DougDew

This sentence sums it up and probably saves a lot of discussion that could be fraught with misunderstandings.

I don't believe anybody in this thread is complaining about Paye, Dayo, or their production as part of our d line. I think its simply a benign discussion about where they stand relative to investment and expectations that come with it. Some investments do better and some do less. It happens, Its not personal. Its a good d line. Hopefully somebody on the edge can emerge as a guy that needs frequent double teams. That's what I was referring to with my still waiting comment.

Thank you. I would assume that his change of heart about play calling at some point before he took the job was due to reflection upon his time with IND, and NOT a condition of being offered the job in the first place? As I said. I believe I read somewhere that the owner pushed the move. I don't follow everything Frank because I'm not passionate about the issue. I treat this forum as a discussion forum, not a research forum. So if things are brought up from misinformation, take it like its given I suppose.

Yes, I did know. Its what all of the tape and analysis said. He would have to learn moves and bendiness after he gets to the NFL. Just saying he's not the pass rusher you like to get with a high investment. Basically, hasn't yet achieved the potential of bendiness and moves that you hope to get with the investment in "ceiling" Like so many other things with the Colts. Still patiently waiting.

BTW, since I've only thought about Dayo today as I read this thread, it takes a while for things to come back to me. The premise of the thread was "what do you think of Dayo's development" Well, I would go back to what the guy who drafted him said. That he was a first round talent that fell to our pick because of the achilles. If you recall, this was the Paye/Darrisaw draft where many folks wanted an OT. Ballard passed on OT prospects like Dillon Radunz (who I didn't like) and Spencer Brown (who I did like) to take Dayo because he was an exceptional value....after already taking a DE with the first pick. That tells me that Ballard expected him to play like first round material...sometime before his contract expires. So my opinion of his development doesn't need a whole bunch of independent thought. Its pretty obvious where Dayo's development stands relative to expectations.

My agenda in this part of the thread is to point out the apparent hypocrisy of the Frank Blamers who might be giddy at the success CAR might have if they do better, but not realizing it took the (more observant?) CAR FO only six games to recognize the (potential) problem. As you know, I wasn't/am not a Frank Blamer, nor have I ever called for Ballard's firing. I think you place me in one extreme. I think the issue is that I play it down the middle so much as the result of dispassionate reason that it aggravates those folks who do have a passionate agenda.

It appears that he wasn't really willing now either, and CAR did a bold thing by giving him an ultimatum of sorts. I thought I read that the owner told Frank to do it, in that Frank didn't really offer it up by himself as a solution.

Yes, recognized after 6 games. Followed by a bold move. Which followed a bold move to get the QB they wanted. Not timid. Some folks like swinging for the fences rather than sitting like a do-little bump on a log. I never participated in that discussion, just raising some similarities to it. You pounce on people because what they wrote makes no sense to you? Why do you automatically blame them for that problem? I have not been thinking about Dayo for three years. I haven't thought about him until I read the thread.

Dayo's fine. At this point, I just don't see where he has turned out to be that first round talent not drafted in the first round because of the Achilles, that Ballard said he was. I assumed he would be an edge setter to Paye's pass rushing, then slide into Grover's spot and play next to Buck. The d line has a lot of Sheard's and Waldens. Lots of plain white bread toast, but one premier biscuit short of what's needed.

No. He is not living in my head for three years. I thought about him because somebody started a thread about him. I don't even think about him when I watch Colts games, because he hardly ever does anything. Yes, Ballard drafted him to be a 280 pound DE. It worked for Richard Dent and Bruce Smith in 1985, but that was 1985.

I remember seeing a pic of Dayo shortly after his surgery and he looked about 300 pounds. With his time off from football, he must of found somebody's Cheetos stash. Great RAS and high ceiling is not the same thing as a player with demonstrated dedication to being a football player. Not saying Dayo isn't one...how would I know..., but that pic was kind of......hmmm......moment for me. I knew he was a good player coming out of Vandy...then the injury came and I forgot about him. But he was listed at 280 there, and to me that speaks of a DT in the NFL 4-3. 3T perhaps....but we had already spent a pick 13 and $100M on ours. So I never understood the pick. Spend a 4th on Buck's backup, sure. But a good second? Dayo is not an edge and might be almost 20 pounds heavier than Lewis at playing weight.

Tipping something is my guess. Not on each play, but I'm guessing that defenses know there is a limited playbook with AR, so the coverage has fewer plays to worry about covering with any given drop back. They have a better sense of what's coming. With Minshew and the full play book, there are more possible routes to cover on any given drop back. Coverage loosens up, so perfect coverage happens less frequently. I think anybody who watches Purdy play can tell that he is extremely accurate with the ball. It almost limits the need to throw deep down field to open up the short game if a QB can place it that well consistently. Can't speak to the low perfect coverage %. Unless DBs and LBs are very concerned about stopping McCaffrey.

I agree. There will probably be a burst from the change. Some of that due to defenses not having tape on the situational play calling. We have to see how the change is sustained over weeks. What I've seen from the CAR games I've watched, the defenses are sitting on the WR routes and stacking the run box eerily similar to what they did with the Colts under Frank. However, like the Colts, CAR has terrible playmakers at the boundary positions. So which is it, Frank and his routes/plays, or a talent issue? Perhaps the new play caller will see things that works for them.

There were two good players in recent Colts history that do the same things as Paye. Set a good edge, and pressure the QB but end up a step slow to get sacks. They tended to get clean-up type of sacks, or coverage sacks. A player that is good to have, but not really a pick #17 guy. Funny thing is, I don't think Paye's career so far has been anything different than what he showed in college or what his weaknesses were....not bendy or explosive to get around the OT. I guess there was some ceiling potential there...lol. The two other guys that come to mind are Jabaal Sheard and Erik Walden. On topic. I always thought Dayo was going to be a DE/DT tweener that took Lewis' role. On draft day, I remember Ballard saying that Dayo was a first round talent that was only available at our second round pick because of the injury. He's now healthy, and I don't think anybody has yet seen first round talent with Dayo.

I agree. My point stated way upstream was that it was a clash that was delayed for a very long time here in IND. In fact, the specific clash of changing play calling never occurred. The entire team had to deteriorate into dysfunction before the matter of "Frank" was even addressed. Then it seemingly had to be addressed by Irsay, if statements are true. But if CAR still stinks it up, none of this irony emerges.

If changing the play caller works, then whatever the culture/dynamics are at CAR makes whatever culture/dynamics that existed with the Colts over the past several years look bad. I used Ballard as a symbol of the FO, but it could be Irsay too, or whomever has the authority to change play callers away from the HC....it has to be someone above the HC. If it works, then CAR is getting it right and the Colts got it wrong for years. I assume the Frank haters, on its surface, would love to see the new play caller at CAR succeed, but they may refuse to then acknowledge that CAR only took 6 games to recognize and fix the problem, compared to the Ballard/Irsay FO that never apparently recognized it or had the fortitude to do it. Chew on that irony.

Good Lord. I know you read stuff hoping to pounce with an eager trigger, but please clearly read what I write before you go off. I said IF the play calling improves and the CAR offense improves THEN its a bad look for Ballard for not seeing what many here saw. I have no idea why you introduce supporting a coach or who traded up. My post is about the play calling switch fixing a real problem. If it actually does. We'll see what happens. That means the future. The bolded ignores that important part of my post.....talk about agenda.

The theory posed was that the CAR FO took away Frank's playcalling. If the offense improves, then it begs the question why didn't the Colts FO take away Frank's play calling when the O struggled....as many were calling for it. Not that the FO listens to the fans, but if the fans see something that the FO later sees and its a fix, then the Frank critics have some merit and Ballard not seeing the problem is a bad look for him. I know, its complex. We'll see what happens at CAR.

And our higher ups didn’t do that. I guess we’ll see if it really matters. If brown sparks offensive production for CAR, it’s a bad look for Ballard.

I think all of those things about his comments. But I don’t expect football players to be anything different than selfish, shallow, and self centered when it comes to things that impact their next contract. I expect him to be concerned about losing impact. what are people saying. That he should just be concerned about taking one for the team in a season that is generally a throw away. So the colts can win 8 games instead of 6. Why would any football player really care about that when it’s a contract year I believe he was honest. I believe he was being self centered. And it’s no big deal, so I’m not going to pretend he’s really an angel deep down.

he’s a football player being criticized for being honest in an after game presser. It’s no big deal. But he likely meant what he said. I don’t see the need to defend these guys like it’s a personal offense.

Yes. Frustration caused him to blurt out what he was thinking instead of being in a situation that would allow him to spin what he was thinking and say something different. Like he did in the interview. I think he had contract on his mind. And he probably thinks he’s a better player than the other guys who got the ball. I don’t have a problem with that.

Look at it this way. The team scores 38 points and two other receivers have better or equal games than he had. Is that really the time to mention how he feels he should have gotten the ball more? Over whom, Downs, AP, JT, or Moss? If the Colts don't have success on offense, yes, but when he is maybe the least material player on a 38 point effort? He's seeing contract year, period. I agree, its only one game. Another way to see it though, he brings up how little he was used probably during the only game he was not the primary target....or, he raised the issue in 100% of those games he's played. And I agree that frustration brought it out. But those words do indicate something, no? Or are they a complete misspeak? I don't think this is a big deal, but it is weird.

I've heard many times before that a team gets a phone call from the League office saying that they got it wrong. I think Polian used to mention those times on his radio show, and other times I've heard it more recently.

I get that, and that's good for a contract. Just wondering if the play design says that the QB is suppose to look MPJs way at that time or if the QB is looking at AP or Downs, or Granson, etc I doubt that MPJ is the first look on every play. Just saying that HCs and GMs look at this stuff with greater knowledge than we do.