping back to cover the flat.  I don't see any other player on the roster doing that, so I'm thinking we need to add a SAM to OPs explanation of the base defense..

 

Maybe someone with more technical knowledge can correct me if we don't.

You're correct, I didn't talk about the Sam.  Mostly because of how frequently we run the nickel.  But you are correct, in this defense, the Sam covers the other flat.

[Matabix]

May see a switch at LB. Franklin playing MLB when he's in.

[MrPreGame]

What's gonna be interesting is the flexibility. Who comes off for a 5th DB? Can Maniac play 3 LB positions and maybe LEO sometimes? Do we need bigger 2 gap lineman? the possibilities are endless...

[AKB]

i told you guys not a lot would change, and if you go and watch Flus defense evolve with us we rarely ran a strict cover 2.  its been more of a cover 3 with a box safety, and soft zones.  it's rarely been strictly cover 2, the last game we ran a lot of cover 2 that immediately comes to mind was the seattle game where Lockett exposed the deep middle repeatedly. 

[Mackrel829]

1 hour ago, coming on strong said:

 looks like the it will be more of the same with gus bradley average QBs will have easy completions all game

 

I think we probably will see a lot of high comp. % again next year but I don't think this a good video. You can summarise the first minute or so as such:

 

'This scheme is bad because if your players don't fulfil their roles then it's a touchdown and if one of your players falls over then it's a touchdown.'

 

Yeah no ****. 

 

I was a big fan of Flus's scheme. The high comp. % is built in. It's not just his scheme being bad. The whole point is that if you increase the number of plays that the offense runs then you increase the opportunities that you have to create turnovers. By allowing short completions, you also minimise big play opportunities. 

 

I'm only vaguely aware of the Xs and Os of what Bradley has done in the past as I don't follow the NFL very closely beyond the Colts. I know the old Seattle scheme better than I know others though and I think we have a lot of players that will suit it. If Bradley can get the D-Line cooking like he did with the Raiders last season then I think this will be a good appointment.

[coming on strong]

14 minutes ago, Mackrel829 said:

 

I think we probably will see a lot of high comp. % again next year but I don't think this a good video. You can summarise the first minute or so as such:

 

'This scheme is bad because if your players don't fulfil their roles then it's a touchdown and if one of your players falls over then it's a touchdown.'

 

Yeah no ****. 

 

I was a big fan of Flus's scheme. The high comp. % is built in. It's not just his scheme being bad. The whole point is that if you increase the number of plays that the offense runs then you increase the opportunities that you have to create turnovers. By allowing short completions, you also minimise big play opportunities. 

 

I'm only vaguely aware of the Xs and Os of what Bradley has done in the past as I don't follow the NFL very closely beyond the Colts. I know the old Seattle scheme better than I know others though and I think we have a lot of players that will suit it. If Bradley can get the D-Line cooking like he did with the Raiders last season then I think this will be a good appointment.

the problem is see is he is to stuck in his scheme  the video points that out .   you need to mix it up more to keep offense guessing which he doesnt do .  if the offense knows you play cover 3 most of the plays its easy to scheme against it .    at least flus would disguise coverages have leonard lined up like he is in man coverage and play the zone .    easy to read defenses can get cooked by elite QB play .  gus system worked when he had elite talent as soon as the talent level went down in seattle he got fired .       

 i like watching a dc  disguising coverages

[coming on strong]

30 minutes ago, Mackrel829 said:

 

I think we probably will see a lot of high comp. % again next year but I don't think this a good video. You can summarise the first minute or so as such:

 

'This scheme is bad because if your players don't fulfil their roles then it's a touchdown and if one of your players falls over then it's a touchdown.'

 

Yeah no ****. 

 

I was a big fan of Flus's scheme. The high comp. % is built in. It's not just his scheme being bad. The whole point is that if you increase the number of plays that the offense runs then you increase the opportunities that you have to create turnovers. By allowing short completions, you also minimise big play opportunities. 

 

I'm only vaguely aware of the Xs and Os of what Bradley has done in the past as I don't follow the NFL very closely beyond the Colts. I know the old Seattle scheme better than I know others though and I think we have a lot of players that will suit it. If Bradley can get the D-Line cooking like he did with the Raiders last season then I think this will be a good appointment.

go look up jalen ramsey calling out gus bradley  when he played for him said every week we ran the same defense  .  players want to mix it up the whole 2000 era of guys like toney dungy running tampa 2 most of the game is outdated .    bill billichick runs a 3-4 defense but switches and plays 4-3 at times  and also play nickel and run dime with 5 man pressures  .  

look how tod bowles kept switching up the stunts on the defensive line all game to keep the chiefs offense guessing

[DeepseaColt]

I believe Gus will be an improvement over Flus. He traditionally gets more out of his pass rushers but as others have said we will need to likely bring in a true FS. Ballard has done a pretty good job of having well rounded D-linemanand LB's that we can interchange but FS has been a weakness for a bit. If he can stop a TE from getting wide open over the middle multiple times a game I'll chalk this up as a win! 

[coming on strong]

1 hour ago, AustinnKaine said:

i told you guys not a lot would change, and if you go and watch Flus defense evolve with us we rarely ran a strict cover 2.  its been more of a cover 3 with a box safety, and soft zones.  it's rarely been strictly cover 2, the last game we ran a lot of cover 2 that immediately comes to mind was the seattle game where Lockett exposed the deep middle repeatedly. 

flus defense started getting stale after a while . in the first year he mixed it up sending pressures on plays looking like cover 2 or would blitz out of the nickel with kenny moore making it a 5 man pressure .  a really good defense can mix it up so well a offense has to guess what they are doing . the time guessing helps the defense by giving more time to rush the passer .    the defenses that always gave manning trouble were ones who disguised very well . the ravens wouldnt even jump into their shell until when manning was ready to snap the ball .

[Hoose]

28 minutes ago, coming on strong said:

the problem is see is he is to stuck in his scheme  the video points that out .   you need to mix it up more to keep offense guessing which he doesnt do .  if the offense knows you play cover 3 most of the plays its easy to scheme against it .    at least flus would disguise coverages have leonard lined up like he is in man coverage and play the zone .    easy to read defenses can get cooked by elite QB play .  gus system worked when he had elite talent as soon as the talent level went down in seattle he got fired .       

 i like watching a dc  disguising coverages

Didn’t Gus leave Seattle to become the Jags’ head coach? I don’t believe he was fired. 

[coming on strong]

2 minutes ago, Hoose said:

Didn’t Gus leave Seattle to become the Jags’ head coach? I don’t believe he was fired. 

yea your i got his time in with the chargers mixed up

[Mackrel829]

1 hour ago, coming on strong said:

the problem is see is he is to stuck in his scheme  the video points that out .   you need to mix it up more to keep offense guessing which he doesnt do .  if the offense knows you play cover 3 most of the plays its easy to scheme against it .    at least flus would disguise coverages have leonard lined up like he is in man coverage and play the zone .    easy to read defenses can get cooked by elite QB play .  gus system worked when he had elite talent as soon as the talent level went down in seattle he got fired .       

 i like watching a dc  disguising coverages

 

Correct me if I'm wrong because I didn't get to watch as much football this season as I usually do but Flus isn't exactly innovative in terms of mixing things up, disguising coverages, etc. The defense under Flus has been pretty vanilla.