shasta519

In the top 3? The only non-QB would be MHJ. But if they aren't taking a QB, I think they would sell that pick to the highest bidder and then get one of their blue chips some picks later. That draft capital could be used in a number of ways, either via trade for impact talent OR for replacing vets that are aging out. Imagine trading back and getting that OT from PSU and still getting a couple R1 and R2 picks. That said, I think you take the QB and don't look back. Much less risk than the current path. I think that would be much clearer next draft season when the QB hype begins back up.

Disclaimer: This is a wild hypothetical that likely won't happen. And with a whole college season to come, anything can happen. But with the info we have right now, it's a pretty simple decision IMO. You take Williams or Maye in this scenario. Barring a huge collapse from the defense, it's hard to imagine a scenario where AR has shown enough AND the Colts win less games than last season. As for what to do with AR, they probably won't have trouble finding a trading partner. They won't get back their original investment, but even Josh Rosen was able to net a R2 pick the year after he was drafted at #9. There will likely be a team drafting late in R1 that would be willing to take a shot (especially if they miss out on the top QBs). So they would get some of their investment. But I continue to believe that next year's QB class is very good. So it might not even have to be a top 1-3 pick.

Clearly it's the secondary. There are question marks at every position and a lot of youth.

Sort of reminds me of Pierce’s debut as a rookie.

Would love to hear an explanation from PFF on how Raimann received a 70+ grade against PIT. Highsmith ate him up that game, including at critical times. But that was the game after the PHI game...and he was much better from that point on. It will just be a matter of building on that. We have seen what happens when this team depends on samples of good play from the previous season. Last season, they got burned bad by both Pryor and Pinter. But I think Raimann is a better player than those two. I just don't think he has a ton of upside to be considered a breakout player.

Reich was so much better than Pagano. It's just Reich's mistakes are much more fresh in our minds. Time has been very kind to Pagano's tenure it seems.

Yikes. That was a bit before my time. What happened there? Did he just get hurt?

Setting aside QB moves, TRich is probably the one.

Andre Johnson? The worst FA move was Corey Simon. That was Polian’s big FA splurge. They signed him to a 6/$30M ($5M was 6% of the cap at the time). He was supposed to be the missing link. He played 2005 season (had 0 sacks). Then got hurt before the 2006 season and was released after it with a settlement. Didn’t even travel with the team to the SB.

They traded Chris Hinton, Andre Rison and at least one R1 pick for Jeff George. That trade is untouchable.

Woods has that potential, but we have only seen flashes. Granson is a fairly average to below average player. MAC is what he is. Ogletree and Mallory are wildcards. I think right now…this room is probably below average with potential.

Well there won't be suspicion if we find out that he didn't bet against the Colts. But if we do, it could get ugly. That's all I have been saying.

Edit: Wasn't aware that this was about Thomas because of the deleted posts. And no, I wasn't saying Thomas could have been involved in a gambling ring. I don't know where this idea of a gambling ring came from. What I said is that if Rodgers bet on the Colts to lose that game, even though he wasn't playing, people would watch the ending and there would still be a lot of speculation.

Yes, the Colts still covered the spread but that’s not the angle here. The angle would have been in-game bets. Prior to the game, since MIN was the favorite, the MIN money line was meh (-200). But at halftime, that MIN money line jumped to +4000 (and even higher at some books) since no team had ever blown that lead. And it would have remained fairly high as the comeback was happening. So there would certainly have been some money to make if you knew the Colts were going to blow that lead at halftime. Another angle would have been getting that game to OT. You can bet that as well. I am sure at halftime, that was also big odds…maybe even bigger.

To the bolded...I agree. Just because he didn't place a huge bet on that app...doesn't mean there wasn't a huge bet placed somewhere and for some reason (whether that was blackmail or he was just getting a nice piece of it). And even if a player wasn't tanking with his play, he could have still known about it and wanted to get in on it. I realize that's just wild speculation because we don't have facts, like what type of bets and when. But that is the type of speculation that will inevitably follow if he was found to be betting against the Colts, especially in a game where they lost. People will be combing over his tape to find instances. And that MIN game is probably where they would start. But all of that speculation is also why I doubt we will ever get the facts. Everybody involved has a vested interest to keep that from getting out.

At least the players do benefit from those partnerships. Gambling pumps billions into the NFL revenue stream, which raises the salary cap and allows players to make more money. All they have to do is not bet on the NFL or at an NFL facility. But I agree that these gambling partnership have created an atmosphere of doubt. Or should I say...they have exacerbated it.

That's the thing. You have individual over/under bets for over/under on rushing, receiving, passing, TDs, etc for a single game. You can bet the 1st TD scorer to the last TD scorer. You could bet one 1:00 slate in the NFL and put in a hundred small prop bets if you really wanted. So I would like to know what types of bets he was making. I am not accusing Rodgers or even implying that he did anything because we don't know anything yet. I am just saying that IF he was betting against the Colts in games which he was on the field, it will rightfully open a whole new can of worms. It's a tough sell at that point and people will speculate on why he bet against them. What did he know? What did he do? I would disagree about his effort on that Cook TD. But then again, it was most of the defense in that 2H. The body language was just awful. To go from an historically great defensive showing to being the worst defense in the NFL in the span of halftime is certainly questionable from at least an effort standpoint.

We don't have the details. There were hundreds of bets were placed during the season and some were Colts bets. We don't know how many and when. But since he was only inactive for the last two games, it's very likely he was making some type of NFL bets when he was active. So it's possible that some of those NFL bets were bets on the Colts while he was playing. We will have to wait to get confirmation on that. Ridley wasn't playing, so of course there wasn't any speculation that he was involved in the outcome. And it was never reported that the two DET players were betting on DET games...just NFL games. The other two DET players weren't even betting on the NFL, which is why they only got six games instead of an indefinite suspension. So there wouldn't be speculation toward that end. Betting on your own team while playing is not something we have seen. And if he bet AGAINST the Colts while he was playing, that is completely uncharted territory. A reasonable person might choose to downplay that as some kid who was just being silly and didn't think he could get caught...or they might think more into it. And if he has a true gambling problem that is bad enough to cause him to rules and risk those millions in his next contract, then what other things could he have done? Even if he made a big bet AGAINST IND in that HOU game...that was the game where Thomas alligator-armed a Hail Mary on 4th and 20 to allow Akins to get the TD. And then Thomas followed that up by getting dusted by Akins on the two-point conversion, which won the game for HOU. Let's be honest...the end of the game was fluky as it gets, especially with it being the difference between HOU getting the #1 pick and the Colts getting the #6 pick. The Colts had a 97% win probability prior to that play and somehow lost that game. Admittedly, I am speculating based on thing we don't know yet. And if he wasn't betting against the Colts, then you are likely correct. But if he was betting against the Colts, this story is likely to get worse.

No. I am not implying anything. I don't know the details. But if he was betting against the Colts in games where he was playing, naturally people will and should wonder if he was alone, or if he knew something. And tape like the 2H of that MIN game would just add fuel to that type of speculation. The outcomes of NFL games being fixed isn't a new idea. I don't think you need to be a conspiracy theorist to sometimes question what is happening on the field. It is an entertainment business after all.

He was actually inactive against NYG and HOU in the last two games. So maybe his IND bets occurred then. But it sounds like there were hundreds of bets (across NFL bets), so hard to imagine all of his Colts bets occurred during those two weeks he was inactive. That would be similar to the Ridley situation, which would probably be the best scenario for him. I doubt they could prove anything from tape anyways. But the speculation would be nearly as bad. Rodgers blowing plays to accommodate $25-50 bets is irrational, but him knowing the fix is in and wanting to make a few free bucks off that is not that crazy. And naturally the conversation would shift to who else was involved.

I think it's being reported that he had DID bet on IND games. But we don't know the details. I don't know why he would have been betting on the Colts to win last year. They were a bad team. Maybe he was betting them to cover spreads. IF he bet against the Colts, this story could get so much worse. For now, all we know is he was involved. But that could change. I doubt the NFL or the Colts would allow that info to get out there though. Just too much money at stake, so somebody would have to leak it.

Just because there wasn't a big bet on whatever app doesn't mean there wasn't a big bet somewhere. But we do know there was betting of some kind. They are going to absolutely investigate if he was betting on games he was playing in and they should.

You are correct...it was a game-tying TD. That play was definitely not all on Rodgers. But his effort was questionable at best. But the rest of the secondary was brutal as well. Thomas just whiffs the head-on tackle and McLeod is jogging after Cook. Then watch the two-point conversion right after that. They (Rodgers, Franklin and McLeod) triple-team Jefferson on the right, which leaves Cook wide open in the flat. He would have walked in if Cousins had looked his way...the defenders didn't even react to him. In that game, the Colts defense went from an insane -1.046 EPA in the 1H to a +.285 EPA in the 2H. Some of that is driven by how teams play with big leads, but that type of variance is almost unbelievable.

Who knows. But I will say this. That 2H of that MIN game should at least raise some eyebrows now that we have this information. It was a historical comeback. Rodgers was pretty bad in that 2H, especially on the Cook and Thielen TDs. But it wasn't just him either. Gilmore only allowed 2 TDs last season...both in that 2H.

Yikes is right. (2:15 4Q): He was lined up against Cook on that game-winning TD. Just kind of hangs around and then eventually chases him down and misses the tackle. (5:30 4Q): The other TD was when Thielen was wide open. I don't know if it was him or Blackmon, but both missed their assignments. This game does look a bit sketchy on second view.