Bad clock management at the end of the game

[Moosejawcolt]

On 9/23/2024 at 9:53 AM, SC-Coltsfan said:

This has probably already been mentioned, but maybe not. 

 

There was 2:01 left in the game and the Bears had one timeout left. I was very surprised we didn't return the kickoff to essentially burn the 2 minute warning timeout that the Bears were then able to use. In the end, we got a first down, so it didn't matter this time. However, had we not gotten the first down, the Bears could have had over a minute to play with opposed to maybe 25 seconds had they only had their one timeout.

 

 

I believe in Steichen as a developer of qbs and a play caller. However, his  coaching  decisions on 4th are very suspect at this time. He has been playing very poor qbs the last 2 weeks in close games. Punt the ball and try to pin them deep. Dont give the offense the ball at mid field and give up easy points. He did it once in both games against the Packers and Bears. Relying to much on analytics and not flow of the game.

[ColtAndOrioles]

8 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

Also,  no 2 minute warning.    

I didn't mean that pee wee football teams kick off. 

 

I meant that even a pee wee football coach knows enough to run the ball out the endzone in that situation. 

Cmon.   Why be so obtuse?

[ColtAndOrioles]

6 hours ago, bluephantom87 said:

 

Just curious... What are your thoughts on Chris Ballard as gm and Gus Bradley as dc?

Have not been a fan of CB since maybe his second year here.  I think he is kind of a narcissist. Big ego.  I hated his quote about if he gets fired for his views then so be it.  Sounded like he almost wanted to be fired tbh. Someone who is NOT ALL IN AT ALL.

 

Do not like his philosophy of low skilled position players like the O line and D line being a priority, but kind of forgoing the higher end skilled position players.  The players that win games.   Especially in FA.  That being said he has drafted more towards that recently with AR, Latu, and Mitchell.   (BTW Latu...please get a haircut.....your present cut does nothing for you...nor does the color haha)

 

As far as Gus?  I am ambivalent.  If he has the proper players to work with his D that can do what he wants......ok.   If he doesn't have the players?  His D is very very bad.  I think the Colts fit into that first category.  Nothing great.  Nothing horrible.

 

I would love to see him go away though.

 

 

[ColtAndOrioles]

4 hours ago, Superman said:

 

 I think you're being generous with how much time would run off the clock for each play.

 

 

 

Calling this a fireable offense is too much. 

Again I think you are kind of twisting what I said.  Not all..but some. 

 

First, I laid out in very basic math and logic how much time would have been left on the clock if the Colts had run the ball out, run 3 plays, the Bears call one timeout, and then the Colts punted.  In fact I was being kind of generous in regard to how much time would have actually been left.  If you figure 5-8 seconds per play.  Refs have to spot the ball.  Restart the play clock.  Punt.   It comes out to around 10 seconds.  Every time.  I am still not sure why you do not acknowledge that?  It is like saying 1 +1 does not = 2.  Simple math. 

 

Second my exact quote when I was questioned on it was this...

 

"Should he be fired over this one decision alone?  No.  But if he keeps making mistakes like this like he is starting to develop a pattern of?  Although none so far have been this blatantly bad....then yes it should be a major red flag in regards to how prepared SS has this team on a day to day, a week to week, and a year to year basis."

 

In other words if he keeps making these same simple in game mistakes?  He should be fired.  With this singular call being the icing on the cake.   He should not be from this single call alone, but kind of a tip of the iceberg moment IF these things keep happening.

 

And I will be honest, the more SS coaches the more and more I get Frank Reich vibes.  Especially from his in game decisions, lack of prep week to week, and his lack of innovation of offense.  For being a Offensive guru?  His offensive play calling is very stale.  Watch the Rams, Chiefs, Packers, or 49ers and see the difference. 

[jvan1973]

1 hour ago, ColtAndOrioles said:

I didn't mean that pee wee football teams kick off. 

 

I meant that even a pee wee football coach knows enough to run the ball out the endzone in that situation. 

Cmon.   Why be so obtuse?

It's really not as big of an issue as you are making it.    Let's say he brings it out and is tripped up at the ten?  We have a great o line and a great back.  He had more confidence in his offense than you do.   He was right

[ColtAndOrioles]

19 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

It's really not as big of an issue as you are making it.    Let's say he brings it out and is tripped up at the ten?  We have a great o line and a great back.  He had more confidence in his offense than you do.   He was right

I don't think it is really a question of confidence in the offense and more so a question about probabilities.  Winning probabilities. 

 

It is a lot of IFS that you are assuming. 

I would hazard to guess that a team running out the clock....with the defense knowing the Offense is going to run the ball all 3 plays....may get the first down 30-35% of the time.  Therefore the %'s lie with the D in this case as far as getting the ball back.  Not winning.  Just getting the ball back.

 

Therefore you just have to play worst case scenario and assume that the Colts....running the ball 3 times....will not get a first and have to punt.  If that is the case, you play the percentages and put the Bears into a position with the least amount of time available...knowing that they have to score a TD and not a FG.

 

Not sure why this is such an issue.  It was a major screw up on the Colts part and if the Colts had not gotten a first down and had been forced to punt with 45 seconds left?  Bad.  If they went and scored?

 

Pure hysteria. 

 

I just watched the replay.  Taylor got a first down with 1:50 remaining.   If he gets stuffed there and on third down?  The Bears get the ball back with around 40 seconds remaining.   Somewhere probably around their own 25 to 35 yard line.   Or would you rather have them on their own 35 to 45 with 10 seconds remaining?

 

I don't understand your rationale here. 

[Superman]

1 hour ago, ColtAndOrioles said:

Again I think you are kind of twisting what I said.  Not all..but some. 

 

First, I laid out in very basic math and logic how much time would have been left on the clock if the Colts had run the ball out, run 3 plays, the Bears call one timeout, and then the Colts punted.  In fact I was being kind of generous in regard to how much time would have actually been left.  If you figure 5-8 seconds per play.  Refs have to spot the ball.  Restart the play clock.  Punt.   It comes out to around 10 seconds.  Every time.  I am still not sure why you do not acknowledge that?  It is like saying 1 +1 does not = 2.  Simple math. 

 

Second my exact quote when I was questioned on it was this...

 

"Should he be fired over this one decision alone?  No.  But if he keeps making mistakes like this like he is starting to develop a pattern of?  Although none so far have been this blatantly bad....then yes it should be a major red flag in regards to how prepared SS has this team on a day to day, a week to week, and a year to year basis."

 

In other words if he keeps making these same simple in game mistakes?  He should be fired.  With this singular call being the icing on the cake.   He should not be from this single call alone, but kind of a tip of the iceberg moment IF these things keep happening.

 

And I will be honest, the more SS coaches the more and more I get Frank Reich vibes.  Especially from his in game decisions, lack of prep week to week, and his lack of innovation of offense.  For being a Offensive guru?  His offensive play calling is very stale.  Watch the Rams, Chiefs, Packers, or 49ers and see the difference. 

 

I don't want us to keep talking past each other. I know that you're not saying Steichen should be fired over this one decision.

 

My point is that talking about this as if it's a fireable offense leaves no room for any other explanation. In your opinion, taking more time off the clock outweighs the risk of a turnover, or a penalty which would pin the offense deep in their own territory. I mostly agree, but IF the staff weighed the situation out and decided that the risk of a turnover or penalty on the kickoff was too high, then I think that's understandable.

 

I also don't think the staff was oblivious to the situation. The confusion before the kickoff wasn't good, but Steichen trying to call timeout and another coach appearing to yell toward the returner makes me think they were tuned in. Either way, they need to clean up that operation, in a major way.

 

Regarding Steichen, I'm not out here cheerleading him, I have the same questions as you. I think he's had some good moments, but I think people are looking to him as the person who is going to save the Colts, and I don't really see it.

[ColtAndOrioles]

18 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I don't want us to keep talking past each other. I know that you're not saying Steichen should be fired over this one decision.

 

My point is that talking about this as if it's a fireable offense leaves no room for any other explanation. In your opinion, taking more time off the clock outweighs the risk of a turnover, or a penalty which would pin the offense deep in their own territory. I mostly agree, but IF the staff weighed the situation out and decided that the risk of a turnover or penalty on the kickoff was too high, then I think that's understandable.

 

I also don't think the staff was oblivious to the situation. The confusion before the kickoff wasn't good, but Steichen trying to call timeout and another coach appearing to yell toward the returner makes me think they were tuned in. Either way, they need to clean up that operation, in a major way.

 

Regarding Steichen, I'm not out here cheerleading him, I have the same questions as you. I think he's had some good moments, but I think people are looking to him as the person who is going to save the Colts, and I don't really see it.

Yeah I get that.  I completely agree for the most part.    Other than I thought the timeout called before the kickoff had nothing to do with confusion about what to do if the ball is kicked into the endzone.  Not at all.    I think that had totally to do with the onside kick potential and the Colts alignment and the number of  players on the field as a result and nothing to do with telling Gould what to do if the kick was kicked into the endzone. 

 

TBH I think the Colts brass had no idea or comprehension about the situation at hand.  Which imo is a testament to the SS coaching staff as a whole through 2 years.  Started out pretty good compared to the last 2 years of Frank Reich.

 

But now more and more it looks like Frank Reich 2.0.

[SC-Coltsfan]

Hmmmmm? Is it legal to catch a kickoff in the end zone and run around a little bit and then take a knee? We've all seen a DB intercept a ball in the end zone and do that.

 

Are there any rules experts on here that know for sure?

 

I assume it isn't. I'm guessing the clock doesn't start until he reaches the field of play.