Bad Morty
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Posts posted by Bad Morty
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Brady did it. He is also a whiny baby. Pats fans follow suit.
However....
This whole thing shouldn't tarnish his legacy any... To me, it's like throwing spit balls. It's against the rules. It's technically cheating, but it's not as serious as juicing, spying, or FA tampering.
I agree with Montana on this FTMP... Brady should be appealing regardless. Then he ought take his suspension and move on.
This whole thing is only still news because of the Pats organization being indignant and hiring junk science lobbying firms to refute the NFL's official report.
If his suspension is completely overturned, it will be worse for Brady's legacy, IMO. It'll get press like OJ 2.0... The public, outside of the Boston area, is satisfied with the findings of the Wells Report.
You make some good points. I think you are wrong though about AEI being a "junk science" firm. Again...I don't pretend to know what's going to happen. My guess is that Goodell sticks to his guns, this ends up in court, and like in Bountygate and independent arbitrator is appointed...and then who knows. It shouldn't be brushed aside that in the past 10 days, you've got legit heavyweights like AEI, the New York Times, and the Washington Post jumping on board the "defend Brady" band-wagon...my guess is that there are some real powerful strings being pulled behind the scenes right now. AEI is a pretty powerful political organization, particularly on the right wing side of the aisle. While I don't know the actual reason they got involved in this, I'm a little skeptical of the authors' claim that this was "just a water cooler discussion in the office and they decided to check it out"...somebody with some serious pull (and I'm not talking about Kraft) is involved here.
EDIT: I said you made some good points...I obviously missed your comparison to OJ...yeah...um...no.
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What I see is not a discussion. Its what I mentioned above.
There are several of us in here who have been having a pretty good discussion about the topic. The goal of internet discussion threads shouldn't be to convince people who disagree with you to suddenly agree with you. The next time that happens will be a first for the internet. Internet discussion forums exist specifically for people to carry on a back and forth on topical and evolving issues. There's really only one person in this thread who doesn't seem interested in the topic as much as criticizing some of the people who are participating in the discussion. Any guesses who I'm talking about? Just ignore the thread if you don't want to discuss it. As John Lennon once said, "it's easy if you try".
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Truer words were never spoken... http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-06-19/let-s-pretend-the-patriots-were-accused-of-hacking-sports-line
Let’s Pretend the Patriots Were Accused of Hacking
Tell us you didn’t smirk when you heard the FBI is investigating whether the St. Louis Cardinals hacked the Houston Astros’ computer network.
So, this time, we shouldn’t be rolling our eyes.
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arod will never be in the HOF
probably not. But A-Rod is 50 times more tainted than any other athlete around, and even he is starting to get positive PR. Here's reality - Brady is going to play out whatever is left of his career...maybe he'll win another one, maybe not. But at some point he'll retire, he'll get a good PR firm, he'll do the interview circuit...and the fickle media will respond favorably to having access...and the spin will be positive. Brady isn't going to be denied the HOF for this. I know you like to think that if you aren't a fan, but deep down you know this is going to blow over and he'll be in...he's a lock.
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no he hasn't. over inflating before the inspection isn't against any rule. Deflating after inspection is
eh...this stuff all fades away. I've read a handful of complimentary articles already this season about A-Rod...nobody is more "tainted' than that guy, but he's having a "comeback" year and the media is starting to turn...it's just the nature of things.
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Great win by NE but to say "LOL "that the defense was not "banged up " is ridiculous. Both safeties were indeed hurt Chancellor very badly. They lost their nickel CB (Lane ) in the first quarter. They were also getting a decent pass rush on Brady until their best pass pass rusher Avril left the game with a concussion.
How many Superbowl teams AREN'T banged up? That's part of the game...attrition. It's the 19th or 20th game of the year for these teams, not including pre-season. I'm guessing if we played the "how banged up were they?" game, the Pats would have had their 4th SB long long ago. I'd love to have seen a healthy Gronk in the last Giants SB, for example.
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even tho you quoted DW49, it looks like you were responding to my post so I have a few more questions to ask.
Since you are convinced that your theory is pretty close to what actually happened, aren't you also livid at the Patriots for not telling the truth in the first place?Or, do you think that the SB win was more important than defending Brady's rep & legacy?That's a loaded question. Do you think telling "the truth" would have protected their legacy? I don't. And I think it would have put them at risk for either Brady or Belichick to get suspended for the Superbowl (and please don't tell me that there wouldn't have been a nation-wide clamoring for that...Goodell would have been under tremendous pressure). So I think they did the right thing in the immediate aftermath of this and prior to the Superbowl. At this point, the less said the better as far as I'm concerned. The team is done talking about it, Brady is appealing his suspension...we'll see how it goes and life will go on. I remember thinking football was never going to be the same when the Ray Rice thing blew up last summer...by week 2, it felt like regular old football season.
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Just a question for all of you who feel that the NFL is above reproach in all this and that they wouldn't engage in anything shady....what were you all thinking back in the fall when an "independent investigator" determined that nobody...not one single soul...in the NFL admin had seen the Ray Rice video?
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The natural grass is softer too. I'm don't know the percentage but it seems like a lot of head injuries result from contact with the ground. Again I don't know that more occur on turf but it seems like a reasonable assumption. I'd imagine less leg injuries as well.
I don't like no helmets that sounds crazy. Flags would take to much away from the game
yep...the fact is, 30 years ago these guys were smaller, slower, and they played most of the time on sloppy footing. All three of those things have changed pretty dramatically. When two bicycles crash into each other at full speed on a dirt road, you get a lot different result than when 2 motorcycles collide at full speed on a track.
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Cool to make fun of people. I've offered before to go back and find the thread where many NE fans were seriously buying into some * NE beat writer deciding that the Colts deflated the intercepted football. Grigson conspired to frame NE and deflating that football was a planned event. NE would be cleared and the Colts exposed .....right ?
Just say the word and I'll go hunting... I believe I'll find something in there from you... not positive but I think so. My memory is not perfect but it's pretty good.
I'll help you out...you probably will find that from me. I can list a number of things in my day to day life that I think differently about now than I did a month ago. Probably you can as well. But I will say this...I never from day 1 believed that they were in the game of deflating footballs to gain an advantage on the playing field and I have never waivered from that. Everything I've thought and/or posted on this topic starts from that core belief and is an attempt to fill in the most logical narrative that fits the known facts, and as of this point, I think I've figured it out, or something real close to it.
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Its very simple and comes down to 1 thing.....The human body is not made to take collisions and that includes the head. Removing helmets wont work...That will just make things worse...Changing players stances wont work because your still going to have collisions...Its football...A collision sport...Unless you take the collision aspect out of a collision sport then risk for serious injury will always be high, The best way to prevent all this if they were dead set on putting a stop to all these injuries is to put flags on players and turn it into flag football...I'd still watch...I'd still enjoy the game even with the dramatic change
I'd rather see them do away with artificial turf and make natural grass fields and outdoor stadiums mandatory...the less than perfect footing would slow the game down enough to minimize some of these high speed collision injuries without making the game unrecognizable.
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Ah, so now you're admitting an infraction on the part of the Pats? Why did you bother with all the absurd arguments (that no one buys but Pat fans) about the science of the matter? At least you now admit the Pats cheated...
curses! You've caught me!! Lol
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aaaaaand here we go again.
DO ANY OF YOU GUYS READ??? It's simply stunning how some of you can follow this topic and respond to a person repeatedly but somehow you managed to miss every single thing that person already said.
it really is amazing...and shows you that people here seem to be more concerned about WHO you are and what team you root for as opposed to what you say.
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Part of me admires his passion defending his organization, but part of me feels sad for him too because 1. Brady is still getting suspended no matter what criticisms he levels against the Wells Report. Brady's not emerging scot free here. No way in hades. & 2. The rest of the world is thinking that the Patriots "doth pretest too much." Translation: Screaming to the heavens that you are being unfairly judged & maliciously prosecuted begins to infuriate the rest of the world after awhile over a trivial 4 game probably 2 game suspension in the end & any sympathy people might have given your club initially turns into visceral outrage over just ending the whole situation by taking your punishment medicine. It's like a tired child who won't settle down that needs a tap on the butt & a nice nap.
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or, to put it another way, "why can't you just accept the league taking your best player off the field for 25% of the season next year, seriously compromising your chances of winning again since the guy is reaching the end of his career, and also taking a first round pick away next year, thus hindering your ability to re-build, all over an infraction that warranted only a warning to other teams. What's wrong with you people?"
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When you have circumstantial evidence , anything is possible. My post 562 explains why I feel the way I do. Why I somewhat have a problem with what some of you post is how it's presented and also some of the "theories" put forth are ridiculous. Do you want me to go back and dig up probably 60% of the Pat fans seriously entertaining the idea that the Colts were involved in a devious plot to frame the Pats ? You were not one of them.
as I said earlier, it's a detective novel...so theories evolve over time as either new evidence emerges or people just think more about it. I'm convinced that my theory on it now is pretty close and ties everything I know about this together with the fewest loose ends. Believe me Gramz...I wish they (the Pats) would run with this regardless of whether or not it's true...because it's very plausible and would change the way people view what happened when it comes to legacies. They may feel that that ship has sailed though, and they may also be constrained from admitting to anything while Brady's appeal is ongoing.
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I don't have "proof" of anything. What I'm basing my opinion on is the circumstantial evidence that I've outlined many times before. Just like when a jury decides a case on circumstantial evidence and the burden of proof is "beyond a reasonable doubt." Once again.. it would be the text messages , the likelihood (which you admit) that the balls were tampered with and the non compliance by Brady and Kraft. The natural gas law is not an area of my expertise.
ok - that's fine...it's not mine either. I'm just relying on what Wells and his scientists are telling me, and that is that in the worst case scenario, a half dozen Patriots footballs measured 0.2 - 0.3 below where they should have. That doesn't really jump out to me as the type of results I'd expect from a scheme to deflate footballs. I know every media outlet in America had somebody on air the week after the AFC Championship game squeezing footballs that were 12.5PSI and 10.5PSI and assuring us they could easily tell the difference. I wonder if they could tell the difference between a football with 11.1PSI versus 11.3PSI?
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*sigh*
I'm not saying whether I agree or disagree with his assessment, I am just going to try to explain to you what he has said over the last bunch of pages that you have either chosen to ignore, didn't read in the first place, or just dont understand for one reason or another (i have my theories).
Morty is making the claim that science can explain why the balls measured as they did, therefor there is no proof that the balls were deflated. At the same time, he thinks there still was some funny business with McNally, perhaps he just gauged the balls to ensure that they were at 12.5 and not 16...which is still a violation but not an act of deflation. The team could still be punished for that violation, but it is his belief that there was no proof of a deliberate act of compromising the integrity of the game by intentionally deflating footballs.
But what about those 2 guys getting suspended? How do you explain THAT??
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Morty - Read post 552 and 549. Both are your comments.
One says balls were never deflated and another says it was pre game. What is the latest from you now?.
that is the latest, Shane...balls weren't deflated. You are getting there. Keep reading.
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I don't pretend to be a scientist like some on this board. Can I prove my beliefs by scientific evidence.. no more than you can.
I'm simply reading what the Wells report tells me (setting aside the obvious issues that have been found with that report).
We all learned from Wells that the ideal gas law would account for balls in the 11.3 - 11.5PSI range at halftime. He then gives us a list of measurements of the Pats balls at halftime taken by 2 different gauges...on one gauge, the Pats balls are (with maybe one exception) ALL well within/above that range.
Then Wells tells us that gauge isn't the one we are supposed to consider. So he gives us the readings off of the other gauge.
And on that gauge, only 3 balls are within/over the range, 6 others are below the range by 0.2 - 0.3 PSI, and 2 "outliers" are in the 0.4 - 0.5 PSI range below what the ideal gas law predicted.
I'm trying to be as objective as I can be. I'm acknowledging that a guy took balls into a bathroom and was apparently not very forthcoming about his reasons for doing that. I have a problem with that and it seems pretty likely to me that he was doing something he shouldn't have been doing. So I'm right with ya on that...
but how can you tell me that there was a scheme in place to gain an unfair advantage by deflating balls below the legal limit and then present this data as your proof of that?
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You clearly can't read or you just repeatedly choose to ignore responses that directly answer your questions. Multiple times it has been said that it is entirely plausible that the Patriots suspended them after the text messages came to light and they were talking bad about Brady. If your boss heard you and another employee speaking about him the way McNally and Jastremsky were, you'd probably get suspended or fired too.
There's nothing illogical about that idea.
yeah, but why did they suspend those guys?? Why won't you answer the question??
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How perfectly ridiculous. How about you PM Virdulant and talk about both your contentions that the Colts would be exposed for framing the Pats.
Can you elaborate on why you find it ridiculous given the measurements of the balls don't support the notion that balls were deflated? Do you want to have an honest discussion or not? Tell me what leads you to believe that balls were deflated when they were measured at halftime and didn't show any conclusive evidence that they were deflated? Science is pretty cut and dry about this stuff. You make a claim, then you test the claim with measurements. If the measurements back up your claim, then your claim is accurate. If the measurements don't back up your claim, then your claim was false. I gave you the readings...so tell me what you find "ridiculous"?
Oh and Shane-o...I've already acknowledged that I believe the 2 employees violated the rules by gauging balls pre-game. So that's why I think they were suspended.
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I've read your nonsense that infers that Brady is innocent . It is not backed up by any science.
lol. Of course it is. Take the worst case Wells assumption that the non-logo gauge was used. Go look at the Pats halftime measurements on that gauge compared to the expected Ideal Gas Law bottom range of 11.3....I'll help you out - 3 of the balls were over 11.3, 6 more were within 0.2 - 0.3 of that number, 1 was within 0.4, and 1 was within 0.5. That's 10 of 11 balls within the range of error of Anderson's 2 gauges. So please don't insult your own intelligence by pretending that this data (which by the way, is questionable) shows evidence of any plan to gain an advantage by setting balls below the legal limit. that's utter nonsense. If they were gaming the system that way, the balls would be unequivocally and significantly lower than the ideal gas law would predict. It's disingenuous and betrays your obvious agenda to suggest otherwise. I'm the guy who is acknowledging that wrong-doing happened. You are making up stories.
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No doubt there was not anything that resembled perfect protocol for measuring the PSI . Problem NE and Brady have is all the other damming evidence and the non compliance that the Wells commission found. The text messages , the trip to the pee room and Brady not letting his attorney look at his phone. That with the less than perfect work by guys that are not scientist is enough for most reasonable people to form an opinion that differs from yours.
if you bothered to read (objectively) what my opinion actually is, you'd find that all we disagree on is whether or not balls were being deflated pre-game in violation of the rules to gain an advantage, or being gauged pre game in violation of the rules to make sure the refs set the pressures correctly. My theory is supported by the science. Yours is not.
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You wont hear. He will disappear for weeks.
Will comeback, post few more crap and disappear.
The answer should be pretty obvious...When was the last time you heard someone talk about how badly Goodell bungled the Ray Rice and Adrian Peterson situations? The guy was barely treading water...I recall a Sunday Night Football game late in the season where Al Michaels came back from a break and basically read a script telling us what a great job Goodell was doing. It was embarrassing, and the guy had never felt so much heat in his entire life. And now *poof*! It's all gone! Like magic...funny how that worked out, eh?
Deflategate merge -- pending appeal results
in NFL General
Posted
If the NFL told you that Andrew Luck couldn't play the first 4 weeks of this coming season, and there wasn't either a clear cut case that he had done anything wrong OR a precedent for that harsh a punishment even if he was guilty of what he was charged with as a first time offender, I would expect Colts fans to be apoplectic over it and with good reason. I watch the NFL to see guys like Tom Brady play football, not to marvel at what a "tough guy" Roger Goodell is. He issued a suspension that basically tells Pats fans "your 2015 season is over, and you aren't getting a draft pick either". I feel like the football season has been taken away from me barring a reversal of this suspension...that's why I'm angry about it.