ColtStrong2013

if you believe Dayo is the better pass rusher, then there is risk in picking the option up. The risk is that you may not able to afford Dayo if he plays at the level we want one of them to play at this season. That’s a problem.

It was 8.5 and as many on this forum would agree, sacks aren’t exactly a true reflection of efficient pass rush… We need more consistency and the boss says so.

So anyways. Back to pick #15…

he picked up Kelly’s as well. And he did at the end of April. he then signed him to an extension just after the 5th year season started. So he picked it up with the full intention of signing an extension. we’ll know come end of April where things are headed with Kwity Paye, I believe. Like @Superman, I don’t see a need of picking him up as there is competition that might dictate whether an extension is even considered. If Dayo has the ability, in Ballard’s eyes, to be the superior option, why would he commit $13 million to Paye?

how little it is on the elite spectrum… Ebukam makes little on the DE/edge spectrum too huh? no it’s not. It’s exercising the need to give him another year past what you already have. They might half way through the last year of his rookie contract decide he is or isn’t worth having for another year. In which case they will have options. Perhaps he’s worth a bit more than the 5th year option, but it allowed for more evaluation and time to decide. Also regarding the 5th year… Ballard has picked up what? Once? Nelson? Is that it? He’s thought so little of the option that he’s traded just outside of the 1st round multiple times. Some GM’s value it so much that they trade back into the 1st round to have the option. Perhaps he does it. And hopefully we will get the reasoning behind it. But I’m not sure he’s going to.

Why is Kwity Paye and elite edge rushers even in the same sentence? He’s not. I doubt very seriously he changes that overnight and becomes that in a contract year. So again- what is the difference between the first year cap hit on what he’s to likely sign an extension for and the 5th year option? Is he even better than Ebukam? I’m not sure he is…

I was 100% joking. although I’m sure he’d be a great resource for #5. In the X’s and O’s and lessons learned (especially in how to better protect yourself.)

I thought when he was suspended that he was done here. However, there was a noticeable difference when he wasn't out there. One prior move that comes to mind is Denico Autry, which people on here absolutely have crucified Ballard on since letting him walk. Would he be willing to do it again? I don't know. He talks Grover up a lot. And he loves his trenches, as we well know. Grover's going to get paid... I do know that. Time will show who pays up.

Is the "could be higher" dependent on if Taylor Swift dumps Travis Kelce or not? 🙃 I originally thought this way. But along those same lines, would a multi-year backloaded deal be much different in year 1 towards the cap than exercising the option? And if it's relatively close, wouldn't the small amount justify more evaluation before rushing that contract? I know that it has been reported that Ballard's buddy Dorsey's career ender in KC was largely from dishing out big contracts without exercising much patience or influence from his team (including CB). I think he'll be patient.

I was just going off measurables. It’s pretty close, and I would venture to say that at any time throughout the year, they are probably give or take 10 lbs. Buckner has nearly two inches on him, and inch on those yard stick hands he possesses, but Dayo has longer arms, which is really hard for me to fathom.

Not optioning him should give the extra motivation in what will be big big contract year for him to put on a show. He can write his own ticket.

He'd be a great back up.

Exactly. What is the 3T doing in the run? Taking on double teams? Yeah, it's important to have a guy take them on efficiently, but it's also going to probably throw ratings like that off...

I feel the same. Regarding Buckner... he was drafted 7th overall. So that speaks in itself how he was viewed. And it was accurate. And if Buck wants to stay, then I say all the power to him. Never just let a player of his caliber walk without good reason. They don't have one right now. I've said on this forum before that while our top talent isn't at premium positions, it doesn't mean we don't have some game changers. I've longed to see Jonathan Taylor, Quenton Nelson, and Deforrest Buckner (and for what it's worth Shaq Leonard) in the playoffs. Guys of that caliber need to be on that stage.

Source for the Ballard had to convince him line? That’s the first I’ve heard of that it might have been mostly rumors. But I remember him talking about having a conversation with Ballard at the end of ‘22 and Ballard repeatedly just said “trust me.” There might have been nothing to that, but that strikes me as a conversation of where things are going and expressing desire to be on a championship contender, which I wouldn’t him blame him for under any circumstances.

@Superman I guess the only thing that I think of from a longterm standpoint is that perhaps Ballard sees Dayo being Buckner’s replacement, in which case it could make sense to look to keep both players. And in that regard, it would be best to have flexibility with an extension with Paye on a 5th year. That might be a hard thing to plan for though, unless Buckner is for sure on his way out… and in that case, maybe he’s a trade candidate, although unlikely. Dayo is 15 lbs lighter than Buckner, but very similar otherwise. Longer arms actually.

I agree on the money with Grover, I just hope there is a good plan in place to replace him. I feel like Buckner might be on his last tour here in Indianapolis considering Ballard had to convince him to stay last year. If we make the playoffs, then I could see him wanting to finish his career here. If not, he’s gone in my eyes. speaking of convincing- That’s a good point on making it a competition between Dayo and Paye. I never thought of it like that, and would now have to agree. If you aren’t an attorney, you are missing a hell of an opportunity… 😂 I think they are in a good position to take what the board gives them. Maybe better than in all of Ballard’s tenure really, not that it stopped him from taking what was given anyways. I don’t look for him to trade back as I think he could have what he views as a premium player. It might just happen to be a player that can impact right away, which would be great. But if it’s on the defensive line, I wouldn’t be as disappointed as most people likely would for the situation we are in with the four players mentioned above.

I worry about age no matter the position. Just because some of the big names at DT over the years had longevity, doesn’t mean it is absolute. Any time a man hits 30, he is no longer peak and subject to changes in his body, injuries, longer recovery time, etc. It’s the case for military- special forces especially. Many of those guys rely on ped’s as the get older to push through…. Obviously Grover got caught with his hand in the jar on that note. It’s aways a concern.

I don’t see that. But I do like Dayo’s versatility, and I think his ceiling might be higher than Paye’s. I think Paye has a chance to take another jump, which would surprise a lot people for some reason. He’s improved every year. He was playing really well at the beginning of the season before injuries came in the picture. As Ballard said, he was really good against the run, just need more consistent pass rush. Maybe a new coach is all that is needed with that aspect of his game. I think we see a jump across the entire d-line with our new coach. Sometimes a tweak or two, and a new energy is all that is needed. Buckner would stand out even more if the others brought more consistent pass rush. This line could really work wonders collectively if they each improve going into next season.

This is how I feel... From a roster building standpoint, it seems to make most sense. Especially given the talent at skill positions in the draft. This is assuming we are tagging/resigning Pittman, which I believe we do. But a depth piece in free agency there and a day 2 pick might not be a bad thing. It's certainly more of Ballard's way of doing things. I can't imagine we don't pick up Paye's 5th year. Assuming as much, and drafting someone like Verse would time out well with not relying on him too much from the get-go. He would be a good rotational piece early while we evaluate and give Paye another 2 seasons to earn a bigger paycheck. Dayo, to me, is the odd duck in the picture, with him going into the final year of his contract. You are probably correct in the thought that DT is more pressing. If we don't sign/replace Grover, I'm not sure what the plan is. But the clock is ticking on he and Buckner, no matter which way you look at it. Also, Ballard has repeatedly stated that he and Steichen see eye-to-eye on the concept of building the trenches. So I think there will be continued investment there.

1987- no memories 1995- too young to enjoy 2006- felt like a champion 2009- Lombardi slipped through fingers 2012- luck put team on back 2014- promising, but holes exposed 2020- wentz and covid stink (wrong year my bad…) rivers awesome, sad he left 2023- division slipped through fingers

I like the idea of addressing skill positions in free agency and doubling down on DE/DT if the value is there. Verse and Jenkins being who I like the most.

expectations are high. That’s for sure

it comes down to matchups in the tournament. They should have a chip on their shoulder from last season. They are also more complete than last year. Braden Smith is a legit point guard. Guards generally take over in the tournament. Last year it was, shut edey down, and problem solved. I don’t think it’s that simple this year. the thing I give Purdue credit for is that they are going to get everyone’s best effort. That’s life at the top of the food chain. But then again, they did last year

time will tell. I wouldn’t bet against her. That’s for sure.