The Bengals Post Game Locker Room Naked Guys Snafu

[Jason_]

Please read my response to Shane Bond....   that should cover it.

 

Your last few responses on this issue have been little more than looking for a fight.    If this were a court-room, a judge would've shut you down days ago as being little more than argumentative.

 

 

 

We're not in a courtroom so what does that have to do with anything?

 

You're not just smart,  you're one of the smartest people on this entire website,  but your last few answers in this on-going thread have been painful to read.    Beneath you.    Not worthy of you.  

 

 

I'm sorry, but some of yours have been painful to read as well.   You're going way out of your way to try to justify the process in defense of the media.  Women can go into an interview area where post-game interviews are done, but this is completely unfeasible for male athletes?  Seriously?

 

A woman gets out of a shower,  she's got a towel wrapped around herself.   She walks to her locker where she's greeted by the media.    How is she supposed to drop her towel and get dressed before talking to the media. A man can put on his underwear beneath his towel and then he's covered.    He can then dress at his own pace without fear of anything being shown.

 

Why does the woman need to drop her towel?  Can she not also slide on a pair of underwear or sports shorts under her towel?  Then all she has to worry about are her breasts, which would still be covered by her towel.  Can't the reporters just keep their eyes up like they do in the men's room?  These are all rhetorical questions of course.  If cameras or male reporters found their way into a woman's lockerroom, it would wind up in a lawsuit.  Men, on the other hand, need to just deal with it so the reporters can get their stories in on time.  It's a double standard no matter how you try to justify it.

[jvan1973]

A good article by a guy who has actually been on both sides of the equation

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=whitlock/050811

[Jason_]

Here we go again.............   (sigh....)

 

There's a difference between media demands of a WNBA game and the media demands of most any male sport.    The two are not the same.   They're not even close.

 

 

I think you're the only one here that's concerned with the media demands.  Which goes to one of my previous points, you're looking at this only from the perspective of the media.  Try looking at it from the perspective of the half-naked players.  

[Myles]

What are you talking about?

 

 

Really?   Having an interview room is hard to do?   Seems to me that a structured interview room would make the media coverage even better.  

 

All I hear you saying is "It's always been done this way".   I work in an industry that has been around for a long time.   We are in a constant fight to improve processes.   Lots of people say "We've always done it like this.   Why change".    The answer is because it can be improved.

 

Media in the locker rooms is still a silly idea even though it has been done that way for a long time.   Let's interview guys while they are changing clothes.   This seems like a good idea to people?

 

Easy fix.   Do it in another room.

[NewColtsFan]

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/gameon/post/2010/09/nude-naked-locker-room-nfl-nba-wnba/1#.VjJoqcvD_qA

 

Good link.    Thanks.

 

But it still looks like we're talking about some locker-rooms and not all.

 

The story referenced the WNBA and college sports.    That still leaves a wide gap of other sports not mentioned.     Perhaps they're now all open as well.    I honestly don't know.      But I'm curious.      Interesting....        And I'm glad to see that women are not complaining.      Good for them.     They seem to understand the need for post-game interviews to be done in the locker-room.

[jvan1973]

Really? Having an interview room is hard to do? Seems to me that a structured interview room would make the media coverage even better.

All I hear you saying is "It's always been done this way". I work in an industry that has been around for a long time. We are in a constant fight to improve processes. Lots of people say "We've always done it like this. Why change". The answer is because it can be improved.

Media in the locker rooms is still a silly idea even though it has been done that way for a long time. Let's interview guys while they are changing clothes. This seems like a good idea to people?

Easy fix. Do it in another room.

Especially now days with cell phones, social media and apps like Skype and facetime. The old tradition is well beyond antiquated

[NewColtsFan]

Really?   Having an interview room is hard to do?   Seems to me that a structured interview room would make the media coverage even better.  

 

All I hear you saying is "It's always been done this way".   I work in an industry that has been around for a long time.   We are in a constant fight to improve processes.   Lots of people say "We've always done it like this.   Why change".    The answer is because it can be improved.

 

Media in the locker rooms is still a silly idea even though it has been done that way for a long time.   Let's interview guys while they are changing clothes.   This seems like a good idea to people?

 

Easy fix.   Do it in another room.

 

I've been responding to most everything.      You're either not readying all my posts,  or cherry picking the quotes that suit your needs.

 

Not a surprise to me,  you've been doing that since the day you showed up here.     It's why I try hard not to respond to you,  it doesn't seem to do either of us any good.

 

For some reason, you're under the impression that you -- who has never been inside a locker-room that requires post-game interviews -- knows my business better than I do.     And I've only been in literally hundreds of professional and college locker-room and have done literally thousands of interviews.

 

Yet, for some reason,  you're under the impression that you understand the comings and going of my industry better.

 

That takes a staggering amount of arrogance.

 

Most of your responses are along the lines of this.     "It's not hard to fix.     You simply do this and that.    How hard is that?    There's no problem."

 

That's the depth of your answers.       Sorry,  but I'm just about flat-out of patience for those who think they know my industry better than I do..........

[NewColtsFan]

I think you're the only one here that's concerned with the media demands.  Which goes to one of my previous points, you're looking at this only from the perspective of the media.  Try looking at it from the perspective of the half-naked players.  

 

As we've talked about and you've forgotten or ignored....   there are few players complaining.    And the owners are siding with the media.

 

Take it up with them.   

 

Of course, I'm the only one who is concerned about media demands.    I'm a 30 year member of the media and I'm the one who understands the demands.    Why is that hard to figure out?

 

You seem more upset than the players and their union reps.

 

One player rep has spoken out.   Eric Winston.    One out of 32.      Nothing from the other 31.    And nothing from the union.

 

You and everyone else here seem to be looking for an issue, that, for the most part,  doesn't much exist.

 

It may someday,   but we haven't reached that day yet......

[NewColtsFan]

We're not in a courtroom so what does that have to do with anything?

 

 

I'm sorry, but some of yours have been painful to read as well.   You're going way out of your way to try to justify the process in defense of the media.  Women can go into an interview area where post-game interviews are done, but this is completely unfeasible for male athletes?  Seriously?

 

 

Why does the woman need to drop her towel?  Can she not also slide on a pair of underwear or sports shorts under her towel?  Then all she has to worry about are her breasts, which would still be covered by her towel.  Can't the reporters just keep their eyes up like they do in the men's room?  These are all rhetorical questions of course.  If cameras or male reporters found their way into a woman's lockerroom, it would wind up in a lawsuit.  Men, on the other hand, need to just deal with it so the reporters can get their stories in on time.  It's a double standard no matter how you try to justify it.

 

The horse just died.

 

So did this thread.

 

This is too painful to continue.

 

This passed the argumentative state a long time ago.

 

It's done.

[Jason_]

As we've talked about and you've forgotten or ignored....   there are few players complaining.    And the owners are siding with the media.

 

Take it up with them.   

 

Of course, I'm the only one who is concerned about media demands.    I'm a 30 year member of the media and I'm the one who understands the demands.    Why is that hard to figure out?

 

You seem more upset than the players and their union reps.

 

One player rep has spoken out.   Eric Winston.    One out of 32.      Nothing from the other 31.    And nothing from the union.

 

You and everyone else here seem to be looking for an issue, that, for the most part,  doesn't much exist.

 

It may someday,   but we haven't reached that day yet......

 

And you know that there aren't more players with an issue that haven't spoken out publicly....how?  

 

I also did not say you were the only one concerned with the media, (edit** yes I did. However the bigger point was to try to get you to look at it from a different perspective..which goes to the rest of this paragraph.) I said you were only looking at this from the perspective of the media.  Try stepping out of your comfort zone and try putting yourself in the player's shoes.  It's just as arrogant of you to claim that this is not a problem as it is for someone to assume they know your industry better than you do.  The only way it's legitimately not a problem is if there are zero players that have a problem with this.  That is not the case though, is it?  

 

You say it may be a problem someday, but we haven't reached that day yet...how do you know this isn't that day?  Why is it you that gets to decide that this is not a problem?  None of us know how many players in the league have an issue with the current process, so to just assume that Eric Winston is the only one because he's (so far) the only one to speak out publicly seems rather foolish. 

 

You seem more upset than the players and their union reps.

 

 

Actually what I find most upsetting is your complete refusal to acknowledge that there is even the possibility that this could be a problem that might need to be addressed.  Your concern is solely with the reporters getting their story and you seem to have no concern whatsoever for the rights of the players.  Now I know you've already said you have no sympathy for the guys who want their money but don't want to honor their media responsibilities.  But not every single player falls into that category.

[Myles]

I've been responding to most everything.      You're either not readying all my posts,  or cherry picking the quotes that suit your needs.

 

Not a surprise to me,  you've been doing that since the day you showed up here.     It's why I try hard not to respond to you,  it doesn't seem to do either of us any good.

 

For some reason, you're under the impression that you -- who has never been inside a locker-room that requires post-game interviews -- knows my business better than I do.     And I've only been in literally hundreds of professional and college locker-room and have done literally thousands of interviews.

 

Yet, for some reason,  you're under the impression that you understand the comings and going of my industry better.

 

That takes a staggering amount of arrogance.

 

Most of your responses are along the lines of this.     "It's not hard to fix.     You simply do this and that.    How hard is that?    There's no problem."

 

That's the depth of your answers.       Sorry,  but I'm just about flat-out of patience for those who think they know my industry better than I do..........

You are out right lying.   Please read the thread.   I have mentioned using another room many times.   You even mentioned how women are brought into an "interview room".   But with men.    Oh no, the world would end.

You seem to be a classic case of not being able to see the forest through the trees.    You are too close.  I compare it to a guy that works in my plant.  For safety, we require the hardhats to be worn with the rim in front.   He argues that they have always done it the other way and everyone is OK.   He can't see the easy solution.

[NewColtsFan]

And you know that there aren't more players with an issue that haven't spoken out publicly....how?  

 

I also did not say you were the only one concerned with the media, (edit** yes I did. However the bigger point was to try to get you to look at it from a different perspective..which goes to the rest of this paragraph.) I said you were only looking at this from the perspective of the media.  Try stepping out of your comfort zone and try putting yourself in the player's shoes.  It's just as arrogant of you to claim that this is not a problem as it is for someone to assume they know your industry better than you do.  The only way it's legitimately not a problem is if there are zero players that have a problem with this.  That is not the case though, is it?  

 

You say it may be a problem someday, but we haven't reached that day yet...how do you know this isn't that day?  Why is it you that gets to decide that this is not a problem?  None of us know how many players in the league have an issue with the current process, so to just assume that Eric Winston is the only one because he's (so far) the only one to speak out publicly seems rather foolish. 

 

 

Actually what I find most upsetting is your complete refusal to acknowledge that there is even the possibility that this could be a problem that might need to be addressed.  Your concern is solely with the reporters getting their story and you seem to have no concern whatsoever for the rights of the players.  Now I know you've already said you have no sympathy for the guys who want their money but don't want to honor their media responsibilities.  But not every single player falls into that category.

 

 

What are you talking about?     "The only way this isn't a problem is if there are ZERO players who are bothered"?!?      WTH?!?    Where on the planet does ANYONE get that kind of deal?      Who demands 100% perfection.     Since when does the needs of one, or a few out-weigh the needs of 1600-1900 players?!?

 

Who are you, and what have you done with Jason?!?    This makes no sense!!!

 

It isn't that day yet,  NOT because I say so....   but because the PLAYERS say so.    When the player reps and Demaurice Smith are standing in front of cameras and microphones and saying this is a serious problem and that they want to meet with owners and TV executives on how to improve the system --- THEN,  ON THAT DAY -- we've got ourselves a problem.      But now, you have a tiny fraction of the players of ONE TEAM complaining.     One player rep.   A few players and their wives -- THAT'S IT!!!!

 

That's not a problem.    That's an annoyance that can be fixed with some common sense.    Reminding for the umpteenth time that this would NEVER HAVE COME UP if not for one camera man who made a mistake.     That's it.

 

I have no problem -- NONE -- if the players and the owners and the union and TV execs and media members can come up with a better system.   If everyone is willing to play ball and create a better system,  then so be it.    Good for them.    I'll be a happy guy.

 

But until that day,  this is the best system going forward,  not because I say so,  because everyone currently involved says so,  including the players,  with their silence.

[Jason_]

What are you talking about?     "The only way this isn't a problem is if there are ZERO players who are bothered"?!?      WTH?!?    Where on the planet does ANYONE get that kind of deal?      Who demands 100% perfection.     Since when does the needs of one, or a few out-weigh the needs of 1600-1900 players?!?

 

 

 

You're reading way too much into my comments.  I didn't say that 1 person means that the entire system has to change.  I said that if one player has an issue, then it is a problem.  Maybe not a big one...maybe not one that's going to get any kind of traction, but it's still a problem.  You keep insisting that it's not a problem...at all.  But that simply is not true.  Because there are some players that have issue with it. 

 

To the rest of your post...I'm pretty much over it at this point.  We'll see what happens.  Likely, nothing will happen.  But at the same time, you never know...maybe these few people speaking out will cause others to speak out as well.  I'd bet my next paycheck that the few that have spoken out so far are not the only ones who feel that way.  Now it's just a matter of seeing if any of the others do decide to speak out. 

 

 

**edit...I did want to comment on this:

 

 including the players,  with their silence.

 

 

That's a pretty huge leap.  Their silence does not at all mean that all of the players feel like the current system is the best system.  It simply means that no one else has decided to speak out.

[NewColtsFan]

You are out right lying.   Please read the thread.   I have mentioned using another room many times.   You even mentioned how women are brought into an "interview room".   But with men.    Oh no, the world would end.

You seem to be a classic case of not being able to see the forest through the trees.    You are too close.  I compare it to a guy that works in my plant.  For safety, we require the hardhats to be worn with the rim in front.   He argues that they have always done it the other way and everyone is OK.   He can't see the easy solution.

 

As someone who has visited internet fan message boards since I first found one in 1999,  I'd like to respectfully offer the following advice....   

 

If you think me, or anyone else here is lying....    don't use that word.   Tell them you think they're wrong.    Tell them you think they're mistaken.    Use another word that means roughly that.       But lying goes to motive,  which you'll likely never know.    So, nothing good comes from anyone using the word "lying" here...

 

Things will escalate badly from there.    Things will quickly get out of hand.    

 

Again, I'm offering this in internet friendship.     You're free to accept this advice, or reject it.    You can tell me to stuff it or stick or anything else you like.

 

But you probably should never use the word lying.....       it's like dropping a bomb...   once it goes off, it's hard to manage the damage.

[southwest1]

What kind of questions might the cheerleaders be asked?

 

1. So, what did you think about the other cheerleaders' pyramid?

 

2. Your squad being out of sync, do you think that had an adverse effect on the team?

 

3. Do the other cheerleaders ever talk smack to you?

 

I guess it doesn't really matter what they ask the cheerleaders, I'd still tune in.

 

 

exactly man, they could be asking them about the turn triple flip sideways back stand and I'd be interested. As a matter of fact, yeah, give us some of that smack talk too. I love drama

I realize that both 18Manning & QuizBoy are merely teasing here, but I've always wondered if rival cheerleaders on opposing sidelines engage in good natured trash talk like some devoted fans do from time to time. What would they exchange friendly jabs about? Uniform attire? The condition & fullness of their hair? The sharpness of their routine as a collective unit? A crazy pass interference call from a zebra on the field? Is there a next woman up in professional cheerleading circles? Would 2 rival cheerleader captains throw insults back & forth about the music artists they set their routines too like a hip hop vs hard rock/Metal smack down face off over dance numbers? Like a yo momma dance routine Cheerleader brawl...Oh yeah, I want front row seats to that arena festival. LOL! 

 

Can a cheerleader be promoted from the practice squad from part time to full time action? Can a cheerleader get ejected from a game for relentless & mean spirited trash talking on the field? If a fight between 2 cheerleaders erupts on the field during a timeout, who breaks it up if all the zebras are male refs with no female representative in sight? Who plays neutral Switzerland to resolve cheerleader confrontations if no female ref is present at the game? Just goofing around folks.  I enjoy exaggerating comic situations to epic proportions for comic relief. It's who I am. It's what I do. 

 

In all seriousness, I do enjoy NCF's, Jvan's, Jason's, & Gramz's commentary here. I have been in locker rooms before, but never as a professional reporter. Their insights are fascinating to read given their experiences. Thank you all. 

[jvan1973]

I realize that both 18Manning & QuizBoy are merely teasing here, but I've always wondered if rival cheerleaders on opposing sidelines engage in good natured trash talk like some devoted fans do from time to time. What would they exchange friendly jabs about? Uniform attire? The condition & fullness of their hair? The sharpness of their routine as a collective unit? A crazy pass interference call from a zebra on the field? Is there a next woman up in professional cheerleading circles?

Can a cheerleader be promoted from the practice squad from part time to full time action? Can a cheerleader get ejected from a game for relentless & mean spirited trash talking on the field? If a fight between 2 cheerleaders erupts on the field during a timeout, who breaks it up if all the zebras are male refs with no female representative in sight? Who plays neutral Switzerland to resolve cheerleader confrontations if no female ref is present at the game? Just goofing around folks. I enjoy exaggerating comic situations to epic proportions for comic relief. It's who I am. It's what I do.

In all seriousness, I do enjoy NCF's, Jvan's, Jason's, & Gramz's commentary here. I have been in locker rooms before, but never as a professional reporter. Their insights are fascinating to read given their experiences. Thank you all.

I've never seen opposing teams cheerleaders at games. Only the hone teams cheerleders. At least at nfl games

[southwest1]

I've never seen opposing teams cheerleaders at games. Only the hone teams cheerleders. At least at nfl games

True Jvan. Well, there goes my cheerleader cat fight scenario. I don't wanna cause or be in the middle of it just witness a landmark event personally like Halley's Comet something rarely seen as common place. 

[Myles]

As someone who has visited internet fan message boards since I first found one in 1999,  I'd like to respectfully offer the following advice....   

 

If you think me, or anyone else here is lying....    don't use that word.   Tell them you think they're wrong.    Tell them you think they're mistaken.    Use another word that means roughly that.       But lying goes to motive,  which you'll likely never know.    So, nothing good comes from anyone using the word "lying" here...

 

Things will escalate badly from there.    Things will quickly get out of hand.    

 

Again, I'm offering this in internet friendship.     You're free to accept this advice, or reject it.    You can tell me to stuff it or stick or anything else you like.

 

But you probably should never use the word lying.....       it's like dropping a bomb...   once it goes off, it's hard to manage the damage.

I'm also a "veteran" of message boards.    It allows me to easily see when someone is lying.  

You accused me of not reading your posts, cherry-picking and being arrogant.   You then skip the posts from myself and others that do not fit your agenda.

 

Sorry you cannot see it.